Are transatlantics profitable?

[caribbeanboy]

Seeing the prices for transatlantics on actually most cruise lines I wonder if they make any money on those trips?

 

A TA is at least 12 days and most of the time you pay what you normally would pay for a 7 day cruise.

[voyager70]

From what I understand the reason transatlantic itineraries are so cheap in comparison to other itineraries is because there are so many sea days, when everyone is on board spending money on drinks, in the casino and shops. The cruise lines make a great deal of their profits on alcohol and in the casino. So I guess the answer is yes, they are profitable, otherwise the fares would be higher.

[Dick in Falls Church]

the ship is going from one cruise area to another. Obviously, anything they can take in will benefit their bottom line.

When you crank in the cost of air either to or from Europe, plus whatever one-way fare (if any) in the States, and the fact that many folks can't take 12-14 days off (except youth-challenged), obviously the lines try to set a price that will at least let them break even.

 

over the last couple years, I've seen the prices creep up, probably as cruisers find out what a good deal it is (if you like sea days).

[TEXASMUNK]

TA's are not intended to be profitable, they are intended to move equipment.

 

If you pay $1000 for two for a 12 night cruise and 2000 people pay the same amount. That is alot of cash to help defray the fuel cost.

That is $1,000,000 in fuel the cruise line has taken it. Cost of food is negligable so any onboard spending you do also reduces the 'repositioning ' costs.

[rubrrick]

If someone wants to really study this subject......take the TA on the Navigator of the Seas vs the Jewel of the Seas TA.

 

There is a major difference..............and I have often wondered why?

 

The Jewel is almost half again as expensive.....and yet, in years past, has always been full.

 

Great question!!;)

 

Rick

[TBSCruiser]

If someone wants to really study this subject......take the TA on the Navigator of the Seas vs the Jewel of the Seas TA.

 

There is a major difference..............and I have often wondered why?

 

The Jewel is almost half again as expensive.....and yet, in years past, has always been full.

 

Great question!!;)

 

Rick

 

Great itinerary, great ship, indoor solarium pool huge draw for me.

[The Big Booper]

As stated above, the purpose of a TA is to move the ship from one part of the world to another. Since these sailings occur during shoulder periods and involve open jaw air travel they are difficult to sell, so the per diems have be low to entice people to book. The passengers on the TAs tend to be older, for obvious reasons, and thus don't run up the big on-board spending bills.

 

No matter, the ship has to move so some revenue is better then no revenue. The only marginal costs are food costs since food doesn't keep forever. Salaries are the same and are fixed.

[pscruzinboyz]

Last year, a week after we sailed the voyager out of Galveston, The next week she was heading to Europe. I thought it was 15 nights and the lowest price I saw was 399.00. If I was not a working Man, I would have jumped on that...................the deal of the year. One Day.......But I think I would like to do the Queen Mary 2. :)

 

Mike

[The Big Booper]

...<<snip>>...I thought it was 15 nights and the lowest price I saw was 399.00. If I was not a working Man, I would have jumped on that...................the deal of the year. ..<<snip>>....Mike

 

But, you are still working......Which proves my point.

[Rocky Sosua]

Hi all,

I suppose I should introduce myself.

They call me Rocky and I live in the DR.

Just took my first cruise a few months ago with Royal Caribbean and I loved it.

It was an TA repositioning deal (from Santo Domingo to Harwich England) and very inexpensive. (under $500)

 

I spent a fair bit of time thinking about Caribbeanboy's topic and I agree with most of what has been said, and I would tend to agree that the older folks probably spend less onboard than a younger crowd The other thing that struck me was someone mentioning that the food was not a great cost factor. I have no expertise on the matter, but I would have guessed that they spent a small fortune feeding us the way they do.

 

I hope they never stop offering good deals on the repositioning cruises.

[Kittycatwlv]

)

 

I spent a fair bit of time thinking about Caribbeanboy's topic and I agree with most of what has been said, and I would tend to agree that the older folks probably spend less onboard than a younger crowd The other thing that struck me was someone mentioning that the food was not a great cost factor. I have no expertise on the matter, but I would have guessed that

 

I hope they never stop offering good deals on the repositioning cruises.

Food runs $8 per person per day. I took the galley tour just this month and was told that figure.

Why would older folks spend less? They have the money to buy call brand liquor and gamble in the casino more.

[pscruzinboyz]

Hi all,

I suppose I should introduce myself.

They call me Rocky and I live in the DR.

Just took my first cruise a few months ago with Royal Caribbean and I loved it.

It was an TA repositioning deal (from Santo Domingo to Harwich England) and very inexpensive. (under $500)

 

I spent a fair bit of time thinking about Caribbeanboy's topic and I agree with most of what has been said, and I would tend to agree that the older folks probably spend less onboard than a younger crowd The other thing that struck me was someone mentioning that the food was not a great cost factor. I have no expertise on the matter, but I would have guessed that they spent a small fortune feeding us the way they do.

 

I hope they never stop offering good deals on the repositioning cruises.

 

WELCOME ROCKY to CC

 

Next time you are cruising, go to the Roll Call thread and find your cruise and start chatting with your fellow cruisers.

I take it DR is the Dominican Republic.........Are you an American who retired down there?

 

Mike

[Rocky Sosua]

Food runs $8 per person per day. I took the galley tour just this month and was told that figure.

Why would older folks spend less? They have the money to buy call brand liquor and gamble in the casino more.

That's amazing. I wish I could feed myself that well for 8 bux a day. Heck, I wish I could feed myself that well for double the price.

Thanks for that info. It really does shed some light on the question of whether the cruiselines make profit on the repositioning cruises.

 

As for the older folks spending less, it's only my guess.

As mentioned, I have been on only one cruise and my experience is at a kindergarten level.

The reason I thought that, is that people talked to me about older retired folks with fixed incomes who just about lived on the ships, going from one good deal to another, as it was just as cheap if not cheaper than living in an old folks home. That being said, I didn't see too many old geisers around, so I am open to learning form your greater experience.

The only thing that nobody can change my mind on, is that I love going on cruises.

The rest is just details.

Regards, Marco.

[BruceMuzz]

My ship just completed a Transatlantic Repo Cruise.

Despite nearly giving the cabins away, were only about 75% full. We are fully booked for every other cruise this year.

 

The passengers onboard were older and very frugal.

They spent nearly nothing onboard for the 6 night crossing.

They also ate about 50% more than we normally feed a full ship.

The majority of the passengers took the auto-tips off, claiming that they couldnt't afford to tip. The service staff made next to nothing.

Did we make any profit? Not a chance.

Did we pay for the fuel to move the ship from A to B? Just barely.

[Rocky Sosua]

WELCOME ROCKY to CC

 

Next time you are cruising, go to the Roll Call thread and find your cruise and start chatting with your fellow cruisers.

I take it DR is the Dominican Republic.........Are you an American who retired down there?

 

Mike

Thanks for the welcome.

I'm told that this forum is highly addictive and I can see why.

 

You are correct, the DR is short for the Dominican Republic. Many folks refer to it as the Dominican, which is like nails on a blackboard to me and others who know better. It's the same as saying, "I went to the American" or " I went to the Canadian". So we call it the DR for short.

 

I was born in Canada but have lived here longer than anywhere else in my life.

I am retired now, but that is quite recent.

I sold my bar/rest/hotel on Jan 1 of this year.

Now I aspire to cruise as much as possible and I fill up the time in between with my hobby of tweaking computers.

I'm well known in these parts and I get an average of 3 computers per day brought to me. I love doing it and the owners of the puters are happier than can be when they get them back, at least twice as fast as before, specially when I do it for free.

The tougher the challenge, the more I like it.

Nothing puts a smile on my face like someone bringing me a laptop with a nasty virus on it.

Regards, Marco..

 

PS: Is it ok to post pix?

[The Big Booper]

I have never worked in the cruise biz but as a CPA with 40+ years experience, I can make some educated guesses about costs.

 

I would guess that the ship lays in provisions for a trip based on passengers aboard and the spread of age groups.

 

Older folks tend not to stay up late drinking so there goes the alcohol consumption.

 

People who are drawn to cheapo TAs don't have a lot of discretionary income and are well aware that they don't have 20-30 years of earning power left to replace money pi$$ed away on a cruise on foolish spending.

 

Older people are most likely to go because they don't work (in schools) and don't have school age kids. And have the time to spend 2 weeks + on a ship.

 

You will not see a high earning couple and their 2 or 3 kids on TAs spending their $$, they are busy working.

 

Since the ship HAS to move and most costs are fixed, why not get some warm bodies on and make some $$ to cover the expenses.

 

On our recent TA on the Indy, at our table for 10, one couple (refugees from Carnival) disappeared with 3 nights to go and never came back, so I guess they stiffed the staff. They made no bones about the fact that they thought the ship was too refined and there was not enough drinking going on at 2 in the morning.

[TBSCruiser]

I have never worked in the cruise biz but as a CPA with 40+ years experience, I can make some educated guesses about costs.

 

I would guess that the ship lays in provisions for a trip based on passengers aboard and the spread of age groups.

 

Older folks tend not to stay up late drinking so there goes the alcohol consumption.

 

People who are drawn to cheapo TAs don't have a lot of discretionary income and are well aware that they don't have 20-30 years of earning power left to replace money pi$$ed away on a cruise on foolish spending.

 

Older people are most likely to go because they don't work (in schools) and don't have school age kids. And have the time to spend 2 weeks + on a ship.

 

You will not see a high earning couple and their 2 or 3 kids on TAs spending their $$, they are busy working.

 

Since the ship HAS to move and most costs are fixed, why not get some warm bodies on and make some $$ to cover the expenses.

 

On our recent TA on the Indy, at our table for 10, one couple (refugees from Carnival) disappeared with 3 nights to go and never came back, so I guess they stiffed the staff. They made no bones about the fact that they thought the ship was too refined and there was not enough drinking going on at 2 in the morning.

 

 

On my TA the bars were rocking until the wee hours each night, casino hopping as well as the clubs and the disco was standing room only. We are in our 40's and love TA's . Many people get two weeks off, hubby gets 6 I get 4, and we are not alone. I would say our age group was the very well represented.

[tnt10]

My partner and I love TA's, have done several over the years.

We enjoy embarking in a European port, after spending several days in that city, then relaxing on the many sea days, with only a spattering of port stops, that only TA's offer. No rush to get up and off to see a port that "you may never see again," which is common on many of the more port intensive sailings.

Relaxing sea days, there's nothing better to put things in perspective than to be out in the middle of the Atlantic, with nothing but the waves and the breeze. Can be very humbling.

Happy Cruising,

TnT

[CavePearl]

I have never worked in the cruise biz but as a CPA with 40+ years experience, I can make some educated guesses about costs.

 

I would guess that the ship lays in provisions for a trip based on passengers aboard and the spread of age groups.

 

Older folks tend not to stay up late drinking so there goes the alcohol consumption.

We're over 55 and we stay up 'til all hours and consume alcohol. :D

People who are drawn to cheapo TAs don't have a lot of discretionary income and are well aware that they don't have 20-30 years of earning power left to replace money pi$$ed away on a cruise on foolish spending.

We deliberately choose TAs because it is the only way we can cruise that offers so many sea days. We prefer sea days to port intensive itineraries. We also consider money that is spent on a cruise is never pi$$ed away. It is well-spent!

Older people are most likely to go because they don't work (in schools) and don't have school age kids. And have the time to spend 2 weeks + on a ship.

I still work, and save my vacation time so I can have two weeks off at a time.

 

You will not see a high earning couple and their 2 or 3 kids on TAs spending their $$, they are busy working.

While our kids are out of the house and on their own, I consider myself to be high-earning enough to support a retired husband. ;) Besides, what does this really have to do with our choice to go on a TA? We go on TAs because it's the only way to get all those sea days! It is actually not a decision based on price at all.

Since the ship HAS to move and most costs are fixed, why not get some warm bodies on and make some $$ to cover the expenses.

I agree. That is just good business.

 

On our recent TA on the Indy, at our table for 10, one couple (refugees from Carnival) disappeared with 3 nights to go and never came back, so I guess they stiffed the staff. They made no bones about the fact that they thought the ship was too refined and there was not enough drinking going on at 2 in the morning.

That's just wrong. If they were at our table we just might have gone and hunted them down after we stayed up late drinking...:p

 

Transatlantic cruises are relaxing and a good value. Ahhh... Is it time to go yet??

[willyguy]

My ship just completed a Transatlantic Repo Cruise.

Despite nearly giving the cabins away, were only about 75% full. We are fully booked for every other cruise this year.

 

The passengers onboard were older and very frugal.

They spent nearly nothing onboard for the 6 night crossing.

They also ate about 50% more than we normally feed a full ship.

The majority of the passengers took the auto-tips off, claiming that they couldnt't afford to tip. The service staff made next to nothing.

Did we make any profit? Not a chance.

Did we pay for the fuel to move the ship from A to B? Just barely.

Do you work for the ship or are you a guess?

[pcur]

Thanks for the welcome.

I'm told that this forum is highly addictive and I can see why.

 

You are correct, the DR is short for the Dominican Republic.

 

 

I had to laugh, because when I read your first post above I thought you were saying you lived in the DINING ROOM on board a ship (DR for short on this board), and I thought you were a stowaway!!!! :D:D

[The Big Booper]

I am a night owl who hardly drinks and uses the hours from 1 AM on to around 2 or so to catch up on my e-mail. When you are a sole practioner in my field you are never on vacation when clients get audit notices, mysterious tax due notices, etc. When they send a panicked e-mail (at 7 PM EDT) and you are on a ship 500 miles west of London, it has to be answered. The quicker the better.

 

So I am up at 2 AM and see what is going on in the ship late night and stand by my points. I have seen ships in the Caribbean at 2 AM and westbound TAs (the only direction I can go) at 2 AM and I know the difference. I never said there were no party animals on the TAs just far fewer.

 

31 cruises and still going strong.

 

And the internet is much faster at 1 AM, fewer users. Get done in half the time.

[robtulipe]

Our last two cruises were repositioning ones, a 14 night west bound TA and a 15 night from Chile to San Diego. Both were extremely well priced, our superior balconies were around $40 per person per day including all taxes and fees, and the ships were only 3/4 full. IMO the cruise line is only trying to cover some of the cost of moving the ship to their new local and have the service staff receive some gratuities which basically is their salary. Empty cabins don't help cover either nor develop any on board sales. In my experience on repositioning cruises you have an older, more experienced and wiser cruiser on board who typically knows the best or a better, usually cheaper way to enjoy themselves and likely has more benefits from the C&A or other cruise line frequent cruiser status. This was particularly evident on the roll call for our last cruise on which different groups arranged private to the port transfers, which was a long one at about 1 1/2 hours, and shore excursions. Not only were these arranged at a much lower cost but were also superior to what was being offered by the cruise line.

[Rocky Sosua]

I had to laugh, because when I read your first post above I thought you were saying you lived in the DINING ROOM on board a ship (DR for short on this board), and I thought you were a stowaway!!!! :D:D

There could be worse places to stowaway in. :D

 

On the matter of whether the repo TAs are actually profitable, I will ask my travel agent today. I'll be calling her anyhow for some cruise stuff and if she has been in the biz for a long time, she will most likely know.

I'll post anything I find out.

[I Fly]

My ship just completed a Transatlantic Repo Cruise.

Despite nearly giving the cabins away, were only about 75% full. We are fully booked for every other cruise this year.

 

The passengers onboard were older and very frugal.

They spent nearly nothing onboard for the 6 night crossing.

They also ate about 50% more than we normally feed a full ship.

The majority of the passengers took the auto-tips off, claiming that they couldnt't afford to tip. The service staff made next to nothing.

Did we make any profit? Not a chance.

Did we pay for the fuel to move the ship from A to B? Just barely.

 

While I know this topic has to do with the cruise lines making money on a TA, I was wondering about the crew making more or less money on certain types of cruises. Are there certain types of cruises that crew members make more or less money in tips? Also, in terms of tipping, what is considered a "good" tip by crew members. When you mention passengers taking off auto-tips. How much tip, over the suggested amount is considered a good tip? When the service is very good and I want to give extra tip, I want the tip to express my satisfaction. I'm speaking of tipping on the last night of the cruise, not on a single time basis when someone brings me a drink.

 

Thanks,

Steve