Quebec City or Montreal Airport?

[CanICruiseSoonPlease]

I know I have been asking about hotels by Quebec City for my cruise out of Que, but how long is the ride by bus if I flew into Montreal and did a pre cruise out of Montreal?  Good idea, bad idea, has anyone done this?

[martincath]

Montreal is very accessible to and from Quebec City - several trains a day, plus the Orleans Express bus service, for the approx. 3 hour travel time. Even allowing for lots of traffic you could manage to get to the cruise on embarkation day with minimal risk even if it isn't one of the 'overnight in QC before sailing' cruises.

 

Since Montreal is a much busier airport than Quebec City, a lot of folks fly to there before a cruise (the fact it's bigger than QC with an even better resto scene and at least as much stuff to see & do certainly doesn't hurt - in fact I'd say that the only sensible reason NOT to add Montreal to EVERY cruise out of QC is a lack of vacation time!!!)

[Jiffymom]

We will take the train to Quebec City 

 

[Sunny AZ Girl]

On 2/1/2019 at 1:52 PM, Jiffymom said:

We will take the train to Quebec City 

 

 

On 2/1/2019 at 1:52 PM, Jiffymom said:

We will take the train to Quebec City 

 

We are doing the same.  We will have 3 nights in Montreal, train to QC, then 3 nights in QC prior to our cruise out of QC.  We are blessed to have that much vacation time.  

 

(Sorry about the double quote.  I don't know how to fix it!)

[Jiffymom]

9 minutes ago, Sunny AZ Girl said:

 

We are doing the same.  We will have 3 nights in Montreal, train to QC, then 3 nights in QC prior to our cruise out of QC.  We are blessed to have that much vacation time.  

 

(Sorry about the double quote.  I don't know how to fix it!)

 

October 1 Toronto to Niagara

2 Niagara to Kingston

3  boat tour of 1000 island in the morning

3 to Montreal in the afternoon

4 all day in Montreal

5 train to Quebec 

6 - 7 tour Quebec

It’s action packed we will really enjoy our day at sea to rest up .

Sunny Az Are you on the train on the 5 th

 

[Sunny AZ Girl]

No. We are going to Quebec City on the 4th. 

[thinfool]

On 1/31/2019 at 7:19 PM, CanICruiseSoonPlease said:

I know I have been asking about hotels by Quebec City for my cruise out of Que, but how long is the ride by bus if I flew into Montreal and did a pre cruise out of Montreal?  Good idea, bad idea, has anyone done this?

Other comments have been great but I will put in a plug for AirBNB.  We were 2 couples that rode the train to QC from Montreal, then Uber XL to our AirBNB house, then uber all over QC for sightseeing, meals, etc. Finally packed and left the house for the ship (Uber XL again).  We had 1.5 days to tour before the cruise.

 

This was our first AirBNB and it was terrific, warm and very cost effective.

[martincath]

1 hour ago, Jiffymom said:

October 1 Toronto to Niagara

2 Niagara to Kingston

3  boat tour of 1000 island in the morning

3 to Montreal in the afternoon

4 all day in Montreal

5 train to Quebec 

6 - 7 tour Quebec

Is this an organized group tour? Or are you doing it yourselves with bus/rental car for the Toronto-Montreal parts?

 

I ask because that first 2 days especially is very inefficient - Niagara is the opposite direction from Kingston so you end up passing through Toronto again (hard to avoid this if you want to see the Falls though, unless you have a private boat to take you across the lake!); Toronto offers so much more stuff to do than Niagara it's just incomparably better - literally the Falls and then you're done in Niagara, the Canadian side is a horrific tourist trap full of cheesy crap (oddly enough the US side is much classier, but it has no view of the best angles). I say this as someone who lived in Toronto almost a decade, visited Niagara Falls double-digits of times including several overnight stays there - you can even do the light show and then drive back to T.O. as sunset is early enough in October (and the roads will be delightfully traffic-free). Kingston isn't bad - we did lots of short stops there on eastbound roadtrips, quite a few decent restos - but unless you're heavily into Canadian political and military history again it's weaksauce compared to Toronto.

 

Assuming you have some degree of control over your plans, I'd book a hotel in Toronto night 1 and 2, take a day-trip to see the Falls, drive to Montreal on Day 3 (spending the afternoon in Kingston on a 1,000 Islands boat ride - by heading east in the morning from a downtown T.O. hotel you are going against commuter traffic this day too); also consider bumping your train to Day 6, or at least taking an evening train Day 5, as there's both more stuff in Montreal plus you have at least embarkation morning (and with many cruises a whole other overnight) in Quebec City to sightsee.

 

While still very short visits to both Toronto and Montreal, these change would improve your ability to do justice to them and you really won't miss out on anything either - of course if you have the time, I'd strongly suggest adding at least an extra night to both these cities!

[Jiffymom]

3 hours ago, martincath said:

Is this an organized group tour? Or are you doing it yourselves with bus/rental car for the Toronto-Montreal parts?

 

I ask because that first 2 days especially is very inefficient - Niagara is the opposite direction from Kingston so you end up passing through Toronto again (hard to avoid this if you want to see the Falls though, unless you have a private boat to take you across the lake!); Toronto offers so much more stuff to do than Niagara it's just incomparably better - literally the Falls and then you're done in Niagara, the Canadian side is a horrific tourist trap full of cheesy crap (oddly enough the US side is much classier, but it has no view of the best angles). I say this as someone who lived in Toronto almost a decade, visited Niagara Falls double-digits of times including several overnight stays there - you can even do the light show and then drive back to T.O. as sunset is early enough in October (and the roads will be delightfully traffic-free). Kingston isn't bad - we did lots of short stops there on eastbound roadtrips, quite a few decent restos - but unless you're heavily into Canadian political and military history again it's weaksauce compared to Toronto.

 

Assuming you have some degree of control over your plans, I'd book a hotel in Toronto night 1 and 2, take a day-trip to see the Falls, drive to Montreal on Day 3 (spending the afternoon in Kingston on a 1,000 Islands boat ride - by heading east in the morning from a downtown T.O. hotel you are going against commuter traffic this day too); also consider bumping your train to Day 6, or at least taking an evening train Day 5, as there's both more stuff in Montreal plus you have at least embarkation morning (and with many cruises a whole other overnight) in Quebec City to sightsee.

 

While still very short visits to both Toronto and Montreal, these change would improve your ability to do justice to them and you really won't miss out on anything either - of course if you have the time, I'd strongly suggest adding at least an extra night to both these cities!

Well I had thought of that. But This is on my husbands bucket list.So we will arrive the first evening so we can see the falls at night. Then next morning take the boat trip and then head out of town. If weather is nice we will stop in Kingston otherwise just go direct to Montreal. 

I already have a hotel reserved and train tickets.  Thanks for your suggestions. 

[LHT28]

3 hours ago, martincath said:

 I say this as someone who lived in Toronto almost a decade, visited Niagara Falls double-digits of times including several overnight stays there - you can even do the light show and then drive back to T.O. as sunset is early enough in October (and the roads will be delightfully traffic-free).

 

When was the last time you drove from NF to Toronto traffic free??

 

[martincath]

4 hours ago, Jiffymom said:

Well I had thought of that. But This is on my husbands bucket list. So we will arrive the first evening so we can see the falls at night. Then next morning take the boat trip and then head out of town. If weather is nice we will stop in Kingston otherwise just go direct to Montreal. 

I already have a hotel reserved and train tickets.  Thanks for your suggestions. 

Ah well, if it's a bucket list thing then so be it. He's seen too many romantic movies about folks eloping/honey-mooning there no doubt. Just don't let him talk you into re-enacting the Lois Lane Niagara Falls scene from Superman II - jump into the river anywhere around the Falls and you'll be banned for life from the park!!! 😉

 

4 hours ago, LHT28 said:

When was the last time you drove from NF to Toronto traffic free??

In the most-literal sense of no other cars on the road, of course never;-)

 

But we did manage to get our actual travel time to closely fit the theoretical GPS traffic-free time, i.e. no notable traffic delays, vehicles able to flow at the speed limit most of the time (downtown Niagara Falls to our door in North York was 90 minutes on Google/GPS without traffic, but was easily 30-60 min longer when we were daft enough to be going with commuter flow e.g. heading out of Toronto after work for an overnight in NF). If memory serves, the most sensible time to leave southbound was 10-11am to arrive in time for lunch or 8-9pm to arrive in time to go to bed (returning toward T.O. the time ranges could slide forward by an hour as there was always a lower traffic volume at the Niagara end). We'd generally be running about 95 mins barring collisions, construction, snow. Obviously there were even quieter times when you could cruise at the limit the whole way, like the wee small hours of the A.M., but they involved compromising sleep or mealtimes too much, not worth it to save the extra 5 mins!

 

Optimal times may of course have shifted some in the ~8 years since we last had to worry about it, and depending exactly where your home is your literal mileage will vary. It's all about passing through the key bottlenecks when most other folks aren't - we applied the same methodology when we acquired our 'cottage' in Portland (Seattle traffic makes Toronto look like a breeze; we have to pass through the entire conurbation along its longest axis plus avoid Vancouver and Portland rush hours on each end of the trip - both of which are also worse than Toronto; AND deal with a choice of border crossings with again different times being optimal in each direction as CBP and CBSA don't operate in quite the same way; it made our efforts to figure out T.O. to Montreal and Niagara Falls look laughably simple in comparison) and our average drive time is consistently 5hrs 15mins compared to a theoretical no-traffic 5hrs 9min. Even with a meal, a gas stop, and the border crossing we arrive within 6 hours much more often than not.

 

I'll definitely cop to being anal about analysis, but there is something incredibly satisfying about checking updates on traffic flow and border crossings and knowing that you saved yourself big chunks of time because of your decisions - it's like getting free bonus time to do something else!

Edited February 4, 2019 by martincath

[LHT28]

6 hours ago, martincath said:

In the most-literal sense of no other cars on the road, of course never;-)

 

But we did manage to get our actual travel time to closely fit the theoretical GPS traffic-free time, i.e. no notable traffic delays, vehicles able to flow at the speed limit most of the time (downtown Niagara Falls to our door in North York was 90 minutes on Google/GPS without traffic, but was easily 30-60 min longer when we were daft enough to be going with commuter flow e.g. heading out of Toronto after work for an overnight in NF). If memory serves, the most sensible time to leave southbound was 10-11am to arrive in time for lunch or 8-9pm to arrive in time to go to bed (returning toward T.O. the time ranges could slide forward by an hour as there was always a lower traffic volume at the Niagara end). We'd generally be running about 95 mins barring collisions, construction, snow. Obviously there were even quieter times when you could cruise at the limit the whole way, like the wee small hours of the A.M., but they involved compromising sleep or mealtimes too much, not worth it to save the extra 5 mins!

 

Optimal times may of course have shifted some in the ~8 years since we last had to worry about it, and depending exactly where your home is your literal mileage will vary. It's all about passing through the key bottlenecks when most other folks aren't - we applied the same methodology when we acquired our 'cottage' in Portland (Seattle traffic makes Toronto look like a breeze; we have to pass through the entire conurbation along its longest axis plus avoid Vancouver and Portland rush hours on each end of the trip - both of which are also worse than Toronto; AND deal with a choice of border crossings with again different times being optimal in each direction as CBP and CBSA don't operate in quite the same way; it made our efforts to figure out T.O. to Montreal and Niagara Falls look laughably simple in comparison) and our average drive time is consistently 5hrs 15mins compared to a theoretical no-traffic 5hrs 9min. Even with a meal, a gas stop, and the border crossing we arrive within 6 hours much more often than not.

 

I'll definitely cop to being anal about analysis, but there is something incredibly satisfying about checking updates on traffic flow and border crossings and knowing that you saved yourself big chunks of time because of your decisions - it's like getting free bonus time to do something else!

 

WHEW

We have family in NF, FT Erie  & Welland  best  time was 2 hrs  worst time  4 hrs that was on a weekend

we try to avoid weekends to/from N.F.

glad you have had  a good run of 90 mins  not usually reality  though 😉

 

[LHT28]

11 hours ago, Jiffymom said:

Well I had thought of that. But This is on my husbands bucket list.So we will arrive the first evening so we can see the falls at night. Then next morning take the boat trip and then head out of town. If weather is nice we will stop in Kingston otherwise just go direct to Montreal. 

I already have a hotel reserved and train tickets.  Thanks for your suggestions. 

I am guessing you have flights booked ?

You could have flown to BUF  did the falls   then on to Toronto & the rest   no back tracking

enjoy the trip

[martincath]

5 hours ago, LHT28 said:

WHEW

We have family in NF, FT Erie  & Welland  best  time was 2 hrs  worst time  4 hrs that was on a weekend

we try to avoid weekends to/from N.F.

glad you have had  a good run of 90 mins  not usually reality  though 😉

 

OPs dates are all weekdays; so were ours except in serious off-season (although the press coverage of the frozen falls has been so extensive I imagine it was a lot busier recently than during our winter trips when we'd only see a literal handful of other cars in the parking lots) as you are completely correct that local leisure traffic from within the golden horseshoe to the Falls definitely picked up over the weekends.

 

I'm also guessing that you are less-conveniently-located for highway access than we were, driving a longer distance, or both as the GTA is not small as you are aware... We were 140km to the parking lot from our condo, but <3km of that was surface streets in T.O. and <5km from the 420 to the Falls with the rest almost all 100kph highways.

 

Good call on suggesting flights to BUF by the way, should have thought to suggest that myself (although a Feb drive to BUF for a flight to NYC to take our first cruise together was our personal worst trip ever along that route for delays - huge snowstorm, cars crawling along the QEW, I don't think I got out of third gear once! 195km trip took almost five hours...)

[LHT28]

we  used to live in the east  end  so about 15 to the Gardiner  then on the hwy

we moved North of the city so about 40 min to 401 on a good day

we try to go weekdays now when we are visiting family

still it will depend on the day always seems like non stop traffic  no matter what time of day or night

we have even left NF after 9 pm to miss  it but  to no avail

[martincath]

3 hours ago, LHT28 said:

we moved North of the city so about 40 min to 401 on a good day

we have even left NF after 9 pm to miss  it but  to no avail

40mins to 401, compared to our ~6mins, means the rest of your two hours is almost identical to the rest of our 95mins - so given the distance that means you were cruising along pretty well except for the surface street parts. You may have felt you were seeing a lot of cars but unless your times are wrong you were actually averaging damn close to the speed limit the entire time you were on the highway.

 

When we moved up to Thornhill we weighed the extra time to the 401 vs. the cost of the 407 and the latter came up a win even though we were still south of it so driving the wrong way - it was actually only a minute or two faster compared to the sweet spot on the 401 but it meant we could have much more flexibility about when we traveled, and not lose time if there was e.g. a collision (gotta love the traffic alerts on GPS). At 40mins to the 401 your case would be much stronger than ours, you must be well north of the 407 to take that long to reach the 401; if you're further east than north it's even better (friends who live scattered around the 905 from eastern Markham through Brooklin, even folks in Unionville, swear by it as it saves them about an hour each a day on commutes into central Toronto/Etobicoke).

 

Interesting as this is to us though, I don't think we're helping JiffyMom much! Pulling it back around to that - since you're doing Maid of the Mist the next morning before leaving, the important thing is to aim for being through Toronto by ~2pm JM. There are a crapton of commuters who live along the 401 corridor east of town, and we learned if you didn't beat them onto the road the highway would be packed, especially where the Express and Collectors merge together at Pickering. In October, not a holiday, not a Friday you're almost certainly safe to be passing there as late as 3pm but if you aim for 2pm or earlier you'll have ample padding in case of any problems.

 

Possible stops en route other than Kingston - Belleville doesn't have much touristy stuff, but we used to make a point of stopping in Capers (a lovely wee bistro on Front Street) on all our eastbound roadtrips. Just checked and they're both still in business and the best-reviewed resto in the town (4.6/5 on Google) so if you're in need of a meal at about that point on the drive it should still be a good option. Super-tacky, but who doesn't love a cheesy roadside attraction, is the Big Apple - you'll see it as it's impossible to miss! As well as very decent pies, they have granny-approved tea and clean restrooms (road trips with elderly British ladies require frequent stops that check off both these boxes). If you do go for a 1,000 Islands boat ride, NB: that they actually leave from Gananoque, not Kingston - the Stonewater Pub was by far the best dining option for just before or after the boat rides, it's walkably east of the docks on Water Street.

 

Montreal itself, the one place we ALWAYS went (and still do on any trip) is Au Pied de Cochon - in fact several times we drove the ~ 6 hours from Toronto specifically to eat there, heading over on Saturday and back on Sunday while doing nothing else at all in Montreal. Yes, it really is THAT unique, and you'd be advised to book dinner pretty early (2-tops around 7pm start getting scarce at least a couple of months in advance) on your full day. I'd do Schwartz' smoked meat for an early lunch (queues which are long regardless of tourist season) and then not eat anything else, as if you don't leave APDC with a button undone and the meat sweats coming on you're just not doing it right;-)