No Alcohol in any UK ports - what! 😱

[flamingo_fancies]

2 minutes ago, podgeandrodge said:

Good points.  NCL are allowing the discontent from this to spread beyond even the people on the ships right now, and annoy those of us who are planning or contemplating another NCL cruise.  Making that statement and refusing the elaborate (especially when the wording with the "may" is so vague!) is unacceptable.  And then letting crew get screwed over by suggesting a drop in the DSC.  

 

My only disagreement with you - if I was on a ship right now in port in the UK and wanting a beer, I'd be seriously píssed!  (Or NOT píssed actually as no alchol 🙂  )

I did put "most" there's always one😆😆

[Greener123]

Message from the Dawn 14th Facebook page, message received from NCL staff - restrictions have been reviewed and now lifted - full service resumed.

 

still no explanation of what the issues were and obviously still the question over if it’ll happen again at random or continue to happen at Italian and Greek ports. 

[podgeandrodge]

5 minutes ago, Greener123 said:

Message from the Dawn 14th Facebook page, message received from NCL staff - restrictions have been reviewed and now lifted - full service resumed.

 

still no explanation of what the issues were and obviously still the question over if it’ll happen again at random or continue to happen at Italian and Greek ports. 

Good news, sounds like something was going on behind the scenes to fix so.  It was not sustainable really, and this thread was probably the fastest growing thread in quite a while, with the potential to become more viral.  If you get a copy of the message please post it!

[Greener123]

Possibly need the couple of posters actually onboard to confirm too, could be headoffice getting ahead of themselves 

[Funky Fusion FoodsJ]

Though some posters are very passionate in thier discussion of this issue, it really is fairly insignificant in the overall perception and success of NCL operations.  I see no need (and it wouldn't happen anyway) for NCL to make a blanket apology:  that really only makes it more of an issue in the eyes of the many who consider it a very minor inconvenience.  

[Krydstosser]

What about the issues in Livorno and Civitavechia? 

[Greener123]

4 minutes ago, Funky Fusion FoodsJ said:

Though some posters are very passionate in thier discussion of this issue, it really is fairly insignificant in the overall perception and success of NCL operations.  I see no need (and it wouldn't happen anyway) for NCL to make a blanket apology:  that really only makes it more of an issue in the eyes of the many who consider it a very minor inconvenience.  

I think a lot of people would consider it to be a major issue - to have paid for a service and then it not be provided

 

On my upcoming Breakaway cruise, there’s a couple of ports we won’t be getting off - I wouldn’t want to be sitting in the sun with only water, juice or sprite to drink all day when I’ve paid to have a beer or cocktail… then have a nice dinner at Cagneys with sprite instead of a nice Malbec 

[Krydstosser]

2 minutes ago, Greener123 said:

I think a lot of people would consider it to be a major issue - to have paid for a service and then it not be provided

 

On my upcoming Breakaway cruise, there’s a couple of ports we won’t be getting off - I wouldn’t want to be sitting in the sun with only water, juice or sprite to drink all day when I’ve paid to have a beer or cocktail… then have a nice dinner at Cagneys with sprite instead of a nice Malbec 

I agree its a huge issue!! 

[SouthamptonCruiseFan]

Okay, sorry but long post here but bear with me if you can. Cruise lines, ferry companies and ships stock up with alcohol from "bonded" warehouses here in Southampton to supply on board to their passengers and crew. The booze, and other goods, in these warehouse are stored securely "duty-free". The duties are DEFERRED until they are consumed. If they are consumed outside the UK, no duties or taxes are payable in the UK. If they are consumed in the UK you pay up - afterwards, having accounted for where the supplies took place. You have to be approved to get supplies from a bonded warehouse in the first place as in doing so you effectively agreeing to pay the duties at a later date IF the goods are consumed in the UK. The duties are paid on what the consumer pays (so the duties on the $6 dollar bottle of wine they put on board are payable based on the "retail" of $10 a glass even when supplied as part of a drinks package).

So, if NCL stocked up in the UK they did so from a bonded warehouse. If they didn't they wouldn't have any drink left on board anyway!!

None of this has changed from past years, the rates may have changed but not the rules.

The only problem here is that NCL's model has changed. NCL reserve the right to add a surharge/tax so passengers cover these "local taxes" and are doing so in many locations to get extra cash in. However in the UK the retail price of alcohol is displayed including taxes and duties. They cannot apply their business model here in the UK.

 

Breaking news is that "normal service is being resumed apparently"! Still to be verified though. The only way this has been achieved is that NCL have accepted that in order to do business in the UK they have to pay these duties.

 

If this is true it demonstrates that they were lying last week as the restrictions have not changed!

 

I find it very surprising that NCL didn't see this coming, particularly bearing in mind that NCL's UK office is in Southampton, but the thing I find most worrying is that when they got to Belfast they didn't know what country they were in. I hope HMRC don't accept ignorance as an excuse for this and fine them as well as charging the appropriate taxes.

 

Sadly NCL is being run by a team of accountants in Florida now who send the instructions to the ship without any thought or consideration for the effect on the passengers.

 

I have one more cruise booked with NCL, but I really cannot see that I will be booking another one, which is such a pity as their on board experience has normally been great. 

Edited May 17, 2023 by SouthamptonCruiseFan
Breaking news

[SakeDad]

3 minutes ago, SouthamptonCruiseFan said:

Okay, sorry but long post here but bear with me if you can. Cruise lines, ferry companies and ships stock up with alcohol from "bonded" warehouses here in Southampton to supply on board to their passengers and crew. The booze, and other goods, in these warehouse are stored securely "duty-free". The duties are DEFERRED until they are consumed. If they are consumed outside the UK, no duties or taxes are payable in the UK. If they are consumed in the UK you pay up - afterwards, having accounted for where the supplies took place. You have to be approved to get supplies from a bonded warehouse in the first place as in doing so you effectively agreeing to pay the duties at a later date IF the goods are consumed in the UK. The duties are paid on what the consumer pays (so the duties on the $6 dollar bottle of wine they put on board are payable based on the "retail" of $10 a glass even when supplied as part of a drinks package).

So, if NCL stocked up in the UK they did so from a bonded warehouse. If they didn't they wouldn't have any drink left on board anyway!!

None of this has changed from past years, the rates may have changed but not the rules.

The only problem here is that NCL's model has changed. NCL reserve the right to add a surharge/tax so passengers cover these "local taxes" and are doing so in many locations to get extra cash in. However in the UK the retail price of alcohol is displayed including taxes and duties. They cannot apply their business model here in the UK.

I'm sure someone in NCL is right now trying to figure out what to do next as there is no easy way round this. There is no form or licence they can to complete, or little fee to pay, to fix this!!

I find it very surprising that NCL didn't see this coming, particularly bearing in mind that NCL's UK office is in Southampton, but the thing I find most worrying is that when they got to Belfast they didn't know what country they were in. I hope HMRC don't accept ignorance as an excuse for this and fine them as well as charging the appropriate taxes.

Sadly NCL is being run by a team of accountants in Florida now who send the instructions to the ship without any thought or consideration for the effect on the passengers.

I have one more cruise booked with NCL, but I really cannot see that I will be booking another one, which is such a pity as their on board experience has normally been great. 

While I get all that....this is not NCL's first cruise from the UK. They have ZERO excuse for this happening,  especially as all other lines had no issues!

 

[SteveH2508]

Probably better not mention Scotland's minimum price per unit of alcohol. That would send NCL's suits into mental meltdown!😈

[SouthamptonCruiseFan]

3 minutes ago, SteveH2508 said:

Probably better not mention Scotland's minimum price per unit of alcohol. That would send NCL's suits into mental meltdown!😈

Not a problem. NCL's prices are way above the minimum pricing levels!! 

[KeithJenner]

I’m not sure how NCLs model has changed. As far as I am aware they have not charged tax in the UK for a few years now. Admittedly I have usually had the package (so may have just missed it), but I didn’t think they were charging.

 

I thought they changed sometime around 2015/16.

[Greener123]

5 minutes ago, SteveH2508 said:

Probably better not mention Scotland's minimum price per unit of alcohol. That would send NCL's suits into mental meltdown!😈

There must be some exclusions for cruise ships where the effective charge is £0

[Greener123]

14 minutes ago, SouthamptonCruiseFan said:

Okay, sorry but long post here but bear with me if you can. Cruise lines, ferry companies and ships stock up with alcohol from "bonded" warehouses here in Southampton to supply on board to their passengers and crew. The booze, and other goods, in these warehouse are stored securely "duty-free". The duties are DEFERRED until they are consumed. If they are consumed outside the UK, no duties or taxes are payable in the UK. If they are consumed in the UK you pay up - afterwards, having accounted for where the supplies took place. You have to be approved to get supplies from a bonded warehouse in the first place as in doing so you effectively agreeing to pay the duties at a later date IF the goods are consumed in the UK. The duties are paid on what the consumer pays (so the duties on the $6 dollar bottle of wine they put on board are payable based on the "retail" of $10 a glass even when supplied as part of a drinks package).

So, if NCL stocked up in the UK they did so from a bonded warehouse. If they didn't they wouldn't have any drink left on board anyway!!

None of this has changed from past years, the rates may have changed but not the rules.

The only problem here is that NCL's model has changed. NCL reserve the right to add a surharge/tax so passengers cover these "local taxes" and are doing so in many locations to get extra cash in. However in the UK the retail price of alcohol is displayed including taxes and duties. They cannot apply their business model here in the UK.

I'm sure someone in NCL is right now trying to figure out what to do next as there is no easy way round this. There is no form or licence they can to complete, or little fee to pay, to fix this!!

I find it very surprising that NCL didn't see this coming, particularly bearing in mind that NCL's UK office is in Southampton, but the thing I find most worrying is that when they got to Belfast they didn't know what country they were in. I hope HMRC don't accept ignorance as an excuse for this and fine them as well as charging the appropriate taxes.

Sadly NCL is being run by a team of accountants in Florida now who send the instructions to the ship without any thought or consideration for the effect on the passengers.

I have one more cruise booked with NCL, but I really cannot see that I will be booking another one, which is such a pity as their on board experience has normally been great. 

How does all that link into the “entitled journeys” bumph form .gov posted previously? 

[insidecabin]

26 minutes ago, SouthamptonCruiseFan said:

Okay, sorry but long post here but bear with me if you can. Cruise lines, ferry companies and ships stock up with alcohol from "bonded" warehouses here in Southampton to supply on board to their passengers and crew. The booze, and other goods, in these warehouse are stored securely "duty-free". The duties are DEFERRED until they are consumed. If they are consumed outside the UK, no duties or taxes are payable in the UK. If they are consumed in the UK you pay up - afterwards, having accounted for where the supplies took place. You have to be approved to get supplies from a bonded warehouse in the first place as in doing so you effectively agreeing to pay the duties at a later date IF the goods are consumed in the UK. The duties are paid on what the consumer pays (so the duties on the $6 dollar bottle of wine they put on board are payable based on the "retail" of $10 a glass even when supplied as part of a drinks package).

So, if NCL stocked up in the UK they did so from a bonded warehouse. If they didn't they wouldn't have any drink left on board anyway!!

None of this has changed from past years, the rates may have changed but not the rules.

The only problem here is that NCL's model has changed. NCL reserve the right to add a surharge/tax so passengers cover these "local taxes" and are doing so in many locations to get extra cash in. However in the UK the retail price of alcohol is displayed including taxes and duties. They cannot apply their business model here in the UK.

 

Breaking news is that "normal service is being resumed apparently"! Still to be verified though. The only way this has been achieved is that NCL have accepted that in order to do business in the UK they have to pay these duties.

 

If this is true it demonstrates that they were lying last week as the restrictions have not changed!

 

I find it very surprising that NCL didn't see this coming, particularly bearing in mind that NCL's UK office is in Southampton, but the thing I find most worrying is that when they got to Belfast they didn't know what country they were in. I hope HMRC don't accept ignorance as an excuse for this and fine them as well as charging the appropriate taxes.

 

Sadly NCL is being run by a team of accountants in Florida now who send the instructions to the ship without any thought or consideration for the effect on the passengers.

 

I have one more cruise booked with NCL, but I really cannot see that I will be booking another one, which is such a pity as their on board experience has normally been great. 

We are in the never say never school.

We are holding off NCL bookings but if they get cheap enough they will still be the best option for the itinerary.

 

All lines are not perfect and many are going through transitions that change the value proposition.

 

They way the ex UK cruises are getting discounted there are some good itinerary at bargain prices.

 

10n starting at £400 base price solo with a cheap(£18) AI package and the optional £155pp service is probably the cheapest line from Southampton at the moment.

 

If this issue has scared a load away more bargains in the pipeline.

 

There was  an Ambassador that went down to entry price £30pppd with grats.

P&O have had a few go under £45pppd entry.

 

Overcapacity in Southampton.

 

 

 

 

[insidecabin]

22 minutes ago, Greener123 said:

How does all that link into the “entitled journeys” bumph form .gov posted previously? 

That is something we as passengers should not have to worry about, we don't with any other cruise line.

[Greener123]

9 minutes ago, insidecabin said:

We are in the never say never school.

We are holding off NCL bookings but if they get cheap enough they will still be the best option for the itinerary.

 

All lines are not perfect and many are going through transitions that change the value proposition.

 

They way the ex UK cruises are getting discounted there are some good itinerary at bargain prices.

 

10n starting at £400 base price solo with a cheap(£18) AI package and the optional £155pp service is probably the cheapest line from Southampton at the moment.

 

If this issue has scared a load away more bargains in the pipeline.

 

There was  an Ambassador that went down to entry price £30pppd with grats.

P&O have had a few go under £45pppd entry.

 

Overcapacity in Southampton.

 

 

 

 

Was in MSC recently and saw a 3 night for $89 + taxes

[fabnfortysomething]

11 minutes ago, insidecabin said:

We are in the never say never school.

We are holding off NCL bookings but if they get cheap enough they will still be the best option for the itinerary.

 

All lines are not perfect and many are going through transitions that change the value proposition.

 

They way the ex UK cruises are getting discounted there are some good itinerary at bargain prices.

 

10n starting at £400 base price solo with a cheap(£18) AI package and the optional £155pp service is probably the cheapest line from Southampton at the moment.

 

If this issue has scared a load away more bargains in the pipeline.

 

There was  an Ambassador that went down to entry price £30pppd with grats.

P&O have had a few go under £45pppd entry.

 

Overcapacity in Southampton.

 

 

 

 

well I was quoted over $8000 for a round trip from Southampton of UK next July

that was for a standard balcony cabin!

[insidecabin]

5 minutes ago, fabnfortysomething said:

well I was quoted over $8000 for a round trip from Southampton of UK next July

that was for a standard balcony cabin!

Follow this year's prices the discount have started, check UK prices

 

Cruise lines love the early bookers paying the inflated rates

[flamingo_fancies]

53 minutes ago, SouthamptonCruiseFan said:

Okay, sorry but long post here but bear with me if you can. Cruise lines, ferry companies and ships stock up with alcohol from "bonded" warehouses here in Southampton to supply on board to their passengers and crew. The booze, and other goods, in these warehouse are stored securely "duty-free". The duties are DEFERRED until they are consumed. If they are consumed outside the UK, no duties or taxes are payable in the UK. If they are consumed in the UK you pay up - afterwards, having accounted for where the supplies took place. You have to be approved to get supplies from a bonded warehouse in the first place as in doing so you effectively agreeing to pay the duties at a later date IF the goods are consumed in the UK. The duties are paid on what the consumer pays (so the duties on the $6 dollar bottle of wine they put on board are payable based on the "retail" of $10 a glass even when supplied as part of a drinks package).

So, if NCL stocked up in the UK they did so from a bonded warehouse. If they didn't they wouldn't have any drink left on board anyway!!

None of this has changed from past years, the rates may have changed but not the rules.

The only problem here is that NCL's model has changed. NCL reserve the right to add a surharge/tax so passengers cover these "local taxes" and are doing so in many locations to get extra cash in. However in the UK the retail price of alcohol is displayed including taxes and duties. They cannot apply their business model here in the UK.

 

Breaking news is that "normal service is being resumed apparently"! Still to be verified though. The only way this has been achieved is that NCL have accepted that in order to do business in the UK they have to pay these duties.

 

If this is true it demonstrates that they were lying last week as the restrictions have not changed!

 

I find it very surprising that NCL didn't see this coming, particularly bearing in mind that NCL's UK office is in Southampton, but the thing I find most worrying is that when they got to Belfast they didn't know what country they were in. I hope HMRC don't accept ignorance as an excuse for this and fine them as well as charging the appropriate taxes.

 

Sadly NCL is being run by a team of accountants in Florida now who send the instructions to the ship without any thought or consideration for the effect on the passengers.

 

I have one more cruise booked with NCL, but I really cannot see that I will be booking another one, which is such a pity as their on board experience has normally been great. 

The rules on "bonded" items in the uk is very very strict. My other half is a Steak Butcher who delt with bonded meat for airlines and also use to supply P&O. All their meat needed to be kept separate and when sending the steaks to the bonded wearhouse they had to box up all the trim and residuals and send it to the warehouse, or sometimes have a specialist company collect it to be incinerated, so it couldn't enter the uk supply chain.

[SouthamptonCruiseFan]

2 hours ago, Greener123 said:

How does all that link into the “entitled journeys” bumph form .gov posted previously? 

So, the entitled journey just means they can 'load' duty free goods onto the ship. So if they a stop on the cruise outside the UK, in Ireland for example, they have an entitled journey.  However this just means they can load it onto the ship without paying the duty up front, they still have to pay the duty on goods consumed per the rules. If the cruise was ONLY to UK ports they would have to pay the duty up front and then could claim back for anything not sold on that cruise.

 

Regarding the nonsense on being a tender port in Scotland:

"For the purposes of ships stores, HMRC consider a ship has arrived at a port once it arrives alongside the berth or where the vessel remains at anchor."

 

NCL seem to be making this up as they go along!!

 

Also, the port agent would arrange much of this and the same port and NCL uses the same port agent as MSC who have no such issues! Go figure.

Edited May 17, 2023 by SouthamptonCruiseFan

[KeithJenner]

15 minutes ago, SouthamptonCruiseFan said:

So, the entitled journey just means they can 'load' duty free goods onto the ship. So if they a stop on the cruise outside the UK, in Ireland for example, they have an entitled journey.  However this just means they can load it onto the ship without paying the duty up front, they still have to pay the duty on goods consumed per the rules. If the cruise was ONLY to UK ports they would have to pay the duty up front and then could claim back for anything not sold on that cruise.

 

Regarding the nonsense on being a tender port in Scotland:

"For the purposes of ships stores, HMRC consider a ship has arrived at a port once it arrives alongside the berth or where the vessel remains at anchor."

 

NCL seem to be making this up as they go along!!

 

Also, the port agent would arrange much of this and the same port and NCL uses the same port agent as MSC who have no such issues! Go figure.

Have NCL made a comment regarding the tender port? All I’ve seen is some mention by people, including me, that it is a tender port, but I haven’t seen anything from NCL (although I could easily have missed something else amongst all the other posts here).

Edited May 17, 2023 by KeithJenner

[SouthamptonCruiseFan]

2 hours ago, KeithJenner said:

I’m not sure how NCLs model has changed. As far as I am aware they have not charged tax in the UK for a few years now. Admittedly I have usually had the package (so may have just missed it), but I didn’t think they were charging.

 

I thought they changed sometime around 2015/16.

They are now charging additional taxes / surcharges in more and more places on both drinks purchased AND those consumed if you have the drinks package.

[hawkeyetlse]

13 minutes ago, SouthamptonCruiseFan said:

They are now charging additional taxes / surcharges in more and more places on both drinks purchased AND those consumed if you have the drinks package.

 

In the (now distant) past I was able to get the taxes charged on beverage package drinks refunded after the cruise, but it's clear that NCL really, really wants to collect this tax. They may stop for a while but it always seems to come back sooner or later. What the actual legal basis is and whether the money is actually reported and passed along to the relevant port/country, I doubt any of us will ever know for sure. But the fact is that they benefit from charging the tax (because it discourages people from using their packages as much as they otherwise would), so they really have no incentive to stop doing it.

 

If anyone has recent experience with contacting NCL about these taxes, whether in the US or Europe or somewhere else, I'd love to hear about it (preferably in a new thread, since it's a distinct issue).