Lawyer already to sue for Celbrity bus accident

[thomasale]

Hell, let's kill all the lawyers (Shakespeare, sort of :)) Lawyers are a necessary part of life whether we like it or not. They are also very easy targets. Hopefully, most people will never be in serious need of the services of a lawyer but, if you are, you will be praying yours is one smart tiger. For the poster who stated lawyers had an enormous effect on healthcare costs, you have been listening to too much rhetoric. Frivolous malpractice suits are an irritant for sure but hardly a dent in the overall costs of healthcare.

I hope you are kidding on this one... I mean the part about "frivolous malpractice suits..."

[BobBeaSea]

I hope you are kidding on this one... I mean the part about "frivolous malpractice suits..."

 

A little bit of tongue in cheek, frivolous lawsuits are a much bigger problem outside of healthcare. The problem is rhetoric, say something over and over and over and all of a sudden, all lawsuits are frivolous. For instance, the cost of malpractice insurance is less than 1% of total healthcare spending, you would have thought with the rhetoric, this cost would be much higher. One hundred thousand people die each year due to medical care mistakes and/or negligence. Redress is needed but saving the butts of the big insurance providers as a prime priority doesn't solve the main issues. ;)

[OceanCruise]

Frivolous malpractice suits are an irritant for sure but hardly a dent in the overall costs of healthcare.

 

As a health care practitioner, I strongly disagree with this statement. So many extra tests are done to prevent the possibility of a future lawsuit and so much time is spent on documentation to cover all the bases. You can be sure if a client develops a brain tumor that some lawyer will sue because 10 years earlier a client had a headache and an MRI wasn't performed back then. Health care practitioners schedule way more follow up visits than are necessary just in case something adverse could possibly happen- otherwise they would be considered negligent in a lawsuit.

[BobBeaSea]

As a health care practitioner, I strongly disagree with this statement. So many extra tests are done to prevent the possibility of a future lawsuit and so much time is spent on documentation to cover all the bases. You can be sure if a client develops a brain tumor that some lawyer will sue because 10 years earlier a client had a headache and an MRI wasn't performed back then. Health care practitioners schedule way more follow up visits than are necessary just in case something adverse could possibly happen- otherwise they would be considered negligent in a lawsuit.

 

I think you missed my point, frivolous lawsuits do not put hardly a dent into healthcare costs...valid lawsuits do. Again, the cost of malpractice insurance is less than 1% of total healthcare costs. As far as authorizing non-required tests, who pays for these tests..the patient and/or their insurance provider, if lucky enough to have one? Are the patients/insurance companies told these tests are for butt covering only? If not, why not? It seems to me there are 4 interested parties to this problem...patients, healthcare providers, insurance companies and lawyers. Why are we zeroing in on the lawyers (and through them, patients) only? Lawyers do make attractive targets in our society, don't they.

[iandjm]

This is utterly pathetic. ACCIDENTS do happen. Why blame Celebrity for peoples own actions? Next they will sue Mercedes for not creating a self steering bus? Its a very sad accident, which we are all deeply sorry happened. People need to stop blaming everything they can. I am afraid this blame and sue culture is ruining both the USA and sadly now the UK.

 

Ian

[Sky Sweet]

A little bit of tongue in cheek, frivolous lawsuits are a much bigger problem outside of healthcare. The problem is rhetoric, say something over and over and over and all of a sudden, all lawsuits are frivolous. For instance, the cost of malpractice insurance is less than 1% of total healthcare spending, you would have thought with the rhetoric, this cost would be much higher. One hundred thousand people die each year due to medical care mistakes and/or negligence. Redress is needed but saving the butts of the big insurance providers as a prime priority doesn't solve the main issues. ;)

 

Then why have so many OB/GYN specialists eliminated Obstetrics from their medical practice, simply because it saves them a fortune in malpractice insurance?

[cechase]

I would have to agree with Sky Sweet on the basis of empirical evidence. Ob/Gyn specialists all over the country have been abandoning their practices because there are a target. Prior to our state passing limits on jury awards for pain and suffering [Nevada], major emergency units were totally shut down. Pretty soon, you will not have anyone to administer the ether, etc. when you have surgery, because again they are a target.

 

When I returned home from a cruise in January and picked up the held mail, I had a "registered letter" from my urologist urging me to come in for an exam. As a senior, every time I go to my doctor, which is very infrequent, I am subject to a number of tests, some of which amount to hundreds of dollars.

 

The fallacy in BobBeaSea's argument is that there is a cost to all of this, and yes it is borne by the patients and their insurance carriers. The more tests, the more co-payments, and the higher the insurance premiums. Irrespective of the docs CYA - it is costing all of us.

 

So how do the lawsuits impact this? First, our doctors are going to cover their ass. Second, when a lawsuit if filed, the doctors, hospitals, etc. are faced with enourmous costs of defense, which can range in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. So, what does their insurance carrier do, pay $100,000 or $200,000 to avoid that expense and the risk of even a higher jury verdict, and guess who walks off with one third or 40% of the settlement amount?

 

I am a retired attorney who practiced 38 years.

[wallygator]

I think I'll sue Santa Claus. For three years in a row I sat on his lap and asked for a Hummer. His first statement to me was "have you been a good boy" Of course I have replied. No problem was his answer. Three years later no Hummer. I'll just have to sue:D

 

I am a retired attorney who practiced 38 years.

 

 

No disrespect meant but I want someone thats days of practice are over. Would you fly on a airline with a captain thats practicing?

[Sky Sweet]

When we first moved to this state, I obtained quotes to insure our cars from the same insurance company that we had used for ten years. To my shock, I discovered that our new insurance policy would cost more than twice as much to insure the exact same cars. At the time, I asked the insurance company if that difference was because auto repair costs were much higher here, or that our cars were more likely to be stolen. The answer was that neither of these factors had a significant affect on the difference in the cost of the policy. The difference was because we are much more likely to be sued for personal injuries in our current location if our cars were in an accident.

[Danno]

I am a retired attorney who practiced 38 years.

 

Thank you for an honest view from the "inside"...do lawyers not have a professional association that is doing anything to return some integrety to this practice of law??

[BrendaJ]

I think I'll sue Santa Claus. For three years in a row I sat on his lap and asked for a Hummer. His first statement to me was "have you been a good boy" Of course I have replied. No problem was his answer. Three years later no Hummer. I'll just have to sue:D

quote]

 

Wally - I'm betting Santa checked with Terry. Forget the Hummer - you'll be lucky if Santa springs for a 1978 Chevette for you, bad boy! :)

 

 

On a more serious note, I haven't seen any discussion in this thread of what the legal situation would be if this tragic accident had happened on an official Celebrity excursion. I don't know anything much about the American legal system (or the Canadian one, for that matter), but even if there is no waiver signed protecting Celebrity from any potential mishaps on their excursions, as Celebrity's ships are foreign-flagged vessels, would any North American legally be able to sue them, regardless of what happens on their ships?

Brenda

[cechase]

Thank you for an honest view from the "inside"...do lawyers not have a professional association that is doing anything to return some integrety to this practice of law??

 

Yes Danno, there are local, state and national bar associations. But in my experience, sadly there really is no effort on their behalf in my opinion to quell the personal injury ambulance chasers, their tactics to round up victums, and their advertisement [bill boards, full page yellow page ads, etc.].

 

I believe that it is well documented that the two largest groups who make the largest political contributions are the Trial Lawyer organizations and the Teachers Unions. The result is that our representatives are reluctant to approach tort reform in a common sense manner, and are totally reluctant to allow parents, particular poor families to have vouchers to move their children out of failing schools.

[BB5953]

Why is everyone so upset at this lawyer? It seems as if everyone is forgetting that the familes have contacted him not the other way around. I certainly don't think the familes should be blamed because they are grieiving however, let's not forget that this man is doing his job... representing a client that contacted him.

[ECCruise]

Yes Danno, there are local, state and national bar associations. But in my experience, sadly there really is no effort on their behalf in my opinion to quell the personal injury ambulance chasers, their tactics to round up victums, and their advertisement [bill boards, full page yellow page ads, etc.].

 

I believe that it is well documented that the two largest groups who make the largest political contributions are the Trial Lawyer organizations and the Teachers Unions. The result is that our representatives are reluctant to approach tort reform in a common sense manner, and are totally reluctant to allow parents, particular poor families to have vouchers to move their children out of failing schools.

 

This is so far OT to be ludicrous. What do school vouchers have to do with cruising, pray tell?

[newmexicoNita]

Why is everyone so upset at this lawyer? It seems as if everyone is forgetting that the familes have contacted him not the other way around. I certainly don't think the familes should be blamed because they are grieiving however, let's not forget that this man is doing his job... representing a client that contacted him.

Well where did you get your information and how do you know it is acturate? I doubt any of us know who contacted who: the point still is: how could anyone in good conscience (spelling) think of sueing the cruise line? NMNita

[turtlemichael]

Despite all the statements here about shonky lawyers, ambulance chasers etc etc, the question is the same as it was before the thread even started.

 

Does Celebrity have a duty of care to the passengers in these circumstances, did it breach that duty of care by its actions or inactions, was there damage? It is a legal question not a question for popular interpretation. If an action is brought it is up to the courts to decide and all the moral indignation here counts for nothing other than allowing people to vent which is probably not a bad thing but does not resolve the basic issue.

 

That is "the rule of law" and I for one am very glad we have it

[newmexicoNita]

Despite all the statements here about shonky lawyers, ambulance chasers etc etc, the question is the same as it was before the thread even started.

 

Does Celebrity have a duty of care to the passengers in these circumstances, did it breach that duty of care by its actions or inactions, was there damage? It is a legal question not a question for popular interpretation. If an action is brought it is up to the courts to decide and all the moral indignation here counts for nothing other than allowing people to vent which is probably not a bad thing but does not resolve the basic issue.

 

That is "the rule of law" and I for one am very glad we have it

Of course we all have our own ideas, but it is beside me how anyone could think Celebrity was wrong in any way. We are adults and can make up our own minds. Is Celebrity of any other ship expected to research every tour company and forwarn us if one might not be licensed correctly or better, whould you want a ship to refuse to allow the guests to take any tours that were not sponsored by the ship? Of course we can not resolve the issue,but we certainly can voice our opinion. NMNita

[TEXASMUNK]

Want to see people defend themselves versus being held for blackmail by deep pocket lwayers?

 

Simple.

 

Loser pays. Then doctors, hospitals, companies will find it worth defending themselves versus settling because it is cheaper...and potentially profitable!

[smeyer418]

Want to see people defend themselves versus being held for blackmail by deep pocket lwayers?

 

Simple.

 

Loser pays. Then doctors, hospitals, companies will find it worth defending themselves versus settling because it is cheaper...and potentially profitable!

 

LOL that is so funny! If loser pays it will increase the cost of the lawsuit by 25% to 33% why? Just as in employment discrimination lawsuits the employer pays when they lose and almost NEVER collect from the people suing. This is the British system and is not known to create justice just more wealthy people. As a group doctors sue more than anyone! Why? They can afford and do sue, emplyment. lack of priviledges at hosptal etc. I once had the head(the executive director not the doctor) of the medical society in NJ make the same remark, After I told them the above and he spoke with his insurance carrier it never came up again.

[smeyer418]

I should have added there are better ways to end frivolous lawsuits. Remove incentives for non-economic loses(pain and suffering) punitive damages should be paid to the government not to the plaintiff. Already there are way to punish lawyers for truely friviously lawsuit(rule 5 sanctions, state licensing agencies etc) but loser pays in my opinion increases costs doesn't reign them in. Remember someone friviolus lawsuit can be someone else's right to be compensated for damages.

 

You never need a lawyer until you REALLY need one.

[turtlemichael]

Of course we all have our own ideas, but it is beside me how anyone could think Celebrity was wrong in any way. We are adults and can make up our own minds. Is Celebrity of any other ship expected to research every tour company and forwarn us if one might not be licensed correctly or better, whould you want a ship to refuse to allow the guests to take any tours that were not sponsored by the ship? Of course we can not resolve the issue,but we certainly can voice our opinion. NMNita

 

NMN, I'm not questioning your right to voice an opinion. After all, I am voicing one too! However, I am saying that whatever opinions any of us have the matter will be resolved according to law. And what any of us think about guilt or negligence in these circumstances, that is a question of law.

 

However, let me put possible grounds to you. It could be argued that a shipping line has a duty to its passengers to ensure they are safe. That's almost irrefutable. That could mean nailing down the carpet so someone doesn't fall and break a leg. It could also mean when taking people to a remote place, making sure they are at least aware that there are shonky operators, that the roads are particularly dangerous and that if they do decide to take a trip other than with an "authorized" tour company, they are aware of the issues. A counter argument could be that that information is common knowledge and every one should know it or find out for themselves. It's not the shipping company's responsibility to tell anyone. Now I have no idea if the tour operator was shonky, unlicensed or whatever. But there is a possible case. Who wins would depend on a whole host of factors but it will be decided according to law.

[Sea-lawyer]

The Florida bar has rules about contacting victims. A lawyer (or someone acting on the lawyers behalf) is not allowed to contact a victim within 30 days of the accident. Rivkind would be subject to sanction if he initiated contact, since 30 days has not yet passed.

[BB5953]

Well where did you get your information and how do you know it is acturate? I doubt any of us know who contacted who: the point still is: how could anyone in good conscience (spelling) think of sueing the cruise line? NMNita

 

 

I know this for a few reasons - one it was stated in the OP - two he has given 2 interviews that I saw where he states this - three I read it in the Miami herald. I am sure we will start to see family members on TV with him soon. They aren’t going to sit their and let him misrepresent what happened.

 

Law and good conscience have nothing to do with each other.

[newmexicoNita]

I know this for a few reasons - one it was stated in the OP - two he has given 2 interviews that I saw where he states this - three I read it in the Miami herald. I am sure we will start to see family members on TV with him soon. They aren’t going to sit their and let him misrepresent what happened.

 

Law and good conscience have nothing to do with each other.

WEll I agree with that statement, but I also don't believe everything I read: example, it was reported recently that NCL had settled a 3.3 million dollar law suit over the sailing during a storm last year: not true as it turns out: the slap over the Sensation (Carnival) is taking several slants right now, what happened to George Smith? I can go on and on. BTW, my husband started his professional career as a newspaper reporter. That doesn't mean I believe what I read nor does he? NMnita

[BB5953]

WEll I agree with that statement, but I also don't believe everything I read: example, it was reported recently that NCL had settled a 3.3 million dollar law suit over the sailing during a storm last year: not true as it turns out: the slap over the Sensation (Carnival) is taking several slants right now, what happened to George Smith? I can go on and on. BTW, my husband started his professional career as a newspaper reporter. That doesn't mean I believe what I read nor does he? NMnita

 

 

I agree about not believing everything you read. I came to that conclusion because I have come across the same information through different sources that have nothing to do with each other.