Is someone at Azamara reading our comments?

[Redtravel]

Many of you nice folks have been writing your comments on this board. Thank you for expressing your ideas. Are we just venting or is there really someone at Azamara Club Cruises that is really paying attention. As I read it, most changes are positive. The one thing that seems to be annoying previously booked passengers is the 2 class system in respect to the specialty dining. By asking the non suite guests to pay a surcharge to eat there, Azamara is moving backwards. Even though it isn't a lot, it has created a lot of negative feelings among the people on this board. Negative feelings do not make people happy. What gives? Are you listening? Also, there is some anxiety about the new loyalty club benefits....are there any?

[shoesonfire]

Many of you nice folks have been writing your comments on this board. Thank you for expressing your ideas. Are we just venting or is there really someone at Azamara Club Cruises that is really paying attention. As I read it, most changes are positive. The one thing that seems to be annoying previously booked passengers is the 2 class system in respect to the specialty dining. By asking the non suite guests to pay a surcharge to eat there, Azamara is moving backwards. Even though it isn't a lot, it has created a lot of negative feelings among the people on this board. Negative feelings do not make people happy. What gives? Are you listening? Also, there is some anxiety about the new loyalty club benefits....are there any?

 

I think you've expressed the majority of cruisers concerns very well. The majority (refering to those already booked on cruises after April 1, 2010) are pleased with the additional enhancements, however, we don't like the newly established selectivity for specialty dining. Hopefully Azamara Club personnel are reading/listening to the voices of their future customers!!

[California Native]

Totally concur

specialty dining and unknown info about my benefits transfering..

didn't make Larry and Edie's announcement quite as fabulous as I had hoped!

[Andy]

Many of you nice folks have been writing your comments on this board. Thank you for expressing your ideas. Are we just venting or is there really someone at Azamara Club Cruises that is really paying attention. As I read it, most changes are positive. The one thing that seems to be annoying previously booked passengers is the 2 class system in respect to the specialty dining. By asking the non suite guests to pay a surcharge to eat there, Azamara is moving backwards. Even though it isn't a lot, it has created a lot of negative feelings among the people on this board. Negative feelings do not make people happy. What gives? Are you listening? Also, there is some anxiety about the new loyalty club benefits....are there any?

 

Hi RedTravel !

 

It is a safe bet that Azamara is reading everything that is posted here.

 

As for the Specialty Dining change, you've made it clear you are not happy about the new plan, and it was good feedback. Personally, I'm not thrilled with the change either, but I can understand why they did it. I've suggested a compromise, that perhaps they should consider offering 1-2 complimentary Specialty Dinings, as a perk in their new loyalty program. This should calm down those who are not happy with the new plan. Whether Azamara will do it or not, is anyone's guess.

 

When you say "what gives" ? I'm not sure what you expect. Even if Azamara were to tweak some of the items many of us have posted, it certainly would not happen over the course of 1-2 days. These things take time.

 

I'm sure that Azamara is digesting the feedback from their TA's, travel partners, passengers, and last but not least, this forum. Hopefully, they will make the appropriate changes along the way. A little patience would probably be my best advice. Stay Tuned !

[greeneg]

I have been told on several occasions by Senior Officers on both ships that not only do the folks in Miami follow threads on Cruise Critic, but the officers and department heads on the ships do also.

[cruiseyguy]

First off, only a relative handful of people have posted on the Azamara board and, looking at the poll on another thread, a majority of those posting (around 58%) say they will definitely sail on the "new" Azamara. So overall, the response of this very small group of passengers has been largely positive to the changes. Secondly, most negative responses seem to revolve around price, since many existing Azamara passengers had become accustomed to paying relatively low fares for a first class cruise experience. As has been addressed elsewhere very thoroughly, that situation can't, and won't, continue. Other complaints revolve around self-centric issues such as paying a larger charge for the alternative dining, special perks for suite passengers, etc. As Host Andy states, there will undoubtedly be some "tweaking" as things fall into place. But Azamara is about to undergo some fundamental changes which are clearly supported by the corporate parent and I doubt that special pleading or even threats by CC members will change that decision.

[Fredr]

Hello

 

Excellent points and well written. As for prices I do not in any way "set" the price of a cruise. Cruise lines charge what they want to, and as a consumer I can choose to accept this price or not.

 

The issue here is whether a significant number of Azamara fans will pay significantly more and continue to cruise on Azamara. I will not if the prices are more than I want to pay. If one wants that special service and amenities which are very nice then one must pay for them.

 

I thought that the "old" Azamara delivered an excellent cruise, especially in terms of value. If I have taken my last Azamara cruise, I will remember it well. And with any business, I surely hope that the new Azamara succeeds even if I go on another cruise line's ships.

[suec12]

I am assuming that at least some of the positive responders (myself included) are saying they will - because they have already booked a trip! So yes, I will cruise the new Azamara but the actual question should be - will I book another trip?

 

And I think the idea of one or two nights for no charge in the speciality restaurants for non-suite passengers, and then an additional charge is a good idea. Esp. when I read that on earlier sailings it seemed these restaurants were underused and the MDR backed up at times. It does seem a bit unfair that at the time I booked, it was "promised" that this would be a $5 charge - seems like that should be honored. But I can do the math, I know that the prepaid gratuities are worth more that the increase in dinig fees!

[critterchick]

I know that Royal Caribbean, the sister line to Azamara, monitors Cruise Critic very closely. Ship-specific comments, positive and negative, are sent to the ships so they can see the feedback and (hopefully) react appropriately to them. So I should think that Azamara and Celebrity do as well.

 

But we should all remember what a drop in the bucket Cruise Critic is relative to the cruising population at large. If we are statistically significant, it's just barely.:)

[Redtravel]

Andy: Thanks for listening. Perhaps Azamara will rethink their plan to have people who booked prior to Dec. 8th pay the new $15 surcharge for specialty dining. It's not that $15 is a lot. Even the airlines did not make passengers pay the baggage charges if they had booked before they announced the baggage fees. Each time, the airlines change their fees, everyone who was already booked has been exempt from the changes.

[Andy]

Andy: Thanks for listening. Perhaps Azamara will rethink their plan to have people who booked prior to Dec. 8th pay the new $15 surcharge for specialty dining. It's not that $15 is a lot. Even the airlines did not make passengers pay the baggage charges if they had booked before they announced the baggage fees. Each time, the airlines change their fees, everyone who was already booked has been exempt from the changes.

 

Hi Redtravel !

 

I hear what you are saying, but I believe it would be a logistical nightmare to enforce what you are suggesting. Never say never, I suppose, but it would be tough.

 

As Azamara will be including some fine new amenities, such as wine at lunch and dinner, (I believe Sodas and Special Coffees will be included as well) and paid gratuities... My feeling is, I would appreciate the upside of what you are gaining. It will more than cover the added cost of Specialty Dining, which will cost you an additional $20 per couple, per meal ($15.00 less the $5 current gratuity = $10.00 per person). IMHO, You are gaining far more value under the new plan. Just my .02 cents.

 

No matter how everything proceeds with the new amenities, I hope you will have a great time on Azamara. Enjoy your Cruise !

[zula]

Hi,

 

I really don't understand some people, they get so much extra (wine, soda,prepaid gratuities ...) and still they .... I am booked on a cruise in february 2010 and would gladly pay for the other restaurants if I would get the free wine with lunch and dinner and etc. I would't hesitate for a moment if someone from Azamara would suggest it. But I'm still looking forward to my cruise very much.

 

Regards,

Sonja

[rodan]

Since a great many people have booked cruises that sail after April 1 there will be a lot of disagreement with the new changes. Do people that have already booked at lower fares get a better deal for their money with the new changes the answer is yes. The big question is whether they are willing to pay the new prices in the future for the new product that they will receive. My wife and I personnally do not drink wine, soda or coffee and we were always happy with the ship's water so that is a negative for us. Pre-paid gratuities is a toss-up and free laundry if it means do it yourself is fine. The charge in the speciality dining rooms for non suite passengers is a turn-off (the caste system at work) but if as many posts have expressed two free dinners are included I guess that would be fair. No matter what for us the higher prices versus the added ammenities do not add up. Does this mean we will not sail on Azamara in the future ?- not necessarily if we feel that the future prices are a fair representation of the product that they will deliver versus market conditions at that time. When we booked our first cruise with Azamara in the summer of 2007 for May of 2008 the price savings were about $1300 for us. If they had not dropped due to market conditions we would have still paid the higher price as we felt it was worth the price of the product. We had sailed on these ships under Ren so we were not afraid to pay the premium for the product that was offered (the original price) but others that were new to the concept of a much smaller ship had to be convinced and so prices fell (this was well before the economy and market crash in late 2008). I guess what I am trying to say is that the market for the product will ultimately determine the prices and product that Azamara will be able to deliver. Not enough demand then the prices will drop and too much and they will drop. Once you have a stable product to offer then the ups and downs will be determined by the world economy. I guess that is why any cruise line would want customers with an income of over $300k. It would help insulate them againest the bad times in the economy.

 

Just my thoughts,

Rodan

[Jade13]

Hi,

 

I really don't understand some people, they get so much extra (wine, soda,prepaid gratuities ...) and still they .... I am booked on a cruise in february 2010 and would gladly pay for the other restaurants if I would get the free wine with lunch and dinner and etc. I would't hesitate for a moment if someone from Azamara would suggest it. But I'm still looking forward to my cruise very much.

 

Regards,

Sonja

 

Us too! We are traveling in February and would be happy to save $82.00pp (I think the cost with tax) for the colas and water. My DH doesn't drink any alcohol, and neither of us drink coffee.

[nooosey]

Hello RedTravel

 

I think that Celebrity, Club Azamara are responsive to Cruise Critic members.

They have instigated the meet and mingle meetings booked via their website and I have been lucky enough to go to meetings on both cruise lines.

Very often Cruise director , hotel manager and social hostess attend as well as other officers. I think they are keen to hear our opinions and are receptive to many ideas.

I have been on Celebrity ships where bridge tours have been organised for CC members who went to the meet and mingle meetings.

 

Philip

[Redtravel]

Since I am an economist/ market research analyst, I certainly know how supply and demand controls the cruise industry. You can change prices, offer more benefits, and say that you are trying to attract people in the $300K+ income class. However, when the ship sails, it will be the cruiser who ultimately decides to book it or not based on many things. I booked a cruise before the creation of the Azamara Cruise Club. The ship was way under booked and increasing prices will change the appeal....maybe up or maybe down. If Azamara is lucky, perhaps after a period of time, they may become attractive to the wealthier cruiser. During upcoming year, Azamara will have a chance to wow cruisers. If not, they will adjust or risk going out of business. I like Azamara and I hope it continues to sail. I booked my cruise based on the dates....it fits my schedule. Having sailed on Azamara before, I like the relaxed feel. Are there other cruise lines out there that I would sail? Yes, but the dates were my deciding feature.

[maryann ns]

Azamara is very interested in our opinions. On our last cruise they had two cruise critic get togethers. We filled out a questionnaire before leaving the ship and received an invitation to complete another one a few days ago.

[cruiseyguy]

"Filling the ships" with passengers paying too little is not the road to profitability. If enough people are paying the "right" prices (whatever they may be), even a half full ship could do better for the bottom line. I don't think Azamara's goal is full ships but greater net profits. And I doubt that anyone here knows what Azamara's specific financial targets are.

[mom&me_cruising]

It seems, to me, people are being unfair when they complain about the $15 pp specialty dining charge and yet they do not consider the new benefits.

 

Let's look at the economics for a 10 night cruise (for nice round number) for the specialty dining and the gratuity trade off.

 

"Old" Azamara:

A couple eating all 10 nights at specialty dining $5 * 2 * 10 = $100

Gratuities (staying with guidelines) for two $12.25 * 2 * 10 = $245

TOTAL with "old" Azamara: $345

 

"New" Azamara Club:

Non-suite couple eating 10 nights at specialty dining $15*2*10 = $300

Gratuities already included in base fare = FREE!

TOTAL with "new": $300

A savings of $45 with the "new", and that $45 amount does not include the savings if one drink house wine with dinner. And, seriously, how many people plan to do all 10 nights of specialty dining? Not eating at specialty dining all 10 nights means additional savings.

 

Would you rather that Azamara "grandfather" in the specialty dining and have you pay gratuity separately if you booked before the announcement date?

 

Personally, I would take the "new" gratuities rules (i.e. included in base fare), and pay for the specialty dining when I choose to eat there. :rolleyes: It is only logical when one look at the money trade off.

 

P.S. I will continue to give extra gratuities as determined by services rendered. The crew works hard and deserves recognition. I know I would not be able to do their job.

[Redtravel]

The specialty restaurants are good. Even if they are included at no extra cost, I would still eat meals in other places. The MDR is great. Breezes is also a good alternative...nice to casually eat outside on deck. Since the menu in the specialty restaurants does not change, I doubt if anyone would just eat in specialty.

[fPetrarca]

On my "Best of Italy" cruise in 2008 I found that I was leaving a gratuity of $10-$15 per person anyway because service was so good. I think the new $15 charge is about right so I probably wouldn't tip more. But if it's an extra-special situation I might do so.

[Andy]

It seems, to me, people are being unfair when they complain about the $15 pp specialty dining charge and yet they do not consider the new benefits.

 

Let's look at the economics for a 10 night cruise (for nice round number) for the specialty dining and the gratuity trade off.

 

"Old" Azamara:

A couple eating all 10 nights at specialty dining $5 * 2 * 10 = $100

Gratuities (staying with guidelines) for two $12.25 * 2 * 10 = $245

TOTAL with "old" Azamara: $345

 

"New" Azamara Club:

Non-suite couple eating 10 nights at specialty dining $15*2*10 = $300

Gratuities already included in base fare = FREE!

TOTAL with "new": $300

A savings of $45 with the "new", and that $45 amount does not include the savings if one drink house wine with dinner. And, seriously, how many people plan to do all 10 nights of specialty dining? Not eating at specialty dining all 10 nights means additional savings.

 

Would you rather that Azamara "grandfather" in the specialty dining and have you pay gratuity separately if you booked before the announcement date?

 

Personally, I would take the "new" gratuities rules (i.e. included in base fare), and pay for the specialty dining when I choose to eat there. :rolleyes: It is only logical when one look at the money trade off.

 

P.S. I will continue to give extra gratuities as determined by services rendered. The crew works hard and deserves recognition. I know I would not be able to do their job.

 

Hi Mom & Me Cruising !

 

You've made a nice comparison !

 

One comment about it, is if you booked this week, you are paying a higher fare to get the new benefits (roughly 10-20% more), for now anyway. So, for new bookings, its not exactly a wash. Of course, prices can always go up or down, as time moves forward.

 

While Gratuities will offset the added cost of Specialty Dining (assuming you will Specialty Dine every night - which is not likely), it may be a savings for those who booked before the increase... as I have to wonder if some will reduce their Specialty Dining, due to the higher surcharge. With that said, even at $15 per person, I feel Specialty Dining is a bargain, for such a wonderful meal. I thought that Prime C & Aqualina were some of the best meals I have ever had on a Cruise ship.

[mom&me_cruising]

The specialty restaurants are good. Even if they are included at no extra cost, I would still eat meals in other places. The MDR is great. Breezes is also a good alternative...nice to casually eat outside on deck. Since the menu in the specialty restaurants does not change, I doubt if anyone would just eat in specialty.

 

Exactly! I would not imagine anyone eating all nights at the 2 specialty restuarants. Beside there would be some nights when people would eat in port trying out local cuisine.

 

Which means that picking "included" gratuities ($245 for 10 nights) over paying $20 per couple extra for each night of eating at specialty restaurant ($60 extra if assuming 3 nights on a 10 days cruise) is a no brainer.

[Andy]

"Filling the ships" with passengers paying too little is not the road to profitability. If enough people are paying the "right" prices (whatever they may be), even a half full ship could do better for the bottom line. I don't think Azamara's goal is full ships but greater net profits. And I doubt that anyone here knows what Azamara's specific financial targets are.

 

Hi Cruiseyguy !

 

Sorry to disagree, but I will never buy into the 1/2 empty ship argument. This is like the chicken and the egg theory. I realize that profitibility is a must, but empty cabins will never make sense to me. I hear this topic debated all the time, and I am in the camp that a ship needs to sail at, or near capacity.

 

Here's why :

 

An empty cabin does not gamble.

 

An empty cabin does not purchase excursions.

 

An empty cabin does not go to the Spa.

 

An empty cabin does not buy drinks at the Bar.

 

An empty cabin does not play Bingo.

 

An empty cabin does not Specialty Dine.

 

An empty cabin does not purchase items in the Gift Shops.

 

An empty cabin probably means no gratuity for that cabin's steward/butler, and will make the crew member unhappy.

 

There are other ways to be profitible. I agree the Cruise rate is an important part of the equation, but it's not the end all. However, I feel you are severely hurting your chances of being profitible, if the ship sails 1/2 empty. I'm not suggesting you fill the ship at ridiculously low prices, but it is crucial to find the proper balance.

 

Just my .02 cents.

[cruiseyguy]

Hi Andy-I should have been a little clearer. I was essentially referring to an all-inclusive or quasi-all-inclusive line such as the "new" Azamara, not to an a la carte line. These lines do not make their money with add-ons since most things are paid for up front. Thus, Azamara could likely make more profit with fewer high paying passengers than with a full ship of low fare passengers who are not inclined to spend on extras. I know Celebrity, and possibly Azamara, ran into this problem over the last year, with passengers very reluctant to spend beyond their basic fare. An a la carte ship can easily incur a loss on a full cruise with little onboard spending for extras.