Worse than they thought

[NeoVega]

all a lot of speculation as

you don't know how many were infected the week before

you don't know that the crew didn't take it seriously

you don't know the crew didn't deep clean and or take precautions

 

You are right. I don't know the number that were infected

 

My comments are from the post referenced above from a passenger from the previous cruise.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?p=41450765&highlight=honeymoon#post41450765

 

There was a considerable outbreak on our cruise so I have to disagree that the outbreak on the 21st voyage was caused by selfish/unsuspecting passengers taking it on board. They have simply picked up the virus left behind by us. I've heard from 2 crew members that I've kept in touch with that staff were definitely ill with a "stomach bug" on both cruises so the ship were definitely aware that Noro was present between the 12-21.

 

Just got out of hospital after disembarking EOS on 21st

We were on for our honeymoon and disembarked on the 21st after a wonderful cruise. Unfortunately, I started being extremely ill 5 minutes after take off that evening. 6 hour flight with constant vomiting is not fun - I am so sorry for my fellow passengers and, yes, I fully expect to have infected some of them :-( I became extremely ill and was admitted to hospital on landing and they kept me in for 3 days due to the severity of my reaction

 

Would you not wonder if the outbreak on the 21st sailing of the EOS could have been prevented? Would you not wonder how many pax had NORO on the previous cruise? Hopefully the CDC has access to the facts from the previous sailing .

[S.A.M.J.R.]

Look, My opinion is that the cruise is not what the paying guests expected the vacation to be. It may or may not be the fault of the cruise line. That fact will probably never be known for sure. The best customer service would be for RCCL to give a 100% refund for this cruise. I never said they should provide a future cruise and I do not think they need to do that. Those are words put in my mouth. If some feel this is not a logical conclusion, so be it but it is my opinion. :8

 

From the OP...

GMA is reporting this morning that after talking to passengers on board the Explorer of the Seas the situation on board is much worse than originally reported. They also reported that they are only refunding 50% of the cruise and offering 50% credit on future cruise. IMO that is a horrible compensation. The passengers that were not ill had a totally ruined vacation. They deserve a paid vacation for their troubles! ... and the poor sick passengers surely deserve a full refund. This is a horrible situation. I have four very good friends that are on that ship. I can't wait to see them on Thursday and get the real story. I will post a full review as reported by them.

Sure sounds like you feel they should get a future cruise.

 

You even admit in a later post this may not be RCI's "fault". While I agree it would be a good PR move to refund this cruise and give them a future cruise, is that the best BUSINESS decision?

[DreamingBig1]

From the OP...

 

Sure sounds like you feel they should get a future cruise.

 

You even admit in a later post this may not be RCI's "fault". While I agree it would be a good PR move to refund this cruise and give them a future cruise, is that the best BUSINESS decision?

 

Nothing productive can come from this. Why don't you guys just apologize to each other and be done with it? This post has gotten personal in many ways. It's just opinions and words people. S@-t$ and giggles people.

[tbill]

Nothing productive can come from this. Why don't you guys just apologize to each other and be done with it? This post has gotten personal in many ways. It's just opinions and words people. S@-t$ and giggles people.

 

I agree. I have an opinion. I am sorry if it is different from anyone else. I have no beef with any poster. I am responding to being attacked every time I post something.

[red devil]

I agree. I have an opinion. I am sorry if it is different from anyone else. I have no beef with any poster. I am responding to being attacked every time I post something.

 

The below must be Royal's fault as well.

Between 19 and 21 million cases of nor virus occur in the U.S. each year, resulting in up to 70,000 hospitalizations and 800 deaths.

 

Why is it the cruise lines fault??

19 million + cases a YEAR AND ALL THEY TALK ABOUT ARE A FEW THOUSAND CASES ON THE CRUIS lines.

Read the 1/21 roll call see what they say.

[Gran2five]

My son had noro on a cruise a few years ago and his cruise was basically ruined. We received no compensation. I'm not sure that it is reasonable to compensate everyone that gets sick on a cruise ship. I understand this was an extreme situation but to me, the compensation seems fair. Admittedly I wasn't there so I guess we'll need to wait until all the details are in to form a final opinion.

 

Agree that a few people getting noro - does not mean all passengers are compensated but in this case, it is more than a few.

 

In the 90's we took our daughter and granddaughter on a cruise where departing passengers were allowed to stay onboard until their flight and therefore mixed with the new arrivals. At the pool, a family told us to watch the 'water' and drink bottle water as there had been quite a bit of illness on their cruise. Sure enough a day later, my daughter followed very shortly by granddaughter and I were ill. Every night more and more people got sick.

 

At the end of the week, when we left for the airport, the next week's passengers were all held in a holding room while they 'cleansed' the ship.

 

We contacted our TA who said no way you won't get a refund - it is what it is. My husband couriered a letter to the CEO of the cruise line, outlining our case - had they 'cleansed' the ship and made everyone disembark before we embarked, perhaps we would have been able to enjoy our cruise. We got 50% back.

 

In this case, there were some people who were ill on the previous cruise and the ship should have been properly cleansed before this trip began.

[red devil]

Post from friends on ship

We are both feeling much better today. Will get 50% back from Royal Caribbean and 50% off the next cruise we book! I would not recommend it.... but not a bad deal. And, we were too sick to drink.....so no bar bill and now they are going us free drinks.....Bloody Mary's with breakfast! Wine and Perrier were free with lunch yesterday! Staff and crew have been wonderful! My guess is that at least half the ship was sick but did not/could not get to medical due to number of sick people. Steve and I both tried to go to medical on Thursday but it was so crowded ........SRO.........that we just went back to the cabin and went to sleep!

[lakelorain]

There is more to deep cleaning than just dusting off a few things on the ship. Literally everything is sterilized. And while that seems obvious, folks who haven’t experienced it don’t understand the huge inconvenience to the passengers and crew. Passengers on the following cruise will likely not have many of the items in their room that isn’t attached to the floor or walls that they are accustomed to because they are taken away to be sterilized. In our experience, passengers will not be allowed serve themselves ANYTHING including all beverages as well as condiments at the table like sugar, salt and pepper. If you want any of those items for your meal, you will have to ask for it. And they will be served with tongs.

 

Sally and I were talking about this last night and we feel sorry for everyone on the next cruise out because they will be inconvenienced a lot. Just imagine standing in line for 15 minutes every morning to get a cup of coffee and orange juice. You learn to get your drink first so your eggs and oatmeal don’t get cold. Oh, you want salt and pepper for those eggs, where is that waiter anyways? New proceedures are not normal for the crew, so they aren’t very good at it at first.

 

And speaking of the poor crew. You can see it in their eyes because not only do they have to deal with the grumpy inconvenienced passengers, they pull double duty in the crew stations as well performing the same sterilizing procedures. We heard that the crew got a maximum of 4 hours sleep a day until the ship got back to normal. Not sure when normal comes, we still didn’t see normal even after our 12 day cruise. But we didn’t have a single passenger or crew member get the Noro. They did a pretty good job. Still, after that experience, I would cancel if I were on the new cruise out on the Explorer. Not because of the virus, but because of the sterilization procedures the ship will have to perform.

 

So you can see why a ship might try to quarantine one or two cases to prevent the other extreme. Once a ship has to go full sterilization, it a couple weeks pain in the rear for everyone including the next couple weeks of passengers.

 

Burt

 

I agree with this. If you have never been on a b2b to see the regular cleaning that is done between cruises, you would be surprised. We've also been on a b2b when there was noro on the first cruise. We were amazed at what was accomplished in a short period of time. Everything, and I mean everything, was decontaminated. This includes walls, ceilings etc.

[DreamingBig1]

The below must be Royal's fault as well.

Between 19 and 21 million cases of nor virus occur in the U.S. each year, resulting in up to 70,000 hospitalizations and 800 deaths.

 

Why is it the cruise lines fault??

19 million + cases a YEAR AND ALL THEY TALK ABOUT ARE A FEW THOUSAND CASES ON THE CRUIS lines.

Read the 1/21 roll call see what they say.

 

Actually in relation to the total that's a pretty high percentage. Even 1% is high in that regard.

 

Its the cruise lines fault if there is something they can do to head it off that they don't do.

 

Now do I want a vacation on a prison boat? Absolutely not. That's the line the cruise line must draw. It's a hard line no doubt. Restriction to

head off vs the freedom of cruisers to have a vacation from life.

[wolfcathorse]

I don't care who is right, wrong, who has facts and reports....what I DO care about is that there could be 500 infected passengers about to descend on EWR. The ones that drove will be stopping at restrooms on the way home. Some will be staying in a hotel overnight....imagine the innocent plane passenger sitting next to one of them, or sitting at the gate in a seat sat on by one of them. Or the little kid in the roadside public restroom who doesn't wash his hands. Or the elevator buttons and handrails in the hotel that will be touched...

[tbill]

Post from friends on ship

We are both feeling much better today. Will get 50% back from Royal Caribbean and 50% off the next cruise we book! I would not recommend it.... but not a bad deal. And, we were too sick to drink.....so no bar bill and now they are going us free drinks.....Bloody Mary's with breakfast! Wine and Perrier were free with lunch yesterday! Staff and crew have been wonderful! My guess is that at least half the ship was sick but did not/could not get to medical due to number of sick people. Steve and I both tried to go to medical on Thursday but it was so crowded ........SRO.........that we just went back to the cabin and went to sleep!

 

Glad to hear you are feeling better. That is what really counts.

[American Bear]

Sorry totally disagree! You have your opinion, I have mine!

RCL should give a 100% refund to everyone!Everyone on this cruise, whether they were sick or not had their trip ruined! And I say this as an RCL stockholder!

The next cruise shouldn't begin until that ship is thoroughly cleaned, (not likely in 48 hours) and all crew members, and back to back cruisers for the next cruise are cleared by medical personal ! That will be difficult since the dormant stage can be up to 5 days or more!

This isn't the first outbreak this year, the Majesty had an outbreak a week ago! It could be just the season, or it could be a company problem, that's what needs to be investigated!

[DreamingBig1]

I don't care who is right, wrong, who has facts and reports....what I DO care about is that there could be 500 infected passengers about to descend on EWR. The ones that drove will be stopping at restrooms on the way home. Some will be staying in a hotel overnight....imagine the innocent plane passenger sitting next to one of them, or sitting at the gate in a seat sat on by one of them. Or the little kid in the roadside public restroom who doesn't wash his hands. Or the elevator buttons and handrails in the hotel that will be touched...

 

It's the common stomach flu/virus. Noro sounds worse. These matters come to head when there is a large group of people on vacation experiencing bad events.

 

So it's not coming, it's probably been there.

[tbill]

Actually in relation to the total that's a pretty high percentage. Even 1% is high in that regard.

 

Its the cruise lines fault if there is something they can do to head it off that they don't do.

 

Now do I want a vacation on a prison boat? Absolutely not. That's the line the cruise line must draw. It's a hard line no doubt. Restriction to

head off vs the freedom of cruisers to have a vacation from life.

 

I agree. with you. I also think that if I have an upset stomach due to sea sickness or eating something that doesn't agree I should not be restricted to my cabin because it must be assumed I have something else. If you go to medical that is what happens. That is what happened on the cruise we were on 5 years ago. It was a Royal Caribbean ship. Vision of the Seas. Passengers were saying that they were being treated horribly by medical and all they were worried about was staying in the cabin, not with trying to help them with the symptoms. That is why when my husband became ill we used the meds that we always bring along "just in case" and he remained in the cabin... on his own... and we used every precaution not to infect me or anyone else. I have seen reports that the staff on the current ship (Explorer of the Seas) has been "wonderful" and that is good to hear.

[tbill]

It's the common stomach flu/virus. Noro sounds worse. These matters come to head when there is a large group of people on vacation experiencing bad events.

 

So it's not coming, it's probably been there.

 

The cruise we were on was out of San Juan and they would not let the infected passengers into the airport. I ran into a family in the ladies room that was hiding the daughter's illness so she could board the plane and get home. Not saying I agree. Just saying what happened.

[tbill]

Sorry totally disagree! You have your opinion, I have mine!

RCL should give a 100% refund to everyone!Everyone on this cruise, whether they were sick or not had their trip ruined! And I say this as an RCL stockholder!

The next cruise shouldn't begin until that ship is thoroughly cleaned, (not likely in 48 hours) and all crew members, and back to back cruisers for the next cruise are cleared by medical personal ! That will be difficult since the dormant stage can be up to 5 days or more!

This isn't the first outbreak this year, the Majesty had an outbreak a week ago! It could be just the season, or it could be a company problem, that's what needs to be investigated!

 

Agree, Agree Agree! There was also an outbreak on Oasis about a month ago. It was reported on this site.

[okiecruiser71]

Lets see, let me figure this out. Being refunded 50% off this cruise and 50% off the next. Isn't that the cost of a free cruise?

How do you know those not sick had a ruined vacation?

 

There's nothing this company does that you would find fault with is there?

 

I've officially seen and heard it all with this whopper.

 

Good grief.

[cruisinfanatic]

Sorry totally disagree! You have your opinion, I have mine!

RCL should give a 100% refund to everyone!Everyone on this cruise, whether they were sick or not had their trip ruined! And I say this as an RCL stockholder!

The next cruise shouldn't begin until that ship is thoroughly cleaned, (not likely in 48 hours) and all crew members, and back to back cruisers for the next cruise are cleared by medical personal ! That will be difficult since the dormant stage can be up to 5 days or more!

This isn't the first outbreak this year, the Majesty had an outbreak a week ago! It could be just the season, or it could be a company problem, that's what needs to be investigated!

If you were on the ship, ate their food, enjoyed their shows, and never felt better why would you expect a 100% refund because the cruise was shortened by 2 days? I'd be thrilled with 50% off and 50% off the next.

Are you for real?

[cruisinfanatic]

There's nothing this company does that you would find fault with is there?

 

That's bull. Read my reviews

 

600 people got sick for a couple days and you'd give the other 2500 100% refund too? You are quite generous

Edited January 28, 2014 by SeaUs

[nolesrule]

Not only is everyone getting the 50/50 deal, but they are also getting airline change fees and accommodations required due to the early return covered. And those who were confined to cabins will also get credit towards a future cruise for each day they were confined.

 

I'd say that's a pretty fair deal.

 

When you get sick at home, you don't expect the doctor to visit you for free, your rent/mortgage/bills don't stop, and the chicken soup doesn't just materialize out of thin air.

[oneputt18]

Sorry totally disagree! You have your opinion, I have mine!

RCL should give a 100% refund to everyone!Everyone on this cruise, whether they were sick or not had their trip ruined! And I say this as an RCL stockholder!

The next cruise shouldn't begin until that ship is thoroughly cleaned, (not likely in 48 hours) and all crew members, and back to back cruisers for the next cruise are cleared by medical personal ! That will be difficult since the dormant stage can be up to 5 days or more!

This isn't the first outbreak this year, the Majesty had an outbreak a week ago! It could be just the season, or it could be a company problem, that's what needs to be investigated!

 

Disagree, Explorer's last CDC test score was a 98 and the Majesty's was a 96.

CDC will not let the vessel sail until they are satisfied with the "barrier" cleaning.

I also think the reimbursement is fine.

 

Quoting the CDC:

"The average incubation period for norovirus-associated

gastroenteritis is 12 to 48 hours, with a median period

of approximately 33 hours."

http://www.cdc.gov/hai/pdfs/norovirus/229110-ANoroCaseFactSheet508.pdf

[gaylemh]

Right, assuming you can get more time off from work to cruise again, and assuming you have the money to pay the other 50% plus travel expenses. Its a crappy compensation... IMO.

 

Wouldn't the 50% refund pay for the other 50% of the next cruise.

[DirtyDawg]

For the life of me I can’t understand why people get so ‘worked up’ on these threads around here. Who really cares what the OP’s opinion is? So he/she doesn’t think the compensation is fair. So What? Some others think that the compensation offered is more than fair. Again so what? The only people whose opinion matters initially are the 3,000 on the ship who were actually affected by this and particularly the hundreds who were ill. I suspect that the repeat cruisers on the ship will more than likely be satisfied with Royal’s offer because they are the ones who would make use of the 50% discount on a future cruise. The first timers may be less satisfied as some of them will value that part of the offer at Zero as they will be put off cruising altogether by this incident and will have no intention of booking another cruise. Over the longer term, Royal will also have to deal with the opinions of people who may or may not book a cruise with them in the future, and who will take Royal’s response to this incident into account when making their decision (BTW 99.9% of those people are not members of Cruise Critic). And that’s for Royal’s marketing and sales people to get ‘worked up’ over, not me.

 

But if people still want to get ‘worked up’ so be it. It does make for entertaining reading.:D

[DreamingBig1]

Not only is everyone getting the 50/50 deal, but they are also getting airline change fees and accommodations required due to the early return covered. And those who were confined to cabins will also get credit towards a future cruise for each day they were confined.

 

I'd say that's a pretty fair deal.

 

When you get sick at home, you don't expect the doctor to visit you for free, your rent/mortgage/bills don't stop, and the chicken soup doesn't just materialize out of thin air.

 

That seems fair.

[DreamingBig1]

For the life of me I can’t understand why people get so ‘worked up’ on these threads around here. Who really cares what the OP’s opinion is? So he/she doesn’t think the compensation is fair. So What? Some others think that the compensation offered is more than fair. Again so what? The only people whose opinion matters initially are the 3,000 on the ship who were actually affected by this and particularly the hundreds who were ill. I suspect that the repeat cruisers on the ship will more than likely be satisfied with Royal’s offer because they are the ones who would make use of the 50% discount on a future cruise. The first timers may be less satisfied as some of them will value that part of the offer at Zero as they will be put off cruising altogether by this incident and will have no intention of booking another cruise. Over the longer term, Royal will also have to deal with the opinions of people who may or may not book a cruise with them in the future, and who will take Royal’s response to this incident into account when making their decision (BTW 99.9% of those people are not members of Cruise Critic). And that’s for Royal’s marketing and sales people to get ‘worked up’ over, not me.

 

But if people still want to get ‘worked up’ so be it. It does make for entertaining reading.:D

 

True true. At least people aren't getting worked up over Bieber or Kardashian.