looking for 1st class flying advice

[E's Mommy]

We're planning on a July 2011 (yes 2011 it sooo long away:eek:) trip to hawaii. I'm taking my DH, DS, DD, and DM(mother) on the POA. I plan on staying 2 days pre-cruise and 3 days post-cruise at the HHV. I really want to fly 1st class (from New Orleans). I think the best is Delta via Salt Lake City or maybe even Atlanta. Has anyone done this? What's the best time to buy? How much did the tickets cost? Any help is very needed; the search feature didn't help at all.

 

Thanks,

Kristina

[6rugrats]

This is going to be very expensive for so many people. The search feature on the airline's webpage will not help you as they aren't selling tickets for next July yet; usually airlines start selling tickets ~330 days in advance.

 

Past price of tickets is not an accurate indicator of what they will cost in the future. However, just picking random dates, for an 11 day trip in July 2010, a F ticket from MSY-HNL on Delta cost ~$2497. Who knows what ticket prices will be next year, or the best time to purchase.

 

I have never paid for an F class ticket, so no experience there.

 

You don't say how old your children are, but we are going to Hawaii this summer and riding up front, but the kids are in the back; they don't care, they are just happy to be taking the trip.

[fbgd]

From MSY I think DL via ATL would be decent as I think they have international aircraft on that route?

 

Alternatively, AA via DFW has 767 with international business class seating in F.

 

These are the two I'd go with.

 

As for the fares, they don't fluctuate nearly as much as economy fares do, you can buy a week out or 11 months and they'll often be the same price, particularly on leisure heavy routes like Hawaii where not all that many people pay for F.

 

You don't say how old your children are, but we are going to Hawaii this summer and riding up front, but the kids are in the back; they don't care, they are just happy to be taking the trip.

 

Seriously? :(

[6rugrats]

You don't say how old your children are, but we are going to Hawaii this summer and riding up front, but the kids are in the back; they don't care, they are just happy to be taking the trip.

 

Seriously? :(

 

Why is this bad? They don't have enough status to get a free upgrade. They are older teens, and experienced at flying by themselves, and they are just a couple rows behind us; I am sure they will survive in the first row of E+. And yes, they are thrilled to get to go on an unexpected trip to Hawaii.

 

Here's another shocker for you; we made them contribute a small $ amount toward this trip. The horror.

[parody]

How much did the tickets cost?

 

I have flown first class to Hawaii a couple of times' date=' and clearly that is the only way to go. One question is how many FF miles might you have on Delta? Assuming that you don't have enough to get the required number of tickets outright, one possible option is to purchase coach tickets and use a (reduced) number of miles to upgrade to first class. Usually this is suggested as the best way to get the most out of your FF miles. While the rules for upgrading are more complicated than they once were, I believe that one can upgrade from a full fare coach ticket for only 7,500 miles, one-way per person. Discounted coach tickets require 15,000 miles. Click here for more rules.

[E's Mommy]

Thanks- great info I just didn't think of. My DD will be 7 and my DS will be 12. Yes- we're all flying 1st class :eek: and that's why I looking for ways to keep the cost down. Since it's so far away I looked for prices this July and they're $2500pp. Since I don't have enough miles, I love the idea of using the miles for an upgrade. I know now that before buying anything I will check to see what plane is being used....I want the full recling seats. Apparently is quicker to go through Salt Lake, but going through Atlanta gives us the "right" 1st class.

 

Thanks so much and keep them coming- this website is wonderful:o!!!!

[PennyAgain]

There are only a limited number of seats available for upgrading with miles on each flight. In addition all the airlines hold back some first class seats with the idea of selling them at full price as the departure date gets closer.

 

Check your airline's WEB site for rules and conditions for doing this. They vary by airline.

[6rugrats]

There are only a limited number of seats available for upgrading with miles on each flight. In addition all the airlines hold back some first class seats with the idea of selling them at full price as the departure date gets closer.

 

Check your airline's WEB site for rules and conditions for doing this. They vary by airline.

 

Good advice; highly doubtful you would find that many seats available for upgrade on this very popular route. Looking for upgrades or good prices on F/business seats to Hawaii in July will be difficult. You don't want to pay for a full coach seat in the hopes you could upgrade, and not be able to do so. You have lots of time to plan your strategy.

[mek]

Why is this bad? They don't have enough status to get a free upgrade. They are older teens, and experienced at flying by themselves, and they are just a couple rows behind us; I am sure they will survive in the first row of E+. And yes, they are thrilled to get to go on an unexpected trip to Hawaii.

 

Here's another shocker for you; we made them contribute a small $ amount toward this trip. The horror.

 

Good for you! I personally think that is great. In our family, several of the grandkids are being spoiled silly and frankly don't have any concept of the value of money. Oh well, they're my step kids and grandkids, but it still drives me nuts.

[CruiserBruce]

I can't speak for all airlines, but the ones I am familar with only use fully reclining seats in First on their International routes. So, unless you get a plane switch, (happened to us once) you probabaly won't get fully reclining (or lay flat) seats in First going to Hawaii.

[fbgd]

While the rules for upgrading are more complicated than they once were, I believe that one can upgrade from a full fare coach ticket for only 7,500 miles, one-way per person. Discounted coach tickets require 15,000 miles. Click here for more rules.

 

Generally unresticted Y class is pretty expensive, and F to Hawaii is pretty cheap. You can easily find sub $2000p.p. fares from the East Coast to Hawaii.

 

You could end up spending more on the unrestricted Y ticket than you could by just buying a discounted F seat outright.

 

Why is this bad? They don't have enough status to get a free upgrade. They are older teens, and experienced at flying by themselves, and they are just a couple rows behind us; I am sure they will survive in the first row of E+. And yes, they are thrilled to get to go on an unexpected trip to Hawaii.

 

Here's another shocker for you; we made them contribute a small $ amount toward this trip. The horror.

 

I guess we all grow up differently....I cannot once recall flying in a different class of service to my parents and recall on more than one occasion my father swapping his operationally upgraded F seat for the J ones that my brother, mother or I were booked into.

 

I can't speak for all airlines, but the ones I am familar with only use fully reclining seats in First on their International routes. So, unless you get a plane switch, (happened to us once) you probabaly won't get fully reclining (or lay flat) seats in First going to Hawaii.

 

From the west coast that might be a fair assessment but for those in the middle and eastern parts of the country there are a few airlines with regularly scheduled flights that offer international premium class seating. AA, CO and DL do for sure.

[FlyerTalker]

A couple of points regarding DL to HNL:

 

1) Currently, DL is using an A330 from ATL to HNL. This has the full BusinessElite cabin, with the slantboard seats found in international business.

 

2) For paid travel up front, you want to look for "A" class fares, which are discounted first.

 

3) If you are using miles for some award tickets along with paid tickets, be sure to have the award seats for the person who is LEAST likely to earn miles in the future. The primary earner should be on a paid ticket so miles will acrue to their account, rather than being orphaned in someone else's account.

 

4) Mileage upgrades are NOT available for the lowest discounted fare buckets. Unfortunately, DL does not post the eligible fare buckets on the website - IIRC, you need a B or M fare to upgrade, maybe an H. But L, U, and T fares (the lowest buckets) are not upgradeable with miles. Call DL to find out the specific buckets eligible for upgrades.

 

5) You may want to get a subscription to ExpertFlyer so that you can check on upgrade availability before buying the coach tickets. Better to have known seats available than buying a more expensive ticket on a "maybe" for the upgrade. And if you do find availability, buy the tickets and confirm the upgrade over the phone in one call. It's worth the call center fee to get it all done by a human at the other end, rather than trusting the website.

 

6) Be prepared to split your group to get upgrades for more than one or two people.

 

7) If at all possible, do NOT fly upfront on a DL767-400 without the international configuration. Generally conceded to be the worst DL aircraft in first class.

 

Hope that helps some.

[Fattony]

There are only a limited number of seats available for upgrading with miles on each flight. In addition all the airlines hold back some first class seats with the idea of selling them at full price as the departure date gets closer.

 

Check your airline's WEB site for rules and conditions for doing this. They vary by airline.

 

If you try for an upgrade be sure to ask if the upgrade is available now or you'd have to be waitlisted. My wife and I recently bought international tickets on Delta using a combination of cash (to buy Class M; more expensive than cheapest economy) and miles (after the full cash price went from $2600 to $4100 in one day). We were put into First or Biz class on all flights but one right away. For that other flight we're still waitlisted. Delta said we'd be informed by e-mail if we were to be upgraded but I've also heard it helps to keep calling. Some imply more upgrades happen 30 days before the flight, IF the FF seats aren't sold out. Some boards, such as Flyertalk, have discussions on the difficulty of getting upgrades on Delta. Tips on verying what type of aircraft you're on are good. On a 757, for example, it's just 2-2. On 767s, some airlines have 2-2-2 seating and others have 2-1-2. Airline Web sites have seating charts. Also check Seatguru.com. If you do fly FF, get to the airport early and take advantage of the airline lounge.

[Toto2Kansas]

I can't speak for all airlines, but the ones I am familar with only use fully reclining seats in First on their International routes. So, unless you get a plane switch, (happened to us once) you probabaly won't get fully reclining (or lay flat) seats in First going to Hawaii.

 

We have found exactly the same thing. Fully reclining seats (lay flat) have only been available to us on International flights. We just booked F seats (with air miles as I refuse to pay what they want to purchase them) for Hawaii the beginning of 2011. The best we could do is to get recliner seats. And some of the flights on the 777's didn't even offer foot rests. Although the seat is wider on the 777, that foot rest is very important to the both of us and we would rather have that then a wider seat. :eek:

[E's Mommy]

Thanks for all of the info :D. I'm starting to think that if I want all of us on the reclining F class I might need to bite the bullet and buy them and as early as possible. What do you all think?

 

Kristina

[fbgd]

I'm starting to think that if I want all of us on the reclining F class I might need to bite the bullet and buy them and as early as possible. What do you all think?

 

It's certainly easier than mucking around with miles and waitlisted for upgrade spots that might never come to fruition etc. etc.

 

If you've got a large group it also helps to buy early so you can pre-assign seats close together rather than being scattered as couples throughout the cabin.

[CruiserBruce]

Thanks for all of the info :D. I'm starting to think that if I want all of us on the reclining F class I might need to bite the bullet and buy them and as early as possible. What do you all think?

 

Kristina

 

I have been watching UA F fares to OGG for next Feb. On the dates/flights we want, not a single F seat has been booked going or coming. But the fare has gone up $500 pp since the flights came available back in April. I figure the real demand will start just after school starts, when people start thinking about winter vacations and getting away from the cold. So I will probably buy before then.

 

So, I am not sure F fares go in sync with any observable pattern. But, as we are now retired, and more flexible, I am watching more carefully, with more patience, then before, trying to find the better price.

[6rugrats]

I have been watching UA F fares to OGG for next Feb. On the dates/flights we want, not a single F seat has been booked going or coming. But the fare has gone up $500 pp since the flights came available back in April. I figure the real demand will start just after school starts, when people start thinking about winter vacations and getting away from the cold. So I will probably buy before then.

 

So, I am not sure F fares go in sync with any observable pattern. But, as we are now retired, and more flexible, I am watching more carefully, with more patience, then before, trying to find the better price.

In your experience, do you think it's worth the money to pay to fly in F on UA to OGG?

[fbgd]

I have been watching UA F fares to OGG for next Feb. On the dates/flights we want, not a single F seat has been booked going or coming. But the fare has gone up $500 pp since the flights came available back in April.

 

How do you know nobody has booked? They might not have seats assigned.

[cindep]

Just a suggestion or something else to consider. When I lived in Oklahoma, we flew to San Francisco, spent the night, and then went on to Hawaii the next day (did the same in reverse coming home). There are a lot more options from the West coast to Hawaii with better cost. Also it helped us get a bit of the time difference "adjusted" before we got to Hawaii. So look into what the costs difference would be by breaking it up. You may save more than enough (if time is not an issue) to cover the hotel and have a more relaxing experience.

[imsulin]

We have found exactly the same thing. Fully reclining seats (lay flat) have only been available to us on International flights. We just booked F seats (with air miles as I refuse to pay what they want to purchase them) for Hawaii the beginning of 2011. The best we could do is to get recliner seats. And some of the flights on the 777's didn't even offer foot rests. Although the seat is wider on the 777, that foot rest is very important to the both of us and we would rather have that then a wider seat. :eek:

 

"International" flights. That's the key phrase. Last I heard, flying from one US airport to another is NOT an "International" flight, but is a DOMESTIC flight. Pay all you want for reclining seats! I've survived several 4 1/2 hour coach flights with regular seats (horror!!) from the West Coast to Hawaii. And back!

[fbgd]

"International" flights. That's the key phrase. Last I heard, flying from one US airport to another is NOT an "International" flight, but is a DOMESTIC flight. Pay all you want for reclining seats! I've survived several 4 1/2 hour coach flights with regular seats (horror!!) from the West Coast to Hawaii. And back!

 

But if the OP wants to spend their money that way then why berate them? I can certainly sympathise with the OP's situation, heck, in a few weeks I've paid for business class on a 30min each way flight.

[E's Mommy]

Wow- didn't mean to start anything. Thanks to all of you who helped me. There is a Delta flight from ATL to HNL with lay down seats. So here's to hoping there's one when my family (all 5 of us) need it.:p

 

Kristina

[CruiserBruce]

How do you know nobody has booked? They might not have seats assigned.

 

That is a good point. How often does that happen? Absolutely no one has requested a seat. Viewing through the UA site, it looks totally open.

 

On your question of value for our F to OGG. As we get older, sitting in coach for longer than 2 hours has become more difficult. Back and neck injuries, and the other processes of aging are hard on you!

 

As mentioned, as we are now retired, wish to travel more, and without battling age, so we travel First more often- Business internationally. The fare to OGG is sort of high now. However, it started as an attempt to book FF miles Saver rates on UA, but as you would expect, the flights were less than desirable on the Saver rates.

 

So, generally, yes it is worth it to go First to OGG. We went E-plus to HNL on a last minute trip last November. That worked (except for the 5 hours of screaming kid right behind us), and we do use that option frequently also.

[parody]

How do you know nobody has booked? They might not have seats assigned.

 

But, if you really need to know how many seats are available by class (irrespective of whether they have selected a seat or not--at least up to 9), go to a class availability site like http://flyaow.com/classamex.htm