notamermaid

From what people have reported here on CC over the years, this is the least favourite excursion on a Viking Rhine river cruise. The coach tour seems not to do the Black Forest justice. Good that you mention this. You appear to have put the Rhine into your considerations because you may be bored on the Douro sailing. The Douro scenery is more spectacular all in all compared to a Rhine river cruise but judging from the Douro photos I would say that "my" river is more varied. As regards how the two rivers "work" I would say you have two almost opposing ways of cruising/excursion/sailing time and distance set-up. But the others have explained that in more detail already. It really depends on what you are looking for. Also remember that you have two quite different areas of Europe; life in the countries, that is Portugal vs. Switzerland/France/Germany/Netherlands, that you will visit is not the same. Especially in summer heat. The Douro villages looked a bit sleepy in the documentary I saw. I will go with Gourmet Gal and suggest that you look at a Rhine/Moselle itinerary instead of the Basel to Amsterdam Rhine Getaway by Viking. Unless you would like to see Cologne Cathedral. But if you enjoy travelling by train the options in Europe are almost endless anyway, so you could go to Cologne by yourself. The Rhine is a busy waterway, the Moselle is a bit like the Douro apparently but with different wine... The Moselle does have barge traffic. Both are lock-controlled by the way, i.e. the Douro and the Moselle. The Rhine partially where river cruise ships sail. notamermaid

Let us have a quick look at what the Danube did in Germany in February. This is Pfelling: At Pfelling we are normally concerned with low water. In winter and sometimes during other months we do see high water and the authorities issue a river traffic ban at 620cm. The river was high in February, starting above 500cm and showing two more spikes due to heavy rain. Thankfully, dry days allowed the river to recover in between them so that flooding did not become severe. No river traffic ban was necessary. At Passau we have that problem with the low bridge and of course the high water coming through Pfelling. That is what the reaction at Passau looked like: The highs did not reach a level that would have impeded sailing under the low bridge. The authorities have put this (as a guideline) at 630cm. notamermaid

The river cruising season on the Elbe is starting on Monday for Viking with the first "Elegant Elbe" itinerary, i.e. Berlin land stay advertised for 11 March. The German company Plantours is sailing on Sunday. They are starting in Berlin as well but will not be on the Elbe before Viking. The reason is: they are going East! Yes, you can do that from Berlin if you have a small ship. The MS Sans Souci: https://www.plantours-kreuzfahrten.de/reise/kulturschaetze-am-oderufer-san0124-san0224/?tab=IhrSchiff Viking's ships, although adapted for the Elbe and therefore smaller than those for the Danube, etc., are bigger than the Sans Souci. Another small ship perfectly suited for the Elbe is the Swiss Ruby. I mentioned her in a previous post in connection with the winter sailings of Viva Cruises. Of course, the company is using the ship for more sailings in the area. On 29 March the Swiss Ruby sets sail from Berlin to Prague. More dates and the reverse itinerary are also available: https://www.viva-*****/en/reise/higlights-der-elbe-und-moldau notamermaid

Aaahhh, not to worry, half meant in earnest. Was going to answer, but wanted to put some info in the Elbe thread anyway, so all over there. Thank you for following there. Interesting that you looked at Nicko Cruises. They have some nice itineraries. They are on the Rhine of course. For all those not familiar with the company - they have spread their marketing internationally but I have no idea how successful they are with that and what the international or at least-bilingual cruises are like. notamermaid

All will be revealed in the thread on the Elbe. 😊 I have just checked: Rhine gauges mostly showing levels above or around the mean (long-term average). All very good for a pleasant start to the season. notamermaid

Indeed. On Viking river cruises on the Elbe, the beginning and the end are nowhere near an Elbe river port. Berlin and Prague on the itinerary become a much more integral part of the whole experience it feels to me, i.e. the trip is not a worthwhile one without the large cities for that company and Viking cannot sail with their ships into either city which are great to explore and so convenient for the airports. The Spree in Berlin is nice for sailing, I am sure you will enjoy it. The Berlin river cruise port is in Spandau, just after the mouth of the Spree on the Havel river. The Havel flows into the Elbe, so that is how CroisiEurope gets from Berlin to Prague actually sailing (there is a canal involved also, I believe). Cruises on the Elbe are a different thing from cruises on the Rhine. And it is an altogether different feel over there in the East I find. It is all German culture of course, but we on the Rhine are Roman influenced and close to France whereas there are no Roman direct influences on the Elbe and Berlin is close to Poland. Dinner cruise in Prague sounds great. That by the way is something you can do in Cologne. Not as much as in Prague I expect but KD does have such offers with drinks and snacks/meals. For those interested: https://www.k-d.com/en/cruises/evening-panorama-cruise-cologne Similar offers are available in a few other towns. notamermaid

Let us have a quick look back at February and what the river was doing at Dresden: The month started on a level well above the mean and climbed over the line that is statistically mean high water. The month basically ended with the level that the month started with. 300cm is a very good buffer for times without rain and it has been dryer so far. The current level is 251cm. A good start to the river cruising season. notamermaid

A coincidence no doubt if I am correct - both Cruisecritic's Adam Coulter and Emma, a seasoned traveller on cruise ships, it seems were on the same river cruise that did not go as planned. It was an unusually rainy November and December on the Rhine so the cruise on the TUI Skyla had some hiccups. Adam reported on this here: https://www.cruisecritic.co.uk/articles/just-back-from-tui-skyla-a-christmas-markets-cruise-on-the-rhine Emma reported on the flooding that changed the itinerary so her video footage complements the text and photo from Adam of Andernach (see also the link in his article). The young lady shows you around the ship and you get a good impression of what sailing TUI can be like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7o_-bPhPYLs notamermaid

Thanks folks, good to read that you are enjoying it. Have re-watched some minutes but currently busy with other stuff. Spring is coming to the Rhineland fast it seems, although it is a bit cold today. Sun getting stronger and magnolia tree nearby getting ready to blossom. Last year I saw the difference in temperatures between valley and hills well. Magnolia tree here was budding, 100m higher in altitude magnolia trees were three days behind ours. Recap of February coming soon. Spotted first river cruise ship in weeks on the river, i,e, not many about yet and me not being that often directly at the river. The Rhine is as busy as ever with barges and tankers. I like that. Good description. Season on the Elbe starting this weekend by the way, both Plantours and Viking. And all our rivers here in Germany and adjoining countries look pleasant for sailing as far as I can determine. notamermaid

That is just my take on the itinerary from Basel to Amsterdam of course. If you wanted to get deeper into this you would need to see where the river comes from and the wild and unusual journey it takes before it becomes a river cruising river - the high Alps and a huge lake. For those with a lot of time I recommend this series on the Rhine. Five parts, well researched and beautifully filmed I find, this is part one: notamermaid

Welcome to Cruisecritic. Than you for saying hello. The very popular itinerary in a great month to see the river, landscape and towns. You are right, low water is not a concern (hardly ever), high water occasionally. Today has been a sunny day with a fast rise in temperatures, kind of Spring-like almost. The daffodils are already out and blooming well where it is warm. Overall winter has been warm and rainy, more than in other years. We are going into the river cruising season with plenty of water in the river and in the ground. Interesting thought. "My" river is what they call a major artery of Europe, a transport highway - a "bl**dy motorway" as one captain called it compared to other rivers. Basel to Amsterdam takes you along so many kilometres that for me it is sort of three rivers. My avatar photo is taken at a ferry crossing in the Upper Rhine valley. A wide, tamed, partly lock-controlled, channel-like river (the French canal-section is nearby there). Quite different from the river where it is naturally "channelled in" by hills and meanders along, what may be seen as the most picturesque part. Then past Duisburg it becomes the wide river again, this time naturally deeper and spreading out as it leaves my country and forms the delta, feeding the canals of the Netherlands (Amsterdam is not on the Rhine at all). notamermaid

The Dom at night is great, certainly something to stay up for. There was not much to do on our river cruise either, we just listened to the DJ, talked to other people in the lounge or watched the scenery even though it was dark. One is up so early in the morning that, contrary to being a night owl, I went to bed early, apart from the evening in Vienna when there was a late evening snack for those returning from a "wine with music" excursion. You can watch television in your room of course - one night there was a football game which the crew put on a public space television per request of some passengers - or hang around in a quiet library area reading. My cruise was a quiet affair compared to American cruise lines, Amawaterways will I am sure have a bit more entertainment that they stage on the ship or offer in towns. notamermaid

It is a bit colder here today, you can feel the little chill on the wind, but overall it is sunny and mild. Spring started meteorologically yesterday and the small varieties of narcissus are blooming in sheltered places in gardens. I live in a warm area of Germany of course so bloom is a little earlier than in the high hills, or the North. I have reduced hours at work, using up holiday from last year. A quiet time for tourism, it will get busier for me in two weeks time. And river cruising starts again then as well on a larger scale. Must admit that while the water lilies are nice I prefer other impressionist paintings and painters. Had a great time in Paris with my art class, really would not mind seeing the paintings again in a kind of "dash in, see 'em, dash out of Paris again quickly" fashion. I have been told that Giverny is interesting but so full that one cannot properly appreciate it. And if that person says something like that to me then I know I would not like it. notamermaid

You are in Scotland, so you will know about the British conversation topics "weather and the state of the roads". In all earnest, I find that topics like those everyone can relate to and they rarely get you into unhappy or embarrassing situations. Weather should not drift into climate change of course, I agree about avoiding that. Politics only ever if it relates to the country you are currently in and it may affect you or be of some historic importance. Religion, probably not a good idea either. At my table we started off by figuring out where we came from - mixed German and English speakers but not native English - and talking about how we got to the river cruise - train or car - and looking at the landscape outside our window (do you live near a river or the sea?), etc. Once you have cruised for a day you can of course relate to the day's events. notamermaid

Thank you. Here is an article from travelweekly uk: https://travelweekly.co.uk/news/tour-operators/apt-to-launch-two-new-ships-in-europe-next-spring The vessels change but it seems that two signature events - both are exclusive to APT I believe - will be the same. Namedy Castle is a great place to have such an event. notamermaid

The flooding of 1784 affected so many lives. Looking briefly at Bonn again, the day of 27 February saw a family in the old town moving their belongings up one floor, the mother having been used to flooding from her childhood home in Koblenz-Ehrenbreitstein. But as the day progressed it became clear that this was not going to be enough. With water and ice approaching the family escaped through the second floor windows with the help of a ladder and through the back yard reached safety. The story only came to light much later when it was published by the owner of the building in Rheingasse 7. The 13-year-old boy who had the lucky escape in 1784 had never talked about it himself. He would have had plenty of listeners as he got around in the world, at that young age already well-known but soon rising to lasting musical fame. The boy's name is Ludwig van Beethoven. notamermaid

Not an easy decision. I agree that a direct comparison from someone who has sailed both lines would be best. I have sailed on neither so just a couple of quick thoughts from me. Daylight between your two dates is not a consideration, they are so close, and daylight saving time only ends on the last Sunday in October. Sunday closure of shops or Monday closure of museums may be a consideration if you are looking at a specific experience/excursion. You have already had responses as regards river levels. Last point from me: autumn foliage. That is more pronounced at the later date. Have fun planning. notamermaid

Oh that really is early. A bit on the cold side but a fantastic experience, I am sure. Of course it is too early to say in detail what the river will do in a week's time and I have no idea what the weather is like past Vienna. Still, weather patterns are often similar further downstream. And there is little rain forecast in Germany, so not much water coming to Hungary. Recap of February coming up. notamermaid

Great stops on this very unusual itinerary as regards the route. I like this one a lot. It would be great if this was on the River Queen, she is one of my favourite ships on the rivers, I mean the design. But I am sure your ship will be great, too. Frankfurt and Trier are so very different from each other, two German cities that one could reach within just a few hours by train, but quite apart in history and feel (and architecture). If you listen carefully to the locals you will also notice the difference in dialect. Enjoy your cruise. notamermaid

Good to read you will be coming to my realm, West Germany. Magnificent Moselle I suppose means that there will be a focus on that river. But you are sailing the Rhine Gorge as well? Sounds good, how long is the itinerary? Any place that you are especially looking forward to? notamermaid

Now that is an image that I will not be able to ban easily from my mind. Grin. Never heard that word, sounds like a slightly misheard thing that made its way into the lingo. Leave it in the streets for a while and wait for Brussels (to) sprout(s). Okay, just to get away from that for a minute, the ITB is happening again, if you are interested: https://www.itb.com/en/ Also, new announcements by river cruise companies coming in almost every day. New solo cruises, waivers, special offers, new itineraries, ship christenings coming up. Difficult to keep up posting them. Really some interesting stuff on offer for this year and next. notamermaid

update to part 3 - Karlsruhe A few more river cruise ships, also internationally, have found their way to Karlsruhe since then but one big name was unlikely to include the city. Now they are doing so. Viking is stopping in Karlsruhe! This is the new itinerary called "Rhine and Main Explorer" sailing in 2025: https://www.vikingrivercruises.com/cruise-destinations/europe/rhine-and-main-explorer/2024-nuremberg-antwerp-basel/index.html If you are looking for something different from the standard Rhine cruise this is a good one to consider. They also have a short stop in Worms (see part #2) on an excursion. And no Rhine Gorge low water issues on this route. Here is to variety in itineraries! Well done in my opinion. 👏 notamermaid

Indeed, that is why it is so practical to end cruises in those two towns. Vilshofen has profited so much from realizing this and - whether it was for that reason or not - investing a lot of money into the river embankment and facilities. Straubing upstream from Bogen lost out a bit despite investing (I do not know how much) and trying to attract river cruise ships. About flooding. The terrible year of 1784 was bad along the Danube as well but it is not as remarkable as on the Rhine. You can see that it is not marked on the tower in Passau and does not rank among the top ten of all time, whereas on the Main and Rhine it is among the top five usually. In Passau the ice caused damage as well though, the Danube bridge and part of the bridge over the river Inn were destroyed. https://www.niederbayern-wiki.de/wiki/Hochwasser_(Passau) To the present: The situation along the Danube is very agreeable and there is a high chance for a good start to the river cruising season. notamermaid

It was on 28 February, 29 February or 1 March that the Rhine reached its highest level at many places along the river in the winter of 1784. You can find markings in towns and cities that record the event on walls of buildings. Some are not spectacular because the context is not clear any more, for example in Mainz where the street level has changed at the tower in this photo and the buildings and flood protection measures have changed the surrounding streets: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pegel_Mainz#/media/Datei:Mainz_Holzturm.jpg Others are more striking, guess which year is the top one, you will find out when you zoom in: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/09/Hochwasser_Linz_am_Rhein.jpg This one is from Neuwied, it so high above one's head that you cannot touch it with your arm (at least I cannot): People desperately tried to blast the ice and push it away from buildings using poles. Many settlements along the river from Koblenz to Cologne suffered heavy damage, houses were swept away, near Bonn a church was severely damaged. In Mülheim, then an independent village but now a district of Cologne, was partly destroyed. Another part of modern-day Cologne called Riehl was also inundated. The flooding changed many lives. The French publisher Louis-Francois Mettra lost his printing workshop in that village for example. He set up his business again in 1785 in Neuwied and became even more successful, editing, printing and distributing journals and books mostly in French language. A church door in Cologne carries this marking with text: https://altes-koeln.de/wiki/Datei:HochwassermarkeMariaLyskirchen-1784.jpg notamermaid

Würzburg gauge over the last four weeks: Well, compared to some other years this is nothing. Let us look back at a different leap year - 1784. In most of Europe - something you can spot in many old river towns that you visit - it was a terrible winter of flooding. Markings on buildings, either old or as a modern reconstruction of the event, tell of a natural disaster ingrained in European history. On 27 February in that year, the Tauber bridge at Wertheim was destroyed. On 28 February the old bridge in Würzburg was severely damaged. Here is a modern gauge to illustrate what the level was: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalenenhochwasser_1342#/media/Datei:Pegel,_Würzburg.PNG This article from 2022 has the headline "Wertheim: A town full of water". It has graphs in a photo depicting the heights of floods over the centuries. At the end of the article there is a photo showing the markings of two floods on a building: https://www.main-echo.de/sonderthemen/feste-events/wertheimerzeitung/wertheim-eine-stadt-voller-wasser-art-7513651 The flood of 1784 is an anomaly which is attributed to a volcanic eruption in Iceland the previous year. I have written about that in the thread of the Rhine here: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2984992-rhine-water-levels-2024-and-similar-topics/page/4/#comments notamermaid