Is it just me or is deployment changing less often these days?

[Itried4498]

6 hours ago, dolphinsfan246 said:

I’m just saying that’s the reason John heald gave for retiring Ecstasy and Sensation when he was on the Ecstasy’s last cruise. They wanted them until 2025 but the engines needed expensive repairs asap. 

 

37 minutes ago, dolphinsfan246 said:

Yes I would not be surprised at all to see them move more Costa ships over. I believe Costa Serena still has no deployment plan. And like I said before , I wouldn’t consider Sunshine safe just because. I know Carnival does not have the financial position to make large ship orders any time soon, so they have already shown they are going be creative to expand their fleet by poaching other brands. Replacing Sunshine with Costa Serena is plausible and lowers the age of ship by 11 years.  

 

Poaching ships would simply limit Carnival Corporation's ability to grow in Europe & Asia, when those regions settle down.  We tend to dwell on age, but economics will be the hindering point - not age - for upcoming retirements.  I'd bet that both Paradise and Elation will be put down, before any other ship...

[CarnivalShips480]

19 hours ago, dolphinsfan246 said:

I wouldn’t be so sure , Sunshine was built in 1996, that makes her 26 years old. Inspiration was built in the same year and was scrapped. Yes Sunshine had a major renovation in 2013 but 26 year old engines are still 26 year old engines. If the cost of the repairs are more than the return on investment they would get, then they will have no problem selling her as well. This is what happened to both Sensation and Ecstasy, they wanted to keep both but both needed costly repairs of over $20M each. Sensation was in worse shape than Ecstasy, so that’s why they gave Ecstasy the final season in Mobile over Sensation. 

I am pretty sure. When Inspiration was sold, it was the pandemic when they had to sell ships. Now and in years ahead, there is no reason to sell. I don't think Sunshine, Elation, or Paradise need to be sold soon. Sunshine doesn't need to be scrapped because of the age. Elation and Paradise seem to be seen as much older because of the oldest sister ships, built 8 years before. What is the condition of Sunshine's engines? Just because it is 26 years old doesn't mean the engines are in bad condition. If Sensation and Ecstasy didn't have engine problems, then they could have lasted longer and would have. It wasn't worth it to keep them in the fleet. If Sunshine was to have the same engine issues, why wouldn't it be worth it to fix? The ship had that huge refurbishment to get features like the new ships.

 

All three ships are in great condition (as far as I know) and have many years of cruising left.

[CarnivalShips480]

13 hours ago, dolphinsfan246 said:

Yes I would not be surprised at all to see them move more Costa ships over. I believe Costa Serena still has no deployment plan. And like I said before , I wouldn’t consider Sunshine safe just because. I know Carnival does not have the financial position to make large ship orders any time soon, so they have already shown they are going be creative to expand their fleet by poaching other brands. Replacing Sunshine with Costa Serena is plausible and lowers the age of ship by 11 years.  

Serena will be in the Caribbean next year from Guadeloupe.

 

The age doesn't matter as much as the condition of the ship. Serena doesn't have anything that Destiny got in the refurbishment to become Sunshine, if any more Costa ships are transferred it wouldn't be to replace Carnival ships.

[Saint Greg]

On 11/4/2022 at 12:40 PM, Top_of_the_Cube said:

I don't know how it works in other ports or other time periods, but back in early 2000, embarking out of Galveston, seems like at least some of the ships we sailed were around for four or five years.

 

I know in the 5 1/2 years I cruised prior to Covid, New Orleans went from Dream/Elation to Dream/Triumph, to Glory/Valor. And I'm pretty sure since I've been cruising Galveston has had Magic, Breeze, Freedom, Triumph, Vista, Dream, Breeze again. Next Jubilee...and they almost had Radiance.

[tidecat]

12 hours ago, CarnivalShips480 said:

Serena will be in the Caribbean next year from Guadeloupe.

The only sailings I saw available for booking on Serena were December 2023 and later. Fortuna doesn't have anything available for booking after mid-April 2023. That's not to say that the Serena sailings may ultimately be canceled or may take place on another ship, or that Serena might re-enter service sooner. It likely would not be cost effective to move Serena over from Dubai to South America to take 2-3 months of Fortuna sailings, so we may not see a move until the middle of next year.

[Itried4498]

11 hours ago, Saint Greg said:

 

I know in the 5 1/2 years I cruised prior to Covid, New Orleans went from Dream/Elation to Dream/Triumph, to Glory/Valor. And I'm pretty sure since I've been cruising Galveston has had Magic, Breeze, Freedom, Triumph, Vista, Dream, Breeze again. Next Jubilee...and they almost had Radiance.

 

We don't get much variety out West.  The Splendor would've likely been here 10+ years if not for declining tourist traffic into Mexico during the early 2010s.

 

7-day Mexican Riviera

Jubilee (???-1998)

Elation (1998-2003)

Pride (2003-2009)

Splendor (January 2009-January 2013) 

Miracle (January 2013-January 2018). 

Splendor (January 2018-December 2019)

Panorama (December 2019-present)

 

3/4-day Weekend Ensenada

Carnival Holiday (??? - early 2000s, I don't remember when)

Carnival Paradise (??-2011)

Carnival Inspiration (January 2011-2020)

Carnival Imagination (January 2014-2020) ***second ship on the route***

Carnival Radiance (2021-present)

 

***The Miracle also performed a few cruises in 2019.  I believe the Spirit was always seasonal San Diego in SoCal but it may have done some out of Los Angeles/Long Beach as well.

[Saint Greg]

4 minutes ago, Itried4498 said:

 

We don't get much variety out West.  The Splendor would've likely been here 10+ years if not for declining tourist traffic into Mexico during the early 2010s.

 

7-day Mexican Riviera

Jubilee (???-1998)

Elation (1998-2003)

Pride (2003-2009)

Splendor (January 2009-January 2013) 

Miracle (January 2013-January 2018). 

Splendor (January 2018-December 2019)

Panorama (December 2019-present)

 

3/4-day Weekend Ensenada

Carnival Holiday (??? - early 2000s, I don't remember when)

Carnival Paradise (??-2011)

Carnival Inspiration (January 2011-2020)

Carnival Imagination (January 2014-2020) ***second ship on the route***

Carnival Radiance (2021-present)

 

***The Miracle also performed a few cruises in 2019.  I believe the Spirit was always seasonal San Diego in SoCal but it may have done some out of Los Angeles/Long Beach as well.

I’d say you’re doing good now with Panorama and Radiance…and Firenze coming.

[simplelife]

On 11/5/2022 at 12:27 PM, CarnivalShips480 said:

Elation and Paradise can stay in the fleet for awhile

I have cruises booked on each of them, We sailed both in the past want to do them again before they're history. 

[CarnivalShips480]

10 hours ago, tidecat said:

The only sailings I saw available for booking on Serena were December 2023 and later. Fortuna doesn't have anything available for booking after mid-April 2023. That's not to say that the Serena sailings may ultimately be canceled or may take place on another ship, or that Serena might re-enter service sooner. It likely would not be cost effective to move Serena over from Dubai to South America to take 2-3 months of Fortuna sailings, so we may not see a move until the middle of next year.

I think Serena's cruises to the Caribbean were recently added so I assume they happen. Carnival can get Magica, and then after Fortuna is done South America, Carnival can get it too. Serena is bigger and newer so Costa would probably want to keep it more.

Edited December 7, 2022 by CarnivalShips480

[tidecat]

2 hours ago, CarnivalShips480 said:

I think Serena's cruises to the Caribbean were recently added so I assume they happen. Carnival can get Magica, and then after Fortuna is done South America, Carnival can get it too. Serena is bigger and newer so Costa would probably want to keep it more.

Magica was supposedly sold to Seajets per Wikipedia - haven't been able to confirm it. She isn't on Costa's fleet page nor are there any sailings available for booking.

 

Fortuna would probably head to Spain or France for drydock  after she returns to Italy from her Transatlantic, so I would concur that move may indeed be coming.

[CarnivalShips480]

3 hours ago, tidecat said:

Magica was supposedly sold to Seajets per Wikipedia - haven't been able to confirm it. She isn't on Costa's fleet page nor are there any sailings available for booking.

 

Fortuna would probably head to Spain or France for drydock  after she returns to Italy from her Transatlantic, so I would concur that move may indeed be coming.

Magica couldn't have been sold to Seajets, wouldn't make any sense. It also was never up for sale. Remember, anyone can edit Wikipedia. Someone is trying to start a rumor.

Edited December 7, 2022 by CarnivalShips480

[CruiseAdict218]

22 hours ago, tidecat said:

Magica was supposedly sold to Seajets per Wikipedia - haven't been able to confirm it. She isn't on Costa's fleet page nor are there any sailings available for booking.

 

Fortuna would probably head to Spain or France for drydock  after she returns to Italy from her Transatlantic, so I would concur that move may indeed be coming.

 

18 hours ago, CarnivalShips480 said:

Magica couldn't have been sold to Seajets, wouldn't make any sense. It also was never up for sale. Remember, anyone can edit Wikipedia. Someone is trying to start a rumor.

Costa Magica’s page at least through the US site didn’t contain and information it was being sold to Seajets and that page hadn’t been updated since June. 

[CruiseAdict218]

Costa ships aside, Carnival Glory is moving to Port Canaveral in 2024, replacing Carnival Liberty it looks like. 

[CarnivalShips480]

Yes, also Legend will be in Tampa from November 2024 through April 2025. 

 

I saw Liberty's name on Grand Cayman port schedules, so I assume that it is going to New Orleans in Glory's spot.

[talkorpi]

18 hours ago, CarnivalShips480 said:

Yes, also Legend will be in Tampa from November 2024 through April 2025. 

 

I saw Liberty's name on Grand Cayman port schedules, so I assume that it is going to New Orleans in Glory's spot.

 

NOLA deserves a better ship.  TBH should send Magic or Breeze over there.

[CarnivalShips480]

29 minutes ago, talkorpi said:

 

NOLA deserves a better ship.  TBH should send Magic or Breeze over there.

They used to have Dream but not enough demand for a bigger ship so they switched it with Valor. Might still not be enough demand for a bigger ship.

Edited December 9, 2022 by CarnivalShips480

[vwrestler171]

4 hours ago, talkorpi said:

 

NOLA deserves a better ship.  TBH should send Magic or Breeze over there.

 

3 hours ago, CarnivalShips480 said:

They used to have Dream but not enough demand for a bigger ship so they switched it with Valor. Might still not be enough demand for a bigger ship.

Agreed, they had to discount Dream to get it to sail full, but the demand was there for 2 smaller ships.  They MIGHT send a Dream class ship there, but I wouldn't hold my breath.  

[slavigne5577]

Well, I saled Dream out of Nola and would continue. Glory  on the other hand, I have been looking at other lines out of Nola.

[BlerkOne]

8 hours ago, CarnivalShips480 said:

They used to have Dream but not enough demand for a bigger ship so they switched it with Valor. Might still not be enough demand for a bigger ship.

Considering how many cabins Carnival is giving away on all ships, they might as well move Mardi Gras to New Orleans!

[tidecat]

On 12/9/2022 at 10:24 AM, CarnivalShips480 said:

They used to have Dream but not enough demand for a bigger ship so they switched it with Valor. Might still not be enough demand for a bigger ship.

I think it's also a case of demand being exceptionally strong out of Galveston. Pre-Covid the plan was to have four ships out of Galveston: Radiance, Breeze, Dream, and Vista. Covid obviously forced that to be dialed back, but Jubilee makes up 5,300 of the 7,000 lower berths between Vista and Radiance, and still represents around 1,300 additional lower berths compared to what Carnival had in Galveston prior to the shutdown.

[Itried4498]

21 minutes ago, tidecat said:

I think it's also a case of demand being exceptionally strong out of Galveston. Pre-Covid the plan was to have four ships out of Galveston: Radiance, Breeze, Dream, and Vista. Covid obviously forced that to be dialed back, but Jubilee makes up 5,300 of the 7,000 lower berths between Vista and Radiance, and still represents around 1,300 additional lower berths compared to what Carnival had in Galveston prior to the shutdown.

The Radiance would’ve likely replaced another ship in Galveston, but Carnival changed its deployment to Port Canaveral when plans finalized, sending the Breeze to Fort Lauderdale.  
 

Of course, COVID happened and the Radiance ended up in Long Beach after RCL announced it would re-enter the Los Angeles market, using a ship that had been recently renovated for the intention of weekend Miami cruises.  Gotta be competitive… 

[tidecat]

1 hour ago, Itried4498 said:

The Radiance would’ve likely replaced another ship in Galveston, but Carnival changed its deployment to Port Canaveral when plans finalized, sending the Breeze to Fort Lauderdale.

You're mixing up the timing.

 

Carnival Valor moved from Galveston to New Orleans in May 2019, along with Glory from Miami to New Orleans:

Carnival bringing new cruise ships to New Orleans in 2019 | Business News | nola.com

This effectively was a three-way-trade, as Galveston lost Valor and gained the Dream; New Orelans lost Dream and Triumph (Sunrise) and gained Glory and Valor; and Fort Lauderdale (not Miami) wound up with Sunrise, only to lose it to Miami.

 

Back in November 2018, Carnival announced Radiance would sail from Port Canaveral starting in 2020 (I was on the second-to-last Victory sailing out of Miami), but those plans changed even prior to the shutdown:

Carnival Radiance featuring Shaq restaurant to call Port Canaveral home – Orlando Sentinel

 

It was announced in October 2019 that four ships would operate out of Galveston from May 2021, including Radiance and Breeze. Breese was a replacement for Carnival Freedom:

News Flash • Port of Galveston, TX • CivicEngage

Carnival Cruise Line to bring Carnival Radiance to Galveston, make other changes - Houston Business Journal (bizjournals.com)

 

Then in July 2020, Carnival announced Radiance would be sent directly to Long Beach in April 2021:

CARNIVAL CRUISE LINE ANNOUNCES UPDATES TO FLEET PLAN | Carnival Cruise Line News (carnival-news.com)

The July 2020 announcement also marked the withdrawal from Fort Lauderdale as Sunrise would take over for Sensation in Miami 

[Itried4498]

2 hours ago, tidecat said:

You're mixing up the timing.

 

Carnival Valor moved from Galveston to New Orleans in May 2019, along with Glory from Miami to New Orleans:

Carnival bringing new cruise ships to New Orleans in 2019 | Business News | nola.com

This effectively was a three-way-trade, as Galveston lost Valor and gained the Dream; New Orelans lost Dream and Triumph (Sunrise) and gained Glory and Valor; and Fort Lauderdale (not Miami) wound up with Sunrise, only to lose it to Miami.

 

Back in November 2018, Carnival announced Radiance would sail from Port Canaveral starting in 2020 (I was on the second-to-last Victory sailing out of Miami), but those plans changed even prior to the shutdown:

Carnival Radiance featuring Shaq restaurant to call Port Canaveral home – Orlando Sentinel

 

It was announced in October 2019 that four ships would operate out of Galveston from May 2021, including Radiance and Breeze. Breese was a replacement for Carnival Freedom:

News Flash • Port of Galveston, TX • CivicEngage

Carnival Cruise Line to bring Carnival Radiance to Galveston, make other changes - Houston Business Journal (bizjournals.com)

 

Then in July 2020, Carnival announced Radiance would be sent directly to Long Beach in April 2021:

CARNIVAL CRUISE LINE ANNOUNCES UPDATES TO FLEET PLAN | Carnival Cruise Line News (carnival-news.com)

The July 2020 announcement also marked the withdrawal from Fort Lauderdale as Sunrise would take over for Sensation in Miami 

I stand corrected.

 

In early 2021, RCL announced its return to Los Angeles beginning June 2022 (later bumped up to fall 2021).  Some reports indicate that this service was to be announced in 2020 but was delayed due to the pandemic (whereas others claim it happened only because of the pandemic).  If this is true, it would’ve forced Carnival’s hand anyway since the Imagination/ Inspiration were simply not competitive ships vs. the Navigator.  Thus, I wouldn’t have been surprised if the Radiance would’ve been moved to SoCal anyway.

[tidecat]

7 hours ago, Itried4498 said:

I stand corrected.

 

In early 2021, RCL announced its return to Los Angeles beginning June 2022 (later bumped up to fall 2021).  Some reports indicate that this service was to be announced in 2020 but was delayed due to the pandemic (whereas others claim it happened only because of the pandemic).  If this is true, it would’ve forced Carnival’s hand anyway since the Imagination/ Inspiration were simply not competitive ships vs. the Navigator.  Thus, I wouldn’t have been surprised if the Radiance would’ve been moved to SoCal anyway.

What Royal (or Norwegian) do with any particular one ship doesn't dictate what Carnival does. Carnival's strategy is to maximize the number of drive-in homeports and departure dates. Having two ships doing 3-4 day cruises in the nation's second largest metropolitan area - not to mention Miracle originally being scheduled to sail seasonally out of San Diego - was very much consistent with that.

 

California requires shore power for the ships that homeport there and given Victory/Radiance was out of service during a very extended dry dock, it made sense to add it then. If Imagination and Inspiration are still around, there's no guarantee Carnival would have done that. Royal also has a different dynamic in that their fleet is global - they don't have the number of brands Carnival Corporation does - so getting Navigator to Los Angeles was a good response to Carnival's move with Radiance. If Carnival Cruise Line felt a response was necessary, there would have been other ships due for drydock to facilitate the shore power conversion. Anyone of Breeze, Dream, Glory, Liberty, Magic, Sunrise, or Valor could have made the move. It's also possible Imagination and Inspiration could have received new features in a 2020 or 2021 drydock (perhaps similar to the Paradise and Elation drydocks) had those actually happened.

[CarnivalShips480]

17 hours ago, Itried4498 said:

I stand corrected.

 

In early 2021, RCL announced its return to Los Angeles beginning June 2022 (later bumped up to fall 2021).  Some reports indicate that this service was to be announced in 2020 but was delayed due to the pandemic (whereas others claim it happened only because of the pandemic).  If this is true, it would’ve forced Carnival’s hand anyway since the Imagination/ Inspiration were simply not competitive ships vs. the Navigator.  Thus, I wouldn’t have been surprised if the Radiance would’ve been moved to SoCal anyway.

Radiance had to move to Long Beach because Imagination + Inspiration were sold.