Tips on avoiding tips please

[RJChatsworth]

Coming back to ships, why do cabin stewards/stewardesses and waiters/waitresses have to rely on tips to make up their wages whereas it appears that other unseen workers providing a service on ships do not? So is it true the others are paid a living wage and the stewards/waiters are not? If this is the case it is quite shameful of shipping lines to penalise waiters/cabin staff in this way and expect passengers to cough up! Tips given by passengers to whom they come in contact should be for above average service, shouldn't it?

 

What is the reality, please?

[Discovery141]

Nice one!!!!

[Discovery141]

We was on the Adventure of the seas and talking to the staff and they said that they don't get a wage it is down to the tips that is why us the customer is spread out evanly at meal times, P & O pay a wage but next time you are on board ask the staff how much they get paid you will be surprised how low there wage is and the time they spend before a day off

[Elaine0138]

We was on the Adventure of the seas and talking to the staff and they said that they don't get a wage it is down to the tips that is why us the customer is spread out evanly at meal times, P & O pay a wage but next time you are on board ask the staff how much they get paid you will be surprised how low there wage is and the time they spend before a day off

 

 

Sorry to say you were being told a sob story this is not true, my son worked for RCI for a few years. Yes they do get a low wage but remember they are all found, they are not press ganged if conditions are so bad why do so many return for further contracts.

[2irisheyes]

I assume they return for further work for the tips which can be sent home. The whole world is not like the UK and in many places workers work for a pittance. There is nothing wrong in wanting a better life for your family but more money than can be earned locally is needed for this. At least they're getting off their backsides and helping themselves rather than relying on handouts which their countries do not provide. Good luck to them.

[Robinhill]

Sir Tipalot-Knott-or should I say Sir Tightwad alot! Shame on you! it has always been customary to tip people who work in the service of others! They work very hard and very long hours often with no time off for 10 months at a stretch and to think that people would actually go out of their way to begrudge them the small amount that is recommended is unconscienable (sp?)to me. Don't you enjoy a wonderful time when you cruise???? Obviously if this is your fourth cruise then you do- then pay for it! If you can't afford and or don't want to tip- then you should'nt cruise- you're a tight wad! Stay home!

[ROSEBASKETS]

Sir Tipalot-Knott-or should I say Sir Tightwad alot! Shame on you! it has always been customary to tip people who work in the service of others! They work very hard and very long hours often with no time off for 10 months at a stretch and to think that people would actually go out of their way to begrudge them the small amount that is recommended is unconscienable (sp?)to me. Don't you enjoy a wonderful time when you cruise???? Obviously if this is your fourth cruise then you do- then pay for it! If you can't afford and or don't want to tip- then you should'nt cruise- you're a tight wad! Stay home!

 

Let me be the first to jump in here. It has NEVER been customary for us to tip in the UK. We pay people to work a fair days pay for a fair days work and wouldn't accept anyone to pay a pittence or tips alone as in the USA. This BRITISH company aimed at British customers gives the opportunity to people to tip for service received over and above the norm.We pay extra for good service and NOT to pay a wage. They pay their staff a decent wage and they work a MAXIMUM of 50 hours per week.

 

I'm all in favour of tipping (and tipping well), but only if the service is good. I cruise with companies who pay their staff well, unlike the US ships who expect the staff to work all hours for little pay and "expect" the passengers to pay for the service:rolleyes:

[Robinhill]

Rosebaskets- point taken- and obviously it does matter culturally what you are used to. You are right this is a British company thus i certainly understand the Brits position in this then. However, when RCCL has its cruises in the US- the US population know that tipping is expected as they do work over here for very little pay and very much work and long hours and send most of their money home to their families. In the US it would be unacceptable to duck out on the tipping maybe RCCL pays better wages for the ships that are in Europe in which case the tipping would not be "expected" Thank you for making see another point of view.

[jocap]

Rosebaskets- point taken- and obviously it does matter culturally what you are used to. You are right this is a British company thus i certainly understand the Brits position in this then. However, when RCCL has its cruises in the US- the US population know that tipping is expected as they do work over here for very little pay and very much work and long hours and send most of their money home to their families. In the US it would be unacceptable to duck out on the tipping maybe RCCL pays better wages for the ships that are in Europe in which case the tipping would not be "expected" Thank you for making see another point of view.

Robin- RCI never make this matter clear in any of its documents.....there's nothing anywhere to say:" The staff on our ships are paid a very small wage, and must rely on the generous tips of you all to live." We only know that the staff are under paid through sites like this....it's far beyond the experience of anyone in Europe that this could be allowed, and is still not proven, other than "I've heard.."-"A waiter told me..."..."I know for a FACT!".....

So, instead, Europeans write up our experiences, and are told we're "stiffing"- or something else equally inelegant- the staff. HOW DID WE KNOW? It's ILLEGAL in Europe to work for less than the minimum wage!

One only has to travel with Thomson's- ships registered in Europe, and no tipping- to realise what it's like to be amongst a happy crew of friendly people who don't have to work the pax for a tip. Otherwise, relying on tipping is still the baksheesh mentality, and even more inelegant than the word "Stiffing".

Cruise companies will have to come clean soon, as most companies are having to send more and more ships to Europe...look at Epic, built for the Caribbean, yet homing in Europe next spring, or Indie with her permanent home in Southampton.

Jo.

[bazzaw]

"it has always been customary to tip people who work in the service of others"

 

I am not sure where/how (culturally speaking) this attitude has become entrenched in North American thinking. If one goes back far enough in time (say feudal times), people who "worked in the service of others" could only expect a good kicking if their service was inadequate. As time rolled on, they actually received a low wage for their "service" - as time rolled on further (and the advent of labour Unions and more enlightened Legislation) , people are now paid a "living wage" .

 

However , it seems that in so called "egalitarian" North America, there seems to be an almost feudal approach to certain forms of labour. I recall seeing a man at an American Airport (Dallas), working as a Porter, with a badge on his chest stating that he "works for tips " only!!

 

Another thing I cannot understand in North America - exactly what is regarded as "working in the service of others". Does the postal clerk who sells me a stamp in the Post Office work in the service of others ? - Should I tip him/her? What about the plumber who comes out and unblocks my smelly sewage line?? Surely he deserves a tip for "personal" service??

 

I know we have forum members from North America here - so can any please enlighten me of the history/background of the concept of "tipping" . Can they also give me a list of types of working people who I should tip while in North America - with a brief explanation of why these deserve tipping while other forms of labour do not??

 

Thanks

 

Barry

[Robinhill]

Jocap- You are absolutely right and everyone should be able to expect at very minimum a minimum wage and not have to "count on" tips to make a living. Thank you for your point of view!

[whippet]

I do think that it is a sad reflection that people would go to such extremes as to avoid tipping.

Tipping is mentioned in the cruise brochure. You are aware before the cruise that tipping will be added to your onboard account.

It should not be a surprise, therefore, that as a Guest, you Tip the service staff for serving you.

The very reason tipping is now being added to pax onboard accounts, is to avoid stiffing the service staff.

In the old days, one only ate in one restaurant for breakfast lunch and dinner. the wait staff and the cabin steward all got tipped personally from the Guest/Pax.

Nowadays with the welcome addition of restaurants, one can eat when you like, where you like. The choices on cruises has increased, thankfully for the better.

However with change, also comes change of outlook and change of pax standards.

Tipping is the actual income that service staff receive in their contracts onboard a ship. It is not for the likes of you and I to discuss the why's and why not, on this thread. Maybe another time.

Tipping happens.

Tipping is expected.

Therefore, we tip.

Therefore we dont stiff the service staff.

 

Tipping is something you do when you receive excellent service.

Wages are what Staff receive for do their job.

therefore I am a great believer in this being left to my discretion, I am not tight but i prefer to tip good service when it occurs and not in advance.

I would hate to tip in advance and end up tipping someone who could possibly be rude or give poor service even if this was unlikely.

i agree that Staff on cruise lines are poorly paid ( Cruse Lines responsibility ) BUT I ALWAYS TIP the staff that I interact with during my cruise.

[whippet]

Thanks Single Cruiser, I very almost bought up the same point as you about Butlins :D

 

Does anyone actually know for a fact that the servers/cabin stewards wages are solely made up of tips? or is it just a rumour made up by the cruise line staff so we feel obliged to tip more. The whole thing has my head in a spin.

 

Chris

 

Staff on Ocean Village state that they earn about £400 per month, plus food and lodgings and that although contract at sea is 10 months they get paid for 12 although they pay the fare to pick up the ship.

[ROSEBASKETS]

Staff on Ocean Village state that they earn about £400 per month, plus food and lodgings and that although contract at sea is 10 months they get paid for 12 although they pay the fare to pick up the ship.

 

Assuming this is true (and I have no reason to dispute this) £400 per month is a fantastic salary for someone in the service industry from the Asian / Pacific regions. In addition they get all food and lodgings, no tax to pay and as much time off as they would do in their own country.

 

Considering an average salary in India for a fully qualified accountant is £2,956 (BBC) I think that the £4800 they earn is adquate to support themselves and their whole family back home (as many do)

 

People in this country and others like the USA who compare salaries like for like don't take into account economic factors in the places that the staff come from. These staff would not do the job if they did not want to do it and take on these jobs to support their whole familiy or to have enough money to buy a house outright in their own countries after 5 years of working on ships. I wish I could earn so much in 5 years to buy a house outright in this country and still eat, drink and pay my way!

 

Good service should be rewarded with Tips. Tips shouldn't be used to pay salaries to the workers on ships, like the Americans. Rant over (sorry):cool:

[Elaine0138]

I wish I could earn so much in 5 years to buy a house outright in this country and still eat, drink and pay my way!

 

 

Get a job onboard ship :D my son who has worked onboard for several years is well on his way to doing this :D

[ROSEBASKETS]

Get a job onboard ship :D my son who has worked onboard for several years is well on his way to doing this :D

 

Geeze where do you live? you can't buy a tiny house for £150,000 round here, even if he earns £30k a year (and I don't suppose he's the capt!)and didn't spend a penny it would take him a few more than "several" years ;)

 

Besides, why would I want a job on a ship when I can get a house paid for by the state while breeding, sitting around on my backside, doing nothing all day, drinking down the pub every night, claiming benefits and getting tattoos every other week (I'm an OV cruiser!):eek:

[Elaine0138]

Didn't say he had all the money but is well on his way.

[Funky Face Painter, UK]

This is a wind up right? The staff work hard and deserve a decent wage for what they do. When I have a bad day working, I always get things in perspective and think of cabin stewards and all the other cruise staff on 12 hour shifts, now that's hard work ......

[ROSEBASKETS]

This is a wind up right? The staff work hard and deserve a decent wage for what they do. When I have a bad day working, I always get things in perspective and think of cabin stewards and all the other cruise staff on 12 hour shifts, now that's hard work ......

 

I'm not winding you up, and on P&O NO member of staff works more than 50 hours per week. This was confirmed by the Beech House Manager on Ventura in May. We had a long chat with him about working conditions and conditions of service and it is the same for those who work "out of sight" They cannot work over 50 hours per week, they are governed by some board that regularly inspects them and P&O are fined if they have staff who do more than their hours.

 

Staff work odd shift patterns, at strange hours, sometimes over 7 days but never more than 50 hours! which works out at less than 8 hours per day, assuming they sleep 8 hours, they get 8 hours off each day.... just the same as the rest of us!

 

Staff do get a decent wage on P&O, just because it's not the same as our wages in the UK, don't assume it's not decent...... In the Phillipines $2 can get you drunk :eek::eek: (so I was told by one waiter on RCI)

 

A waiter in the Beech House was an Accountant, but he could earn more on the ship for working less hours for more pay, that's why he was there!

[BigTanya]

I NO member of staff works more than 50 hours per week. This was confirmed by the Beech House Manager on Ventura in May.

!

Rosebaskets, you do need to get out more and begin to live a real-life.

I do understand that your post was made with good intentions, but you are such an innocent sweetheart.

Wanna buy a used car ?

[NSWP]

Think this is a wind up, Sir Tipalot-Knott has cruised a few times according to his profile:D

Crikey a lot of cruises, think of all the money he saved by not tipping, but also think of all the people who served him on those ships.

 

Just my two bobs worth.

 

As for Rosebaskets, I would rather not comment.

[ROSEBASKETS]

Rosebaskets, you do need to get out more and begin to live a real-life.

I do understand that your post was made with good intentions, but you are such an innocent sweetheart.

Wanna buy a used car ?

 

Please elaborate, are you suggesting that the Beech House Manager, his staff and staff in two other venues plus our cabin steward all sing from the same hymn sheet, and tell the same lie? :confused:

 

What kind of car is it? Do you have one to sell, or are you just trying (and failing) to be amusing. I suspect it is a Beetle, possibly pink, with a great big white daisy on the front and the musty smell of hemp humming from the inside. May I suggest you move out of the 60's and keep up with the times & possibly try a cruise with P&O, as I guess that you haven't!:eek:

[jenny wren]

[

 

What kind of car is it? Do you have one to sell, or are you just trying (and failing) to be amusing. I suspect it is a Beetle, possibly pink, with a great big white daisy on the front and the musty smell of hemp humming from the inside. May I suggest you move out of the 60's and keep up with the times & possibly try a cruise with P&O, as I guess that you haven't!:eek:

 

 

:D:D:D:D

[lolw811]

My sister works as a singer on a cruise and said the service staff get paid there basic salary and then on top of this they get tips... my sister is paid exactly the same wage as service staff and they dont recieve any tips from the auto tipping whatso ever they are not entitled to it.

 

people always think the entertainment are much better off but there not.

 

i would rather tip who i feel has given great service but i will use the auto tipping untill the cruise companies change the procedure as i do agree in tipping.

[BigTanya]

 

I suspect it is a Beetle, possibly pink, with a great big white daisy on the front and the musty smell of hemp humming from the inside. May I suggest you move out of the 60's and keep up with the times & possibly try a cruise with P&O, as I guess that you haven't!:eek:

Not far off, but I may disagree with your comments about tipping and the exact amount that waiters get paid, but I will give you 100% marks for humor.

excellent:)