What (if any) itinerary changes do you see happening with Celebrity?

[excitedofharpenden]

I notice on the news wires that Ocean Village cruises is ceasing operations by 2010 and their ships transferred to P & O. Ocean Village may not be that familiar to many of you, but it's a well known budget/introduction to cruising company in the UK. In addition one of the Carnival ships is staying in the Caribbean rather than going to Europe in 2009 and Radiance of the Seas has cancelled its expensive South America sailings for 2009/2010 and is staying in San Diego doing the Mexican Riviera run. Not to mention the other British marketed line Island Star that has the old =X= Horizon in its fleet of two ceasing operations.

 

What are peoples feelings about what will happen with Celebrity, given the new ships coming on stream? Do you see any itinerary changes and what do you think they may be?

 

From my own perspective I guess it had to happen and in some ways is a good thing. It's better to have a ship in a place where it can at least make some money from being reasonably well booked than struggle to fill in a declining market place. The current cheap prices out there have me worried to an extent. It's nice to be able to cruise for a great price, but I do wonder if corners will be cut and the experience diminished.

 

This is the first time the cruise lines have had to go through this in their current form and it will be interesting to see how it plays out.

 

I'm interested to hear others thoughts (and I know we have some much more knowledgeable cruise experts than me on this board!)

 

Phil

[Texed]

What are peoples feelings about what will happen with Celebrity, given the new ships coming on stream? Do you see any itinerary changes and what do you think they may be? Phil

 

Phil,

I see a lot of new home ports because people are hating to fly.

[rolfecms]

I see a lot of new home ports because people are hating to fly.

 

Not to mention the cost of flying - people can put up with more inconvenience when the price is right.

[richsea]

I wouldn't be surprised to see Celebrity pull a ship from Europe in 2009 due to soft bookings. More cruises from more home ports is also a possibility.

In the current economic environment, I would expect Celebrity to transfer their older smaller ships, Mercury, then Century, as the new builds come on line, rather than try new areas of the world to cruise.

[bgsimp]

When we were in Michigan, it got very expensive to add the airfare on, plus a night in a hotel. Now we live in Florida. We are taking our 35th. cruise. What's so nice is we can drive to Tampa, Jacksonville, Port Canaveral, Ft. Lauderdale & Miami. We are in the center of the state. They also have a good senior rate in Florida.

I see home ports that people can drive to working very well. Sure keeps the cost down for the cruisers & that part of it doesn't affect the cruise lines. They have to go where they can fill up the ships without having to do alot of big discounts.

[cpacruiser54]

I think Celebrity will bring back a ship to NY/New jersey year round. They used to sail to Bermuda with 2 ships from April thru October and were very successful. They may rethink their strategy and return to Bermuda from East coast ports

[Carol Anne]

I also agree that they will probably bring most ships back from Europe. Between the airfaire and the rate of exchange for the average cruiser the costs are just getting too high.

 

I think you will see them discount the price of the cabins in the hopes that while onboard more revenue will be realized. The industry has always known that they aren't making the profits on the cabins but on the many things available onboard to pruchase. So by making the cabin more affordable passengers will be more apt to send on the Spa, Shops, excursions, Specialty Rest. etc.

 

I think the key to their success is ports that are local and keeping them here year round. I would love to see them do Bermuda again. One ship out of NY or Baltimore and perhaps another from Florida. It would sell I think very well.

[skybird123]

Let me first say X is our cruise line of choice. We have sailed with them frequently but I feel they've used the old bait & switch on our upcoming transatlantic cruise. Here we are 1 month out and they cancel the two ports in Morocco. They were the main reason we chose this cruise as we have been to the other stops. The reason given is that it is a Muslim Holiday. I question whether they ever intended to visit them. 1- I'm sure someone looked at the calender before they made the port choices. 2-they waited until final payment was made so no changes(cancellations) could be made. 3-They're still luring people in with the original locations on the website. 4-the price after final payment was made dropped drastically. We are paying $1000 more than folks who waited until the last minute, so much for planning ahead. Kind of leaves a bad taste in your mouth.

 

 

The European cruise lines have not curtailed their visits to Morocco.

 

We've had port cancellations before and we understand the line has free reign to do so. Changes made because of weather, mechanical problems, health issues are totally understandable. From what I've read the security in Morocco is top notch, much safer than many cities here in the US.

 

I really hate to complain/whine because I really enjoy everything onboard!

 

Perhaps someone can give me an idea on how this was decided upon.

Unhappy for now- Elenore

[Cruise Arizona]

I do seem them maintaining a few vestages of traditional cruising, but moving more towards a broader demographic, (not sure if that exactly the right wording for it. ) I think the new dress code is trying to appeal to people from all walks of life who simply want a more casual vacation.

 

I think that some of their new initiatives like "Staring You" and listing the onboard activities like Island Night, 50's Night, and Irish Pub Night are trying to show that "Hey a Celebrity Cruise can be fun too!"

[Andy]

Hi Everyone !

 

As I wrote in this post a few days ago http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=16791715&postcount=3 , I feel that Celebrity should consider re-deploying 1 ship (or more) from Europe back to the US. I feel that Closer to Home sailings will be the hot item for Cruise lines for 2009, and probably 2010.

 

While searching for my previous comments on this, I found this post from May. http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=14835363&postcount=11. It's interesting to read, now that several months have passed, and some of this is coming to reality. I have been writing about this, even before that time.

 

Here is another post from April, which I mentioned the possibility of the Perfect Storm for the Cruise industry: http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=14416888&postcount=20. It looks like my Crystal Ball is still working. I'm surprised that virtually none of the Cruise lines saw it coming.

 

While we recently saw some changes to Mercury's & Millennium's deployment, I am very curious to see if Celebrity makes any further deployment changes. If they decide to tweak their deployments, we should be hearing from Celebrity soon.

[Cruise Arizona]

Phil,

 

My bad, I totally missed the "Itinerary" part of the question. I guess I was just having a blond moment. Sorry to be OT.

[c-legs]

Hi Everyone !

 

As I wrote in this post a few days ago http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=16791715&postcount=3 , I feel that Celebrity should consider re-deploying 1 ship (or more) from Europe back to the US. I feel that Closer to Home sailings will be the hot item for Cruise lines for 2009, and probably 2010.

 

While searching for my previous comments on this, I found this post from May. http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=14835363&postcount=11. It's interesting to read, now that several months have passed, and some of this is coming to reality. I have been writing about this, even before that time.

 

Here is another post from April, which I mentioned the possibility of the Perfect Storm for the Cruise industry: http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=14416888&postcount=20. It looks like my Crystal Ball is still working. I'm surprised that virtually none of the Cruise lines saw it coming.

 

While we recently saw some changes to Mercury's & Millennium's deployment, I am very curious to see if Celebrity makes any further deployment changes. If they decide to tweak their deployments, we should be hearing from Celebrity soon.

 

Good evening, Host Andy

 

As usual, you ol' reliable wise ol'man are correct again.:)

Thanks for your sage advices over time. It helps ''tranquillizing '' the cruise-aholics among us...;)

Your third post about the ''perfect storm'' is bang-on !!:cool:

 

I however still think CCL went a bit too ''hard'' in their corrective manoeuvres by slashing dividends....Nobody in our industry has ever done that in over 17 years if I'm correct about this.

 

Thanks for your comments

Cheers:)

[Andy]

Good evening, Host Andy

 

As usual, you ol' reliable wise ol'man are correct again.:)

Thanks for your sage advices over time. It helps ''tranquillizing '' the cruise-aholics among us...;)

Your third post about the ''perfect storm'' is bang-on !!:cool:

 

I however still think CCL went a bit too ''hard'' in their corrective manoeuvres by slashing dividends....Nobody in our industry has ever done that in over 17 years if I'm correct about this.

 

Thanks for your comments

Cheers:)

 

Hi Claude !

 

Thank you for your kind comments. I agree with you that CCL could have handled things better, especially regarding their dividend elimination, for a few reasons. First, why was anyone surprised when CCL said new bookings were soft ? Royal Caribbean said it 3 days earlier. Anyone who was surprised by this, simply did not do their homework. I suggested this scenario months ago, and it became fairly obvious when the stock market had the huge downturn over the past several weeks. This wasn't your run of the mill Stock Market correction, it was much worse. It was a destruction of wealth if you ask me.

 

Second, I believe Carnival made a big mistake by completely eliminating their dividend. By cutting out the entire dividend, it forced some institutions and funds to sell their entire position, as some funds have requirements to hold securities that only pay dividends. No Dividend ? Out you go. If they felt compelled to reduce their dividend, that's understandable. However, they should have done everything possible to avoid a total elimination of the dividend (cut it in 1/2 perhaps) and re-evaluate it again at a later date. The shock of their report AND the dividend elimination appears to have been too much for their shareholders to handle.

 

You know who I feel badly for the most ? Royal Caribbean Management, shareholders, and employees. Their shares took a hit on their soft booking news earlier this week, AND was hit a second time on Friday, when the CCL report came out. Talk about getting punished twice for the same type of news (though Royal did not cut their dividend). Unfortunately, for RCL and their shareholders and employees, everything doesn't always make perfect sense on Wall Street.

[tom_uk]

Taking 'itinerary' in the narrow sense, it is the fact that changes have already been made to Solstice's 11-night E Med cruises in 2009 - Rhodes has been removed from the itinerary. The excuse was that 'it was a Monday & museums are shut on Monday', but I don't believe that. I think the reason for that was to save fuel. The former itinerary was Kusadasi - Rhodes - Athens, which is a bit of a detour; the itinerary will now be Kusadasi - [sea day] - Athens, which can be done more economically (plus on-board expenditure will be high during a sea day). However, the price of oil has now fallen right back, so I wonder if the Rhodes call will be reinstated?

 

Now the question of itinerary in a wider sense, which I take to mean deployment. I agree that if any change are going to be made, it will be in the number of ships deployed to Europe. At the moment Celebrity will have five ships in Europe next year:

a) Solstice doing the 10 and 11 night Eastern Med cruises that Galaxy did in 2007 and this year - all season;

b) Summit, mainly doing 12 night cruises between Barcelona and Venice, - all season;

c) Century, with cruises from Amsterdam in Northern Europe to the end of August, then moving to the W. Med and thereafter doing 7-night cruises out of Barcelona until the end of November;

d) Constellation, also doing N Europe cruises but out of Harwich, from May to the end of August; and finally

e) Equinox, doing one cruise from Southampton to the Med. immediately after delivery in August, and then doing 13 or 14 night cruises in the E Med until the end of October.

 

That is a significant commitment. I've done two Med cruises on Galaxy, and I would say that about 90% of the passengers were from North America rather than local; and I've also read comments here as to how expensive it is to fly across the Atlantic, and also to stay in places like Rome, London, and so on. So I agree that it wouldn't surprise me if Celebrity changed their plans. The question is, what would those changes be?

[cvat]

I´m not familiar with the Carriebean itineraries, but i have seen in the new catalogue that the company offers for two ships nearly the same route(Eupore).

And some of the cruises are nearly going about 2 weeks.

 

 

 

 

 

AS to Marocco.

From what i have heared is that Tangier is very clean, and Casablanca unsave, but this is something i have heard i have never been there.

 

From viewing the cathalog 2008/2009 i have told this is supposed to be the highlight of this particuliar itinerary.

Did they offer another cities instead of this?!

Something like Cadiz?!

[cathy82]

I hope they don't re-deploy their ships from Europe in 2009. I have a Baltic Cruise booked for next May and most of us have already paid for our airfare. That would be devastating to us! It will be the trip of a lifetime for my group of 4. I was also hoping to do an Australia/New Zealand Cruise in January 2011. Hopefully at least one cruiseline will still do them by then. Maybe Celebrity will go back. I can only hope.

[cvat]

Is this something intended -to deduct their fleet from european sea territories.

They will recieve more Euro, which is still more in US, still now,when they keep them here.

 

 

You will have to pay probably a quarter of the price when you are going to cancel right now.

So i hope they stay here! When they are here i hope you have than a great cruise!

[cruiseyguy]

I think Celebrity will come to see their Solstice-class ships as "Resorts at Sea," where the onboard experience will be more important than the ports for both passengers and cruise line. For the passengers, more activities, dining options, shopping venues onboard; for Celebrity, more passenger spending onboard. fewer port fees and other costs associated with docking. Although this may seem counter-intuitive, I think they should consider using one of the new mega-ships for double trans-Atlantics each season (to Europe and back, then to Europe for seasonal deployment). This would allow Celebrity to pull maximum onboard revenue from the ships and allow trans-Atlantic passengers to enjoy the ship enroute to their European vacations (a modification of Cunard's business model).

[cvat]

They seem now not to care that much for the ports, they have 3 ships Summit, Solstice, Equinox docking at the same Islands in Europe. (Santorin, Rhodos, etc.)

Must be some form of 3 ship Group discount.

If they can find a forth ship it would maybe advance the dicount.

[pcur]

Let me first say X is our cruise line of choice. We have sailed with them frequently but I feel they've used the old bait & switch on our upcoming transatlantic cruise. Here we are 1 month out and they cancel the two ports in Morocco. They were the main reason we chose this cruise as we have been to the other stops. The reason given is that it is a Muslim Holiday. I question whether they ever intended to visit them. 1- I'm sure someone looked at the calender before they made the port choices. 2-they waited until final payment was made so no changes(cancellations) could be made. 3-They're still luring people in with the original locations on the website. 4-the price after final payment was made dropped drastically. We are paying $1000 more than folks who waited until the last minute, so much for planning ahead. Kind of leaves a bad taste in your mouth.

 

 

The European cruise lines have not curtailed their visits to Morocco.

 

We've had port cancellations before and we understand the line has free reign to do so. Changes made because of weather, mechanical problems, health issues are totally understandable. From what I've read the security in Morocco is top notch, much safer than many cities here in the US.

 

I really hate to complain/whine because I really enjoy everything onboard!

 

Perhaps someone can give me an idea on how this was decided upon.

Unhappy for now- Elenore

 

Have you called X and had them adjust your price down to the lower one? Definitely do that!

 

I have noticed similar tactics with X before, too. I don't think they have the flexibility in their pricing like RCCL, because their product is a little more expensive. They have those little "extras" that other mid-market cruise lines don't have: champagne when you board, etc.

 

While pricewatching on our last X cruise, I noticed they suddenly raised the prices by $100 per person. The next week they offered a $75 off coupon in their newsletter!

 

I love X, and we have a cruise booked with them next March. I just don't expect the same "sales" that I see with our RCCL cruises.

 

As far as dropping ports are concerned, well..........it's just an ugly reality of cruising. They can change them anytime they want, for whatever reason they want. They've got that all locked up in their cruise contract, small print, etc.

[dmk]

Let me first say X is our cruise line of choice. We have sailed with them frequently but I feel they've used the old bait & switch on our upcoming transatlantic cruise. Here we are 1 month out and they cancel the two ports in Morocco. They were the main reason we chose this cruise as we have been to the other stops. The reason given is that it is a Muslim Holiday. I question whether they ever intended to visit them. 1- I'm sure someone looked at the calender before they made the port choices. 2-they waited until final payment was made so no changes(cancellations) could be made. 3-They're still luring people in with the original locations on the website. 4-the price after final payment was made dropped drastically. We are paying $1000 more than folks who waited until the last minute, so much for planning ahead. Kind of leaves a bad taste in your mouth.

 

 

We were on the fall TA in 2007. The exact same thing happened. Morocco was cancelled after final payment...some talk of dangers. Hogwash!

This makes me annoyed to seee the exact same t6hing is happening this year!

[skybird123]

Thank you "dmk" for your info, I'll mention that when I call X. Yes, I did call when the super discounted price was offered. The answer was no, no changes after final payment. C'est la vie!!

 

I would like to see fewer ports(Europe) but more time in them. Two days instead of one. It would save on fuel and perhaps food. We are often torn between which tours we can squeeze in. 2 or more days in one stop would allow us to truly enjoy the sites. I would have gladly given up Cyprus for another day in Alexandria/Cairo. I'm not sure if it's feasible but they should somehow stagger the days ships are docking. It seems we sometimes outnumber the locals. I truly hope X keeps some smaller ships, the mega ships are more than we can handle. The walk from the bow to the stern can be daunting!

 

Do you think anyone from Celebrity ever reads these posts?

[FinelyCruising]

Hi Phil - Here is what I think is going to occur.

 

I think the OBC will be eliminated.

 

I think the cruise line will keep Europe in a highly limited way and with the ships in the fleet going back to the RT sailings rather than the open ended.

 

I think some ships will homeport in areas and that will do shorter and or split week sailings and I think Bermuda will come back along with the Mexican Riviera sailings.

 

I think time of year sailings from the coldest winter ports will be the most dramatically priced, and I do think the menus may be different on the ships based on restricted profitability of the ship sailing at a particular time of year, length of cruise, home port and size and age of ship.

 

I think the only common denominator will be the cruise line's name, Dining Options, Style of Dress and on board amenities such as Welcome Champagne, Cruise Credits, Specialty Food Stations, Specialty Food Venues, Pool Deck Atmosphere, Evening Entertainment, by example.

 

FWIW, I think they could do better if they had a Continental Breakfast served in suite or on a particular deck based on the same cabin card selection in use now, and having a pay-for breakfast in the MDR for those who are looking for proper sit down service.

[Ma Bell]

We were on the fall TA in 2007. The exact same thing happened. Morocco was cancelled after final payment...some talk of dangers. Hogwash!

 

This makes me annoyed to seee the exact same t6hing is happening this year!

 

We were on the TA this year and we did stop in Morocco. Many of our group went to Marrakesh and were glad they made the trip but I don't think they would have really minded not going. We stayed on board after many of the crew members warned us to be careful. We were also not too fond of having a 3 and a half hour bus ride each way for a tour. Many others we spoke to were really disappointed in Morocco and felt very uncomfortable there. A few folks had purses and wallets stolen. Some people got off and explored but came back to the ship quickly. The stories were not good.