Zandaam passenger overboard...search underway

[Boytjie]

Well said, Goldryder.

[mamaofami]

THis is so sad to read. My heart goes out to her family and friends.

[razor_baks]

My wife and I were on the Zaandam two weeks ago - took a picture of the Temsco Helicopters warming up as we were coming into Ketchikan:

 

 

I'm looking forward to hearing from passengers on this cruise on how the incident was handled.

 

So sad

[Shewuf]

No one could survive that cold water for any length of time. Chances are that it was a suicide in a breath-taking, unique place. Sad, but I read that people don't usually fall overboard. More often than not, it is planned. :o

[neverpar]

So sad. Unfortunately it does seem like a suicide. I really don't understand this sort of thing. I get why people sometimes feel they have no options. Okay. However, why involve anyone else? The Coast Guard, the ship's crew, friends and family onboard, other passengers... If you truly feel you need to end things then please, do so without jeopardizing (the search and rescue team) and without traumatizing others.

 

 

Explain....how does one go about commiting suicide without traumatizing others?? :confused:

I would think no matter how you choose to do it, it's going to traumatize your family and friends...

 

This is a very sad story...my thoughts and prayers go out to her family and friends..

[pms4104]

Because none of us know the circumstances of this poor woman's demise ... it is unfair to her and to her family and friends to presume her disappearance was a suicide.

 

Very sad situation ... my sympathies to those in her life who cherished her.

[RetiredMustang]

Sadly, it appears that Brian may have been right: http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2009597521_apuspassengeroverboard2ndldwritethru.html

 

Dave

[Krazy Kruizers]

Heard that they found her body this morning.

Very sad for her and her family and friends.

[DougMacP]

Let's be honest, those railings are so high that you have to work to fall overboard. Usually it's someone that is drunk and sitting on their balcony railing..or someone who jumps. Almost always at night. Yes, feel bad for her family, but also for all the other folks on that cruise. It must have cast a dark cloud over all their vacations.

[Cruising-along]

Sadly, it appears that Brian may have been right: http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2009597521_apuspassengeroverboard2ndldwritethru.html

 

Dave

 

It's all so sad, my sympathy and prayers go out to her friends and family.

 

I was wondering where she lived, as earlier the news just said "Washington state". My gosh, Arlington is a small town just a few miles from here.

[littlebluebook]

What scares me is, what a terrible way to go. Not that there is any great way to commit suicide, but to jump overboard and fall all that way into that freezing water in the dark...it doesn't bear thinking about. Frightens the beejeezus out of me!

 

Such a sad stroy :(

[YeaYeaYea]

Killing yourself ......................why???????????

[JerseyJaguar]

However, why involve anyone else? The Coast Guard, the ship's crew, friends and family onboard, other passengers... If you truly feel you need to end things then please, do so without jeopardizing (the search and rescue team) and without traumatizing others.

I agree, if you are that desperate to kill yourself, don't involve complete strangers. This is a very selfish thing to do, with no regard for the other people on the ship or the rescue people.

[suse]

Very sad. Suicide is selfish. These people aren't thinking of anything other than killing themselves because they are very sick.

Sorry for her family. It will be hard to heal.

[cruzin girl]

I think that once they reach that state of mind, logic is not an option.

It is hard for someone like us on the outside to comprehend...but in their own mind, they are trapped and it is the only way out. :(

[noobiecruiser]

So sad ...

[Goldryder]

Selfish...depends on which side of the rail you are standing on, and I don't mean that in a bad or flippant way.

 

With the benefit of being on the outside looking in after the event and for those of us who have been there and come close to 'flicking the switch' and decided against it, yes it can be seen as a selfish act towards family, friends and the total strangers that will be caught up in your own nightmare for those few moments of madness.

 

However, for the person who is so tormented and so tortured that they feel that there really is no way to continue life, then any thoughts of the pain or suffering passed onto family, friends and total strangers fades into the background...sometimes vanishes altogether.

 

When all hope is lost, when one's mood is so low that even seeing the sun rise one more morning is just way too much to bear, then all that person will be thinking about is flicking that switch and making that life go away.

 

Like I said before, when you get that low, you are convinced that you won't be missed and the world will be a better place without you...

 

It is so easy to call someone who commits suicide 'selfish' but when in their shoes, they aren't being selfish at all, they are effectively taking the burden of their lives and their problems off the shoulders of those around them.

 

Irrational...probably, yes, but when you are at the bottom of that dark pit and you cannot see the daylight, there are few alternatives to choose from and most do not want to be seen as even more of a burden than they already consider themselves to be.

 

Ms Mulkuch's family will inevitably go over the days, weeks and months prior to this happening and try to piece together what they might have missed, but chances are, something inside snapped on that ship and as to what that was will never be known.

[CowPrincess]

Goldryder, thank you for your sensitive, insightful posts.

[JerseyJaguar]

but chances are, something inside snapped on that ship and as to what that was will never be known.

Unless, like that old couple who disappeared from a locked cabin, it was a well thought out plan and she purposely took that cruise to kill herself there.

 

I appreciate your insight into suicide, and I've seen what suicide does to family members, but I was discussing her need to include complete strangers, all her fellow passengers, in this. Many suicides feel as you say, but most don't involve thousands of people in their death.

[suse]

I also appreciate the insight into suicide since I never could understand it. Thankfully, I suppose. I've always thought it was selfish to hurt so many people but I understand it probably isn't selfishness at all.

Involving so many people, including Coast Guard, ship's crew, and so on does seem excessive.

[mrsltg]

Explain....how does one go about commiting suicide without traumatizing others?? :confused:

I would think no matter how you choose to do it, it's going to traumatize your family and friends...

 

This is a very sad story...my thoughts and prayers go out to her family and friends..

 

Oh let's see... there was the man who jumped off of my office building and hit the ground below my window. That was fun to see. Then there was the guy who just last week blew his brains out in a hospital parking lot in front of people (he was hoping by doing this his organs could be harvested), the person who ties up traffic for hours on a bridge thereby attracting a large audience before jumping, etc, etc, etc. You get the point. By hanging yourself in your closet you'll obviously cause trauma to whomever finds you but that's a whole lot different then the above scenarios where you invite strangers to participate in your suicide. JMHO.

 

I also care, very much, for the recovery team that suited up and headed into 57 degree water. That's not good for anyone. They also take their helicopter up which is not without danger to begin with. Granted, the Coast Guard and others like them sign up knowing the risks, HOWEVER, the risks are more understandable when discussing someone who needs help, not someone who has taken their own life and then put these responders at greater risk. I would like to reiterate that I do feel very sorry for the deceased. The hopelessness that surrounded her in the end is horrific.

[Goldryder]

No-one who reaches the end of their rope consciously chooses their 'stage' in which to carry out their last act on earth, nor do they choose the audience that might view it. External forces are blurred. Suicidal thoughts are one thing...most people have a bout of those at least once in their life...actually going through with it is something completely different altogether.

 

It's not a case of that they do not care about anyone watching them or finding them or looking for them. They are totally consumed in their own misery and their own pain and they just want out. It isn't a pretty way to die whether in the full glare of the public eye or in the privacy of a closet in the bedroom, but when desperate the act of dying is all that is important and not the effect it will undoubtably have on those in the vicinity of where the deed is done.

 

Whatever happened to force Ms Malkuch's hand and for her to take the decision that she did will never ever be known, however, those who dutifully searched for her and those who will grieve for her will all still treat her with the dignity and the respect that she deserves. They won't label her as less deserving of respect just cos she chose to take her life, so who are we to do so?

 

The 'why' doesn't matter, the 'how' doesn't matter....what matter's is that this lady is now at peace with herself, which is probably something she has not been able to be for some time.

 

Debating whether or not she was selfish shouldn't even be a consideration here, this lady has died a traumatic and deeply sad death...she died alone and in an escape from demons that only she could understand. Let her rest in peace and show her the respect that any human being who has passed away should have without judgement.

[lettienets]

...........this lady has died a traumatic and deeply sad death...she died alone and in an escape from demons that only she could understand........

I was coming home from the cottage last week on the busiest highway in Canada and it was closed one way as a guy was hanging near death on an overpass. There were police at the top talking to him. I don't know what happened to that fellow but I could only feel sympathy for him. These people are mentally ill and need help. Unfortunately they often don't get it in time.

[Hapytocruise]

Does no one think it odd that she ordered room service at midnight and then jumped overboard???? Sounds a bit suspicious to me.

[RuthC]

Does no one think it odd that she ordered room service at midnight and then jumped overboard???? Sounds a bit suspicious to me.

Not at all. This poor, tortured soul had made her decision, and at last had a bit of peace with herself. She was comfortable in her plan, and was able to relax with it.

 

This whole situation is just too, too sad.