The Amsterdam 2014 World Cruise - wonderful! - but 1 disappointment

[Sunriseatsea]

We enjoyed this year's full world cruise and had a wonderful 4 months.

Our fellow CC reviewers and bloggers have already done a super job of covering the great ship, crew, and ports. We would like to be on record as expressing our enthusiastic pleasure with our choice of this voyage and the experiences we enjoyed travelling around the world on the Amsterdam. Would we do it again? Definitely!

 

At the same time, there was one continual disappointment during our 4 months aboard: the lack of any satisfactory place to enjoy dancing. Yes, there are 2 locales with live music and small dance floors. However, the big problem is what I will refer to, for lack of any better idea, as the great dance divide. This divide involves the type of music played, the types of dances a small minority believe have universal appeal, and the space those dancers assume is appropriate for them to monopolize. Basically, ballroom dancing vs social dancing.

 

My husband and I are part of the huge generation of baby boomers who should be the prime focus for the future growth of Holland America. We are exactly the perfect population for them to reel in for big trips and years of brand loyalty: retired, plenty of free time, in control of our financial situation, and active and healthy enough to pursue exotic destinations. However, Holland America continues to solely focus on our parents' generation in this area of dancing.

We and our fellow recent retirees are not the World War II generation. Yes, we also have grey hair, but we were born in the mid to late 40's, so the music we relate to is from the 60's, not the 50's. We never did the fox trot or the jitterbug. We never did Latin dances. We have no interest in ever doing those. Fast dancing for us was always unattached and basically rhythmic self expression, usually allowing us to socialize with our friends while dancing. Slow dancing was not a formalized routine; it never had a name other than slow dancing. But it was always in close body contact, romantic, and in a relatively small, squarish portion of the dance floor. Never, ever, would a couple travel around the dance floor on a mission. We frankly didn't care what anybody but our partners thought of our dance moves! Nobody was performing. Sociologists have said that people relate to the music popular when they were dating and first married. The music of the 1960's brought with it this type of relaxed, unstructured dancing.

 

Twice in 4 months aboard the Amsterdam we were blissfully able to enjoy dancing together: both times were out on deck as Debbie Bacon performed under the stars. The few times we tried to dance before or after dinner in either lounge, the dance floors were monopolized by a handful of very skilled dancers who were very determined to perform their repertoire of dances. This created problems on so many levels. Obviously, the band started catering the music to these ballroom dancers. Further, on these small dance floors, their requirements for dance floor space was not limited to the approx. 3 ft x 3 ft that most social dancers can live with. Often, the dance floor resembled a roller derby of a few circulating couples. Any casual, unpolished social dancing couples who just wanted a relaxed few minutes together dancing were either repeatedly bumped into or made to feel like they were interfering with the flow.

Night after night, the same couples would be on the dance floor, and all the rest of the passengers who might like to dance were sitting around glassy eyed.

Yes, the first time anybody watched a serious dancing couple, they would commend them on their accomplishment and grace. From then on, frankly, it was not of interest to the rest of us. No more than any of the tv shows like Dancing with the Stars, etc. I have never seen anyone who does those dances in country clubs, cocktail lounges, etc. There is a place for that if you are a serious ballroom dancer, just not on a ship's small dance floor.

 

I love to swim laps, and I have become very good at it, but I don't expect others to be an audience for me. And I would never think of trying to swim laps in the afternoon when most of the pool is being enjoyed by non-swimmers just standing around in the water socializing. I respect the skill the ballroom dancers have also achieved and am happy they enjoy their hobby. I just do not believe the ship's small dance floors are appropriate for that type of dancing.

[kazu]

Congratulations on your world cruise.

 

You must be having a hard time adapting back to real life.

 

I haven't noticed what you are talking about in terms of dancing before but I have never been fortunate enough to be on a world cruise.

 

I don't want to belittle your disappointment and I hope that this won't be misinterpreted - but if this was your only let down on this long voyage - then I think you had a great time?

 

 

Frankly, if dancing meant that much to me, I would have gone on the dance floor and simply said "excuse me". Just wondering if they were performers practicing?

 

Sorry to hear of your disappointment on your cruise though - It would be lovely if everything could be perfect for sure.

[Lizzie68]

We enjoyed this year's full world cruise and had a wonderful 4 months.

Our fellow CC reviewers and bloggers have already done a super job of covering the great ship, crew, and ports. We would like to be on record as expressing our enthusiastic pleasure with our choice of this voyage and the experiences we enjoyed travelling around the world on the Amsterdam. Would we do it again? Definitely!

 

At the same time, there was one continual disappointment during our 4 months aboard: the lack of any satisfactory place to enjoy dancing. Yes, there are 2 locales with live music and small dance floors. However, the big problem is what I will refer to, for lack of any better idea, as the great dance divide. This divide involves the type of music played, the types of dances a small minority believe have universal appeal, and the space those dancers assume is appropriate for them to monopolize. Basically, ballroom dancing vs social dancing.

 

My husband and I are part of the huge generation of baby boomers who should be the prime focus for the future growth of Holland America. We are exactly the perfect population for them to reel in for big trips and years of brand loyalty: retired, plenty of free time, in control of our financial situation, and active and healthy enough to pursue exotic destinations. However, Holland America continues to solely focus on our parents' generation in this area of dancing.

We and our fellow recent retirees are not the World War II generation. Yes, we also have grey hair, but we were born in the mid to late 40's, so the music we relate to is from the 60's, not the 50's. We never did the fox trot or the jitterbug. We never did Latin dances. We have no interest in ever doing those. Fast dancing for us was always unattached and basically rhythmic self expression, usually allowing us to socialize with our friends while dancing. Slow dancing was not a formalized routine; it never had a name other than slow dancing. But it was always in close body contact, romantic, and in a relatively small, squarish portion of the dance floor. Never, ever, would a couple travel around the dance floor on a mission. We frankly didn't care what anybody but our partners thought of our dance moves! Nobody was performing. Sociologists have said that people relate to the music popular when they were dating and first married. The music of the 1960's brought with it this type of relaxed, unstructured dancing.

 

Twice in 4 months aboard the Amsterdam we were blissfully able to enjoy dancing together: both times were out on deck as Debbie Bacon performed under the stars. The few times we tried to dance before or after dinner in either lounge, the dance floors were monopolized by a handful of very skilled dancers who were very determined to perform their repertoire of dances. This created problems on so many levels. Obviously, the band started catering the music to these ballroom dancers. Further, on these small dance floors, their requirements for dance floor space was not limited to the approx. 3 ft x 3 ft that most social dancers can live with. Often, the dance floor resembled a roller derby of a few circulating couples. Any casual, unpolished social dancing couples who just wanted a relaxed few minutes together dancing were either repeatedly bumped into or made to feel like they were interfering with the flow.

Night after night, the same couples would be on the dance floor, and all the rest of the passengers who might like to dance were sitting around glassy eyed.

Yes, the first time anybody watched a serious dancing couple, they would commend them on their accomplishment and grace. From then on, frankly, it was not of interest to the rest of us. No more than any of the tv shows like Dancing with the Stars, etc. I have never seen anyone who does those dances in country clubs, cocktail lounges, etc. There is a place for that if you are a serious ballroom dancer, just not on a ship's small dance floor.

 

I love to swim laps, and I have become very good at it, but I don't expect others to be an audience for me. And I would never think of trying to swim laps in the afternoon when most of the pool is being enjoyed by non-swimmers just standing around in the water socializing. I respect the skill the ballroom dancers have also achieved and am happy they enjoy their hobby. I just do not believe the ship's small dance floors are appropriate for that type of dancing.

 

I applaud your post. I have heard this mentioned before by others and you are totally right about our generation and the need to dance socially.

[jp2001]

On QM2 the ballroom dancers would use the outer circle of the dance floor and social dancers the inner space. But I don t know if HAL small dance floor would accommodate that. Or there could be times designated for each type of dancing.

[hpf]

We have noticed it also and have tried dancing when they are up and just get looked at as tho we shouldn't be there. We have also heard a few rude comments by dancers as they danced past us or after we have sat down and they walk past you complaining about those bumbling dancers. Yes those were the words someone stated.

We just don't bother anymore.

Also I believe those dancers who do hog the floor are just wanting to show off.

We have also noticed the same thing on the Royal Caribbean Cruise Line.

Helen

[Spinner2]

We have been on a couple of shorter cruises (one, a 10-day; the other, as I remember, 14 days) and saw the same thing. In one case there was only a single ballroom-dancing-style couple; on the other cruise I am remembering 2 couples. But they did "command the floor" every evening and soon, no one else was dancing. The lady in one of the couples made a big production of changing into her "dancing shoes" at the sidelines; at least we noticed that if we happened to be there when the band had just arrived and the music was about to start.

 

It's not a world cruise thing it seems, and I haven't noticed it on any of the cruises we've been on since the Dancing with the Stars program started, so it doesn't seem connected to that in any way either. And the couples we noticed were passengers; definitely not part of the ship's entertainment dancers. I think it's just ballroom dancers who happen to be on a cruise and haven't thought past the kind of dancing they like to do.

[erewhon]

Am pleased that you enjoyed the World Cruise.

 

Did you write your comments about the Dancing on the Survey you received from HAL after the cruise?

[Scrapnana]

You mentioned two locales with live music. Were they both devoted to the ballroom dancing group? On the QE World Voyage there was one area which was usually (but not always) more ballroom style and another area (with a smaller dance floor) which usually had the "social" dancing ( like we did in the 60s).

[CI66774]

Your comments about the ballroom dancers are interesting. I just got off a 26-day cruise on the Royal Princess and saw the same thing. There was one couple who seemed to think they owned the small dance area - flitting about with any regard to anyone else. At one point, they did a wide twirl (or something like that) and bumped into my daughter who was dancing off to the side with her friend. She proceeded to push my daughter out of the way and shake her finger at her. I rushed over to her and told her she didn't own the dance floor and if she ever touched my daughter again, I would kick her a@@. Suffice to say, she stayed away from my daughter after that.

[PathfinderEss]

Glad to hear you enjoyed your world cruise except for the dancing issue.

[Zyzygy]

Perhaps those forced to the sidelines could hold up rating cards for the floor hogs. A few 3's and 4's might give them the idea.

[Stratheden]

Perhaps those forced to the sidelines could hold up rating cards for the floor hogs. A few 3's and 4's might give them the idea.

I like that:D

[Krazy Kruizers]

Glad you enjoyed your World Cruise.

Sorry about the dancing situation.

[Hflors]

I am glad that you enjoyed your world cruise. (we here on the side lines are green with envy ) but my thought was. Did you think about going up and quietly speaking to the band about having some different music played? Maybe this would worked, maybe not, but I have seen that sometimes asking the person in charge quietly and off to the side allows the band to understand that while ballroom music is nice for some people not all people wish to dance to it.

 

Just a thought.

[lidojohnny]

we were on that cruise and know what you mean about the dancing and music!

We called them the Arthur Murray dancers, because they must have gone to

some dance studio, and when they came on board they had to show their stuff.

It became very comical after awhile, because when the husbands made a

misstep, their wives gave them what for! They even formed cliques, especially

in the Ocean Bar, whereby they thought other passengers showed up just to

see them. Yes, WWII was 70 years ago. It seems that HAL thinks its still going

on with the constant Big Band Jump music. You say that was the one disappointment. I understand, however we could go into losing a second day

in Cape Town by going 11k knots for three days, and the TuTu thing, but

that's another story. But I think what really is funny is that the Arthur Murray's

entered the Dancing With The Stars, and did not come even close, but they

had flair, I can give them that.

[Maryandi]

Hflors - there is no 'speaking quietly to the band to change the music'

 

The band has to play what HAL tells them.

 

We have complained, suggested and gotten fed up with the

'There is nothing we can change' that is the way Seattle (home office) wants it.

 

We have been HAL cruisers for many years - and the dance hosts (on Grand Voyages) , band, etc. must comply.

 

Maryandi (formerly Wowzo)

[ajcruiser]

Bravo. We had the same experience on the 2012 WC to where we ended up social dancing right by our chairs rather than trying to get on the dance floor. The same folks were on that cruise. Time for the little people to rise up and Take Back the Floor!

 

Also in agreement that the bands and the nightly entertainment needs to move into the 60's and 70's. We hope your suggestions are heard for the 2015 WC.

[Katie333]

This is very interesting to me. I'm in my late 30's and my DH and I still can't believe how most of the entertainment (especially music and dancing) seems to be catered to a very very very older demographic. I've also seen the Arthur Murray dancers on many cruises and they do tend to take over the dance floor.

 

HAL and Princess continue to accommodate this seeming minority. My gut says it's because 1) change can take a while to see and implement and b) at least with these dancers, the floor is always full and HAL doesn't risk an empty room with everyone sitting around.

 

If the OP is the primary demographic, then I'm the secondary and the cruise lines clearly need to get with the times (or at least the 60s/70s, dare I say 80s?) :)

Edited May 31, 2014 by Katie333

[Cinder Again]

I applaud your post. I have heard this mentioned before by others and you are totally right about our generation and the need to dance socially.

While I am not much of a dancer, I agree with you! IF the music played IN ONE VENUE was from our Boomer generation, I think the dance floors wouldn't roll up at 10:00. Carnival's senior CD John Heard is a blogger and I read his column on FB. his humor is a bit naughty, but he has a huge following, and he's a Boomer himself. Reading his column has made me realize that in HAL's world, understated elegance equates with stodgy and predictable. I don't think they encourage creativity, by performers or staff. While I don't want "blue humor" every night, AND I AM NOT SUGGESTING HAL TURN INTO CARNIVAL, it would be nice to have some less predictable entertainment, and there are lots of folks who visit Vegas for just that type of entertainment. If you want people to buy drinks, you have to give them a reason to stay in your bars, really from breakfast thru to bedtime. I love the before dinner Happy Hour, but why not do a second one after dinner, with music or entertainment? If there was a reason to stay, people would stay. A canned music cycle can be peaceful, but not too lively and surprising. When you are on board for long cruises, it would be nice to see more impromptu entertainment, geared to us Boomers. JMHO

[Hflors]

Hflors - there is no 'speaking quietly to the band to change the music'

 

The band has to play what HAL tells them.

 

We have complained, suggested and gotten fed up with the

'There is nothing we can change' that is the way Seattle (home office) wants it.

 

We have been HAL cruisers for many years - and the dance hosts (on Grand Voyages) , band, etc. must comply.

 

Maryandi (formerly Wowzo)

 

Maryandi - I had no idea. Sometimes I just shake my head at what HAL does. Any logical person would think that with a ship full of World Cruisers who wanted 50's and 60's music mixed in with some older tunes wouldn't be a problem.

[kalliekae]

We wish HAL would update their music, too. We are not our parents generation and don't care for 1940's music. HAL falls very short in the entertainment category when compared to other cruise lines. HAL needs to realize that the Baby Boomers now have the financial means and opportunities to enjoy cruising. We are HAL's future so why not offer music and entertainment venues that appeal to our demographic?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

[candbgirl]

We enjoyed this year's full world cruise and had a wonderful 4 months.

 

Our fellow CC reviewers and bloggers have already done a super job of covering the great ship, crew, and ports. We would like to be on record as expressing our enthusiastic pleasure with our choice of this voyage and the experiences we enjoyed travelling around the world on the Amsterdam. Would we do it again? Definitely!

 

 

 

At the same time, there was one continual disappointment during our 4 months aboard: the lack of any satisfactory place to enjoy dancing. Yes, there are 2 locales with live music and small dance floors. However, the big problem is what I will refer to, for lack of any better idea, as the great dance divide. This divide involves the type of music played, the types of dances a small minority believe have universal appeal, and the space those dancers assume is appropriate for them to monopolize. Basically, ballroom dancing vs social dancing.

 

 

 

My husband and I are part of the huge generation of baby boomers who should be the prime focus for the future growth of Holland America. We are exactly the perfect population for them to reel in for big trips and years of brand loyalty: retired, plenty of free time, in control of our financial situation, and active and healthy enough to pursue exotic destinations. However, Holland America continues to solely focus on our parents' generation in this area of dancing.

 

We and our fellow recent retirees are not the World War II generation. Yes, we also have grey hair, but we were born in the mid to late 40's, so the music we relate to is from the 60's, not the 50's. We never did the fox trot or the jitterbug. We never did Latin dances. We have no interest in ever doing those. Fast dancing for us was always unattached and basically rhythmic self expression, usually allowing us to socialize with our friends while dancing. Slow dancing was not a formalized routine; it never had a name other than slow dancing. But it was always in close body contact, romantic, and in a relatively small, squarish portion of the dance floor. Never, ever, would a couple travel around the dance floor on a mission. We frankly didn't care what anybody but our partners thought of our dance moves! Nobody was performing. Sociologists have said that people relate to the music popular when they were dating and first married. The music of the 1960's brought with it this type of relaxed, unstructured dancing.

 

 

 

Twice in 4 months aboard the Amsterdam we were blissfully able to enjoy dancing together: both times were out on deck as Debbie Bacon performed under the stars. The few times we tried to dance before or after dinner in either lounge, the dance floors were monopolized by a handful of very skilled dancers who were very determined to perform their repertoire of dances. This created problems on so many levels. Obviously, the band started catering the music to these ballroom dancers. Further, on these small dance floors, their requirements for dance floor space was not limited to the approx. 3 ft x 3 ft that most social dancers can live with. Often, the dance floor resembled a roller derby of a few circulating couples. Any casual, unpolished social dancing couples who just wanted a relaxed few minutes together dancing were either repeatedly bumped into or made to feel like they were interfering with the flow.

 

Night after night, the same couples would be on the dance floor, and all the rest of the passengers who might like to dance were sitting around glassy eyed.

 

Yes, the first time anybody watched a serious dancing couple, they would commend them on their accomplishment and grace. From then on, frankly, it was not of interest to the rest of us. No more than any of the tv shows like Dancing with the Stars, etc. I have never seen anyone who does those dances in country clubs, cocktail lounges, etc. There is a place for that if you are a serious ballroom dancer, just not on a ship's small dance floor.

 

 

 

I love to swim laps, and I have become very good at it, but I don't expect others to be an audience for me. And I would never think of trying to swim laps in the afternoon when most of the pool is being enjoyed by non-swimmers just standing around in the water socializing. I respect the skill the ballroom dancers have also achieved and am happy they enjoy their hobby. I just do not believe the ship's small dance floors are appropriate for that type of dancing.

 

 

This isn't only happening on HAL. It happens on Celebrity! On a recent cruise on Equinox the Ballroom dancers completely monopolized the small dancing area. They would arrive, sit down , change their shoes and start dancing. There was one very old couple who just loved dancing with each other. I spent many evenings watching to see if they would be run down. Finally the cruise director set up another venue and sent the ballroom dancers over there. Much nicer and everyone got to dance safely.

[lcand1923]

Hear! Hear!

 

I know the OP posted about the World Cruise, but I have seen the same on HAL -- and other cruise lines -- since my first cruise in 1999. My parents loved to dance and took Ballroom Classes (not Arthur Murray) for many years, so I more or less understand the "rules". I never can understand why the cruise lines don't try to accommodate both the Ballroom Rule Dancers and the Social Dancers in the evening hours. There are normally two venues available, but if only one, the evening hours could be split between the two styles of dancers.

 

If a person loves to dance, they love to dance. If appropriate music is playing, the dancer will go, buy a few drinks, and stay until the music stops.

[mor mor]

I really enjoyed your well written post. We are from the "silent generation"--as Time mag dubbed us -people born in the 30s, which is the smallest cohert yet. so we never jitterbugged or charlestoned or did Latin America dances, but mostly slow dancing - but most of us enjoy the individual dancing that came about with your generation. (Notice how we are neither the "greatest generation" too young for WW2, OR the baby boomers but we are never mentioned.) I am annoyed by show off dancers too, and once you have seen their routine it is boring. We go ahead and dance in a corner if we feel like it and no one is rude as being old means you are invisible.:) plus you care less what other people think.

 

I am glad you had a good cruise - the bloggers really were enthusiastic - and I hope you have many happy dancing years ahead with the kind of music you and we enjoy.

[Sunriseatsea]

Well, thank you mor mor! Maybe someday we will be lucky enough to be dancing on the same dance floor (not in the corner!) and enjoying ourselves immensely!