Question about plus size airfare charges

[CLEMM]

If a person has to pay double for an airline seat do they actually get an extra seat? This is not my issue, but I'm just wondering. What if the plane is full? And if it isn't full then why charge extra, just put the plus size person next to an empty seat. I guess I don't understand how this will work. Will you have to declare your plus size when you book?

[LMKohler]

This is not my issue either, but I do believe that if you pay for the extra seat you actually get it otherwise it wouldn't make any sense to charge the person for it. As to whether you have to declare yourself as plus size -- I'd have to read the new rules and see if there is a weight chart or anything like that. When does this go into effect?

[CLEMM]

I read that Southwest is already doing it and United is going to do it. It seems you would have to declare at booking because otherwise they would not know to reserve two seats. Yet I'm sure some people won't actually know if it means them or not. Even if there is a weight chart or something, people won't always tell the truth, especially if they are close to the limit and want to save the money, and who wouldn't? I know they said you can't need more than one seat belt extender, but you may not know that until you are actually on board, and then the plane might be full, and again, if it is not full then what is the difference? Also, what if you are travelling with a spouse or friend who doesn't mind that their spouse or friend is extending slightly into their space. I just don't see how this will work. Just my opinion.

[txsloth]

They do not charge you if the plane isn't full.

 

edited to add, if it is full, and you haven't booked the 2nd seat already, they are bumping you to a later flight.

[phoenix_dream]

What concerns me about this is if you are plus sized, and go to board and are denied because of your size and no available open seats, are you at a serious risk of missing a cruise???? Even if you go a day ahead of time, if you are flying to a location such as San Juan there may not BE an open seat available even the next day as there are so few flights on United.

 

If a person truly is so large that he/she literally takes up more than one seat then I guess there is some justification for this, but as someone who has a traveling companion who is big (but not so big he/she can't fit with the armrests down) I am concerned that an overzealous flight attendant may try to bump this person unreasonably. Besides the abject humiliation that person would face, it could totally ruin the whole vacation and cause us to miss a cruise. Plus - what about the issue of splitting up families?!? Someone in your party supposedly doesn't fit, so he/she is bumped to a later (maybe next day) flight. So now they need to fly alone? This whole thing STINKS. Maybe airlines need to recognize the American population AS A WHOLE are getting larger and yet - gee whiz - the seats are getting smaller. :mad:

[txsloth]

What concerns me about this is if you are plus sized, and go to board and are denied because of your size and no available open seats, are you at a serious risk of missing a cruise???? Even if you go a day ahead of time, if you are flying to a location such as San Juan there may not BE an open seat available even the next day as there are so few flights on United.

 

If a person truly is so large that he/she literally takes up more than one seat then I guess there is some justification for this, but as someone who has a traveling companion who is big (but not so big he/she can't fit with the armrests down) I am concerned that an overzealous flight attendant may try to bump this person unreasonably. Besides the abject humiliation that person would face, it could totally ruin the whole vacation and cause us to miss a cruise. Plus - what about the issue of splitting up families?!? Someone in your party supposedly doesn't fit, so he/she is bumped to a later (maybe next day) flight. So now they need to fly alone? This whole thing STINKS. Maybe airlines need to recognize the American population AS A WHOLE are getting larger and yet - gee whiz - the seats are getting smaller. :mad:

 

 

I never fly United, so don't know how they are enforcing it, but I fly Southwest weekly and have never seen it enforced. I don't see flight attendants bringing this type of headache on themselves. I bet a passenger complaint will usually be needed to trigger the policy.

[texancruzer]

I never really gave it much thought......until a flight home from San Juan Puerto Rico.

 

Last person to board the plane (a full plane) sat right next to me in an aisle seat. Don't know what a "seat belt extender" is and I don't think she used one - not sure. BUT I do know that even with the arm rest down she took up half of my seat. She tried very hard to "lean" the other way into the aisle while playing a gameboy the whole 4+ hours but it did not help.

 

While I feel sorry for those required to buy two seats...... I honestly have to say that was the LONGEST most uncomfortable flight I have ever taken.

[cruisinjudy]

I would think the best thing to do is book an extra seat at the start. This would make it more comfortable for everyone. As a person with long legs I am considering doing this by booking three seats for the two of us when we fly.

[CathyCruises]

I heard that if there is a plus sized person, they will first try to move the passengers around so that the larger person can have an open seat next to them. Now, if there are no open seats, obviously the larger person can't buy another one--I guess it would have to be on a later flight.

 

I once got stuck on the runway in Dallas, waiting out thunder storms, in the very last row on the plane. My good friend who was travelling with me, who weighs in at about 300 lbs. (at 5'8"), had the window seat; I was in the middle, and I am not a small person, and a nice guy was next to me with an 18 month old baby in his lap. For TWO hours before the flight even took off. Talk about misery!

 

I am very sympathetic (there but for the grace of God go I!) but I don't really know what the 'right' answer is.

 

Cathy

[snowglobe]

I'm 5'2" and weigh just shy of 200 lbs.. I wear size 18 jeans. I'm pear-shaped: so I really do look Rubinesque, as my body is not well-proportioned. It's ME, I've been this size for years and it came with age and genetics. I am part of a life-long hospital study of weight management clinic patients. Spare me any rhetoric - I don't need it, it doesn't apply, and it's largely based on misinformation.

 

I fly frequently; within North America, Central America & Europe mostly. I fit in the seats, and yes, sometimes need the armrest for my elbows. On some planes, I have lots of room. On others, my knees are scrunched against the seat in front (remember - 5'2"!!). I've never needed a seat belt extender.

 

Last year, on a connector flight through Chicago, I was assigned an aisle seat next to a sixtyish-looking woman. As I was stowing my carry-on in the bin across from my seat, this woman intercepted the stewardess in front of me and loudly told her that she didn't want to "share her seat with a fat person!". I was stunned, stopped what I was doing, and blinked at the stewardess. She was obviously as uncomfortable as I was about this. :o

 

I spoke first. I asked her if there was another seat that I could move to, because I told her that I wouldn't be very happy seated next to this passenger. She gave me a big smile and told me to wait a moment and didn't at all speak to this other woman. She came back quickly and offered me another aisle seat closer to the front of the plane and wished me a good flight. The seat next to mine had a guy who barely glanced my way when I sat down. I took it for granted that the stewardess thought the same about this ignoramus as I did...

 

What would now happen if this scenario repeated itself under the new UA rules? :eek:

Would I have been made to pay for a second seat, even if not needed?? Would I have been bumped off the plane??

If I had paid for a 2nd seat, would the ignoramus have been the one bumped off the plane?? :p

 

Who decides that I'm so large that I have to pay? The stewardess who can easily see that I could fit into any seat? or the ignoramus passenger who doesn't want a "fat" person seated next to them??? :confused::(

 

I wish the rules would be clearer -- an objective measure would be better than a subjective judgment. There's now a good chance that I may encounter another such situation in the future, especially since Mrs. Ignoramus would now feel that she has a point... :rolleyes:

[NCMtnBoys]

...the ignoramus passenger who doesn't want a "fat" person seated next to them??? :confused::(

 

 

I think if I were a flight attendant, I would have escorted Mrs. Ignoramus to a middle seat between two passengers holding screaming/crying babies and given her a choice..."this seat, your original, or there's the door" :D

[greatam]

Southwest has been doing this for at least 2 years. IF the check in agent has questions about your size, you will be asked to either purchase another seat OR you can go to the "try out room" where there is an airline seat set up. IF you cannot get the armrests down or the seat belt fastened with one extender, you will be TOLD to purchase another seat. If you don't, you won't board the flight. And if there are no extra seats available, you will be asked to wait for the next flight. You MAY luck out and the check in/gate agent MAY ask for volunteers to give up their seats for a voucher. But don't count on it. SW is not known to be overly generous with denied boarding compensation. All this "testing" takes place outside the general public's view. In PHX, it is handled at the end of SW's counter, in an area leading back to the offices, adjacent to the elevator housing.

 

I have also seen it numerous times on Airline.

 

I would guess United will handle it about the same way.

[snowglobe]

I would guess United will handle it about the same way.

 

I would hope so, as it would take the pressure off the flight attendants on board the plane.

 

Since there is such variability in airplane seat sizes (width and pitch), for the airlines that want to surcharge Plus Size passengers, should they not be required to disclose the seat dimensions during the booking process?

[greatam]

I would hope so, as it would take the pressure off the flight attendants on board the plane.

 

Since there is such variability in airplane seat sizes (width and pitch), for the airlines that want to surcharge Plus Size passengers, should they not be required to disclose the seat dimensions during the booking process?

 

Seat dimensions are readily available on most airline websites. And Seat Guru has very good listings of seat dimensions.

 

Why the airlines would be REQUIRED to disclose the dimensions I cannot fathom. You (generic you) know the rule is in effect. Would it not be the passengers responsibility to discover this information BEFORE they book the flight?

[CandCrew]

With United's policy, it's pretty cut and dried . . . one must fit into the seat with the armrests down AND with only one seatbelt extender. There's not much subjectivity to that. I would venture to guess that they'll follow Southwest's example and have that "sample" seat before one even boards the plane.

 

With all this discussion, I thought about something. Wouldn't it be more economical if, when one knows or strongly suspects that they will NOT fit by the criteria, a business class or FC seat was purchased? Yes, one could take the chance of buying on coach seat and hoping that the flight wasn't oversold but if actually being on the flight is a priority wouldn't that be wiser? To me, not purchasing the BC or FC seat is essentially taking the same risk as someone flying coach who shows up right before take off--there is the risk that one will not make the flight because it's oversold and additional seats simply aren't available.

 

Also, what happens if comes down to 1-2 limited seats and there are more passengers requiring 2 seats than available. How would they determine who flies and who goes? First one(s) on?

[snowglobe]

The *only* way a Plus Size person can tell if there is a potential problem is for full disclosure of seat size by the airline during the booking process.

 

Why? Because this info can easily be programmed into the database of the booking system AND...

 

Since all major airlines have gone to the hub & spoke model, unless you're flying between 2 major cities, you are looking at flights with more than one segment - often on different model planes with differently sized seats. (Oddly enough, I have found the small regional connector plane seat more comfortable in many cases.)

 

In addition, many of the flights I book end up code-shared with another airline. How do I go rooting for this info, buried in one website or another -- *IF* available at all?? I'm sorry, Greatam, but this information really is NOT readily available and Seat Guru doesn't always cut it either...

 

Is it at a hub boarding gate for my second segment that I get potentially pulled aside and forced to buy a second seat? Or is it the partner airline who sees a possible "mark"?

 

Shouldn't a person be able to book an itinerary based on seat size, if it potentially incurs an added cost to the overall ticket price? Shouldn't a responsible consumer have this information readily available?

 

To those who suggest that a Premium Economy or First Class seat would be an answer, I've also found these seats to be extremely variable in size as well.

[paul929207]

What concerns me about this is if you are plus sized, and go to board and are denied because of your size and no available open seats, are you at a serious risk of missing a cruise???? Even if you go a day ahead of time, if you are flying to a location such as San Juan there may not BE an open seat available even the next day as there are so few flights on United.

 

If a person truly is so large that he/she literally takes up more than one seat then I guess there is some justification for this, but as someone who has a traveling companion who is big (but not so big he/she can't fit with the armrests down) I am concerned that an overzealous flight attendant may try to bump this person unreasonably. Besides the abject humiliation that person would face, it could totally ruin the whole vacation and cause us to miss a cruise. Plus - what about the issue of splitting up families?!? Someone in your party supposedly doesn't fit, so he/she is bumped to a later (maybe next day) flight. So now they need to fly alone? This whole thing STINKS. Maybe airlines need to recognize the American population AS A WHOLE are getting larger and yet - gee whiz - the seats are getting smaller. :mad:

If someone is denied boarding because they are not in compliance with the rules, then they could possibly miss their cruise. I doubt that travel insurance would cover this.

[snowglobe]

I have seen counter crew and flight attendants grab at straws to deny boarding to passengers for an overbooked flight. I have repeatedly seen "easy" targets get summarily bumped. I once witnessed two 16 year-olds bumped from their flight in NY's JFK during a connection. These kids had no clue what was happening to them. I have seen passengers showing up, long before the door is set to close, denied boarding 40 min. before departure because they showed up at the gate supposedly "too late" to make their connection. These passengers were foreigners and targeted again because of their inability to make a fuss. I can continue with the examples.

 

Am I cynical? Yes - I've spent too much time in airports and have witnessed too many of these types of shenanigans when the airline staff is scrambling with an oversold flight.

 

Ohhhh yes, I do see Plus Size passengers being targeted BIG time with this rule - especially when someone/anyone needs to be shuffled to a later flight. What better solution??? NOT having to pay compensation AND make $$ in the deal! Pick a vulnerable looking target, one you think will not make a fuss, whether they could fit in the seat or not will not be the point.

[6rugrats]

There's a lot of anecdotal evidence and supposition being thrown around on this thread. I fly a great deal and spend lots of time observing the GAs and people at the gate and I have never seen any of the examples given in the previous thread. Besides, that has nothing to do with this topic.

 

Here's the reality. Airlines that have the "pay for the space you use" policy" have the rules of this policy clearly stated. Instead of endlessly speculating who is going to enforce these policies, why not go and read them yourselves.

 

UA's policy:

 

http://www.united.com/page/article/0,6722,52985,00.html

 

WN's policy:

 

http://www.southwest.com/travel_center/cos_guidelines.html

 

Note in WN's policy it states: "Customers .... should proactively book the number of seats needed prior to travel. "

 

It's pretty simple. Most people know if they will or will not fit in an airline seat or if they need more than one seat belt extender. It's also pretty simple to look at the type of aircraft on your booking, and then either call the airline for the seat dimensions, or quickly go to seatguru and look them up.

 

If you can book a ticket yourself, you have the skills to do this. If you can't I suggest you book your air travel through a TA.

 

Take responsibility for yourself and you will avoid a lot of hassle.

[6rugrats]

I've never needed a seat belt extender.

 

What would now happen if this scenario repeated itself under the new UA rules? :eek:

Would I have been made to pay for a second seat, even if not needed?? Would I have been bumped off the plane??

If I had paid for a 2nd seat, would the ignoramus have been the one bumped off the plane?? :p

 

Who decides that I'm so large that I have to pay? The stewardess who can easily see that I could fit into any seat? or the ignoramus passenger who doesn't want a "fat" person seated next to them??? :confused::(

 

I wish the rules would be clearer -- an objective measure would be better than a subjective judgment. There's now a good chance that I may encounter another such situation in the future, especially since Mrs. Ignoramus would now feel that she has a point... :rolleyes:

 

Why not read the rules yourself instead of speculating. Nothing would have happened to you under UA's new policy. The criteria are NOT subjective. If you fit in the seat and can put the armrests down and don't need a seat belt extender, you don't need the second seat.

 

Drama abounds today in this forum.

[DanJ]

I wonder what UA or the other airlines would do if 2 people of size wanted to share an empty middle seat? Would they make each person pay for an extra seat, or just let them split the cost of the one empty seat? I'm also curious what SW does when they say a passenger of size should proactively book the extra seat in advance, but they don't have assigned seating, and when you board, there are tons of single seats all over the place, but no double seats, let alone 3 seats together if you happen to be travelling as a couple.

[6rugrats]

I wonder what UA or the other airlines would do if 2 people of size wanted to share an empty middle seat? Would they make each person pay for an extra seat, or just let them split the cost of the one empty seat? I'm also curious what SW does when they say a passenger of size should proactively book the extra seat in advance, but they don't have assigned seating, and when you board, there are tons of single seats all over the place, but no double seats, let alone 3 seats together if you happen to be travelling as a couple.

 

They can't charge two different people for half a seat. One person would pay for the extra seat and sort it out with the other person.

 

For WN, I imagine, since they know two seats were booked in advance they would prevent this from happening by letting the COS (customer of size, is that better?) preboard.

 

Let's now move on to, I wonder what would happen if a meteor hit the earth today?