Noro outbreak on Caribbean princess

[RickEk]

I really think cruise lines policies need to change in order to help reduce outbreaks and eventually they may figure this out as the bad press is costing them millions.

 

Currently, if a passenger is about to board and completes the health questionare honestly, stating they are having flu-like symptoms, they are denied boarding AND lose all of their money to boot.

 

This penality makes the health questionare completely ineffective and a waste of time.

 

If a passenger makes it all the way to the terminal for embarkation and honestly admits they are ill, their fare should be credited towards a future cruise.

 

And the argument against that is that they should have purchased insurance...

[Scotto97]

The word in that suggestion is "honestly". Anyone could change their mind for ANY reason, never buy insurance and then just show up and say, "sick".

 

Many passengers fly or drive long distances to the port. Would some make this effort just to reschedule a cruise without penality - yes. But I'll bet that would cost the cruise lines less than all this terrible publicity from the Noro outbreaks.

 

Besides, cruise lines could certainly keep track if a person tried this more than once.

 

Expecting people to admit they are sick and therefore lose thousands of dollars in the process is not realistic in this day and age.........

[Mom33]

Many passengers fly or drive long distances to the port. Would some make this effort just to reschedule a cruise without penality - yes. But I'll bet that would cost the cruise lines less than all this terrible publicity from the Noro outbreaks.

 

Besides, cruise lines could certainly keep track if a person tried this more than once.

 

Expecting people to admit they are sick and therefore lose thousands of dollars in the process is not realistic in this day and age.........

 

You can feel perfectly fine on boarding and be totally honest when filling out the form. 24 hours later, the virus hits with no warning. You can not assume the person had symptoms when boarding.

[Scotto97]

You can feel perfectly fine on boarding and be totally honest when filling out the form. 24 hours later, the virus hits with no warning. You can not assume the person had symptoms when boarding.

 

That is certainly true, but eliminating the "Honesty" penality would at least help reduce the outbreaks from boarding passengers.

 

It just seems like a joke to hand someone a questionare asking them if they are sick when they know answering "Yes" will cost them a cruise and thousands of $$$$

[ar1950]

That is certainly true, but eliminating the "Honesty" penality would at least help reduce the outbreaks from boarding passengers.

 

It just seems like a joke to hand someone a questionare asking them if they are sick when they know answering "Yes" will cost them a cruise and thousands of $$$$

 

Sorry, I don't see it. Someone has traveled half way (or maybe all of the way) across the country, has taken the time off of work, plus, this is their big vacation for the year. My guess is they are thinking "I don't feel that bad. I'm sure that I will be fine in a day or two. I'll just answer no to those questions." And on to the ship they go. In their mind better to feel bad for a day two and still get to enjoy the majority of the cruise rather than miss the whole thing. The next opportunity for another cruise for them may be two or three years away and this vacation is now. Just sayin' ......:eek:

[BruceMuzz]

Very good point. I wonder how well the terminal gets sanitized when they sanitize the ships???

 

In most cases, the terminal is NOT sanitized. The ports who own the terminals are not willing to spend the money, and in most countries (USA for example) the ships crew is not allowed to work in the terminal to clean it.

[BruceMuzz]

I really think cruise lines policies need to change in order to help reduce outbreaks and eventually they may figure this out as the bad press is costing them millions.

 

Currently, if a passenger is about to board and completes the health questionare honestly, stating they are having flu-like symptoms, they are denied boarding AND lose all of their money to boot.

 

This penality makes the health questionare completely ineffective and a waste of time.

 

If a passenger makes it all the way to the terminal for embarkation and honestly admits they are ill, their fare should be credited towards a future cruise.

 

This is just not true. We board people all the time who have flu-like or Norwalk-like symptoms. We only ensure that the ill people agree to isolate themselves onboard until they are no longer contagious.

The only passengers denied boarding are those who are so ill that they might need evacuation or hospitalization during the cruise.

[satxdiver]

If someone gets Noro, does that person develop an immunity to that virus for awhile?

Or can that same person get Noro again if exposed?

 

The CDC website commented on immunization and did not know anything about long term immunization. There are many strains of noro much like the flu so one would have to be immune to more than one type of noro which is unlikely. Noro is a common virus and is widespread here at home.

 

http://www.cdc.gov/norovirus/hcp/clinical-overview.html

[bunnycrawford]

We boarded on a Saturday at 12:00. No one was sick, everyone felt great! Around 5:30, DD 13 said her head hurt, by 8:30 her stomach hurt, 10:30 sick! She threw up 3 times and I did not let her leave our room until 24 hours after the last time she was sick. We all washed our hands, I used clorox wipes and wiped down the entire cabin every time she touched anything. No one else got sick! Handwashing works! Take clorox wipes, handi wipes, small lysol and use all of it!

 

I plan to wipe my hands after I serve myself from the buffet and before I eat from now on, too. If everyone washes their hands and keeps their hands away from their faces, the spread will be limited!

 

I'm hoping that by our spring break cruise in March, a lot of this will be over, winter is terrible!

[Sailin' Shoes]

This is just not true. We board people all the time who have flu-like or Norwalk-like symptoms. We only ensure that the ill people agree to isolate themselves onboard until they are no longer contagious.

The only passengers denied boarding are those who are so ill that they might need evacuation or hospitalization during the cruise.

 

We? Are you an officer with Princess?

[need2cruisesoon]

US couple eats dinner at 5 star Michelin restaurant in London and gets Noro on flight home to Texas.

This stuff is nasty and you can catch even at the most upscale restaurants. They blamed it a dish of Oysters but my guess it was from kitchen help not washing hands enough.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2550252/Dinner-Hestons-food-bug-shuts-AGAIN-At-10-reports-poisoning-chefs-Michelin-starred-restaurant.html

[Katecat]

Following with interest.

[Loonbeam]

Bruce does work for cruise lines. For obvious reasons he can't say exactly where, but over time has provided nough information that I have zero reason to doubt his veracity.

We? Are you an officer with Princess?

[Colo Cruiser]

We? Are you an officer with Princess?

 

If he was he would not have a job for long.

[crackupforlaughs]

We've had noro years ago and most likely from the airport or plane. We never want it again -- not only are you throwing up and getting dry heaves, your body feels like a corkscrew and the Loony Tunes Tasmanian Devil are going through it.

 

That said, our daughter, then 3, got it a year later and we had learned to treat it like a biohazard. And, we didn't get it. Kept hands washed, used gloves, wipes, lysol, etc. However, we were not on a cruise but in a hotel and could control our own food.

 

Reading this thread has me so concerned about eating and drinking on the ship I think we'll be bringing our own MREs! So much for enjoying sushi or salads... Hope they get it contained soon.

[Posaune]

If this really was Noro your daughter had, according to CDC she is contagious for 2 to 3 DAYS after the last active event. That is why Princess and all other lines confine you to your cabins. 24 hours does not cut it.

[Memiki]

You can get sick anywhere. There are people that have noro and never been on a cruise ship.

You just hear about it more because it is on a cruise ship.

You just have to take precautions. If you don't chances are you will get sick.

You can get it when you get off ship at a port and bring it on board. You just never know.

I am sure they are doing the best they can. After all they want to make money.

People get sick on trains and planes. Heck, you can get sick with something being in the hospital.

Hope everyone can enjoy themselves and just relax.

Don't worry, be happy.

[JimmyVWine]

You just hear about it more because it is on a cruise ship.

This isn't entirely true. Or, perhaps it isn't true for the reasons you think. People seem to think that cruise ships bear a disproportionate level of publicity when it comes to noro, but that level of attention is warranted. While you are correct that one can contract noro in a variety of places, the reason that you hear about it more on cruise ships is that cruise ships are unique in their setup such that the rate of infection is far greater than in the general population. If 10 people out of 4,500 have noro in the gereral population, the odds of 700 becoming infected over the span of a week are slim to none. If 10 people have it on a cruise ship and do not follow quarantine protocols, the odds of 700 people contracting the virus are far greater.

 

So while it might seem that cruise ships get an "unfair rap" when it comes to noro, the truth is, cruise ships are floating Petrie dishes when it comes to the virus. Sure, hospitals are known to have outbreaks too. But many hospital patients stay in their hospital rooms 23 hours a day, do not use handrails to descend stairs, do not push elevator buttons as frequently, do not go to buffets and handle food and/or utensils, and they do not roam around the entire grounds of the hospital the way passengers roam around a ship. Land-based resorts are susceptible to the same issues, but people check in and check out on a daily basis, so you don't have the same 4,500 people confronting each other for 7-10 straight days. Infected people travel back home and infect people on the plane, or back home, and the concentration of infected people gets dispersed to the point where it is largely unnoticed. Cruise ships really are different in that you have a concentrated population that does not come and go, and everyone passenger has only one or two "degrees of separation" from every other passenger.

[msmoger]

This isn't entirely true. Or, perhaps it isn't true for the reasons you think. People seem to think that cruise ships bear a disproportionate level of publicity when it comes to noro, but that level of attention is warranted. While you are correct that one can contract noro in a variety of places, the reason that you hear about it more on cruise ships is that cruise ships are unique in their setup such that the rate of infection is far greater than in the general population. If 10 people out of 4,500 have noro in the gereral population, the odds of 700 becoming infected over the span of a week are slim to none. If 10 people have it on a cruise ship and do not follow quarantine protocols, the odds of 700 people contracting the virus are far greater.

 

So while it might seem that cruise ships get an "unfair rap" when it comes to noro, the truth is, cruise ships are floating Petrie dishes when it comes to the virus. Sure, hospitals are known to have outbreaks too. But many hospital patients stay in their hospital rooms 23 hours a day, do not use handrails to descend stairs, do not push elevator buttons as frequently, do not go to buffets and handle food and/or utensils, and they do not roam around the entire grounds of the hospital the way passengers roam around a ship. Land-based resorts are susceptible to the same issues, but people check in and check out on a daily basis, so you don't have the same 4,500 people confronting each other for 7-10 straight days. Infected people travel back home and infect people on the plane, or back home, and the concentration of infected people gets dispersed to the point where it is largely unnoticed. Cruise ships really are different in that you have a concentrated population that does not come and go, and everyone passenger has only one or two "degrees of separation" from every other passenger.

 

All your points are well taken and I agree 100%. However, as I read your post I had to laugh......one's a petri and the others are Petrie's :D:D I'm showing my age!!

Edited February 4, 2014 by msmoger

[JimmyVWine]

All your points are well taken and I agree 100%. However, as I read your post I had to laugh......one's a petri and the others are Petrie's :D:D I'm showing my age!!

 

Oooohhhhhhh Rob!!. Darn spell checker!

[Memiki]

while I somewhat agree with you JimmyVWine. But anywhere you have a large amount of people in a contained floating box you are bound to get something. Be it cold, flu or plague :) j/k

I went to a conference once. Two of the participants came on the train, They got sick (noro) a day later. They had traveled from the East Coast to West Coast, at first they thought they had food poisoning. But soon in various times we each came down with it. Soon the hotel quarantine the entire floor, even some of their staff got it. After about two days of thinking you were going to die and cancelling returning flights, we all began to return to human.

It is a chance you take when you are contained like you are on a ship.

 

http://www.cdc.gov/features/norovirus/

Edited February 4, 2014 by Memiki
added link

[Posaune]

And once you return to feeling human, you need to remain quarantined the 2 to 3 days after the last episode, or it just keeps being passed on to someone else. (even the entire Petrie family!)

[Carpe_Diem]

Very good point. I wonder how well the terminal gets sanitized when they sanitize the ships???

 

 

 

On our last cruise the voyage before us had noro. In the terminal as we were going towards the ship there were people sanitizing the hand rails on the escalator. This was in Port Everglades.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Forums mobile app

[RetiredNTraveling]

This isn't entirely true. ...the reason that you hear about it more on cruise ships is that cruise ships are unique in their setup such that the rate of infection is far greater than in the general population. If 10 people out of 4,500 have noro in the gereral population, the odds of 700 becoming infected over the span of a week are slim to none. If 10 people have it on a cruise ship and do not follow quarantine protocols, the odds of 700 people contracting the virus are far greater.

 

So while it might seem that cruise ships get an "unfair rap" when it comes to noro, the truth is, cruise ships are floating ..... .

 

It is so obvious that once you are on a cruise, you are contained and exposed. However, have you ever thought about an airplane? People walk down the center aisle and touch the top of every seatback. Then after the flight everyone gets off and a new group comes on board.

If you get the virus, you take it with you, as does everyone else so there is no containment. You just go home and are sick! Bon Voyage!

[JimmyVWine]

It is so obvious that once you are on a cruise, you are contained and exposed. However, have you ever thought about an airplane? People walk down the center aisle and touch the top of every seatback. Then after the flight everyone gets off and a new group comes on board.

You are making my point. If one catches noro on an airplane, one disperses from the rest of the plane population immediately upon landing. By the time the symptoms develop, all of the passengers have gone their separate ways and there is no dense population that merits news coverage. In the end, the sick people on that plane may end up infecting 1,000 more people. But they will be spread out too much for anyone to notice or care. It is the density of the sick population that makes the news and ships are unique in the way the virus spreads to a captive audience making a disproportionate percentage ill. Perhaps prisons might be another example of a captive popualtion resulting in a virus cluster. But 500 sick inmates at a prison won't lead the 6:00 news the way a luxury cruise ship filled with paying vacationers will. Every once in a while a college or university will make the news due to noro. But cruise ships are easy prey for this phenonemnon, especially during the winter Caribbean season.