Any plumbing issues with hal's vista class ships?

[Cahpek]

We read with a bit of concern under the P&O discussion section that someone reported plumbing problems with the MS Arcadia. And then someone else replied and mentioned that Vista class ships "all seem to have plumbing" issues.

 

Of course, HAL has a number of Vista class ships (MS Zuiderdam, MS Oosterdam, MS Westerdam, MS Nordam, MS Eurodam).

 

Has any HAL cruisers here experienced any plumbing issues with any of them?

 

We have been on Koningsdam and really liked cruising on her, but plan to be travelling with HAL again in the near future. It would be good to know that if one those cruises will be on a Vista class ship, would we encounter plumbing issues ?

[chengkp75]

We read with a bit of concern under the P&O discussion section that someone reported plumbing problems with the MS Arcadia. And then someone else replied and mentioned that Vista class ships "all seem to have plumbing" issues.

 

Of course, HAL has a number of Vista class ships (MS Zuiderdam, MS Oosterdam, MS Westerdam, MS Nordam, MS Eurodam).

 

Has any HAL cruisers here experienced any plumbing issues with any of them?

 

We have been on Koningsdam and really liked cruising on her, but plan to be travelling with HAL again in the near future. It would be good to know that if one those cruises will be on a Vista class ship, would we encounter plumbing issues ?

 

What plumbing issues are you referring to? Toilet issues, leaking water pipes, clogged drains? Just about any ship, new or old can have these at one time or another, affecting one area of the ship or another.

[Lizzie68]

We read with a bit of concern under the P&O discussion section that someone reported plumbing problems with the MS Arcadia. And then someone else replied and mentioned that Vista class ships "all seem to have plumbing" issues.

 

Of course, HAL has a number of Vista class ships (MS Zuiderdam, MS Oosterdam, MS Westerdam, MS Nordam, MS Eurodam).

 

Has any HAL cruisers here experienced any plumbing issues with any of them?

 

We have been on Koningsdam and really liked cruising on her, but plan to be travelling with HAL again in the near future. It would be good to know that if one those cruises will be on a Vista class ship, would we encounter plumbing issues ?

 

Some time ago - yes, huge problems. Vacuum pumps had to be replaced mid-cruise. However, I haven't heard of many issues in the last couple of years. Maybe they have fixed the problems. But no matter what the issue is, if you report it, front office will say they haven't had any problems before, and if you post it here, it will have been your fault.;)

[KroozNut]

HAL has a number of Vista class ships (MS Zuiderdam, MS Oosterdam, MS Westerdam, MS Nordam, MS Eurodam).

 

One minor correction... Eurodam is a Signature not a Vista Class ship.

[bleacher04]

The Vista Ships were a new model for HAL. This was the first time HAL built a "big" ship.

Many errors were made in their design: crew elevators too small, no room service galley or pantries, medical center in the bow of the ship, hull design errors that still create problems and noise.

Zuiderdam - the very first model - was (and remains) the most problematic. The ship was far behind schedule, with delayed first sailings. Many errors were made on this first model. Strangely, they forgot to install telephones and toilets in public areas. These were hastily added just as the ship went into service. You may notice that some of Zuiderdam's public toilets are located in very strange places. They had no choice but to convert available void spaces and storage lockers to toilets at the last minute.

 

The vacuum toilet system on any ship can be problematic. But the engineers are usually able to stay on top of any problems.

One of the challenges with a vacuum toilet system is the necessity for relatively small diameter waste pipes that keep the vacuum pressure high. These pipes also function better with a minimum number of twists and turns in the pipe network.

With all the bizarre things people flush down these toilets, it is quite important that the insides of these pipes are kept clean, so the inside diameter is not reduced to block large objects coming through the pipes.

Most cruise lines have a variety of chemicals that they use to treat the insides of the pipes in order to reduce the chance of blockages.

HAL stopped using those chemicals soon after the Vista Ships started sailing (too expensive).

 

As you might imagine, the number of toilet problems on the Vista ships started increasing not long after that. These larger ships had much longer vacuum pipes with many more twist and turns in them - ideal places for all those bleach wipes, hand towels, pizza slices, steak bones, soiled underwear, tampons, cigarette ends, etc to get stuck.

 

Then HAL got creative with new vacuum pumps that were supposed to be far stronger, forcing the blockages all the way down to the pump itself. Bad idea. Now the blockages go directly into the pumps, putting them out of service for hundreds of toilets at one go.

When I last worked on Zuiderdam, we were experiencing around 500 toilet blockages / outages every day. Most were quickly resolved by our very efficient but not-too-happy engineers, only to have the very same problems re-occur the following day.

Boy, the stuff you can learn here! Thanks! :D

We've sailed on both the Noordam and the Zuiderdam, and noticed a few odd differences -- I guess build sequence would explain that.

 

Are the vacuum pumps located in the stateroom hallways? I ask because on the Zuiderdam a couple of years ago, we found ourselves with an overflowing toilet (clean, thankfully) as we were preparing for dinner (on a formal night, of course). An engineer had already been called -- apparently we weren't the only cabin with this problem -- and he had to go into a service space down the hall, between two cabins, to correct the problem.

No blame was assigned to us, and in fact we received a rather decent bottle of wine for the inconvenience :cool:

 

Back to the OP, we have sailed on Vista-class ships four times, and that was the only plumbing issue we've ever encountered.

[chengkp75]

No, the vacuum pumps are in the engine room. An overflow of clean water indicates the water valve for the toilet is not shutting off (since the bowl is closed off with the discharge valve, additional water will not simply flow down the bowl like shore toilets. He may have had to go down the hall to turn the water off to change out the water valve.

[bleacher04]

No, the vacuum pumps are in the engine room. An overflow of clean water indicates the water valve for the toilet is not shutting off (since the bowl is closed off with the discharge valve, additional water will not simply flow down the bowl like shore toilets. He may have had to go down the hall to turn the water off to change out the water valve.

 

 

Thanks, that makes sense. I also realized that large vacuum pumps would be rather noisy, for installation between cabins.

 

 

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[catl331]

We've been on Westerdam, Oosterdam, and Zuiderdam once each, and Noordam three times. No plumbing problems on any.

[Stratheden]

We had a clean water overflow from our toilet on the Zuiderdam a few years ago. We told our Room Steward who was just down the hall. It was attended to immediately and two other attendants came with a huge machine (maybe a large wet vacumn cleaner) and the bathroom was clean and dry very quickly.

[chengkp75]

Thanks, that makes sense. I also realized that large vacuum pumps would be rather noisy, for installation between cabins.

 

 

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The pump needs to be at the end of the line, much like the fan on your vacuum cleaner. If it was up on the passenger decks, there would be no motive force to get the "product" down to the engine room, other than gravity. As noted, one of the massive benefits of a vacuum system is that the drain lines do not have to keep getting larger in diameter the more toilets that are connected, unlike the septic lines in your house that rely on gravity. So, if you were using gravity from deck 12 down to the engine room, you lose the major benefit of a vacuum system.

 

The pumps themselves would make some noise if in the public areas, but they are relatively quiet by ship's pumps standards, and are relatively small. Even on the largest ships, the pumps are only about 3hp each, there are just more of them the larger the ship

[sail7seas]

The pump needs to be at the end of the line, much like the fan on your vacuum cleaner. If it was up on the passenger decks, there would be no motive force to get the "product" down to the engine room, other than gravity. As noted, one of the massive benefits of a vacuum system is that the drain lines do not have to keep getting larger in diameter the more toilets that are connected, unlike the septic lines in your house that rely on gravity. So, if you were using gravity from deck 12 down to the engine room, you lose the major benefit of a vacuum system.

 

The pumps themselves would make some noise if in the public areas, but they are relatively quiet by ship's pumps standards, and are relatively small. Even on the largest ships, the pumps are only about 3hp each, there are just more of them the larger the ship

 

We sailed Zuidedam about 3-4 cruises when she was still new and had a few toilet problems but not bad. We have sailed Westerdam 4 cruises ( with a few b-to-b) and I do not remember any toilet issues. We sailed Noordam twice and Oosterdam once,,,,,, again, no toilet problems.