Defending those with disabilities!

[Queenie2]

wrp36,

 

I called yesterday and got my room switched to a non-HC cabin, as well as reported the TA (although in all honesty her supervisor didn't sound all that concerned). Yesterday was the first opportunity I had to reach the TA after booking, due to the weekend, and I got it taken care of.

 

I expect her supervisor was the one who was encouraging her to do it. To be honest if we didn't have these TAs handing out accessible rooms as perks, we would not have this whole problem. My beef is with the TAs. Some consider it their competitive edge.

 

Candy

[juliab]

I expect her supervisor was the one who was encouraging her to do it. To be honest if we didn't have these TAs handing out accessible rooms as perks, we would not have this whole problem. My beef is with the TAs. Some consider it their competitive edge.

 

Candy

 

Oh Candy, Tell me this isn't true. How sad!

[ehough]

Unfortunately it seemed to me like that was the case- the TA was handing out an HC room as an extra perk.

 

When I spoke with the supervisor and explained that we did not require the room and wanted to leave it open for those who require it, he tried to assure me that I would be bumped if someone needed it. Of course, from reading here on CC I knew that was most likely not going to happen so I declined.

 

When I told him I thought it was quite unethical of the TA to have given it to us, seeing as how we're a year away from sailing and how few HC rooms there are, he basically said that the TA was trying to do us a favor and it should not be taken in any negative way, that she was trying to help us. Now, he didn't flat out say that he agreed with that but he was trying to explain away why she did it.

 

Then again he told me that we could accept the room now and if anyone required it, they would get it instead of us. They've "done this before" and never had any problems with HC cruisers needing the room. I had to say over and over that I didn't want the room regardless of whether or not he thought we would be bumped.

 

So it would appear that, indeed, the TAs would play a major role in not only HC cruisers not being able to have the HC cabins but also in AB cruisers not fully realizing what they're doing when they accept an HC cabin. If I had spoken to this supervisor two weeks ago I probably could have been convinced that it was an okay situation and that I would be bumped from the room, so no worries. Obviously that's not the case but it's rather unfortunate to think about what others could easily have been convinced to do in this situation.

 

For the record I wanted to state that I did not mention my TA's company in my original thread, in case anyone is now trying to avoid Cruise Compete because of it! Cruise Compete is just an outlet that allows TAs to basically try to outbid each other to book your cruise, and I got this TA through them. So Cruise Compete, as far as I'm concerned, would not be the issue here. Just wanted to clear that up.

[Host Walt]

My issue is with the cruise lines, not with the TA.

 

If a TA is able to book an AB in a HC room then the cruise line is making no significant effort to enforce the rule. The ethical TA who will not do that knows that someone else will and will soon ignore ethics for business reasons.

 

If a cruise line can handle the complex paperwork needed for immigrations regs in all of their ports, why can't they also require proof of eligibility for HC rooms at the time of booking (or at check-in)?

 

It would be interesting to find out which lines make an effort to "pre-screen" HC's and which ones don't.

[Queenie2]

 

If a TA is able to book an AB in a HC room then the cruise line is making no significant effort to enforce the rule. The ethical TA who will not do that knows that someone else will and will soon ignore ethics for business reasons.

 

 

With all due respect, I have to disagree with you on that one. It's like one AB saying that it's OK to park in an accessible parking spot because "others do it".

 

And for the record, I'm not anti-TA. I think a *good* TA is a valuable asset. And yes I know many good TAs. But I know a lot of sleaze ones too, who do consider accessible rooms "perks". Sad, but true.

 

I think more education is needed on this issue. As in this case, once the situation is really explained (how things really work), then people understand that the "if someone needs the accessible cabin" line is a load of crap.

 

FWIW, there was an article on CC (a ship review) where the writer said that the accessible rooms on a certain ship were large and said that they were a great option if you are claustrophobic. I got several letters about it and ended up blogging about it. It just sends the wrong message. So education is needed everywhere, including this site.

 

Candy

[littlefarge]

I tried to book an HC cabin on-line with RCCL. The on-line system required me to telephone a Royal Caribbean Certified Travel Planner. I did get some sense that they were at least trying to verify the need. I then, had to call the special needs department to take care of the other requirements.

I hope the same requirement would apply to the TAs.

[leoandhugh]

we are handicapped requiring an accessible cabin - amputee/wheelchair - and while, yes it is true that the rccl system does not permit you to book an HC online and you have to go through special needs or CVRs, their system does allow TAs to book - both the good and the "sleaze" TAs. it makes the assumption that if it is booked by a TA it's a valid case of need, and we all know that is not always the case. years ago, most cruise lines required a letter or certificate from a doctor stating the need for an HC; then the cruise co. lawyers got in the act and said that in itself could be considered discriminatory. so I guess the cruise lines are doing the best they can. despite some of the protests that appear on this board which are very obviously written by TAs, that is where most of the problem is, whether they like it or not. now watch the TA flames descend on me - they will just bounce off my wheelchair. go ahead, take your best shot.:)

[Calkat]

I applaud all of you on this thread for defending the HC and hope I have the opportunity to sail with you one day. My handicap is not readily obvious. I was left with mobility and balance deficits as the result of a stroke in young adulthood. I cannot ascend or descent steps and have been "attacked" by older passengers for occupying a seat in the back/top of the auditorium/theater on more than one occasion. But the real kicker is the people who use HC stalls in public restrooms. I am not ashamed to admit that I have wet myself on more than one occasion because I must wait for the stall with grab bars. So please - keep preaching!

[Host Walt]

With all due respect, I have to disagree with you on that one. It's like one AB saying that it's OK to park in an accessible parking spot because "others do it".

 

And for the record, I'm not anti-TA. I think a *good* TA is a valuable asset. And yes I know many good TAs. But I know a lot of sleaze ones too, who do consider accessible rooms "perks". Sad, but true.

 

I think more education is needed on this issue. As in this case, once the situation is really explained (how things really work), then people understand that the "if someone needs the accessible cabin" line is a load of crap.

 

FWIW, there was an article on CC (a ship review) where the writer said that the accessible rooms on a certain ship were large and said that they were a great option if you are claustrophobic. I got several letters about it and ended up blogging about it. It just sends the wrong message. So education is needed everywhere, including this site.

 

Candy

I think you misread my comment. We agree.

 

What I said is that the cruise line, not the TA, is where the HC cabins must be protected. If the TA knows the Cruise Line will make it difficult for a HC booking, the situation is improved greatly.

 

If the Cruise Lines don't make it difficult, then the TA has no choice but to do what's best for his/her client.

 

The same applies to HC parking. If there is no penalty for an AB using a HC parking spot, guess what happens?

[Nebr.cruiser]

I gave up on reading this whole thread, but I've been under the impression that you can book an HC cabin, either on purpose or by accident if, not disabled, but that you know going in that if a handicapped person needs the cabin you will be moved. I see no problem with this. I'd probably never knowingly book an HC cabin, but if I did I'd expect to and would be glad to move if it was required by someone because of disablilites. Why leave a cabin go empty IF no one needs it?

 

 

It's kind of like the handicapped stalls in a restroom. I'd never use one if a DA person was there or waiting, of course, but in all honesty I've seen one being used by someone disabled only twice in my entire life. Many restrooms have only two or three stall; it's silly to let one sit empty 99% of the time. Also, the larger stall is great if you have young children, a stroller, etc. And many times the diaper changing station is in the HC stall as well.

 

I don't use that stall normally unless there is no other option--I don't like the higher stool--but will use it if necessary and no disabled person is there.

[ehough]

I gave up on reading this whole thread, but I've been under the impression that you can book an HC cabin, either on purpose or by accident if, not disabled, but that you know going in that if a handicapped person needs the cabin you will be moved. I see no problem with this. I'd probably never knowingly book an HC cabin, but if I did I'd expect to and would be glad to move if it was required by someone because of disablilites. Why leave a cabin go empty IF no one needs it?

 

 

It's kind of like the handicapped stalls in a restroom. I'd never use one if a DA person was there or waiting, of course, but in all honesty I've seen one being used by someone disabled only twice in my entire life. Many restrooms have only two or three stall; it's silly to let one sit empty 99% of the time. Also, the larger stall is great if you have young children, a stroller, etc. And many times the diaper changing station is in the HC stall as well.

 

I don't use that stall normally unless there is no other option--I don't like the higher stool--but will use it if necessary and no disabled person is there.

 

The problem is that, while I would think a lot of AB people would be happy to give up their cabins if an HC person required it, this doesn't happen. It'd be nice if ABs could book HC cabins and be able to sleep at night knowing that they will absolutely be bumped if necessary, but that's just not the case. Booked cabins are booked cabins. They are removed from the available cabin list. Why would TAs and other people doing the booking look at cabins that are already booked? I suppose if an HC person called up the cruise line to specifically ask if the room is being used by an AB they could pull up the room but I don't even know if it's notated anywhere who is in the room and whether or not they're disabled. I'm no TA so I can't say for sure but the general consensus is that it just plain doesn't happen.

 

No one on this board that I've seen has a problem with ABs staying in HC rooms if no one else has booked it. No one thinks they should remain empty. The problem begins when ABs book the room far in advance, effectively ruining the HC person's chance of taking that cruise.

 

As far as the HC stall analogy, the difference is that an HC person has to wait a couple minutes and then they can use the HC stall (which arguably they shouldn't have to do, but moving on). With a cruise, the HC person plain cannot get on that cruise. It's not a matter of waiting a couple minutes, it's a matter of someone taking an HC room from someone who actually requires it. Again, this isn't applicable to cruises where the HC room is going to go empty otherwise, but in general, I don't think you can compare taking a HC stall to taking a HC room. One requires a wait of a couple of minutes. The other requires the HC person to find another cruise.

[Nebr.cruiser]

Thanks for the clarification; I see your point that travel agents or the cruise line reps may have no way of knowing that an AB person is booked in a HC suite and so could be moved; I guess I just assumed that there was some procedure in place that took care of that problem. Apparently not.

 

I do realize the HC stall in a restroom isn't a good analogy; I included it because I have had people argue that those stalls should never be used except by an HC person, which kind of linked up to the HC cabins on a ship not being used if no HC person requested one.

 

It's a dilemma, huh?

[ehough]

Thanks for the clarification; I see your point that travel agents or the cruise line reps may have no way of knowing that an AB person is booked in a HC suite and so could be moved; I guess I just assumed that there was some procedure in place that took care of that problem. Apparently not.

 

I assumed the same thing until I, an AB, posted on here about being handed an HC cabin over a year in advance, and everyone set me straight;) It's sad to think about how many HC rooms go to AB cruisers because those ABs assume they'll get bumped! You would think there would be a better procedure in place but unfortunately that doesn't appear to be the case.

[rangeley]

We just booked a cruise on princess and we were specifically asked if someone was in a wheelchair and could not walk. hopefully other cruise lines will follow suit and not let ab people take all the hc cabins!

[hrslvr142]

I am really torn here after reading this thread. My husband is disabled, currently in the hospital with his 3 heart cath in 4 months, might be facing dialysis in the future, has mobility issues and sight issues BUT does not always require a wheelchair, it just depends on how tired he is. I called RCI to see if his manual wheelchair would fit in the non-HC room we previously had and they moved him to a HC accessible room. I did not ask but did not turn it down. We are about 70 days out so I would hope that anyone else that needed a HC room would have already booked but I don't know that and maybe we shouldn't have accepted the room. Any thoughts? We will be making our last payment within 10 days, should I ask for a non-hc room in case there is someone else that needs that room? Thanks.

[AAAAmerican]

Yes having it as your stateroom is adviseable .;)

 

Others lack the room in the doorways and to manuver properly. Since it may be need be glad they have it or once you board make your wishes know if someone else needs it more tom trade with them it is there..:mad: Wish more rooms were accessable for people with disabilities..

 

:D

 

We have been on a few cruises UnNamed lines here...

 

Which did not have rooms available nor the staff really went out of there way that we saw so we helped people the best we were able to each and evertime as many others aboard the vessels do/did too.

 

If in need just ask a fellow passenger most do/will helpyou.

 

GODSpeed!