Incidents on board and security

[Kentman]

I was on the Ventura cruise and the group that caused the commotion on the second day were hooked off at Madeira. (An armed policeman was getting off the ship the same time as we were.) Not sure if there was a stabbing or not but it seemed that it was quite serious. From someone who was "there" it seems that one of the group was attacking the medical staff who were attending the injured person who it seems was another member of the group.

 

With regard to the grooming of the child, it is alleged that a guard was placed outside this persons cabin to restrict them leaving. (The launderette talk was that something happened in one of the hot tubs.)

 

The number of people who were taken ill and off loaded was considerable, in fact in one port. St Marteen, we had to return 45 minutes after we had left to offload someone else who had been taken ill.. This was after we were delayed leaving while waiting for an ambulance to collect a sick passenger and companion. On a sad note I heard from a reliable source that over 10 people had died on the cruise.

[zap99]

56 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

I've no problem with that. I've never mentioned drinks packages or those kind of people but I'm the one that's getting all the flack!  I do believe that price slashing is a factor in the problem and will take some convincing otherwise - open to being proved wrong of course.

 

Princess was mentioned by some earlier regarding drinks packages. I've yet to see a fire sale over there or on RC or Celebrity.  NCL have a stated policy since restart that they will not go down the cutting prices route.  There is a connection.

 

There's also a connection much as I hate to say it, to football.  Not heard back what was on in Brodies re the Iona incident but looking at the time 9.00pm ties in with UK football matches evening kick offs . On all my winter cruises P&O have taken to using football matches as a cheap form of entertainment on-board the bigger ships. Brodies tends to be set up as a sports bar with numerous tv screens to show sport on.  Lots of drinking all day combined with many different people who generally support different teams and taking into account the latest post, come from different parts of the UK, is not a good mixture.  

 

The other problem that I have encountered is that the bad behaviour comes from large groups (often families with multi generation members) not individuals. They of course feed of each other and the nuisance grows accordingly.

Not having experienced drunken behaviour I fully accept your analysis. As for price cutting, I get several emails a day detailing the latest RC, X bargains.  If fact got one just now from CC with a list of offers from their trusted TA partner. Actually on Britannia in the Caribbean we did have a drunk that kept coming up to us on the deck party......can I have a dance...no....oh please I only want one dance....DW said ,go on dance with her she may go away...I did..and she did..problem gone away.

[Megabear2]

6 minutes ago, zap99 said:

Not having experienced drunken behaviour I fully accept your analysis. As for price cutting, I get several emails a day detailing the latest RC, X bargains.  If fact got one just now from CC with a list of offers from their trusted TA partner. Actually on Britannia in the Caribbean we did have a drunk that kept coming up to us on the deck party......can I have a dance...no....oh please I only want one dance....DW said ,go on dance with her she may go away...I did..and she did..problem gone away.

Yes, I get the bargains too but they aren't offering totally low presum loss preventing prices in the same way P&O appear to be doing.  

 

With all the cutbacks on things others are speaking about it is very possible that those not interested in anything other sun and drink are very glad of the cut pricing.  Drinks packages aside the P&O on-board pricing is probably also in no way restrictive compared with the other lines.

[paulatsea]

6 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

So not a totally British cruise then.  I've sailed MSC, never seen bad behaviour either but a totally different clientele. Comparisons of that type aren't any more helpful than those being put forward by those asking why Princess don't have the same question asked.

 

You seem to have a personal problem with me for raising a question I considered valid. No point in discussions continuing really as it's just become a slanging match between people. Very sad that some have seen fit to get personal but there you are.  Most of the posts and comments seem to indicate others have had reason to be concerned, this isn't a thread of me moaning which it appears certain people think it is. 

 

As I said earlier the thread reignited as others started to post experiences and that's nothing to do with me although I do of course have an opinion.

MB - Would you recommend MSC ? It’s not one I have thought about trying.

 

 

[Megabear2]

2 minutes ago, paulatsea said:

MB - Would you recommend MSC ? It’s not one I have thought about trying.

 

 

I enjoyed my cruises with them very much.  However I've always sailed out of Miami so the UK departures aren't something I've experience of.  I liked very much the mixture of nationalities and entertainment being geared to this, clever. The dining experience was good.

 

Although I sailed all.inclusive there were still things that were extras (bowling and arcade games being two) but overall sailing alone I found most things I needed were included.

 

Unfortunately MSC have.moved away from offering cheap singles deals so are now somewhat out of my budget but I'd definitely sail with them again particularly on the ships like Divina.  Ive.not tried the Seaside class so can't comment on those but the new ships are beautiful inside. 

 

I'm thinking of doing one of their cruises that takes in Saudi as it is somewhere not particularly accessible and a controlled environment to visit the area seems the perfect choice. 

[zap99]

11 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

Yes, I get the bargains too but they aren't offering totally low presum loss preventing prices in the same way P&O appear to be doing.  

 

With all the cutbacks on things others are speaking about it is very possible that those not interested in anything other sun and drink are very glad of the cut pricing.  Drinks packages aside the P&O on-board pricing is probably also in no way restrictive compared with the other lines.

Just a thought, but why would folk intent on booze.and sun go on cruise when a week AI in a Mediterranean hotel is £5/600. We are of to Majorca in June .........nuf said.🤣

[Megabear2]

1 minute ago, zap99 said:

Just a thought, but why would folk intent on booze.and sun go on cruise when a week AI in a Mediterranean hotel is £5/600. We are of to Majorca in June .........nuf said.🤣

Because some on Britannia at Christmas paid £799 for two weeks in the Caribbean at a time when it was cold and miserable?

 

The last minute prices are very, very cheap.  I nearly booked Arvia end of February as it was £999 but changed my mind due to reports.  Booked Aurora in April instead for £1,700 still very cheap for 19 nights. Yes, they're inside cabins but many won't care.

[zap99]

2 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

Because some on Britannia at Christmas paid £799 for two weeks in the Caribbean at a time when it was cold and miserable?

 

The last minute prices are very, very cheap.  I nearly booked Arvia end of February as it was £999 but changed my mind due to reports.  Booked Aurora in April instead for £1,700 still very cheap for 19 nights. Yes, they're inside cabins but many won't care.

+£40pppd for all that booze. That's.  X + 🤔🤔, or 40 × 14 =🤔🤔. That's...lots.

[Tablelamp]

Reading about the dreadful plane crash in Nepal rather puts our petty moans into perspective.  However I do hanker after the old days when people were so polite to each other and well behaved.

[Megabear2]

1 minute ago, zap99 said:

+£40pppd for all that booze. That's.  X + 🤔🤔, or 40 × 14 =🤔🤔. That's...lots.

It may well be but judging how busy the bars were I assume it didn't enter their thinking.  Without causing more ructions I think many were a long way over the 15 drinks, particularly when the draft beers ran out - 2 bottles to a pint means 15 drinks go very quickly.

 

I have no idea what a reasonable drinking night out costs ashore or on-board but I asked a member of the family who's a teacher in her 30s and apparently they don't turn a hair at £100 to £150.  I was astonished but I assume they budget it in on holiday too.

[Dermotsgirl]

2 hours ago, happy v said:

I read yorkpetes post last night and thought nothing of it but thought I would let others reply. However looking now it seems some are offended by this. So my two penn'oth....

I think this was misconception and the men were from the N.E. For 'love' you could insert madam. Means exactly the same thing. He would be offering her a seat as he would feel uncomfortable sitting if a lady was standing. Rather than a sexual connotation. Also up here everyone talks to each other, in a queue, on a bus etc. It isn't odd. If I showed this post to people the general conception would be 'she had a stick up her back____!'

So sorry for the essay but I am trying to stop this descending into anarchy 

 

I think you might be adding fuel to the fire, rather than stopping the thread descending into anarchy! 

 

I think this is the quote you are referring to 

 

'One night I was at the roulette wheel with my wife and one drunkard kept saying 'come and sit down love' to her whilst another said 'dont worry he is just a cruise playboy'

 

I wasn't aware of the where the men came from, but I don't think it really matters.

 

When I come from (near London) a man might say, 'ere, luv, 'ave my seat'. Nothing wrong with that, the offer would be accepted or declined and that would be that.

 

In the scenario described, if sounded like a drunk was constantly harrasing the woman, after she'd said no thanks. As the friend made excuses for him (he's just a cruise playboy) it sounded like that drunk wasn't just offering his seat - it sounded like he wanted the woman to sit next to him, no doubt to breathe his beery fumes into the woman's face.  

 

I don't know if you are a man or a woman, but most women don't like being hassled by drunks. I'm also a bit surprised that a woman who doesn't accept this sort of thing is deemed to 'have a stick up her back'. It's almost like revisiting the 1970's - I thought we had moved on a bit since then 

Edited January 17, 2023 by Dermotsgirl

[PaulManchester]

This site would be a lot nicer if some of the people using it were just more honest. 
Nowadays, thankfully, with the expansion of the cruising industry over recent years, a cruise holiday, even one around the Caribbean, is within the financial reach of people and families that couldn’t possibly have experienced a cruise even 10-15 years ago. 
This means it is less exclusive, and certainly less of a status symbol to go on a cruise. 
Most people, like myself, welcome this and see it as a great thing. I’ve been cruising for many many years and often return to P and O precisely because they are a budget cruise line, and relative to the industry, they always have been. They ALWAYS have been. I love the different types of passenger one gets to interact with on a typical P and O sailing. 
 

Sadly, and predictably, some people will never forgive P and O for making the joy of cruising more accessible in recent years. You only have to read this and other threads to witness it. 
 

I have news for those people: It ain’t gonna change. Even when you thought you were upmarket by cruising on P and O, you weren’t. You were cruising on a line which has always been (certainly in the last 40 years or so) at the more budget end of the industry. And all power to P and O for it. 
 

“These type of people” are welcome to sit alongside me on any of my cruises. As they always have been. And do you know how many incidents of poor behaviour towards me and/or my companions my attitude of life and let live have resulted in? None. Zero. Zilch. Nada. 

Maybe that’s a clue. 

[paulatsea]

7 minutes ago, PaulManchester said:

This site would be a lot nicer if some of the people using it were just more honest. 
Nowadays, thankfully, with the expansion of the cruising industry over recent years, a cruise holiday, even one around the Caribbean, is within the financial reach of people and families that couldn’t possibly have experienced a cruise even 10-15 years ago. 
This means it is less exclusive, and certainly less of a status symbol to go on a cruise. 
Most people, like myself, welcome this and see it as a great thing. I’ve been cruising for many many years and often return to P and O precisely because they are a budget cruise line, and relative to the industry, they always have been. They ALWAYS have been. I love the different types of passenger one gets to interact with on a typical P and O sailing. 
 

Sadly, and predictably, some people will never forgive P and O for making the joy of cruising more accessible in recent years. You only have to read this and other threads to witness it. 
 

I have news for those people: It ain’t gonna change. Even when you thought you were upmarket by cruising on P and O, you weren’t. You were cruising on a line which has always been (certainly in the last 40 years or so) at the more budget end of the industry. And all power to P and O for it. 
 

“These type of people” are welcome to sit alongside me on any of my cruises. As they always have been. And do you know how many incidents of poor behaviour towards me and/or my companions my attitude of life and let live have resulted in? None. Zero. Zilch. Nada. 

Maybe that’s a clue. 

Rubbish 

[Megabear2]

25 minutes ago, PaulManchester said:

This site would be a lot nicer if some of the people using it were just more honest. 
Nowadays, thankfully, with the expansion of the cruising industry over recent years, a cruise holiday, even one around the Caribbean, is within the financial reach of people and families that couldn’t possibly have experienced a cruise even 10-15 years ago. 
This means it is less exclusive, and certainly less of a status symbol to go on a cruise. 
Most people, like myself, welcome this and see it as a great thing. I’ve been cruising for many many years and often return to P and O precisely because they are a budget cruise line, and relative to the industry, they always have been. They ALWAYS have been. I love the different types of passenger one gets to interact with on a typical P and O sailing. 
 

Sadly, and predictably, some people will never forgive P and O for making the joy of cruising more accessible in recent years. You only have to read this and other threads to witness it. 
 

I have news for those people: It ain’t gonna change. Even when you thought you were upmarket by cruising on P and O, you weren’t. You were cruising on a line which has always been (certainly in the last 40 years or so) at the more budget end of the industry. And all power to P and O for it. 
 

“These type of people” are welcome to sit alongside me on any of my cruises. As they always have been. And do you know how many incidents of poor behaviour towards me and/or my companions my attitude of life and let live have resulted in? None. Zero. Zilch. Nada. 

Maybe that’s a clue. 

So we're back to accusing people of being snobs based on one person's comment on "these type of people". I don't personally know that lady but she is entitled to speak as she finds.

 

I'd never cruised before 2008 so doubt I've sailed in the "golden era of cruising" as I certainly couldn't afford to before that so assumedly fall into your "new cruiser" era.  Actually thinking about it, I took out a bank loan for my first cruise to enable me to fulfil a wish of my mother for her 80th birthday by sailing on the QE2 and until her death sailed with her as her companion so yes costs were more prohibitive.

 

However what you don't appear to like is the fact that some who post here are being honest, it's just not your honesty.  

 

Live and let live?? Shame the drunk who accosted me and ruined my holiday didn't think about that and then I might not have had to mention it here or anywhere else.  In fact live and let live isn't too high on your agenda if you think its appropriate to attack others on here as dishonest and not nice.

[Eglesbrech]

50 minutes ago, PaulManchester said:

This site would be a lot nicer if some of the people using it were just more honest. 
Nowadays, thankfully, with the expansion of the cruising industry over recent years, a cruise holiday, even one around the Caribbean, is within the financial reach of people and families that couldn’t possibly have experienced a cruise even 10-15 years ago. 
This means it is less exclusive, and certainly less of a status symbol to go on a cruise. 
Most people, like myself, welcome this and see it as a great thing. I’ve been cruising for many many years and often return to P and O precisely because they are a budget cruise line, and relative to the industry, they always have been. They ALWAYS have been. I love the different types of passenger one gets to interact with on a typical P and O sailing. 
 

Sadly, and predictably, some people will never forgive P and O for making the joy of cruising more accessible in recent years. You only have to read this and other threads to witness it. 
 

I have news for those people: It ain’t gonna change. Even when you thought you were upmarket by cruising on P and O, you weren’t. You were cruising on a line which has always been (certainly in the last 40 years or so) at the more budget end of the industry. And all power to P and O for it. 
 

“These type of people” are welcome to sit alongside me on any of my cruises. As they always have been. And do you know how many incidents of poor behaviour towards me and/or my companions my attitude of life and let live have resulted in? None. Zero. Zilch. Nada. 

Maybe that’s a clue. 

I take it you have been reading this site in the background for a while to have formed such very definite opinions?

 

Given this is only your third post I’ll be extremely interested to hear more of your views over time.

[Fionboard]

3 hours ago, terrierjohn said:

Iona has a design flaw, in that Brodies has no direct access aftwards on the ship. Both Brodies and the Casino can be accessed forward, towards the theatre, but only the casino has access aftward.

This results in the casino, which compared to the other large ships, is quite a small area, becoming very crowded, especially as the theatre empties or a show is due to start, and crowded areas can lead to confrontations, especially where drink is involved.

Absolutely. The Casino is a dreadful 'pinchpoint' for crowds exiting the theatre. Bad design.

[Fionboard]

P&O do employ extra security (ex service and police personnel) for short booze cruises. Spoke to some in Havana on 4 night Amsterdam cruise in May. They said that trouble on the whole is not too bad. 

[Happy afloat]

16 minutes ago, Fionboard said:

P&O do employ extra security (ex service and police personnel) for short booze cruises. Spoke to some in Havana on 4 night Amsterdam cruise in May. They said that trouble on the whole is not too bad. 

Perhaps the amount of security staff is not the only problem, more so P&O's apparent reluctance to act speedily and firmly with any initial bad behaviour? 

I can't help but think a "short, sharp shock" and a public announcement as to the offenders punishment and the fact that their behaviour is unacceptable,  may have a calming effect on any further wrongdoing? 

Just a thought....

[Yorkypete]

7 hours ago, Megabear2 said:

That's an interesting observation.  If the venue was full to overflowing what was happening there to cause this situation?  A special event, quiz, football or is the place just too small for the number wanting to use it?

 

My experience is Brodies on any ship tends to house those who don't want to wander from venue to venue as P&O closes certain places and makes them "dead" rather than keeping all areas with entertainment all the time.

I believe the place was just too small...and possibly people like the pub atmospere. It was not a special night although football was on nearly every night.

 

[jeanlyon]

The only time I have witnessed bad behaviour was on the only cruise we did on Azura.  I never considered P&O to be upmarket at all, but the language and abuse thrown at my husband on that ship had to be seen to be believed.  Not seen anything like that on Aurora or Arcadia.

[Yorkypete]

4 hours ago, happy v said:

I read yorkpetes post last night and thought nothing of it but thought I would let others reply. However looking now it seems some are offended by this. So my two penn'oth....

I think this was misconception and the men were from the N.E. For 'love' you could insert madam. Means exactly the same thing. He would be offering her a seat as he would feel uncomfortable sitting if a lady was standing. Rather than a sexual connotation. Also up here everyone talks to each other, in a queue, on a bus etc. It isn't odd. If I showed this post to people the general conception would be 'she had a stick up her back____!'

So sorry for the essay but I am trying to stop this descending into anarchy 

 

For your information my wife prefers to stand and the seats are for players only(supposedly). The man concerned offered a seat next to him which she turned down TWICE. He would not take no for an answer.Thankfully my wife, an ex manager responsible for around 100 people can handle these type of situations otherwise....?

[happy v]

13 minutes ago, Yorkypete said:

For your information my wife prefers to stand and the seats are for players only(supposedly). The man concerned offered a seat next to him which she turned down TWICE. He would not take no for an answer.Thankfully my wife, an ex manager responsible for around 100 people can handle these type of situations otherwise....?

I didn't know this. I've only ever passed through the casino. I was just trying to say sometimes people perceive things differently. However given your wife's job she would know this so I apologise.

[Megabear2]

26 minutes ago, Yorkypete said:

I believe the place was just too small...and possibly people like the pub atmospere. It was not a special night although football was on nearly every night.

 

Thanks for the clarification.  I am on Iona on 18 March so it will still be football season.  I appreciate many, myself included like footbal, but it does seem a cheapskate way to provide entertainment in a venue if it's chosen to screen virtually every PL match.

 

I agree with your other comments about drunken behaviour and repeated pushing of questions at people.  My own husband deflected the situation with me and he's not easily angered however others may not be so calm.  Sadly if someone reacts in defence of a loved one they too will find themselves in trouble and all because a family member was being tormented.

[doog442]

5 hours ago, Megabear2 said:

Princess was mentioned by some earlier regarding drinks packages. I've yet to see a fire sale over there or on RC or Celebrity.  NCL have a stated policy since restart that they will not go down the cutting prices route.  There is a connection.

 

 

 

P&O need to fill these ships, especially the Arvia. Princess did have a fire sale last year but they did it differently. They basically gave the premier package away and kept cabin prices a little higher. It was clever marketing perhaps for experienced cruisers or those aware of the value of a Princess drinks package - no issues with anti social behaviour that we saw and filled the ships.. P&O however are going with bargain basement type pricing as you say, indeed my postie was sticking a P&O leaflet in every door today..big yellow letters £1199 two weeks Caribbean. 

 

The thing is. That £1199 cabin is still £2400 for two. Add on drinks, (package or not ) and everything else associated , a few tours, airport parking, internet whatever and its not a cheap holiday easily approaching £4k if big drinkers.  

 

Some things have changed lately however. £3k would ordinarily get you a very nice 5 star AI hotel for two weeks in Mexico, or the DR at this time of year but prices have gone nuts, hence these P&0 cruises suddenly look incredible value . Not so much Barbados as you said (always expensive), or St Lucia / Antigua. So perhaps we're seeing a short term switch of folk who ordinarily wouldn't cruise (which is what P&O want)

 

I don't think this is going to be typical or a trend. I think there's probably a bit of a correction in the market at the moment and perhaps the clientele (who's idea of fun is different)  due to crazy pricing elsewhere.

 

If it is a trend then P&0 will need to play catchup pronto as threads like this aren't good reading. 

 

 

 

Edited January 17, 2023 by doog442

[majortom10]

10 hours ago, kalos said:

Thinking about this problem away from ships for a moment reminds me of a guy i know.

He took redundancy from his job and bought a pub that struggled and he came up with 

the idea "£10 and sup what you want ." This really took off and was a success bringing 

punters in from all walks of life with very little problems .

Now he went on to buy adjoining buildings out and became big .

With being big came bigger problems ,drunken fights , bouncers for crowd control .

People getting barred were those "type of people" from well to do backgrounds and the 

not so well to do back grounds .

The problems started when he went bigger and a party pub .

Going back to the ships most (but not all) seem to be on the bigger ships and party style .

Maybe that explains why sleepy old Saga and ships like Arcadia seem to dodge these 

problems . Bigger the ship, bigger the crowd , throw in a cheap price more chance of a 

problem. Nowt to do with if your rich or poor, young or old , it's how you are brought up. 

Not necessarily because once Arcadia and Aurora were bigger ships. The only really upsetting scenes of drunken behaviour in all the cruises we have done was in Carmen's Lounge on Aurora where an extended family used to eat first sitting and then head for Carmen's for the duration of the night. Every night they got drunk were very loud with the kids running around the dance floor when acts were performing. After many requests by staff nothing changed and by 11pm people were heading into Carmen's for second show and couldn't get a seat because all the children were lying on them asleep. Nothing to do with size of ship and was before drinks packages it is just purely down to the people onboard.