Haven Sundeck and Children

[dandelpino]

1 hour ago, Two Wheels Only said:

 

Wonder OTS has the Suite Neighborhood which is also child-friendly. 

 

Good to know. I have not been paying much attention to RCCL this year. Glad they're catching up honestly because their suite experience is pretty disjointed compared to ship-within-a-ship offerings elsewhere in the industry.  

[pcakes122]

6 minutes ago, dandelpino said:

 

I understand that's your opinion but I doubt NCL executives would agree. Do you really think they would send their most profitable guests - families in the Haven - to their competitors over this?

How could you think they wouldn't agree?They already made the decision that the Haven Sundeck is limited to 16+ only.  It's just the customers that can't accept it.

 

I would also argue that Haven "families" probably aren't the most profitable revenue segment for NCL. Not sure what data you have to back that up.

 

The bottom line is this discussion wasn't about whether or not NCL should have this rule (that decision was already made.) The discussion was should people expect it to be put aside for them because their children are special in some way.  I still vote no.

[dandelpino]

Just now, pcakes122 said:

I would also argue that Haven "families" probably aren't the most profitable revenue segment for NCL. Not sure what data you have to back that up.

 

Well I don't have access to NCL's customer data so I can't know with certainty. But what I do know is how NCL built out their Haven offering. They designed a fairly large room called the "Haven 2-Bedroom Family Villa" and then installed between 20 and 45 of said cabins on their ships. It's the most numerous type of Haven cabin on most ships. NCL clearly intended to have a lot of families in the Haven. Because let me tell you, that second bedroom is for kids. Anyone who has sailed in that cabin will tell you the same. No fare-paying adult wants that second bedroom.

 

If a different customer segment were more profitable then NCL really missed it and they built their ships all wrong. Either they spent hundred of millions of dollars building Haven areas to cater to their most profitable customers, or they messed up. We'll never know.

 

[pcakes122]

41 minutes ago, dandelpino said:

 

Well I don't have access to NCL's customer data so I can't know with certainty. But what I do know is how NCL built out their Haven offering. They designed a fairly large room called the "Haven 2-Bedroom Family Villa" and then installed between 20 and 45 of said cabins on their ships. It's the most numerous type of Haven cabin on most ships. NCL clearly intended to have a lot of families in the Haven. Because let me tell you, that second bedroom is for kids. Anyone who has sailed in that cabin will tell you the same. No fare-paying adult wants that second bedroom.

 

If a different customer segment were more profitable then NCL really missed it and they built their ships all wrong. Either they spent hundred of millions of dollars building Haven areas to cater to their most profitable customers, or they messed up. We'll never know.

 

Well, they definitely don't want those kids on the Haven Sundeck. 😂🤣  It's not my rule. You are complaining to the wrong person.  You need to call NCL and give them your business advice.

[KansasTexan]

43 minutes ago, dandelpino said:

 

Well I don't have access to NCL's customer data so I can't know with certainty. But what I do know is how NCL built out their Haven offering. They designed a fairly large room called the "Haven 2-Bedroom Family Villa" and then installed between 20 and 45 of said cabins on their ships. It's the most numerous type of Haven cabin on most ships. NCL clearly intended to have a lot of families in the Haven. Because let me tell you, that second bedroom is for kids. Anyone who has sailed in that cabin will tell you the same. No fare-paying adult wants that second bedroom.

 

If a different customer segment were more profitable then NCL really missed it and they built their ships all wrong. Either they spent hundred of millions of dollars building Haven areas to cater to their most profitable customers, or they messed up. We'll never know.

 

You're right. We'll never know. Just going by numbers, there are a LOT of studio cabins for solo travelers. Perhaps we can all just get along, pay our fares, and follow the rules. Seems so simple...

[RocketMan275]

47 minutes ago, dandelpino said:

 

Well I don't have access to NCL's customer data so I can't know with certainty. But what I do know is how NCL built out their Haven offering. They designed a fairly large room called the "Haven 2-Bedroom Family Villa" and then installed between 20 and 45 of said cabins on their ships. It's the most numerous type of Haven cabin on most ships. NCL clearly intended to have a lot of families in the Haven. Because let me tell you, that second bedroom is for kids. Anyone who has sailed in that cabin will tell you the same. No fare-paying adult wants that second bedroom.

 

If a different customer segment were more profitable then NCL really missed it and they built their ships all wrong. Either they spent hundred of millions of dollars building Haven areas to cater to their most profitable customers, or they messed up. We'll never know.

 

Simple. 

They designed a large number of cabins with children in mind. 

Then they designed a sundeck with adults in mind.  

[gingersvp]

It's bananas to me that people keep arguing about kids in a very small space in the Haven. I do wonder if the OP some how mixed up Courtyard for Sun Deck in their original question. As a parent, I can understand and agree with it being a hard no if my kids weren't welcome in the main Courtyard area.

 

I think that we, as parents who have so much access to the Haven with our children, can abide by the rules and have this one small space be kid free. 

 

The policy isn't unwelcome to families, it's truly such a small area. We'll be in the Haven in January. My 7 year old will be in the Courtyard, at the restaurant and in the lounge. She will firmly not be on the Sun Deck or anywhere near the spa. And when I sneak away for some rme time, I will be extremely thankful for areas without children. 

 

Something for everyone.

[KateQ22003]

14 hours ago, dandelpino said:

 

I agree they should. As someone else posted, they should enforce noise and disruptiveness, not age. If the mere presence of a child is bothersome to someone, then NCL is simply not the right cruise line for that person. NCL is a family cruise line so children are to be expected.

 

Who the heck is going to enforce that? On the smaller ships, there is one server in the Haven. He/she certainly doesn't have time to enforce "noise and disruptiveness." Limiting access to age is the easiest way to ensure the adults in the haven have one place to go without kids. NCL understands this, which is why that sundeck exists in the first place. They are certainly not going to stop catering to a segment of the population so that children have 100% access to all venues on the ship.

 

[KateQ22003]

10 hours ago, dandelpino said:

 

Well I don't have access to NCL's customer data so I can't know with certainty. But what I do know is how NCL built out their Haven offering. They designed a fairly large room called the "Haven 2-Bedroom Family Villa" and then installed between 20 and 45 of said cabins on their ships. It's the most numerous type of Haven cabin on most ships. NCL clearly intended to have a lot of families in the Haven. Because let me tell you, that second bedroom is for kids. Anyone who has sailed in that cabin will tell you the same. No fare-paying adult wants that second bedroom.

 

If a different customer segment were more profitable then NCL really missed it and they built their ships all wrong. Either they spent hundred of millions of dollars building Haven areas to cater to their most profitable customers, or they messed up. We'll never know.

 

I have been in that second bedroom several times, both inside and outside of the haven. It's not a bad room if you have the steward pad the bed. It has its own bathroom, and is a nice place to get away to at the end of the day. That second bedroom is absolutely fine for a fare-paying adult. 

 

I dare say the Haven sees more adult occupancy than kids most of the year, due to the school calendar. We try to cruise as much as possible while school is in session; Very few if any kids.

[The Black Page]

On 10/25/2022 at 11:03 AM, July1963 said:

We booked Norwegian first time for July next year on the Joy. We have since found out that children are not allowed on the Sundeck. This would exclude us as a family from this whole area, our Son will be 14 when sailing, only child and behaves much as an adult. I did have an online Chat with Norwegian and they said to talk with Guest Services when onboard. 

Has anyone seen children in this area? This may well be a deal breaker for us to the extent we cancel.

 

 

If that is how you feel, consider the deal broken.  The rule is in place and teaching your son that it is OK to break rules is not something a good parent would do.  The rule does not say only well behaved children are allowed on the sun deck, and for good reason.  "well behaved" is highly subjective whereas setting an age limit is a firm parameter with that has no room for subjectivity.  Having said all of that, teh sun deck in question is a very small portion of the ship and there many Haven areas that you son can join you as a family.  Quit worrying about a small sundeck, go on your cruise with your family and have a great time.

[The Black Page]

On 10/25/2022 at 11:58 AM, dandelpino said:

In any case, if you really want your son on the sundeck my advice would be to not ask for permission and just have him sit out there. The Haven staff are not going to ask him to leave unless he's being disruptive.

 

 

Terrible advice.  You are basically saying "go ahead and break the rules and make others have to complain to have you follow them or force the staff into the uncomfortable situation of letting you know that he has to leave"  It is not OK to beak rules until someone calls you on it.
.

[The Black Page]

On 10/26/2022 at 6:58 PM, IronRobi said:

This is exactly what I was going to say as well. If your son is as respectful and quiet as you say, the staff won't have any issues with it and the other haven guests shouldn't either. I say shouldn't because you will always run into the people who follow every rule to the letter and will take every opportunity to complain and point out when somebody doesn't. So if this happens, staff will be forced to enforce it, just try not to put up a giant fuss about it since it is against the rules.

 

 

So it is OK for him to break the rule but it is not OK for someone else to call him out on it.  LOL that has to be of of the most absurd things I have ever read on the internet.

[The Black Page]

On 10/26/2022 at 9:41 PM, Beamco said:

Why shouldn't other guests have a problem with it. I am perfectly fine with leaving the Haven Lounge, Pool, Observation Deck etc. to avoid children behaved or otherwise. Just don't chase me away from the one area of the Haven that is designated no children. Additionally, the parents with the disrespectful children show up and get to say - it's Ok because other children are here - and we go down the slippery slope from there. Rules are rules and they are not meant to be broken. The rule is there for a purpose. Also it's not about the staff breaking up the  monotony of their job its about the comfort of your fellow guests that are following the rules. The no kids under 16 on the Haven sundeck is a hard rule not a soft one. Oh and I can say it this way you always run into the people who take every opportunity to take the edge for their own benefit over others and god forbid others complain about their self centered behavior. If people follow the rules the staff won't be forced to do anything. 

I wish I could have liked this 1000 times.  Finally someone posts a well thought out cogent post,.  Kudos to you Beamco!

[The Black Page]

On 10/27/2022 at 8:37 AM, kitty-sail said:

Very well stated. No one, guests or staff, have a problem except if children are rude or disruptive to other guests. If I remember correctly, as a teenager, the last thing I wanted to do was hang out with my parents.

So you have interviewed EVERYONE, guest and staff, and can speak for them all?  The rule dos not say a thing about being rude or disruptive (those are both highly subjective terms so who would decide anyway), it states a specific age limit and should be enforced with no exceptions.  If a family wants to be together, simply go elsewhere on the ship.  Is it really that hard to follow rules?

[Laszlo]

Wow.... this is still going on. I don't know what problem is. The stated rule is 16....   Not 15.5, not 14 or 13. Not 15 if they are nice kids. It's pretty cut and dry, its 16. If you have a problem with that rule that's on you, don't book the Haven

[cruising sister]

19 hours ago, dandelpino said:

 

I understand that's your opinion but I doubt NCL executives would agree. Do you really think they would send their most profitable guests - families in the Haven - to their competitors over this?

Disney is about as family/kid friendly as you can get and they strictly abide by their adult only areas. I will be happily sailing on them in January with the grandkids and I am glad they have both areas. I don’t think NCL will lose customers over a small area reserved for adults. 

[Vyhanek]

The adults only area is not the area with the swimming pool.   Its not the enclosed courtyard area.   That enclosed courtyard area is open to all Haven guests including children..    Its paying Haven guests only because it isn't that big and definitely not enough chairs or space in the Haven pool for a bunch of extra people.  

 

Its like being on the concierge floor at a nice hotel, you can bring your personal guests to your room but you can't take them to the lounge with the free appetizers and free drinks!  

 

TheHaven  courtyard is nice but it is enclosed, 4 sides surrounded by ship, there is no where  to sit in the courtyard and see the ocean if that matters to you.   Guests without children tend to migrate to the upper sundeck because the enclosed courtyard gets really loud, its an enclosed space with lots of glass and metal and the noise bounces off the hard surfaces.   Even a couple kids playing in the pool gets loud from the noise bouncing around that enclosed space.   

 

The Haven upper sundeck is what is adults only/Haven guests only.   Its even smaller than the courtyard area with  maybe 25 lounge chairs and a hot tub.   Space is at a premium.   There is definitely no extra lounge chairs for extra guests because there aren't even enough to go around.  That isn't being a Karen.....good lord, your guests pay a small fraction of what legitimate haven guests pay and then they  take a chair when there aren't nearly enough to go around anyways....that's just basic.  Very basic.   The staff in the Haven knows who belongs and they will address any guests who don't belong.   They also know the ages of the kids, from the passport info you enter for each guest.   They know the minors, they will address it.  

 

 Ive cruised the NCL haven many times with my young kids. Now we've aged out of that stage and we are all glad for a space in the Haven that can be kid free.  We stay out of the enclosed courtyard area, we'll leave that space for you with kids.  When you get beyond the young kid years, you'll feel the same way.   

Edited November 8, 2022 by Vyhanek

[mscdivina2016]

On 10/25/2022 at 8:03 AM, July1963 said:

We booked Norwegian first time for July next year on the Joy. We have since found out that children are not allowed on the Sundeck. This would exclude us as a family from this whole area, our Son will be 14 when sailing, only child and behaves much as an adult. I did have an online Chat with Norwegian and they said to talk with Guest Services when onboard. 

Has anyone seen children in this area? This may well be a deal breaker for us to the extent we cancel.

I don't understand how this has gotten so many posts.

Rules are rules.

Is you son going to drink? Oh that's age 21 right?

Is he going to drive to the port? That's 16 at least.

Smoke?

Gamble?

 

I personally wish it was age 18