Problems in Europe

[CrossBluePerchance]

No cruises though...the prices were too high!

 

We're booked on a 9 day loop, Marseille to Marseille, on the CDF Horizon, on which we did an eastbound transatlantic this Spring, (and have already booked for next Spring) - price PP for this trip is $803 US (fare/taxes/port fees, but not gratuities).

[CrossBluePerchance]

There are absolutely no issues travelling between Genoa and Marseilles.

 

Than you for the info - much appreciated.

[cruisemom42]

Is it? Many of them were already in a safe country such as Turkey, Greece, Italy and Jordan. But obviously, being safe is not the reason. They want to live in Germany or Sweden and we all know why.

 

Greece and Italy, due to their locations, have taken in many, many more refugees than many other, more prosperous EU countries. Is it fair that they must shoulder more of the burden (when their economies are not as strong) than other EU nations?

[buggins0402]

Thank you......appreciate the input.....we've heard stories about rail strikes - just one more reason for a contingency plan. Which is why we're attempting to do our due diligence beforehand. ;)

 

For Italian transportation strikes you can check here:

 

http://www.slowtrav.com/blog/italy_transport_strikes/

 

Perhaps someone else knows a link for finding planned French strikes.

[Priya2]

OP has a point to worry. It's a fluid and unpredictable situation that can turn ugly without warning. Every time a country loses control of its own border, bad things usually happen.

I don't understand the alarm. Perhaps its because Europe feels foreign and therefore unpredictable to Americans. You have far more chance of being shot in your own country than to encounter a problem with a refugee in Europe!

 

What exactly are you afraid of? These people are refugees from war. They are not mainly young men, despite some of the news footage. They are mainly families with young children fleeing Syria. When interviewed they explain that their towns have been raised to the ground and they are trapped between Asad's forces and ISIS. The people massing in Europe have been able to pay for their passage and are mostly young adults at University or professionals (doctors, lawyers, teachers, nurses etc). Of course they are going look 'rough', they have been travelling for weeks with inadequate food and rest! Many British and European tourists coming across them simply find a shop to buy water and a toy for a child. This situation calls for compassion, not fear!

[Priya2]

Is it? Many of them were already in a safe country such as Turkey, Greece, Italy and Jordan. But obviously, being safe is not the reason. They want to live in Germany or Sweden and we all know why.

Yes we do know why. For many its because they already have family there, and for all, its be because those countries have stated that they will welcome refugees from Syria and help them settle. They seem like very good reasons to me!

[CrossBluePerchance]

These people are refugees from war. They are not mainly young men, despite some of the news footage.

 

If the linked chart from the UN Refugee Agency is correct, 72% are male.

 

http://data.unhcr.org/mediterranean/regional.php

[Priya2]

If the linked chart from the UN Refugee Agency is correct, 72% are male.

 

http://data.unhcr.org/mediterranean/regional.php

Including children and the elderly. And your point is?

[CrossBluePerchance]

Including children and the elderly. And your point is?

 

If you view (again) the link it indicates 15% children, 13% women & 72% men.

 

It does not specify 'elderly men', and I don't personally recall seeing any/many in online pics.

 

My point? You were the one who claimed they were mostly 'young families', I merely posted a link that appears to contradict that assertion.

[Priya2]

If you view (again) the link it indicates 15% children, 13% women & 72% men.

 

It does not specify 'elderly men', and I don't personally recall seeing any/many in online pics.

 

My point? You were the one who claimed they were mostly 'young families', I merely posted a link that appears to contradict that assertion.

Yes, you're right, children are listed seperately. There are many elderly men. We see them on our TV news daily, so the men category will include all ages. Apparently, many older women and some younger ones, pregnant and with young children wait in Turkey. The journey is difficult and if a man obtains asylum status, he can send for his family and they have an easier journey.

 

I don't see this as a central issue though. This may be of interest http://www.amnesty.org.uk/truth-about-refugees#.Vfg55nB4WrV

Edited September 15, 2015 by Priya2
To add link.

[sfaaa]

Including children and the elderly. And your point is?

 

Where are all the women? Why are they being left behind to become sex slaves while these brave men turned tail and ran to Europe?

[newport dave]

Where are all the women? Why are they being left behind to become sex slaves while these brave men turned tail and ran to Europe?

They're waiting in Turkey, which is currently classed as a safe country for refugees. Which is what the previous post states..

 

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

[Priya2]

Where are all the women? Why are they being left behind to become sex slaves while these brave men turned tail and ran to Europe?

Newport Dave got there before me sfaaa. Perhaps read a bit about this issue. You seem very ill informed. Can I suggest beginning with this as posted above http://www.amnesty.org.uk/truth-about-refugees#.Vfg55nB4WrV

[John Bull]

Like the USA, the UK has had a hard time with economic migrants getting into the country and it has hardened opinion. An opinion I've always had, even toward large-scale legal immigration from eastern EU countries.

 

But most of the current migrants are refugees from countries being torn apart by what are effectively civil wars in Syria and (on a smaller scale) Burkina Faso.

They deserve a great deal more compassion.

Yes, there are refugee camps in Lebanon, Jordan & Turkey - but that's an existence, not a life or hope or income. OK as a temporary measure, but there's no end in sight for the conflict in Syria. Plus, why should those countries bear the load? Especially since world aid for those camps is running out.

 

So a little more understanding & humanity from some posters, please.

And be grateful you're not in their situation.

 

We've strayed from cruising, and I guess this post, and others, will be wiped & this thread closed as a result.

But I've said what needs to be said.

 

JB :)

Edited September 15, 2015 by John Bull

[CrossBluePerchance]

But I've said what needs to be said.

 

Oh well, if you've said it, what more could anyone possibly want? :rolleyes:

[John Bull]

Oh well, if you've said it, what more could anyone possibly want? :rolleyes:

 

Said it mainly to get it off my chest.

I'd given up on you some time ago :rolleyes:

 

JB

[sfaaa]

They're waiting in Turkey, which is currently classed as a safe country for refugees. Which is what the previous post states..

 

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

 

Yeah, the Yazidi women and girls all made it to Turkey. I got you.

[Priya2]

Yeah, the Yazidi women and girls all made it to Turkey. I got you.

That is a seperate subject! Can we assume then that you have compassion for them, but not for the ones who made it to Europe seeking asylum. :rolleyes:

[CrossBluePerchance]

As the OP, when I posted what I thought was an innocuous, relatively straightforward question, I didn't anticipate the thread drift that followed.

 

Made me think of this:

 

[Priya2]

I still genuinely wonder what exactly you are worried about Crossblueperchance. The only violence there has been has been on the part of Hungarian Police who seem to have a bit of an 'Eastern Block' hangover!

[sail7seas]

Despite some of the less courteous posts, I think this an interesting and pertinent thread. Summer/fall European cruises are still underway and were I booked for one, I'd be interested in the latest accurate news in this regard.

 

Seeing my friends returned just days ago from Prague, Danube cruise and stay in Budapest, I am particularly interested to compare their comments with those made here.

 

Edited September 15, 2015 by sail7seas

[Velvetwater]

Greece and Italy, due to their locations, have taken in many, many more refugees than many other, more prosperous EU countries. Is it fair that they must shoulder more of the burden (when their economies are not as strong) than other EU nations?

 

Took the words out of my mouth, and then theres Greece's other problems that make it harder for them to support others.

 

I also agree with Priya on the family issue. I work in a school in a city with a large immigrant population and a good chunk of the children I help settle in have come to join family. We also have a lot of Roma children in our school that have been mistreated in various locations in Europe and have come to the UK for relief of that. This week we have our first two Syrian children arriving.

 

I think its easy to label a person from any country moving to another as a cheeky opportunist when in reality most of us do not know what they have faced (although the war in Syria et al is quite obvious) and what they want for their families.

Edited September 15, 2015 by Velvetwater

[CrossBluePerchance]

I still genuinely wonder what exactly you are worried about Crossblueperchance. The only violence there has been has been on the part of Hungarian Police who seem to have a bit of an 'Eastern Block' hangover!

 

To re-reiterate: We have a narrow window, both ways, Genoa-Marseille return; we're traveling by bus & train, and we're concerned about disruptions at stations/bus depots which would be an impediment to a fluid transition, and which could possibly result in a) our missing the ship and/or b) missing our return flight.

 

In other words, we want to get on the train and on the bus unhindered.

[Priya2]

To re-reiterate: We have a narrow window, both ways, Genoa-Marseille return; we're traveling by bus & train, and we're concerned about disruptions at stations/bus depots which would be an impediment to a fluid transition, and which could possibly result in a) our missing the ship and/or b) missing our return flight.

 

In other words, we want to get on the train and on the bus unhindered.

There is nothing to suggest disruption of transport on your route. I hope you have a good trip.

[Velvetwater]

To re-reiterate: We have a narrow window, both ways, Genoa-Marseille return; we're traveling by bus & train, and we're concerned about disruptions at stations/bus depots which would be an impediment to a fluid transition, and which could possibly result in a) our missing the ship and/or b) missing our return flight.

 

In other words, we want to get on the train and on the bus unhindered.

 

On a side note...trains on the continent are usually on time even in the busiest seasons.

 

Whats more many countries give refunds/discounts when the train is late.

Edited September 15, 2015 by Velvetwater