New Cruise Award Protocol

[seapenarth]

How very disappointing, I was hoping that we would get the same information from our cruise agent, after all if we have qualified for our 140 days in November 2009 but unable to have the time to take the award cruise by the end of 2009 it seems like we have been "short changed" by Seabourn and I for one feel very aggrieved about it. It is very confusing.

 

As Iamboatman said at whatever date the cut off was made some would be disappointed. Jacta Alea Est the die is cast. Best to try to slip a cruise in before Nov. 2009 and use that November one as your freebie. ;)

[Prunella]

As Iamboatman said at whatever date the cut off was made some would be disappointed. Jacta Alea Est the die is cast. Best to try to slip a cruise in before Nov. 2009 and use that November one as your freebie. ;)

 

We are not able to do that as our November cruise is on the Odyssey!

[LaPaloma]

Well,...we finally received the infamous letter today. Was amused to see that it was single-spaced..small print...and the ink was quite grey...thus an effort to read...or were we just lucky and the others were different?? Most of the SB letters are quite easy to read and welcoming..guess they thought making it a trifle hard to read...would add to the confusion about what you were reading.:confused:

[dmb707]

Hi

 

I have today been advised by my English TA after numerous telephone conversations with SB the following

 

I have had confirmed that if you reach 140 days by the end of December 2009 you then have 2 years in which to take your free 14 day cruise, I have also had confirmed that even if you do not take the cruise in this 2 year period as long as it is booked during that time it can be taken in a later year.

 

I have been promised that the above confirmation will be send out by SB so I will await that as I know that SB have a habit of saying one thing and then changing there minds!!!

 

deb

[Iamboatman]

I have received from Seabourn the following confirmation:

 

"All redemptions starting in January 2010 are at the new levels, i.e. 7 days for 140 or 14 days for 250. If guests wish to redeem at the current levels they must qualify and redeem before the change date"

[norm2002]

This really is ridiculous. It sounds as if they have not thought out the policy clearly. And if Eric's confirmation is right, that is still ambiguous. What does redeem mean? Is booking the complementary cruise enough - which would not be unreasonable - or do you have to have started (or finished) the complementary cruise? Please, Seabourn, spell it out for your loyal cruisers in words of one syllable what you mean!

[tulip 1]

Below please find the meaning of redeem as per dictionary:

 

re·deem (r-dm)

tr.v. re·deemed, re·deem·ing, re·deems

1. To recover ownership of by paying a specified sum.

2. To pay off (a promissory note, for example).

3. To turn in (coupons, for example) and receive something in exchange.

4. To fulfill (a pledge, for example).

5. To convert into cash: redeem stocks.

6. To set free; rescue or ransom.

7. To save from a state of sinfulness and its consequences. See Synonyms at save1.

8. To make up for: The low price of the clothes dryer redeems its lack of special features.

9. To restore the honor, worth, or reputation of: You botched the last job but can redeem yourself on this one.

 

I suppose this means you need to 'book' your complementary cruise 'before the 1st January 2010', but the actual cruise can take place after that date.

I think/it seams, that the information I was given, and posted earlier, was correct afterall.

But SB should be clearer and confirm that the actual cruise can take place in 2010 0r 2012

[norm2002]

Below please find the meaning of redeem as per dictionary:

 

re·deem (r-dm)

tr.v. re·deemed, re·deem·ing, re·deems

3. To turn in (coupons, for example) and receive something in exchange.

 

Looks like 3 is the one and it does support your interpretation. But what do I know! I can't even spell complimentary! Thanks for not checking that in your dictionary.

[Harvey2442]

I agree with Norm2002 this policy has the appearence of being poorly thought out and poorly introduced and communicated.

 

Maybe one of the reasons the awards are being reduced is a change in accounting standards. It appears that currently Carnival charge the cost of award cruises in their accounts when we take them. The introduction IFRIC 13 effective for Carnival for their November 2009 accounts, the reason why awards at the old rates have to be taken by the end of 2009, means they have to set aside part of the cruise cost as the award is built up. This is quite a large number - the change will probably more than half the provision and if they restate their comparative numbers they could get an added bonus in their 2009 financials or even 2008 if they adopt the new standard earlier. I thought Pamela Conover’s letter sounded defensive. So whatever the commercial reasons for the change its impact on Carnival’s accounts could be another. Life is getting tough for Cruise lines when short term profitability appears dominant over long term passenger loyalty.

[seapenarth]

I have received from Seabourn the following confirmation:

 

"All redemptions starting in January 2010 are at the new levels, i.e. 7 days for 140 or 14 days for 250. If guests wish to redeem at the current levels they must qualify and redeem before the change date"

 

Could`nt be plainer. I am wondering if I shall get my letter re. changes before I get my redemption ? :rolleyes:

[Daneite]

Could`nt be plainer. I am wondering if I shall get my letter re. changes before I get my redemption ? :rolleyes:

 

Well I don't think it is plain! I think Seabourn need to spell it out like Norm said in a way that cannot be interpretated in more than one way. I read this as the free cruise had to be taken before the end of 2009 but others have taken the meaning as the free cruise has to be booked by the end of 2009. Which is it?

[Host Dan]

Could`nt be plainer. I am wondering if I shall get my letter re. changes before I get my redemption ? :rolleyes:

Personally, I'd like to see a statement from Seabourn, first hand, explaining their true position on the matter, not hearsay from a 2 different TA's, I don't know personally, and with conflicting details..

 

Host Dan

[Iamboatman]

My quote is directly from the executive office at Seabourn.

 

It is not my wording, it is Seabourn's direct communication.

 

There, I have said the same thing three times now.

 

If you don't believe me, I cannot prevent you from asserting I am a liar. (BTW, Seabourn is not going to post here...but you know that.)

[norm2002]

Eric, no one - at least not I - is questioning what you have reported. But what does it mean? I repeat my question. To me, redemption is when I enter into a commitment to take the complimentary cruise, ie book it. To others, redemption is when the cruise sails. This is what should be made clear to everyone.

[Iamboatman]

Let me be a lawyer...OK I am a lawyer.

 

The phrase is "qualify and redeem". In order to qualify you must, I would think, obvious have taken the 140 days of cruises; otherwise you would not qualify for a free cruise. Redeem has to mean something and it, obviously, means something other than vest in the cruise because that is what qualify means.

 

Now, again looking at the language, "All redemptions starting in January 2010 are at the new levels". So, if redeeming means anything in the context of the foregoing, it means to use it...not just have right to use it.

 

I appreciate the confusion on one part, but not the insults of my supposedly making up language. At the risk of overstepping my constraints - but the inference of my being dishonest has me fuming mad - I will share a portion of a communication with the executive office which should (if anything can!) put this to bed:

 

I wrote: "I have some clients wanting to know if they should "top up" their cruises so they vest in 14 days cruises by the end of 2009. " The response was: "Only if they also intend to redeem before January 2010 too."

 

Norm, I hope this helps. :)

[norm2002]

Well either way it doesn't affect me as I will have "redeeemed" my complimentary cruise before the deadline. So I think I will drop out of this even though I am still confused. I think you would make a good lawyer (is that an oxymoron - or even tautology?).

[Iamboatman]

Ironically, I just got off the phone with the executive office at Seabourn and the term "redeem" is to be understood, without question, as "to actually sail".

 

Trust me.;)

[Host Dan]

Eric,

No one is calling you, or anyone else, a liar... That is a bit extreme. What I question is this... You quote Seabourn's position, dmb707 quotes Seabourn's position from the London TA. The positions are VASTLY different.

I know that Seabourn won't post first hand here (unlike Crystal, that spoke with Laura Sterling when there was a controversy over groups), but maybe they could update their own website?

Here is the quote copied and pasted from the Seabourn site-

 

Complimentary cruise of up to 14 days for repeated sailing aboard Seabourn yachts*. Current award: 14 days after 140 days. Award effective January 1, 2010: seven days for sailings 140 days, 14 days for sailing 250 days. Awards may not be redeemed aboard Seabourn Odyssey until April 24, 2010.

 

Lets say a passenger reads this like I did initially, thinking that I would get another 14 days after reaching 250 days (not 280). I book like crazy, only to find out that they meant to convey something else.. (like my sailed days started again at zero after my last free cruise.) OR a passenger completes his or her 140 days in, lets say, November 2009. He or she happily calls Seabourn to REDEEM the 14 day cruise, and is told "sorry, we "meant" that you had to SAIL the 14 days by Dec 2009". This could be a PR nightmare, AND could cause bad feelings towards the company. This issue needs to be nipped in the bud NOW, before its too late!

 

Updating the website AT LEAST, would be a good start.

 

Host Dan

[LaPaloma]

Well said Dan, I cannot imagine the SB that we all love wanting their loyal psgrs. [guests] to get in a pickle over this. The kind thing would have been...you must BOOK before Jan 1010..that would certainly simplify this mess. Lola

[seapenarth]

Well I don't think it is plain! I think Seabourn need to spell it out like Norm said in a way that cannot be interpretated in more than one way. I read this as the free cruise had to be taken before the end of 2009 but others have taken the meaning as the free cruise has to be booked by the end of 2009. Which is it?

 

It only reads one way. A 14 day free cruise produced from 140 days sailing has to be taken before Jan 1 2010.:cool:

[lord of the seas]

It only reads one way. A 14 day free cruise produced from 140 days sailing has to be taken before Jan 1 2010.:cool:

 

You're catching on,That is exactly it.No argument. :)

[Iamboatman]

There is a big difference between doubting what a poster says her English travel agent says Seabourn said (hearsay on hearsay) and what I did, which was post Seabourn's exact words.

 

What is even clearer is that the deadline is January 1, 2010.

 

Words are funny things. People can read them as they are or they can read them as they wish they were. Personally, I wish I had 140 days in the bank and a free cruise coming up.

[Daneite]

It only reads one way. A 14 day free cruise produced from 140 days sailing has to be taken before Jan 1 2010.:cool:

Well obviously to you it may, but I would not have wasted my time posting if I thought so!

As for Eric getting his knickers in a twist and being "fuming mad" he obviously reads posts in a different way to me as I have certainly not had the impression that he has been insulted and cannot see that he has been called dishonest!! Everyone here has just asked for clarification as we do not understand clearly what has been said.

[dmb707]

Hi

 

what i have had confirmed is that on my forthcoming cruise in June 2008 i will reach 140 SB days, i have had confirmed from Seabourn both in the UK and the US that i have to book my complimentary 14 day cruise within 2 years of that date, and that i can take it after June 2010, as long as i have booked by then.

 

I am currently awaiting written confirmation of this

 

deb

[Iamboatman]

Personally, I'd like to see a statement from Seabourn, first hand, explaining their true position on the matter, not hearsay from a 2 different TA's, I don't know personally, and with conflicting details..

 

Host Dan

 

I guess I am just funning about such a comment when I say I just spoke with Seabourn's executive office or I quote from an email from Seabourn and it is characterized as hearsay and equivalent to what a poster recalls some travel agent telling her that some unidentified somebody at Seabourn said. You may not see it as questioning my integrity, but I most certainly do.

 

And just as you may respect Dan's comment, please respect the fact that I try very hard to assure I give you guys very accurate information and to demean my posts to such a level based upon nothing I have ever done wrong doesn't leave me with a warm and fuzzy feeling.

 

Let's drop it now, please. We all know what the deal is and who likes and dislikes it. (And you just might want to consider that winning over any company by publicly complaining generally is not very productive.)