Are Celebrity cost cutting and penny pinching there faithful customers off the ship?

[QuestionEverything]

4 hours ago, TowandaUK said:

We’ve decided to rest X until things settle down. Two reasons being the lovely Silhouette will no longer sail from Southampton. We have no wish to fly and E class ships have no interest for us with infinity balconies and inflated prices. Secondly you are unlikely to get what you booked, by the time you sail. So many alterations after you book.
 

We initially booked a Princess cruise but have since cancelled and booked a Cunard cruise. I had always thought Cunard was too pricey but actually it compares favourably with X. Excursions actually seem a lot cheaper than X!  We love dressing up so are ok with the stricter dress code and are looking forward to trying Cunard. Would like to think we might sail with X again but time will tell. 

You will enjoy Cunard, it has class and excellent lectures - a cruise for intellectuals.

I just booked 2 QM2 TA's post new land tours in 2024 and 2025.

I got a wonderful, thick paper, rectangular thank you note indicating our voyages and a Welcome Aboard.

Class indeed.

[Joker54]

35 minutes ago, tfred said:

I worked in capital equipment sales for 40 years   Software, hardware, support services changed all the time. Along the way I put in 2000+ nights in hotels and 2 million air miles so I know something about the receiving end of the hospitality business

 

The "prime rib" comment is one that is constantly used here on CC.  It seems to be the determinator of "good food" on board. Every time there is a food change (4 shrimp cocktail instead of 5) a handful of people fly off and start complaining instead of looking at the overall quality of the meal

 

my guess is that the team concept will be absolutely the same experience for 99% of suite pax

Thank you for answering my question.

 

I worked in the telecom engineering field for the same contracting company for 22 years. I have 2.6 million miles on just one airline, doesn't count all the others I flew. I was in the first group of Diamond-for-life members with Hilton. I retired 2 years ago after working my way to the C suite.  Not only do I understand the hospitality business, I also understand how demanding customers can be in the business world.

 

All of the above said, I still disagree with you.

 

You wont find any post from me complaining about the food. You will find one post where I complained about the noise in Luminae on an E-Class ship since it affects my hearing aids in a really bad way.

 

Cheers

Edited August 3, 2023 by Joker54

[Joker54]

1 hour ago, cruzeluver said:

I would be curious to know what percentage of the very frequent Elite Plus and up customers still purchase shore excursions, shop at the "recommended" stores, buy photos, art etc. In other words, bring in ancillary revenue.

 

"Familiarity breeds contempt"

We will be Zenith in November if we keep that cruise. We still book shore excursions a lot, shop here and there. We don't do excursions in the Caribbean as have been to those islands so many times. So we admittedly enjoy the "yacht" while everyone else is ashore. And we take 10 to 12 cruises a year. You would probably have a heart attack if you knew how much money we give X every year.

[hankandteri]

13 hours ago, QuestionEverything said:

Well we moved from Celebrity in 2018 due to cutbacks and a desire to have a fully open ship to enjoy, not agreeable to segregation. Went to Oceania, like many former Celebrity customers. Now cancelling Oceania, along with our many travel mates, due to their forced purchase of alcohol and shore excursions called the "Free Simply More" scam. 

 

We too thought Oceania was “our” line, but what we experienced on our first post pandemic cruise with them in June has sent us packing. Some of it could be attributed to a lot of new crew and a very full ship, but the deal breaker was obvious evidence of corporate greed and an utter lack of concern for their guests’ best interests. That’s not the way to treat a very well heeled and very loyal passenger base who are willing to pay a bit more in return for a premium vacation experience. 
 

I can honestly say that our last cruise with Oceania was the worst we’ve ever taken out of dozens of prior cruises, even though we had a penthouse suite on that cruise with butler service and the other perks. It’s also the first time I’ve ever walked off a ship feeling ripped off. 
 

My “worst cruise ever” evaluation includes a bunch of cruises on Carnival and other budget lines, so Oceania had to work at it to disappoint us that much. 

 

A huge percentage of the passengers on that cruise were repeaters like me, and a whole lot of those  told me they wouldn’t be coming back. 
 

Oceania’s parent company (NCL) just released their quarterly numbers and they were spectacular. Great. They delivered an awesome quarter, good for them, but the way they did it alienated many of their loyal customers. 
 

We have booked our next two cruises with Princess and Celebrity to see what they are all about. I know some of the same games will be afoot, but I’m going in with my eyes wide open, a different set of expectations, and at a far lower price point. 

Edited August 3, 2023 by hankandteri

[wineoclock]

If you don’t mind me asking for those looking at Cunard how does it compare to X please & if in Grills to the Retreat. Thank you 

[TowandaUK]

41 minutes ago, wineoclock said:

If you don’t mind me asking for those looking at Cunard how does it compare to X please & if in Grills to the Retreat. Thank you 

We haven’t been yet and are in a balcony room so can’t comment. However there are lots of you tube vlogs out there, and the Cunard site is very good at info. If you look at the Cunard forum on here you will see very few gripes. 

[Jeremiah1212]

On 8/1/2023 at 1:45 PM, lv2cruisgrl said:

It seems she is a bean counter and only wants to make the company more profitable.   In doing so us "Older and Loyal" customers will possibly stop cruising on Celebrity.  She is looking to the next,  younger generation to fill the cabins.  Unfortunately things don't always stay the same in life.  We sail on Beyond again in November and if we dislike all the changes we may cancel our 2024 cruises with them.  Sad....

 

Sad to some, perhaps. They have to be forward thinking. Who is the next customer. The reality is the current crop of Boomers and Silent Gen will phase out of cruising, perhaps sooner than later. All it takes is one loss, a medical mishap or a hit to the finances and they are gone. A new crop of 'older and loyal' customers is what they are aiming to build. Edge class ships will be around in 20 years. Many of the Boomers/Silent Gen aged pax will not be. 

 

One a seven night Caribbean cruise nearly half of the passengers are Boomers (47%). That seems like a lot. However 43% are Gen X/Millennials/Gen Z. That number is what needs to continue to grow. Things will change. Boomers don't cruise the same way their parents did in the 60's and 70's and the Millennials and younger don't cruise the same way their parents did in the 80's and 90's. 

[zitsky]

37 minutes ago, Jeremiah1212 said:

 

Sad to some, perhaps. They have to be forward thinking. Who is the next customer. The reality is the current crop of Boomers and Silent Gen will phase out of cruising, perhaps sooner than later. All it takes is one loss, a medical mishap or a hit to the finances and they are gone. A new crop of 'older and loyal' customers is what they are aiming to build. Edge class ships will be around in 20 years. Many of the Boomers/Silent Gen aged pax will not be. 

 

One a seven night Caribbean cruise nearly half of the passengers are Boomers (47%). That seems like a lot. However 43% are Gen X/Millennials/Gen Z. That number is what needs to continue to grow. Things will change. Boomers don't cruise the same way their parents did in the 60's and 70's and the Millennials and younger don't cruise the same way their parents did in the 80's and 90's. 

I would be interested to see the breakdown not lumping those younger groups together.  Because I am Gen X and 56.  I started cruising in my 50s.  I’d like to better understand how Millennials and Gen Z cruise.  How many and how much do they spend?

[Duanerice1]

Sounds bad but I really don't care.  The market will take care of itself.  Since a cruise is just one of our vacations each year if Celebrity fails to impress then we will move on.  We travel a lot and if we didn't cruise we'd probably be OK with that.

 

That being said, we probably had one of the best cruises ever last April on the Equinox.  Just a very nice cruise.

[numnums]

52 minutes ago, Jeremiah1212 said:

 

Sad to some, perhaps. They have to be forward thinking. Who is the next customer. The reality is the current crop of Boomers and Silent Gen will phase out of cruising, perhaps sooner than later. All it takes is one loss, a medical mishap or a hit to the finances and they are gone. A new crop of 'older and loyal' customers is what they are aiming to build. Edge class ships will be around in 20 years. Many of the Boomers/Silent Gen aged pax will not be. 

 

One a seven night Caribbean cruise nearly half of the passengers are Boomers (47%). That seems like a lot. However 43% are Gen X/Millennials/Gen Z. That number is what needs to continue to grow. Things will change. Boomers don't cruise the same way their parents did in the 60's and 70's and the Millennials and younger don't cruise the same way their parents did in the 80's and 90's. 

I started my first cruise with my friends in my early 20's, Like when I just hit 21.

 

I have another scheduled at the end of this year and next year with a group of similarly aged friends.

 

The only thing I have to say me and the older crowd can agree on, we don't like kids or teenagers... Even if we are relatively close to their age, they're just typically rowdy. (Or me and my friends personalities don't align, we are pretty polite, quiet, shy, etc. So we don't do well with other people who speak very crass and loudly)

 

Things we like... Trendy food, milkshakes, crepes, coffee... Which wasn't offered on the cruise very much, crepes were occasional and waiting a long time on the buffet, milkshakes and smoothies kind of non-existent. We just love frozen& dessert kind of drinks and stuff... Sugary things. Possibly more food variety, but i still loved it nonetheless despite the food shortages.

 

Most of the shows were pretty slow, but we do heavily enjoyed interactive shows and musicals! It was wonderful.

 

Music was...ok in general, they had the classic bangers so we're able to enjoy it on silent disco, silent disco was really fun. The daily activities are fun though! We did archery on the apex and dot painting.

 

Now...If they had more movies to choose from in the room or more movies in the theatre, or an arcade like dance dance revolution or wii games... That could help...

 

And there's my opinion as a millennial-Gen z Fusion. Possibly more Solo staterooms would greatly help too. It's really hard to get my friends to come with me, since they're usually working.

[Bo1953]

3 hours ago, zitsky said:

For some of us, this is about a company changing a contract after payment of a non refundable deposit or final payment.

z - actually we as the passenger have contracted X to take us from the point of embarkation to the point of dis-embarkation with no guarantee of accommodating us in the class for which we were told that was paid for.

 

X has retained thier legal right to change any part of the transportation without prior notice, yet we have the right to go to binding arbitration if there is an issue with what we perceive is not in conformity with X's CoC or gross mis-conduct or gross deviation from the CoC's.

 

We may find a sympathetic Arbiter to rule in our favour to a great degree or not.

 

Which, while very upsetting as posters point out here, not far afield from X's rights. I Am sure if some of us make a big deal out of it, then X, in its' wisdom or charity, can make changes on a case by case basis or across the board.

 

As for changing the contract, the contract has not changed only our expectation of what we believe, without reading the actual contract, we are due or want according to the advertizement and nothing more.

 

bon voyage

 

bon voyage

[sunonfire]

On 8/1/2023 at 3:16 PM, horseymike said:

I have noticed that retired / older people have more free time on their hands to travel / cruise.

They also seem to have budgeted accordingly. With that said , I would not be in any hurry to chase them away, repeat business is the biggest business in the world . Someone’s mistake may end up being someone else’s gain.

A little off topic but I took my first Holland America at age 50. We were just in a regular balcony cabin on a 10 day cruise. Guest services called my cabin every single day of the cruise to see if I was happy or had any issues. My husband asked why do they keep calling. I jokingly said because I have 30 to 40 years to continue cruising. I was their future. The young ones on that cruise were in their 70s and 80s.

[bnurick]

20 minutes ago, Bo1953 said:

z - actually we as the passenger have contracted X to take us from the point of embarkation to the point of dis-embarkation with no guarantee of accommodating us in the class for which we were told that was paid for.

 

X has retained thier legal right to change any part of the transportation without prior notice, yet we have the right to go to binding arbitration if there is an issue with what we perceive is not in conformity with X's CoC or gross mis-conduct or gross deviation from the CoC's.

 

We may find a sympathetic Arbiter to rule in our favour to a great degree or not.

 

Which, while very upsetting as posters point out here, not far afield from X's rights. I Am sure if some of us make a big deal out of it, then X, in its' wisdom or charity, can make changes on a case by case basis or across the board.

 

As for changing the contract, the contract has not changed only our expectation of what we believe, without reading the actual contract, we are due or want according to the advertizement and nothing more.

 

bon voyage

 

bon voyage

 

I concur and read the contract last night. There are services which are changing and as such I believe one would be successful, but a painful process. Since the vaping negatively impacts my asthma and is further documented with my doctor, I think there are other routes to go.

 

In the end, I just want X to make things right and we will have to wait to see how it shakes out here.

[numnums]

1 hour ago, zitsky said:

I would be interested to see the breakdown not lumping those younger groups together.  Because I am Gen X and 56.  I started cruising in my 50s.  I’d like to better understand how Millennials and Gen Z cruise.  How many and how much do they spend?

me and my buddies, we are in our early twenties when we just hit around 22, do not spend on excursions or drinking actually... We spend more on food/dining... If we get excursions it is off ship, such as the chocolate tour in cozumel mexico which wasn't being offered on ship... We shop around on the ports. I think the only thing we would try is the bingo and deal or no deal possibly for the experience, but haven't found a way to fit that into our schedule last time...

 

We like trying out different foods or variety of activities, and the activities and food are usually free... we do specialty dining but they don't have a lot of different restaurants on celebrity ship so we did not spend much... Internet package of course... Nothing else, which is why we are probably only going to buy zero proof package and cruise fare only, with some restaurant reservations.

 

Now if they had every bar have a blender and offered more different desserts that are always available, more icecream (I had my favorite flavor run out extremely fast), it would be a different story... We love trying new things, trendy food... I think the ones you usually see in tiktok or like popular street food that makes the news... We would probably do that, like crepes, japanese style food, dessert french toast... Love juice and smoothies but was very limited on our sailing(can only get those healthy protein smoothies at spa cafe)

 

If the bar with blenders also opened later at night like the pool and mast bar, it would do wonders...

 

Maybe it's different with other younger people, but me and my crowd are very shy and reserved so we only go out when there's not a lot of people, like swimming and enjoying the hot tub pool at night. We have a hard time ordering drinks at the bar because of our personality traits... Which probably adds on why we don't drink much, because we don't know a lot about drinking or the different kind of drinks there is.

 

We do not like vaping or smoking, I'm extremely anti smoking because i struggle to breathe already and i'm terribly afraid of second hand.

 

I hope that helps with your curiosity and understanding! 

Edited August 3, 2023 by numnums
more info

[Bobsgonecoastal]

On 8/1/2023 at 12:16 PM, horseymike said:

I have noticed that retired / older people have more free time on their hands to travel / cruise.

They also seem to have budgeted accordingly. With that said , I would not be in any hurry to chase them away, repeat business is the biggest business in the world . Someone’s mistake may end up being someone else’s gain.

There is a old saying that I’ll paraphrase;

some people have the time, and some people have the money, but few have the time and the money. 
The few describes those of us who are retired and have the wherewithal to cruise on a frequent basis.  Celebrity and others would be wise to remember who really supports the cruise industry while they plan for their future market. Yes, we’re all getting older, but from my vantage point, we are still their most affluent and loyal market.

[zitsky]

1 hour ago, Bo1953 said:

z - actually we as the passenger have contracted X to take us from the point of embarkation to the point of dis-embarkation with no guarantee of accommodating us in the class for which we were told that was paid for.

 

X has retained thier legal right to change any part of the transportation without prior notice, yet we have the right to go to binding arbitration if there is an issue with what we perceive is not in conformity with X's CoC or gross mis-conduct or gross deviation from the CoC's.

 

We may find a sympathetic Arbiter to rule in our favour to a great degree or not.

 

Which, while very upsetting as posters point out here, not far afield from X's rights. I Am sure if some of us make a big deal out of it, then X, in its' wisdom or charity, can make changes on a case by case basis or across the board.

 

As for changing the contract, the contract has not changed only our expectation of what we believe, without reading the actual contract, we are due or want according to the advertizement and nothing more.

 

bon voyage

 

bon voyage

Hey Bo I usually enjoy your posts.  🙂
 

I will save you a table in the buffet when Celebrity decides to remove the Luminae benefit from suite passengers and closes all the specialty restaurants.  Since as you said, they can do whatever they want.

[zitsky]

43 minutes ago, numnums said:

me and my buddies, we are in our early twenties when we just hit around 22, do not spend on excursions or drinking actually... We spend more on food/dining... If we get excursions it is off ship, such as the chocolate tour in cozumel mexico which wasn't being offered on ship... We shop around on the ports. I think the only thing we would try is the bingo and deal or no deal possibly for the experience, but haven't found a way to fit that into our schedule last time...

 

We like trying out different foods or variety of activities, and the activities and food are usually free... we do specialty dining but they don't have a lot of different restaurants on celebrity ship so we did not spend much... Internet package of course... Nothing else, which is why we are probably only going to buy zero proof package and cruise fare only, with some restaurant reservations.

 

Now if they had every bar have a blender and offered more different desserts that are always available, more icecream (I had my favorite flavor run out extremely fast), it would be a different story... We love trying new things, trendy food... I think the ones you usually see in tiktok or like popular street food that makes the news... We would probably do that, like crepes, japanese style food, dessert french toast... Love juice and smoothies but was very limited on our sailing(can only get those healthy protein smoothies at spa cafe)

 

If the bar with blenders also opened later at night like the pool and mast bar, it would do wonders...

 

Maybe it's different with other younger people, but me and my crowd are very shy and reserved so we only go out when there's not a lot of people, like swimming and enjoying the hot tub pool at night. We have a hard time ordering drinks at the bar because of our personality traits... Which probably adds on why we don't drink much, because we don't know a lot about drinking or the different kind of drinks there is.

 

We do not like vaping or smoking, I'm extremely anti smoking because i struggle to breathe already and i'm terribly afraid of second hand.

 

I hope that helps with your curiosity and understanding! 

So how would / do you react if you went out at night to the hot tub or pool but you find out that Celebrity had changed the hours and it was closed?

 

Don’t start drinking.  It’s an expensive habit.  First you think Pabst Blue Ribbon and Iron City are perfectly fine.  Then you start drinking IPAs that cost you $6 everywhere you go.

[Ipeeinthepools]

3 minutes ago, zitsky said:

So how would / do you react if you went out at night to the hot tub or pool but you find out that Celebrity had changed the hours and it was closed?

 

Don’t start drinking.  It’s an expensive habit.  First you think Pabst Blue Ribbon and Iron City are perfectly fine.  Then you start drinking IPAs that cost you $6 everywhere you go.

Iron City?   No one drank that stuff unless you were born in Pittsburgh.

[Bo1953]

15 minutes ago, zitsky said:

Hey Bo I usually enjoy your posts.  🙂
 

I will save you a table in the buffet when Celebrity decides to remove the Luminae benefit from suite passengers and closes all the specialty restaurants.  Since as you said, they can do whatever they want.

LOL - you going to be a chair hog now??? LOL

 

bon appetit and bon voyage

[zitsky]

13 minutes ago, Bo1953 said:

LOL - you going to be a chair hog now??? LOL

 

bon appetit and bon voyage

I won’t be a chair hog.  They closed the pool, don’t you remember?  They can change whatever they want.

[mayleeman]

6 hours ago, tfred said:

I worked in capital equipment sales for 40 years   Software, hardware, support services changed all the time.

 

How many customers would you have had long-term if you started changing what they were getting, if you unilaterally changed refundable deposits to non-refundable, and if your idea of customer service was to require any inquiries to be made on a system that regularly required 1 to 2 hr wait times? Or if you eliminated discounts for repeat customers to enter new contracts, then raised prices, and then kept telling them what a great new deal they were getting? How about if you did all this with nary a peep to your most loyal customers? 

 

I don't disageee that Celebrity has the right under the contract to do many many things. But when they exercise that right in a fashion that inconveniences or disappoints people who have cruised with them as many as 50 to 100 times before, they can expect blowback. As many have explained, it is no individual thing--it is the number of changes without any notice to or accommodation to cruisers affected who have already paid for stuff that used to be available, and was proudly advertised, and then reduced or eliminated.

 

I suspect you paid a heckuva lot more attention to your loyal customers than Celebrity is doing.

[BlackLion 213]

3 hours ago, Bo1953 said:

z - actually we as the passenger have contracted X to take us from the point of embarkation to the point of dis-embarkation with no guarantee of accommodating us in the class for which we were told that was paid for.

 

X has retained thier legal right to change any part of the transportation without prior notice

 

As for changing the contract, the contract has not changed only our expectation of what we believe, without reading the actual contract, we are due or want according to the advertizement and nothing more.

 

I regularly enjoy your posts. However, you’re missing the mark on this one.

 

I have no desire to read, decipher or debate what the contract says they are entitled to get away with once we have paid. It is always appreciated to have an alternate opinion shared here. But pointing out that our contracts essentially say that we are “sadly” out of luck, is anything but comforting.

 

The point is that many long time Celebrity loyalists book and pay in good faith expecting to receive what the website & advertising describes, and in all reality, what we have become accustomed to. It’s called expectations. And while Celebrity can apparently do whatever they want to those expectations, contract-wise, those same loyal customers are upset that Celebrity is not upholding their part of the bargain that we believe we are due. And they are doing so at the expense of said loyal passengers.

 

While I’d like to say I’ll be sharing a table with @zitsky, I likely won’t be anywhere near a Celebrity ship anytime soon.

 

[Ex-Airbalancer]

10 minutes ago, BlackLion 213 said:

 

I regularly enjoy your posts. However, you’re missing the mark on this one.

 

I have no desire to read, decipher or debate what the contract says they are entitled to get away with once we have paid. It is always appreciated to have an alternate opinion shared here. But pointing out that our contracts essentially say that we are “sadly” out of luck, is anything but comforting.

 

The point is that many long time Celebrity loyalists book and pay in good faith expecting to receive what the website & advertising describes, and in all reality, what we have become accustomed to. It’s called expectations. And while Celebrity can apparently do whatever they want to those expectations, contract-wise, those same loyal customers are upset that Celebrity is not upholding their part of the bargain that we believe we are due. And they are doing so at the expense of said loyal passengers.

 

While I’d like to say I’ll be sharing a table with @zitsky, I likely won’t be anywhere near a Celebrity ship anytime soon.

 

Celebrity will not notice that you are not there 

[zitsky]

1 minute ago, Ex-Airbalancer said:

Celebrity will not notice that you are not there 

Ouch.  🙄

[BlackLion 213]

On 8/2/2023 at 4:25 AM, OysterD said:

It's why I largely ignore the negativity from most of the posters who have been complaining non stop. There are maybe 10-15 who consistently post criticism and complaints, mainly about the same things just over and over again, or even worse, just vague references to 'constant cuts'. You get threads 30 pages long about a topic but if you break it down some posters have just opined the same view dozens of times on the thread. 

 

So we have 10 to 15 regularly stating negative views out of roughly 30,000 people who are cruising on Celebrity every week. This board is not at all representative of the cruising population as a whole. I have friends and know people who cruised with Celebrity in Jan, Mar, Apr, and just stepped off a cruise last week. Not a single complaint from anyone, everyone loved it and is looking at booking future cruises.

 

 

Six months ago, I would have agreed with you. The occasional repeated complaint about this or that, and then the responses from others on the same cruise who didn’t experience what was being reported. Celebrity has always had its “cheerleaders” on this forum. Heck, I was certainly one of them.

 

But you cannot deny the shift in the pattern of responses, even in this particular thread. No longer are people wholly disagreeing with the substance of what the op asked. In fact, most seem to agree. And they are providing quantifiable reasons for their new opinion of Celebrity these days.

 

As for being representative of the cruising population... No, of course not! But I am going out on a limb to say it's more so than we believe when it comes to what's right or wrong on board. Without giving Cruise Critic any unnecessary kudos, it is probably the top place where knowledgeable cruising folks turn to discuss matters. So, when things go awry, it gets reported here. It gets discussed here. It gets debated here.

 

We were disgruntled by some of the new changes or ways they have handled things in just the past few months. We had hoped that our cruise on Eclipse would remind us why we liked Celebrity so much, and would make us feel more comfortable with them again.

 

It did anything but. So this once-faithful Elite+ Celebrity cheerleader is looking elsewhere to spend his vacation time & money.