Haven privileges for 5/6th guests

[CI66774]

OP has six guests in the Haven and paid full fare for two of them. They now want to move two of the "free" ones to another cabin and keep the Haven perks. If that is true, drop the KSF because this is a cancellation and rebooking, pay full fare for the six in the Haven and then sell them a Balcony. NCL wins and OP gets what they want. Same as any other cancellation and rebook. Seems easy and fair for everyone?

 

"Fairness" is irrelevant and shouldn't come into play here. The remaining paxs aren't "free." They're paying taxes, etc. NCL ran this promotion and OP is taking advantage of it. Good for her. The only thing about booking another room (if NCL allows it) is they would have to pay daily gratuities for that room, too.

[GeezerCouple]

OP has six guests in the Haven and paid full fare for two of them. They now want to move two of the "free" ones to another cabin and keep the Haven perks. If that is true, drop the KSF because this is a cancellation and rebooking, pay full fare for the six in the Haven and then sell them a Balcony. NCL wins and OP gets what they want. Same as any other cancellation and rebook. Seems easy and fair for everyone?

 

Would you object if the OP did not use any KSF promotion?

 

We were trying to do that (with NO promotion) and were told it was absolutely impossible.

 

This would have been a case where the 2BR suite would accommodate 6. We wanted to pay for 5.

Then we also wanted another smaller cabin so there would be a quieter place for someone to sleep.

 

We've since spoken with someone at NCL who said, in effect, what a shame, I could have helped you with that. So, about 3 cruises from now, we'll have that same situation, and hopefully it will work.

 

The bottom line in terms of capacity is IF NCL will sell a cabin for up to "X" number of Guests, then that is what should be allowed in there.

If someone wants to purchase another cabin for luggage, or to use as a dressing room, or for private yoga exercises, as long as they pay for that cabin, so what?

 

And if the concern is that "cabins aren't getting fully utilized for 'extra spending' like casino or gift shop", then that argument leads to not allowing families to get the extra connecting cabin for "two children". Make them stay in the same cabin as the parents, so that other cabin can be sold to someone else. Really!?

 

As for lifeboat capacity, of course! But using that to disallow 5 or 6 in a cabin/suite that *allows* 5 or 6 is no different than saying one should not be allowed to add 2 more in a cabin that takes 4.

 

This is all getting very confused with some seemingly similar questions (that are actually quite different), where some people ask things like, "We have 10 in our group, and only 8 are in suites; can't we have the other 2 join us in Cagney's anyway?"

In that type of case, the people are NOT interested in/willing to pay the extra person surcharge for extra people in suites, OR perhaps they don't want to pay for the larger suites that would have the capacity to include the others. The key there is that there are passengers who are NOT listed in any suite at all, and NO payment for "suite capacity" was paid for them.

 

GeezerCouple

[Nalagh]

Let's say the OP books the H4 for 4 and the inside for 2.

Still 6 people 2 cabins

The H4 now has just taxes and fees for the 3rd and 4th guests

The let's say B4 is double occupancy plus taxes and fees

Two cabins 6 passengers 6 port fees paid

 

The OP fills the H6- 3rd-6th guest pays port fees and taxes

The OP PAYS double occupancy for B4 plus one extra port fee and taxes

7 port fees and taxes paid.

 

Unless NCL can fill the ship to capacity, NCL wins.

[Casino Comp Chick]

Let's say the OP books the H4 for 4 and the inside for 2.

Still 6 people 2 cabins

The H4 now has just taxes and fees for the 3rd and 4th guests

The let's say B4 is double occupancy plus taxes and fees

Two cabins 6 passengers 6 port fees paid

 

The OP fills the H6- 3rd-6th guest pays port fees and taxes

The OP PAYS double occupancy for B4 plus one extra port fee and taxes

7 port fees and taxes paid.

 

Unless NCL can fill the ship to capacity, NCL wins.

 

Like!

And don't forget the DSC

Edited October 21, 2014 by iimmie

[rochelle_s]

Let's say the OP books the H4 for 4 and the inside for 2.

Still 6 people 2 cabins

The H4 now has just taxes and fees for the 3rd and 4th guests

The let's say B4 is double occupancy plus taxes and fees

Two cabins 6 passengers 6 port fees paid

 

The OP fills the H6- 3rd-6th guest pays port fees and taxes

The OP PAYS double occupancy for B4 plus one extra port fee and taxes

7 port fees and taxes paid.

 

Unless NCL can fill the ship to capacity, NCL wins.

 

 

 

So it is acceptable to purchase the Haven perks for non Haven guests for a fee? In this case the fee being equivalent to the port fees and taxes?

 

 

Rochelle

[rochelle_s]

And don't forget the DSC

 

There is nothing to say that the DSC will be paid twice.

 

As everyone knows they can be removed. What is to stop someone from go to guest services and removing the fees with the reason being that they are being paid twice. If that even happens at all as there will likely be only one Sail & Sign account set up per passenger.

 

 

Rochelle

[Casino Comp Chick]

So it is acceptable to purchase the Haven perks for non Haven guests for a fee? In this case the fee being equivalent to the port fees and taxes?

 

 

Rochelle

 

If 6 people are in the Haven suite isn't that the same thing?

Just saying........

[Casino Comp Chick]

There is nothing to say that the DSC will be paid twice.

 

As everyone knows they can be removed. What is to stop someone from go to guest services and removing the fees with the reason being that they are being paid twice. If that even happens at all as there will likely be only one Sail & Sign account set up per passenger.

 

 

Rochelle

 

I would never dream of removing them so I do not think in those terms. I do see that is plausible though.

[havenfan]

OP here. I'm heartened to see that my original plan B (keep all of us in the H4 and double book my parents) should have worked.

 

If you do not exceed the capacity in your Haven cabin you may book a second cabin anywhere on the ship in your name. Keep everyone booked in the H4 , and then book the second cabin just in your name thus preserving privileges. At the pier for check-in, you proceed through the Haven line and then on the ship the Concierge will give you door open only keys only for the second cabin.

 

I have done this on the Breakaway, Sky, Gem and I now have booked the same for the Escape for October 2015.

 

I have done this on the Breakaway this past August...6 people traveling together. 4 adults, 2 kids. I had an AFT Penthouse and a balcony booked. The AFT Penthouse had the 4 adults registered in it and the balcony had the 2 kids listed. The reservations were linked and all 6 of us had Haven privileges. When we were on board we had extra key cards made for the cabins so we all had key cards to each cabin and the kids needed the key card to access the door to the Haven courtyard. The balcony wasn't a connecting cabin BUT it was directly next to the AFT Penthouse. 2 of the adults slept in a "real bed" in the balcony cabin and the kids had the extra beds.

 

This would have been a case where the 2BR suite would accommodate 6. We wanted to pay for 5.

Then we also wanted another smaller cabin so there would be a quieter place for someone to sleep.

 

We've since spoken with someone at NCL who said, in effect, what a shame, I could have helped you with that.

 

From their first-hand experiences, it seems that NCL does condone and, indeed, facilitate this arrangement. I don't know about the rest of you but I've learned something (don't be fooled by my Join Date; I've been lurking for a long, long time). Thank you very much Nalagh, Godiva830 and GeezerCouple for sharing.

 

Unfortunately, my TA must have trained at the same school as LadyShiva's and GeezerCouple's. After what he claimed were extensive conversations with NCL, he still said he couldn't do it.

 

However... after his "extensive conversations" yesterday he called back this morning and said that NCL had a H5 open. The upsell fairy must have been moving somebody around, though I've no idea where they could have gone to. So we went with plan A and the six of us will be staying in a H4 and a H5 (on opposite sides of the courtyard, but thank God for the little things).

 

This should make Demonyte, rvsullivan and rochelle_s happy. Somehow I think that, even though it seems established that I would have been "within the rules," they'd still feel bad about something:)

[Nalagh]

So it is acceptable to purchase the Haven perks for non Haven guests for a fee? In this case the fee being equivalent to the port fees and taxes?

 

 

Rochelle

 

IMHO, NCl put a deal on the table; KSF. In my experience, when such a special is offered the prices are inflated. The first and second person price increases, but you pay less for additional guests in the cabin.

 

I do not have a problem with filling the H4 to capacity under any circumstances. If an extra room is desired for comfort and there is availability, NCL does not lose. Everyone gets to spend time together and gets real beds. The OP ends up paying more in the end, not less. The DSC is also added to the second cabin, and you are correct it could be removed by unappreciative idiots.

 

We may not agree, and that's okay. Like I said, it is my opinion.

 

Cherie

[pieshops]

IMHO, NCl put a deal on the table; KSF. In my experience, when such a special is offered the prices are inflated. The first and second person price increases, but you pay less for additional guests in the cabin.

 

I do not have a problem with filling the H4 to capacity under any circumstances. If an extra room is desired for comfort and there is availability, NCL does not lose. Everyone gets to spend time together and gets real beds. The OP ends up paying more in the end, not less. The DSC is also added to the second cabin, and you are correct it could be removed by unappreciative idiots.

 

We may not agree, and that's okay. Like I said, it is my opinion.

 

Cherie

 

Totally not true on the price increase. I checked the day before the KSF went on and the next day when it was official same exact price.

[GeezerCouple]

So it is acceptable to purchase the Haven perks for non Haven guests for a fee? In this case the fee being equivalent to the port fees and taxes?

 

 

Rochelle

 

No.

 

It is acceptable to have Haven/Suite perks for EVERYONE who is a listed passenger in a Haven/Suite cabin.

 

(Or are you objecting to perks for 3rd, 4th, etc., passengers LISTED in a Haven/suite because they never pay as much as the first two passengers would pay if there were just two in the cabin? This is whether or not there is any promotion. The first two always pay far more than the rest, per person, if there are only two vs. more. This happens in inside cabins, OV's, balconies... up to and including the Garden Villa, where the 3rd+ passengers *really* get a good "value", once the cost of the first 2 passengers is considered.)

 

GeezerCouple

[havenfan]

Even though my immediate issue has been resolved, I still find this thread quite interesting. Particularly:

 

I have done this on the Breakaway this past August...6 people traveling together. 4 adults, 2 kids. I had an AFT Penthouse and a balcony booked. The AFT Penthouse had the 4 adults registered in it and the balcony had the 2 kids listed. The reservations were linked and all 6 of us had Haven privileges. When we were on board we had extra key cards made for the cabins so we all had key cards to each cabin and the kids needed the key card to access the door to the Haven courtyard. The balcony wasn't a connecting cabin BUT it was directly next to the AFT Penthouse.

 

Godiva830, I've never sailed on the Breakaway but from NCL's website, the AFT Penthouses have a capacity of only 4. Is that correct for your cabin?

 

If so, this expands the possibilities beyond Nalagh's restriction that you can only get privileges for a suite's capacity.

 

Or maybe NCL was happy with this because it was just kids in the non-suite cabin.

 

Or maybe this was just an extension of NCL's definition of a "connecting" cabin for suite privilege purposes.

 

I'm always interested in finding out what NCL's rules really are. Especially since my TA doesn't seem to know.

[rochelle_s]

Havenfan,

 

I am happy to read that everything has worked out for you and that you have the accommodation that will work best for your party..

 

For the record I wish to point out that I was personally not opposed to your original plan. Nor were my thoughts an attack on you. I just found it very interesting how it was accepted here within the thread and that there was no extreme opposition as had been evidenced in previous threads about the potential of increased numbers of guests availing themselves of suite perks. My comments were only meant for discussions sake.

 

Wishing you and your family a very pleasant cruise.

 

 

Rochelle

[Nalagh]

Totally not true on the price increase. I checked the day before the KSF went on and the next day when it was official same exact price.

 

I am pleased this has been your experience, but it has not been mine.

 

Cherie

[pieshops]

Havenfan,

 

I am happy to read that everything has worked out for you and that you have the accommodation that will work best for your party..

 

For the record I wish to point out that I was personally not opposed to your original plan. Nor were my thoughts an attack on you. I just found it very interesting how it was accepted here within the thread and that there was no extreme opposition as had been evidenced in previous threads about the potential of increased numbers of guests availing themselves of suite perks. My comments were only meant for discussions sake.

 

Wishing you and your family a very pleasant cruise.

 

 

Rochelle

 

Not a lot of opposition because they are 2 totally different situations. In this case one has a haven booked for all and wants to keep the haven for all just get an extra cabin and pay for that cabin. The other way is people wanting others who are not listed in the haven cabin to have haven privilidges or pay a fee for partial haven privileges. Completely different.

[Casino Comp Chick]

Totally not true on the price increase. I checked the day before the KSF went on and the next day when it was official same exact price.

 

Same for me, no price increase until after booking (its up, wayyy up)

[Casino Comp Chick]

Not a lot of opposition because they are 2 totally different situations. In this case one has a haven booked for all and wants to keep the haven for all just get an extra cabin and pay for that cabin. The other way is people wanting others who are not listed in the haven cabin to have haven privilidges or pay a fee for partial haven privileges. Completely different.

 

There are exceptions, I booked the same configuration as Cherie (based on Cherie's review) and booked 4 adults into the H6 and 4 kids in the connecting BD cabin, NCL has given me in writing assurances that the children will have the same access as the suite passengers.

Yes I did not have to pay extra for it, though I would have taken advantage of the Priority plus had it lived long enough for me to get off the Breakaway last month.

Flame away if you must but it will not change my reservation or the price I paid, or didn't pay.

:D

[havenfan]

Rochelle,

 

I apologize for being snarky. I was just so relieved to get a good resolution to my problem.

 

As I said, my plan A was always to get two Haven suites. Plan B was to keep everyone in the one suite and get an extra bedroom. While it is true that it would have cost me relatively little, ~225pp in taxes and DSC in addition to the full price of another cabin, it would have been inconvenient and possibly a little embarrassing for my parents if they wanted to use the pool or hot tub with the kids. Only plan C was to throw myself at the mercy of the maitre'd and the concierge.

 

I make no apology for booking under the KSF promotion and, therefore, opening up the possibility of, in effect, getting Haven privileges for only $225pp. There is a quantitative difference, but no qualitative difference than if I'd paid a further $449 for each extra person. And the quantitative difference is merely trying to get the best deal that NCL legitimately offers. I seriously doubt anyone on this board would do otherwise.

 

However, I will note that it may have been the KSF which caused a run on the Haven cabins preventing me from using plan A in the first place. NCL giveth, NCL taketh.

 

You don't have to believe me, but I would under no circumstances have cancelled the service charge for the extra cabin. Well, ok, if the stewards spat in my parents' faces, perhaps, but otherwise.... I've sailed on enough cruises to know that the staff work very, very hard and that they make most of their compensation from the tips. I'm lucky enough to be able to pay for two Haven suites and I'm a very proud person; I'd hate to think I was such a churl as to stiff the people who make the holiday so nice.

 

Perhaps some of the people who have brought up the importance of ancillary revenues feel differently, but I do not believe it is my concern whether NCL make profits at any given level of pricing or under any set of rules. I believe that's NCL's concern. My concern is to get the best deal I can within the prices and rules that NCL sets. Otherwise I feel like a chump, and I'd rather avoid that.

 

Just out of curiosity, would any of those who posted about the importance of ancillary revenues (drinks, excursions, etc.) let us know if they've ever gone out of their way to buy a more expensive drink or booked a more expensive excursion thinking, "I've got to do this so NCL can make their expected profit off of me?"

 

Finally, I'm also curious why I haven't seen more "outrage" in the past about situations where parties book the adjoining mini-suites or balconies and NCL grants suite privileges to the whole group. I would have thought the possibility of a party with six in a SC and four in the connecting MB, so ten in total at Cagney's, would have been more inflammatory than the plan B I was suggesting (and may yet try in the future. If I can get a decent TA.)

[jmele999]

Dear OP - Glad to that your situation was resolved.

 

I really don't understand why NCL is no willing to facilitate the plan B that the OP was describing. Why does NCL bother to point out that some mini suites connect to SC suites (I know that they don't get Haven access). NCL is missing the point of how attractive it would be to have three room suites. For example, NCL could easily sell a suite and adjoining balcony cabin for six guests, and have the 5th and 6th guest pay less.

 

 

NCL - This is a simple business decision and one that could make a lot of people happy if the rooms (suite and adjoining balcony room) are available. Even if adjoining rooms are not available, don't you think that it would be better to sell a cabin to somebody who is already occupying another cabin.

[rochelle_s]

Not a lot of opposition because they are 2 totally different situations. In this case one has a haven booked for all and wants to keep the haven for all just get an extra cabin and pay for that cabin. The other way is people wanting others who are not listed in the haven cabin to have haven privilidges or pay a fee for partial haven privileges. Completely different.

 

One could argue that once a guest is listed as a first or second inhabitant of a cabin that this becomes their primary accomodation. Any listing of their name as a 3rd, 4th, 5th or 6th passenger in another cabin becomes secondary. They are working the system in order to have suite privileges. You can word it any way you like but this is what is happening.

 

The same can be said for the poster who had four adult passengers listed in the Suite and two children listed in the balcony. I highly doubt that the sleeping arrangements had the 4 adults in one cabin and the two children alone in the balcony cabin. They worked the system to their benefit and in this case did not have to pay anything extra in the way of fees in order for all 6 to have full suite privileges.

 

In the case of the OP what they wanted was the Haven for their entire party and as soon as an extra suite cabin became available and they could achieve this with two cabins they ponied up and paid full fare for this. Kudos to them.

 

There will be plenty of others who will try and maximize the suite benefits for their party with the least expenditure of cash all the while working within the system. There is the possibility of this catching on and the Haven and the associated perks being pushed to the limit. This will diminish the 'value' of the perks which was one of the key issues with the Priority Plus Program.

 

Hence why I disagree that the two scenarios are completely different.

 

It could be viewed that the difference is that with the Priority Plus program you did not have to know someone in the Haven to purchase a few perks. But the 'rules of acceptance' change if you know someone in the Haven (connecting cabins or kids listed separately) or are willing to 'grease the wheel' by paying a little extra to add their name to the cabin. If you have an 'inside connection' there is no longer any outrage over the taxing of the perks in these situations

 

Work the system any way you like. As I said before I find the comparative reactions interesting. Personally I see merit in both sides of the discussion.

 

 

Rochelle

[Godiva830]

Even though my immediate issue has been resolved, I still find this thread quite interesting. Particularly:

 

 

 

Godiva830, I've never sailed on the Breakaway but from NCL's website, the AFT Penthouses have a capacity of only 4. Is that correct for your cabin?

 

If so, this expands the possibilities beyond Nalagh's restriction that you can only get privileges for a suite's capacity.

 

Or maybe NCL was happy with this because it was just kids in the non-suite cabin.

 

Or maybe this was just an extension of NCL's definition of a "connecting" cabin for suite privilege purposes.

 

I'm always interested in finding out what NCL's rules really are. Especially since my TA doesn't seem to know.

 

Yes the AFT Penthouse only accommodates 4 people. We were 6. All 4 adults have to be listed in the suite to have suite privilege. The kids have to be listed under the non suite cabin. The balcony was able to accommodate 3 people. Adults basically have to pay for suite privileges.

 

then my sister wanted to come and initially we had the "extra room" in the balcony reservation bc there's only 2 people listed but bc she's an adult, not registered in a suite cabin, she would not have Haven privileges. We would've had to move into another suite so all could have Haven privileges but I was not giving up my AFT Penthouse so my sister was out of luck lol

 

NCL only makes those kinds of reservations when it's kids listed on the non suite reservation and there's an override they need to do in the system bc it's also 2 minors under 21 being registered into that cabin and the system won't allow minors to be booked in a cabin. It has to be linked to the suite.

 

Also, about a week before sailing I got an up sell call to go into the Deluxe Owners Suite and I said I had a non suite linked and it was next door to my cabin and if I was to move all the way to the front of the ship and my other non suite cabin was still in the back would they still have Haven privileges and they told me yes they would.

 

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Forums mobile app

[rochelle_s]

Rochelle,

 

I apologize for being snarky. I was just so relieved to get a good resolution to my problem.

 

As I said, my plan A was always to get two Haven suites. Plan B was to keep everyone in the one suite and get an extra bedroom. While it is true that it would have cost me relatively little, ~225pp in taxes and DSC in addition to the full price of another cabin, it would have been inconvenient and possibly a little embarrassing for my parents if they wanted to use the pool or hot tub with the kids. Only plan C was to throw myself at the mercy of the maitre'd and the concierge.

 

I make no apology for booking under the KSF promotion and, therefore, opening up the possibility of, in effect, getting Haven privileges for only $225pp. There is a quantitative difference, but no qualitative difference than if I'd paid a further $449 for each extra person. And the quantitative difference is merely trying to get the best deal that NCL legitimately offers. I seriously doubt anyone on this board would do otherwise.

 

However, I will note that it may have been the KSF which caused a run on the Haven cabins preventing me from using plan A in the first place. NCL giveth, NCL taketh.

 

You don't have to believe me, but I would under no circumstances have cancelled the service charge for the extra cabin. Well, ok, if the stewards spat in my parents' faces, perhaps, but otherwise.... I've sailed on enough cruises to know that the staff work very, very hard and that they make most of their compensation from the tips. I'm lucky enough to be able to pay for two Haven suites and I'm a very proud person; I'd hate to think I was such a churl as to stiff the people who make the holiday so nice.

 

Perhaps some of the people who have brought up the importance of ancillary revenues feel differently, but I do not believe it is my concern whether NCL make profits at any given level of pricing or under any set of rules. I believe that's NCL's concern. My concern is to get the best deal I can within the prices and rules that NCL sets. Otherwise I feel like a chump, and I'd rather avoid that.

 

Just out of curiosity, would any of those who posted about the importance of ancillary revenues (drinks, excursions, etc.) let us know if they've ever gone out of their way to buy a more expensive drink or booked a more expensive excursion thinking, "I've got to do this so NCL can make their expected profit off of me?"

 

Finally, I'm also curious why I haven't seen more "outrage" in the past about situations where parties book the adjoining mini-suites or balconies and NCL grants suite privileges to the whole group. I would have thought the possibility of a party with six in a SC and four in the connecting MB, so ten in total at Cagney's, would have been more inflammatory than the plan B I was suggesting (and may yet try in the future. If I can get a decent TA.)

 

Havenfan,

 

Absolutely no reason to apologize to me. anyone else or for booking under the KSF program.

 

I am a big believer in getting the biggest bang for the buck. I can also appreciate when people want to get what they have paid for, especially if the price they have paid is at a premium.

 

Not that it matters but I do believe that you would have left all DSC charges in place. I too can't imagine a situation where I would remove them. But there are plenty of folks on every cruise that unfortunately do not hesitate to do so.

 

I also agree that the KSF program is very likely increasing sales of the Haven categories as the overall price makes it more affordable and/or appealing to a wider audience. NCL has a fairly unique concept with the Haven and its 'ship with in a ship' module. NCL promotes it as an exclusive area of the ship and many people buy into it for this very reason. The more promotions, loop holes and back doors there are the less exclusivity there is. By comments made on this thread alone there is the potential to increase the capacity as high as 200%. Not sure that is exactly what a lot of Haven guests are looking for. This could prove to be a slippery slope for the cruise line.

 

I did not post about it before but as to your question about ancillary revenues I have never thought about my on board spending in terms of profits for NCL. I do though factor in a free cruise through CAS into my casino budget--this is more to keep the offers coming as opposed to worrying about the NCL's bottom line.

 

Once again wishing you and your family a wonderful cruise.

 

 

Rochelle

[jmele999]

Yes the AFT Penthouse only accommodates 4 people. We were 6. All 4 adults have to be listed in the suite to have suite privilege. The kids have to be listed under the non suite cabin. The balcony was able to accommodate 3 people. Adults basically have to pay for suite privileges.

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Forums mobile app

Godiva - another question.

 

Did NCL make you pay the full price for all four adults in the suite, or did two of them pay as the 3rd or 4th person. Very interesting that they allow you to this. I wonder if they would allow the same for 6 adults.

Edited October 21, 2014 by jmele999

[pieshops]

Godiva - another question.

 

Did NCL make you pay the full price for all four adults in the suite, or did two of them pay as the 3rd or 4th person. Very interesting that they allow you to this. I wonder if they would allow the same for 6 adults.

 

while the promotion says kids sail free, it is really for any person who is the 3-6 passenger. We took advantage of this on our upcoming jade cruise with a 2 br haven