Some small Koningsdam dining updates

[InTheWASide]

Given the older crowd on Hal I wonder how that would work. My parents would freak out if they had to order anything that way. I realize a lot of older folks are tech savvy so no need for anyone to jump down my throat about it. I wonder if any cruise line uses this method for the MDR and if it has proved successful.

 

Obviously it would depend on the interface, but if it was as simple as touch the names of the dish(es) you would like instead of speaking them to a server I see no reason why this would be difficult or confusing. It may also allow people to see a full list of ingredients for allergy or other preferential reasons, pictures of the entrees (so that you would know how it is presented... ever order something assuming it'll be plated one way only to find out that while all the ingredients were there it wasn't what you were expecting?) and so forth.

 

If I can either say "I would like the beef carpaccio, french onion soup and surf and turf steak cooked medium please" OR touch the buttons for beef carpaccio, french onion soup and surf and turf and then have it prompt me for a temperature on the steak it would be a little different, but I can't see this as a source of confusion, especially if the servers come by first to introduce themselves and briefly explain the process while taking drink orders perhaps (that said drinks could also be done on an ipad)

 

We did ipad ordering at Gordon Ramsay's BurGR in Las Vegas and we were able to see ingredients for various cocktails, the full menu, pictures of the various items and more. We liked it.

 

With any restaurant... on land OR at sea... how the interface is programmed is going to be the biggest factor on if it's helpful or if it totally sucks. And if it goes over exceptionally poorly it wouldn't be too hard to wipe the memory and find another use for them onboard

Edited July 9, 2015 by InTheWASide

[cruz chic]

Obviously it would depend on the interface, but if it was as simple as touch the names of the dish(es) you would like instead of speaking them to a server I see no reason why this would be difficult or confusing. It may also allow people to see a full list of ingredients for allergy or other preferential reasons, pictures of the entrees (so that you would know how it is presented... ever order something assuming it'll be plated one way only to find out that while all the ingredients were there it wasn't what you were expecting?) and so forth.

 

If I can either say "I would like the beef carpaccio, french onion soup and surf and turf steak cooked medium please" OR touch the buttons for beef carpaccio, french onion soup and surf and turf and then have it prompt me for a temperature on the steak it would be a little different, but I can't see this as a source of confusion, especially if the servers come by first to introduce themselves and briefly explain the process while taking drink orders perhaps (that said drinks could also be done on an ipad)

 

We did ipad ordering at Gordon Ramsay's BurGR in Las Vegas and we were able to see ingredients for various cocktails, the full menu, pictures of the various items and more. We liked it.

 

With any restaurant... on land OR at sea... how the interface is programmed is going to be the biggest factor on if it's helpful or if it totally sucks. And if it goes over exceptionally poorly it wouldn't be too hard to wipe the memory and find another use for them onboard

While it might seem confusing to you or I that doesn't mean a lot. While my parents wouldn't go on a cruise my mom is in a constant state of confusion now. Something like this would put her over the edge. That said she has no problem stating her order to a person. An iPad would be overwhelming for her. I don't know how many others would find it that way. While I can see this working for a smaller restaurant I can't see it working for an MDR where you could have several hundred people ordering at once. Who would cover the cost of these iPads? With the give away costs for last minute cruises on Hal are they really going to outlay that kind of cash for many iPads?

[InTheWASide]

While it might seem confusing to you or I that doesn't mean a lot. While my parents wouldn't go on a cruise my mom is in a constant state of confusion now. Something like this would put her over the edge. That said she has no problem stating her order to a person. An iPad would be overwhelming for her. I don't know how many others would find it that way. While I can see this working for a smaller restaurant I can't see it working for an MDR where you could have several hundred people ordering at once. Who would cover the cost of these iPads? With the give away costs for last minute cruises on Hal are they really going to outlay that kind of cash for many iPads?

 

Well I would certainly expect that the staff could assist since at some point they would be recollecting them anyway. If someone doesn't want to fuss with it surely they can tell the server and the server could always just "punch it in" for them. The day a HAL server says "tough crap lady, put it in the ipad or starve. Doesn't impact me either way" is the day...well... it's really not even remotely feasible

 

Also, I would assume that in most cases if someone is "in a constant state of confusion" and they were on a cruise they would not be travelling alone most times whether it's family or a caretaker with them.

 

Who would cover the cost? It might take a while but it would offset the cost of all the papers they otherwise fill everything out on so it would even work toward a "greener" approach and less waste generated onboard.

 

Not to mention this entire conversation is 100% hypothetical ;)

Edited July 9, 2015 by InTheWASide

[Fouremco]

I'm very tech oriented and very supportive of HAL taking every measure possible to play catch up. Although it appears that the interactive TVs may still be missing some of the most used and useful functions on other lines, at least it's finally taking the plunge.

 

Having said that, I'm not overly fond of the idea of ordering a meal on an iPad and eliminating the interaction with the wait staff. We dined with friends last night at Le Cordon Bleu Signatures Restaurant in Ottawa, and the from start to finish the servers answered questions and explained selections from pre-appitizer amuse-bouche prepared by Chef Yannick Anton to dessert choices and beyond. While MDR servers aren't of the same calibre, they are still very helpful with menu selections, and the iPad simply isn't go to tell me that a particular item is very small and that recommend that I order two.

 

In smaller or more specialized restaurants, iPads may have a place, although I view it as a fad. Having eliminated all but the serving and clearing of the meal, does the wait staff still expect the same tip in these establishments?

[Third]

I'm also tech oriented but there are exceptions. For ordering a meal I like the human interaction. And I like the Daily Program on paper, to take it home as a souvenir.

[rkacruiser]

I am not tech oriented and I do like human interaction with the wait staff that will be serving me. But, that said, a national upscale restaurant in my area began using Ipad type devices for their wine list. Initially, I was turned off by this and asked for the printed wine list, which was available. Subsequent visits to this restaurant found me "playing" with the device. And, I discovered that along with the wines available, there were informative statements about the wines that a printed wine list did not offer. It proved to be an educational tool, at least for me. It gave me a better idea of what to expect if I was ordering an unfamilar wine.

 

I can see something like that being a good addition to the service available on a HAL ship.

[InTheWASide]

I am not tech oriented and I do like human interaction with the wait staff that will be serving me. But, that said, a national upscale restaurant in my area began using Ipad type devices for their wine list. Initially, I was turned off by this and asked for the printed wine list, which was available. Subsequent visits to this restaurant found me "playing" with the device. And, I discovered that along with the wines available, there were informative statements about the wines that a printed wine list did not offer. It proved to be an educational tool, at least for me. It gave me a better idea of what to expect if I was ordering an unfamilar wine.

 

I can see something like that being a good addition to the service available on a HAL ship.

 

Agreed. It does not necessarily have to be a service replacement. The experience we had at Gordon Ramsay's was fantastic with being able to see ingredients, learn about various beers, see pictures of dishes... We liked it. And the staff was still there to answer questions, make sure everything was entered correctly, and took really good care of us throughout the entire meal

Edited July 9, 2015 by InTheWASide

[Fouremco]

I am not tech oriented and I do like human interaction with the wait staff that will be serving me. But, that said, a national upscale restaurant in my area began using Ipad type devices for their wine list. Initially, I was turned off by this and asked for the printed wine list, which was available. Subsequent visits to this restaurant found me "playing" with the device. And, I discovered that along with the wines available, there were informative statements about the wines that a printed wine list did not offer. It proved to be an educational tool, at least for me. It gave me a better idea of what to expect if I was ordering an unfamilar wine.

 

I can see something like that being a good addition to the service available on a HAL ship.

While I think that a knowledgeable sommelier would do a better job of recommending an appropriate wine, this is certainly an improvement over a wine list in an establishment where the wait staff has no clue about wines.

[Fouremco]

Should we perhaps be talking about tablets and not iPads? HAL appears to be Microsoft oriented, in contrast to Celebrity with its Apple affiliation. I don't know what the nature of their respective agreements with the tech companies might be, but I suspect that HAL would go with Surface 3 or similar.

[ellieanne]

Most of the restaurants/pubs around me have gone to iPad ordering -- at least the servers have iPads not paper. But serious problems come in when the technology doesn't way it's supposed to. The last time I was at a particular pub, the internal network was down and the whole system broke down. Frankly, thirty minutes to get an order of fish & chips and a pint because they can't function without technology is insane!

 

I can see this situation happening on the ships, only worse -- imagine what happens if the system collapses during early dinner service. That delay will create delays all night. People are going to be some kind of angry and not at all understanding -- and nor should they be.

 

I appreciate technology, it's what keeps me in touch with my parents/family in the US while I'm in Australia. But I also know that things need to be able to be done without technology too. Just because we have tablets/touch screens does not make them the better choice in all circumstances.

[Fouremco]

Most of the restaurants/pubs around me have gone to iPad ordering -- at least the servers have iPads not paper. But serious problems come in when the technology doesn't way it's supposed to. The last time I was at a particular pub, the internal network was down and the whole system broke down. Frankly, thirty minutes to get an order of fish & chips and a pint because they can't function without technology is insane!

 

I can see this situation happening on the ships, only worse -- imagine what happens if the system collapses during early dinner service. That delay will create delays all night. People are going to be some kind of angry and not at all understanding -- and nor should they be.

 

I appreciate technology, it's what keeps me in touch with my parents/family in the US while I'm in Australia. But I also know that things need to be able to be done without technology too. Just because we have tablets/touch screens does not make them the better choice in all circumstances.

I was in a small store recently when the power went out. The person at the cash was completely flummoxed, with no idea how to calculate sales tax and challenged adding up a small handful of items. Businesses need to have backup plans and employees capable of functioning when networks crash or power goes out.

[pris993]

Yeah and from various angles, etc I'm having a hard time telling if it's a cushioned seat, kind of a wicker or faux wicker or if it's like a canvas material (think like a "directors chair")

 

 

For a farm to table concept I would have loved to have seen either more of a bench style seat or a mix-up of various wood chair styles. Something a little more rustic.

 

Also good news that they plan on making Canaletto feel like more of a permanent concept. I hate what they did with it on the S/R/Vista ships. Eurodam, Nieuw Amsterdam and Prinsendam on the other hand are beautiful (though Prinsendam can do without the venue name/logo on every single tabletop)

 

While I understand how you might suggest a "bench style" seating for the "farm to fresh concept", the last thing I would want to sit on is a bench and even looking at these tables without any table clothes would not motivate me to check this new option out. Just because the food is fresh, doesn't mean I to give up confort and some class.

[PatsyAnne]

No matter what country you're in, if a business doesn't have a contingency plan for computer/cash register failure, then it doesn't matter how capable the waiter / checker is... there's no way to do it correctly. (A good plan would include not only performing the transaction, but also recording it for future input to the system.) So, on the Koningsdam, if they use tablets for ordering, I hope there is a plan that would allow for ordering during a failure. I would hate to miss my dessert!

[LAFFNVEGAS]

While I understand how you might suggest a "bench style" seating for the "farm to fresh concept", the last thing I would want to sit on is a bench and even looking at these tables without any table clothes would not motivate me to check this new option out. Just because the food is fresh, doesn't mean I to give up confort and some class.

I have to agree with you, when I first saw this picture I was not impressed, it just plain does not look comfortable. Having picnic style bench seats would be even worse :eek:

[Mary Ellen]

I'll admit that when I first read the suggestion for bench seats I rolled my eyes. While I don't always like the design decisions, that would be a new low if HAL actually had bench seats. :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

[InTheWASide]

I'll admit that when I first read the suggestion for bench seats I rolled my eyes. While I don't always like the design decisions, that would be a new low if HAL actually had bench seats. :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

 

I never meant benches would be appropriate for a HAL ship... but for that kind of concept it's the first thing I visualize.

 

Actually I just did a "farm to table restaurants" google image search and some of these concepts are quite nice.

https://www.google.com/search?q=farm+to+table&safe=off&biw=1280&bih=939&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=t9yfVe_uLcrFggScvIjoCQ&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAQ#safe=off&tbm=isch&q=farm+to+table+restaurants

 

As far as the other comment about no tablecloths... it wouldn't really "feel right" for this kind of concept. Obviously everyone has their own opinions and thoughts but more rustic environments don't always need one and most of these don't... and are lovely.

[InTheWASide]

Slight side topic. Is this what people were talking about with a Koningsdam brochure that came with the mariner magazine? Still haven't got the magazine but did manage to get this.

 

[RuthC]

Actually I just did a "farm to table restaurants" google image search and some of these concepts are quite nice.

https://www.google.com/search?q=farm+to+table&safe=off&biw=1280&bih=939&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=t9yfVe_uLcrFggScvIjoCQ&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAQ#safe=off&tbm=isch&q=farm+to+table+restaurants

Many of those pictures remind me of my college dining hall. They don't at all look like a cruise ship place to eat---chow down and go, all the way. :rolleyes:

[Mary Ellen]

To me most of those pictures just said "clutter". Not at all what I'd want in a kitchen/dining environment. Those with rough hewn wood would be a nightmare for the crew to keep clean. I like what HAL shows much better than those suggestions.

 

As to tablecloths not being right for this environment, there were tablecloths in at least one of those pictures. That's not an issue for me either way.

[buckirj1]

I wonder if the Lido will also have extended dining hours? Closing down so early during dinner hours is a real minus, in my opinion.

[Mary Ellen]

I never meant benches would be appropriate for a HAL ship... but for that kind of concept it's the first thing I visualize.

 

Actually I just did a "farm to table restaurants" google image search and some of these concepts are quite nice.

https://www.google.com/search?q=farm+to+table&safe=off&biw=1280&bih=939&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=t9yfVe_uLcrFggScvIjoCQ&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAQ#safe=off&tbm=isch&q=farm+to+table+restaurants

 

As far as the other comment about no tablecloths... it wouldn't really "feel right" for this kind of concept. Obviously everyone has their own opinions and thoughts but more rustic environments don't always need one and most of these don't... and are lovely.

Also, did I miss something? Where did the "Farm to Table" concept come in? Isn't the Culinary Arts Center about cooking classes / display kitchen? I understand wanting to emphasize 'fresh ingredients', but unless HAL is going to have an actual farm on board, there is NO way the Culinary Arts Center could be a "Farm to Table" concept. Fresh ingredients and farm to table aren't the same thing. Produce and proteins will have to shipped there just like any other (non farm to table) restaurant.

[LAFFNVEGAS]

Also, did I miss something? Where did the "Farm to Table" concept come in? Isn't the Culinary Arts Center about cooking classes / display kitchen? I understand wanting to emphasize 'fresh ingredients', but unless HAL is going to have an actual farm on board, there is NO way the Culinary Arts Center could be a "Farm to Table" concept. Fresh ingredients and farm to table aren't the same thing. Produce and proteins will have to shipped there just like any other (non farm to table) restaurant.

 

From the HAL Website

With a menu emphasizing fresh, thoughtfully sourced selections, chefs will even harvest some of the ingredients for the evening meal from a glass-enclosed growing area just off the kitchen.

 

The Culinary Arts Center presented by Food & Wine magazine: Our signature show kitchen for demonstrations and hands-on cooking classes during the day now transforms to a dinner venue at night! Based on the popular farm-to-table movement, dinner at the Culinary Arts Center will feature simple, artisanal dishes prepared by chefs at the center of the action.

 

http://koningsdam.hollandamerica.com/culinary/culinary-arts-center?WT.ac=KOSNavDINCulinary

Edited July 10, 2015 by LAFFNVEGAS

[Mary Ellen]

So at least they are saying it is "based on" the farm to table concept, not actual farm to table. "Based on" can be a far, FAR cry from the real thing. On some itineraries (say the Med), I could see the possibility of actually bringing on 'farm to table' ingredients. In these days of corporate purchasing, I don't expect that to happen. In our early days of cruising that was common on Royal Viking.

 

I would expect the ingredients grown on board to be herbs.

[VermeulT]

Also new will be the Grand Dutch Café, overlooking the atrium, reflecting the cruise line’s heritage and serving Dutch specialties. Foods will be complimentary; guests will only pay for specialty coffees and other beverages.

 

To me - this is THE BEST news ever. And gives me hope that my future cruising will stay with HAL. It's one of the reasons why I fell in love with the line.

[cshim]

Do the servers have iPads? You would still need the servers to take the orders.

 

Or do passengers have to order from their own iPads? If so, what happens if passengers don't have an iPad?.

 

Passengers have the iPads but you don't order with them. They act as menus and the server comes to take your order as normal.