Which 2 way radios work in Europe

[westcoastmom]

My husband and I like to browse in different shops and I am thinking of getting a pair of 2 way radios so I can connect with him. I've heard our frequencies here in the US are different from those in Europe. Have anyone tried using ones you brought from home? Any recommendations will be appreciated.

[greatam]

My husband and I like to browse in different shops and I am thinking of getting a pair of 2 way radios so I can connect with him. I've heard our frequencies here in the US are different from those in Europe. Have anyone tried using ones you brought from home? Any recommendations will be appreciated.

 

It is illegal to use your US radios in Europe. The US frequencies in Europe are often used by emergency services. Sorry, but you will have to find another way to keep in touch. International cell phone, maybe??? Or just a meeting place every couple of hours????

[smeyer418]

buy a pair of eurpoean ones on Ebay. Your USA ones will work in Europe...its the frequency of your radio that makes them work but as Greatam says they may be illegal to do so. if you are using them on a cruise it may not matter but they get much more touchy about this if it is a police or military frequency. I am sure there is a website that tells you what frequencies are verboten in what country....

[Philip217]

westcoastmom,

 

Think about it. 2-way radios only connect with each other. It doesn't matter which part of the planet you are on. If you purchase 2 identical radios, one radio on channel three connects with the other radio on channel three. We are not talking about telephone towers, radio towers, or satellites.

[Mary Ellen]

westcoastmom,

 

Think about it. 2-way radios only connect with each other. It doesn't matter which part of the planet you are on. If you purchase 2 identical radios, one radio on channel three connects with the other radio on channel three. We are not talking about telephone towers, radio towers, or satellites.

 

:confused: Nope. Two way radios work on frequencies shared with others. If you've ever had a baby monitor (a radio) pick up conversations from a neighbor's monitor, you'll know. If you've ever tried to use a 2-way radio at a major theme park you'll know how many times you've heard a strange kid's voice trying to reach "Mom", you aren't the only ones on that frequency.

 

Different frequencies are assigned to different types of 'traffic' around the world. I did a simple google and found a site that answers the OP's question. Gear Guy

 

Philip - I suggest you talk to your ships communication officer about this. He (she?) will straighten out your misconception.

[KINGBOBOFTHENORTH]

Mary Ellen, I believe Philip's point was that the radios do work and where you are in the world does not stop the one radio from communicating with the other. The fact that the frequency in Europe is used for other purposes or that using the radios in Europe is illegal does not mean they don't operate.

 

BobK/Orlando

[Philip217]

Mary Ellen,

Good advice, but I already did it.

My Comms Officer gave me the info I posted earlier.

 

Sitting in front of me on my desk is my trusty Motorola UHF Pro5150 2-way radio.

This radio has been on channel three for 4 years now. It has worked well for me (and my colleagues on channel three) in about 75 countries all over the world over the past four years. In a few ports, when we had many ships with us, we switched to channel four for better reception. Still worked great.

[richwmn]

Mary Ellen,

Good advice, but I already did it.

My Comms Officer gave me the info I posted earlier.

 

Sitting in front of me on my desk is my trusty Motorola UHF Pro5150 2-way radio.

This radio has been on channel three for 4 years now. It has worked well for me (and my colleagues on channel three) in about 75 countries all over the world over the past four years. In a few ports, when we had many ships with us, we switched to channel four for better reception. Still worked great.

 

Phillip - your status as a ships officer puts you in a different licensing category than the passengers. Your radio can be programmed as to what frequency each channel corresponds to. Part of the range that your radio is capable of is reserved for industrial, scientific and medical uses. Ships operations could fall under industrial, or there may be another range specified for ships operations. This would not allow passengers to use the same frequencies particularly when away from the ship. The radios will work but it may be against international treaties to do so. The radios purchased for personal use fall under a different license and the frequencies used are different in the US than in Europe.

 

Rich

[Philip217]

Richwmn,

 

Sorry, but I purchased my UHF radio on the street in Tokyo 4 years ago. It was never re-programmed nor licensed. But it does communicate very nicely with all the other radios onboard - regardless of where on the planet we happen to be.

[richwmn]

It is illegal to use your US radios in Europe. The US frequencies in Europe are often used by emergency services. Sorry, but you will have to find another way to keep in touch. International cell phone, maybe??? Or just a meeting place every couple of hours????

 

Richwmn,

 

Sorry, but I purchased my UHF radio on the street in Tokyo 4 years ago. It was never re-programmed nor licensed. But it does communicate very nicely with all the other radios onboard - regardless of where on the planet we happen to be.

 

Phillip --

You have missed the point that I and others have been trying to make. Yes, the radios will WORK but it is against laws in many countries to use them. Think about cars. Most cars, at least US makes, will go over 100MPH. If you are on the Autobahn in Germany (AFAIK) it is ok to do so. If you are in front of a school in Georgia you will be arrested and pay a hefty fine for doing so. The car is capable, the law doesn't allow it. We have never said that the radio won't work, just that you may be violating laws or treaties in doing so.

 

Rich

[Philip217]

Rich,

You may be right.

But I have a question.

I have worked on 28 cruise ships, for 11 different cruise lines, for the past 34 years, sailing all over the world, to every country that touches the sea. And I have used 2 way radios on all those ships, in all those countries.

You are the first person ever to tell me about licenses and illegal frequencies. You would think that the 245 cruise ships sailing around the world today - all using the same radios - might have gotten themselves into trouble over this sort of thing you are talking about.

 

I have checked with quite a few of my colleagues on many other ships these past few days, and they are as mystified as I am about your information.

 

Somebody ought to wake up the cruise industry.......................

[richwmn]

Rich,

You may be right.

But I have a question.

I have worked on 28 cruise ships, for 11 different cruise lines, for the past 34 years, sailing all over the world, to every country that touches the sea. And I have used 2 way radios on all those ships, in all those countries.

You are the first person ever to tell me about licenses and illegal frequencies. You would think that the 245 cruise ships sailing around the world today - all using the same radios - might have gotten themselves into trouble over this sort of thing you are talking about.

 

I have checked with quite a few of my colleagues on many other ships these past few days, and they are as mystified as I am about your information.

 

Somebody ought to wake up the cruise industry.......................

 

Phillip -

Please forgive me if this is a rather long response, but there are several facets to the answer.

 

The use of the radio spectrum is governed by international treaty and local regulations which further define the local interpretation of the treaty.

 

First, most of your passengers purchasing radios in the US would be using either CB or FRS radios, both of which meet specific hardware requirements. First we look at the website of the FCC, the governing body for radio transmitters in the US.

 

http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/prs.html

 

From the site

You can operate your FRS unit anywhere in the U.S. and its possessions. Before using FRS in other countries such as Canada and Mexico, check to see if that country allows operation of FRS units. There is no minimum age requirement for operating an FRS unit.

By the mention of checking if a country allows operation of a FRS radio, the implication is that some don't. Going to wikipedia we find the following —

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_Radio_Service

Europe

 

In Europe, a personal radio service with the same sort of licensing restriction is PMR446 having eight channels in the 446MHz range. One cannot legally use the FRS radio in Europe or PMR446 in the U.S. The 446 MHZ band is allocated to amateur radio in the United States, so in principle a licensed amateur operator could use non-FCC-type-accepted PMR446 radios in the U.S. in compliance with the rules for amateur radio operation. In Great Britain, FRS frequencies are used for fire brigade communications and this sometimes causes problems when FRS equipment is imported from the U.S. and used without awareness of the consequences by members of the public.

So we see that within the European Union the use of FRS radios is prohibited and the use of a similar European Service within the US is also prohibited.

 

Also a web site referenced by an earlier poster

http://outside.away.com/outside/gear/gearguy/200607/20060728.html

It’s not legal to use a U.S.-purchased FRS (Family Radio Service) or GMRS (General Mobile Radio Service) in Europe. That’s because European nations have allocated their radio frequencies in a way that’s different from the United States. For instance, the radio bands used by FRS here are used by emergency services workers in England. Similar conflicts can be found elsewhere on the European continent.

 

Now to your particular radio. From the Motorola website there are three sub models of your radio. One is VHF and two are UHF. The usable frequency ranges for the two UHF models of the Pro5150 UHF Radio are 403-470MHz and 450-527MHz.

 

http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422/14mar20010800/edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2002/octqtr/47cfr2.106.htm

5.138 The following bands:

 

6765-6795 kHz (centre frequency 6780 kHz),

433.05-434.79 MHz (centre frequency 433.92 MHz) in Region 1 except in

the countries mentioned in No. 5.280,

61-61.5 GHz (centre frequency 61.25 GHz),

122-123 GHz (centre frequency 122.5 GHz), and

244-246 GHz (centre frequency 245 GHz)

 

are designated for industrial, scientific and medical (ISM)

applications. The use of these frequency bands for ISM applications

shall be subject to special authorization by the administration

concerned, in agreement with other administrations whose

radiocommunication services might be affected. In applying this

provision, administrations shall have due regard to the latest relevant

ITU-R Recommendations.

 

Note that one model of your radio can transmit in the range in bold above. If you were to interfere in an authorized use, someone would seek you out and at least ask you to change channels.

 

To look at the situation from the other side, what if someone brought a radio aboard the Holland America Maasdam with a radio tuned to 457.5250MHz which according to a scanner enthusiast website (http://home.earthlink.net/~ecps91/frequencies.htm) is her bridge operations channel, how long would he be able to use it before the crew tracked him down and either asked him not to use it or confiscate it?

 

Now to the reality of the situation. As long as you don't interfere with a authorized licensed service, chances are you will never hear anything about your use. However the chance does exist. Much like bringing liquor aboard your ships. Radios used by the ships crew, like the bridge operations radio above, are licensed by the country the ship is flagged under to use the frequencies they need.

 

Rich

[richwmn]

I just located this website --

http://www.cbtricks.com/members/kd6tas/cbfaq2.htm

Which gives a FAQ on CB radio uses. Please note that while the US does not require a license to use a CB Radio, many other countries (including UK, Germany and Portugal do). Most use the same frequency and power restrictions as the US -- 26.965 - 27.405MHz using Amplitude Modulation only and 4 watts maximum power.

 

 

Rich

[Terpnut]

My husband and I like to browse in different shops and I am thinking of getting a pair of 2 way radios so I can connect with him. I've heard our frequencies here in the US are different from those in Europe. Have anyone tried using ones you brought from home? Any recommendations will be appreciated.

The bottom line is that your FRS and GMRS consumer radios that you can buy in the U.S. will work in Europe but it will be illegal to do so. If you want to use radios AND do so legally, you need to buy European spec radios.

[richwmn]

Rich,

You may be right.

But I have a question.

I have worked on 28 cruise ships, for 11 different cruise lines, for the past 34 years, sailing all over the world, to every country that touches the sea. And I have used 2 way radios on all those ships, in all those countries.

You are the first person ever to tell me about licenses and illegal frequencies. You would think that the 245 cruise ships sailing around the world today - all using the same radios - might have gotten themselves into trouble over this sort of thing you are talking about.

 

I have checked with quite a few of my colleagues on many other ships these past few days, and they are as mystified as I am about your information.

 

Somebody ought to wake up the cruise industry.......................

 

Phillip - Just wondering if you, your comm operator or colleagues have any differing information to add

 

Rich

[ehfl]

A 2 way radio has no way to tell what country it's in, and doesn't care. They will work just fine.

[greatam]

A 2 way radio has no way to tell what country it's in, and doesn't care. They will work just fine.

 

Please don't provide erroneous info. It has already been established that the radios will work.

 

It has also been established that it is ILLEGAL to use US frequency radios in Europe. You could be arrested/fined for interfering with emergency communications. Wouldn't you feel absolutely horrible if you were using your US walkie talkies in Europe and European firefighters could not communicate properly? Just don't do it-could cause a lot of problems for lots of people.

[AF-1]

you can rent two way radios on the ship

[ehfl]

I'm sure you can find a cheap pair once you get there. Or see if you can rent an international phone from your cell phone provider....most of the major companies have this service.

[ecps92]

What Phillip is using, would be a UHF Marine Radio.

 

Most Ships use the same 4-5 Pairs of channels [10+]

 

457.5250 / 467.7500 Ch.01

457.5500 / 467.7750 Ch.02

457.5750 / 467.8000 Ch.03

457.6000 / 467.8250 Ch.04

 

None of these are the same as the FRS / GMRS radios of the USA or the PMR Radios of Europe.

 

Altho some ships use this set of pairs, which are ILLEGAL in the USA and Canada

 

457.5250 / 467.5250

457.5500 / 467.5500

457.5750 / 467.5750

457.6000 / 467.6000

 

Also the European standard has begun to include some of the FRS channels in the new Maritime Channel Plans [bad news for both Cruisers and Ships]

 

Phillip - your status as a ships officer puts you in a different licensing category than the passengers. Your radio can be programmed as to what frequency each channel corresponds to. Part of the range that your radio is capable of is reserved for industrial, scientific and medical uses. Ships operations could fall under industrial, or there may be another range specified for ships operations. This would not allow passengers to use the same frequencies particularly when away from the ship. The radios will work but it may be against international treaties to do so. The radios purchased for personal use fall under a different license and the frequencies used are different in the US than in Europe.

 

Rich

[ecps92]

I wish someone would. I have tracked GMRS interference, right to various ships in the Port of Boston. Many of them CRUISE SHIPS. Even better is when they use USA Amateur Frequencies or our TV News Media [Trafic Reporting etc] frequencies as did the Seven Seas Navigator.

 

If you can point your Radio Shop to my web site, they can contact me, and I would be glad to assist them correcting the ERROR of the various frequencies for the USA Ports.

 

Rich,

You may be right.

But I have a question.

I have worked on 28 cruise ships, for 11 different cruise lines, for the past 34 years, sailing all over the world, to every country that touches the sea. And I have used 2 way radios on all those ships, in all those countries.

You are the first person ever to tell me about licenses and illegal frequencies. You would think that the 245 cruise ships sailing around the world today - all using the same radios - might have gotten themselves into trouble over this sort of thing you are talking about.

 

I have checked with quite a few of my colleagues on many other ships these past few days, and they are as mystified as I am about your information.

 

Somebody ought to wake up the cruise industry.......................

[AstroExeter]

In the UK the normal 8 PMR446 channels use the following frequencies (in MHz):

1. 446.00625

2. 446.01875

3. 446.03125

4. 446.04375

5. 446.05625

6. 446.06875

7. 446.08125

8. 446.09375

The American FRS / GMRS frequencies are:

 

 

FRS has 14 channels, numbered 1-14 below. GMRS uses the same channels as FRS 1-7, and then adds a further 7 channels numbered 15-22 below. There are many "combination" FRS/GMRS walkie-talkies on the market that have all 22 of the channels listed below.

1. 462.5625

2. 462.5875

3. 462.6125

4. 462.6375

5. 462.6625

6. 462.6875

7. 462.7125

8. 467.5625

9. 467.5875

10. 467.6125

11. 467.6375

12. 467.6625

13. 467.6875

14. 467.7125

15. 462.550

16. 462.575

17. 462.600

18. 462.625

19. 462.650

20. 462.675

21. 462.700

22. 462.725

If you used American FRS / GMRS radios in the UK, you might interfere with:

 

In many cases, given the short range of walkie-talkies, you may not interfere with anyone. But: the 462MHz FRS channels 1-7 are used for some emergency service radios, and interefering with these is very illegal and potentially dangerous.

The higher FRS / GMRS channels on 467MHz are used by licensed private users such as TV outside broadcasts, special event organisers etc. They will have paid for the right to use those channels and could complain if they get interference.

 

 

 

As previously stated, technically you will still be able to communicate but will risk prosecution if you do.

[richwmn]

What Phillip is using, would be a UHF Marine Radio.

 

Most Ships use the same 4-5 Pairs of channels [10+]

 

457.5250 / 467.7500 Ch.01

457.5500 / 467.7750 Ch.02

457.5750 / 467.8000 Ch.03

457.6000 / 467.8250 Ch.04

 

None of these are the same as the FRS / GMRS radios of the USA or the PMR Radios of Europe.

 

Altho some ships use this set of pairs, which are ILLEGAL in the USA and Canada

 

457.5250 / 467.5250

457.5500 / 467.5500

457.5750 / 467.5750

457.6000 / 467.6000

 

Also the European standard has begun to include some of the FRS channels in the new Maritime Channel Plans [bad news for both Cruisers and Ships]

My post #12 kinda covers this (the last part), specifically mentioning 457.5250 and its use on the Maasdam. I also referenced the same website as the source for the Maasdam frequencies. As I stated, Phillips status allows use of the frequencies set aside for ships operations without a specific license.

Rich

[ecps92]

Correct, but what I was pointing out is there are two flavors of Channel Pairs used [World Wide] and Only One of them is LEGAL in the US of A and the other for Europe. Many of the Cruise lines have unfortunately programmed the radios incorrectly, and even reversed the TX/RX Pairs too :(

 

My post #12 kinda covers this (the last part), specifically mentioning 457.5250 and its use on the Maasdam. I also referenced the same website as the source for the Maasdam frequencies. As I stated, Phillips status allows use of the frequencies set aside for ships operations without a specific license.

Rich

[skinut]

Interesting and useful debate. I had been planning to take my FRS radios on a cruise in Europe, but wouldn't dream of doing something that might interfere with public safety communications there. I work in that field in the US, and we get very touchy when police, fire or EMS radios recieve inteference from illegal operations. Lives are at stake