Notification FRom HAL re: dining on Westerdam 2/20

[bd1958]

This stinks, but the real joke might be on those poor Christians who sign up...check the prices. Nearly double the lower rates published by HAL. plus a 'conference fee.' Not to mention the fact that the group doesn't say that the ship is shared with non-conference guests (possibly heathens!). Someone is making a lot of money off that charter.

[blueboro]

WE had booked the Eurodam in 2013 and found out about the Gospel cruise group. I called HAL and they said..."oh it is not a large group and it will have no impact on the cruise". I then went to the gospel group website and found out over 1,000 were booked on the cruise, saw they were taking over the main showroom each evening, and knew we were screwed and would be 2nd class passengers. We immediately cancelled the Eurodam and went to Celebrity. We are trying the Eurodam again leaving 2/14 and hope we are not overrun by any groups.

[sail7seas]

Wow that is terrible. I noticed on the group update thread we have a knitting group on our trip, I presume that is different ie not a charter????

 

 

Sent from my iPod touch using Forums mobile app

 

Kazu

Just to clarify, a charter typically books the entire ship and cruise so it is only available to their group and no one else.

 

The large groups that book along with passengers are the issue here.

 

I wouldn't be concerned with a knitting group. Have seen them on our cruises and they have posed no issue whatsoever.

 

 

Thanks for clarifying kazu

 

 

Sent from my iPod touch using Forums mobile app

 

The point is not what the group is comprised of but the size of the group.

Doesn't matter if they are knitters, gospel singers, gymnasts or whatever...... If the group on board comprises 25 - 30% or more of the number of guests on board, it is a problem. The larger the group, usually that means the larger the problem.

 

To have the pool taken over for a private party, Crows Nest closed at night to all others, a full seating at dinner, a lounge set aside for private events...... these are all very common features of having a large group aboard.

 

That is why the cruise lines are very closed mouthed about giving that information even if directly questioned.

 

Avery's Gram, For the crew to be so shocked this happened to you is a bit insincere as they certainly have seen it happen before. While it is it not 'their fault' in that Seattle booked the group and gave the orders as to what was open and closed to others, the crews certainly are aware this happens.

 

Edited February 12, 2016 by sail7seas

[Avery's Gram]

Of course, I understand that the crew knew there would be unhappy people......but they were in the middle, and I could see that they, who are trained to keep us happy and satisfied, were unhappy too.

[serendipity1499]

Then I would still have your TA call again and talk to a supervisor, because it doesn't make sense given what we have already learned about this cruise. Someone is wrong.

 

I agree with Lizzie..Your TA should ask for a Supervisor & read the e-mail you received to them..

 

We just got off a btoB on the Eurodam.....first week was horrible! Over 900 inspiration gospel music fans took over the dining room for late dinner....no one was allowed to eat after 6:30 and there were a lot of very angry passengers who had not been notified....we were all told we were assigned "as you like dining' date='" but as one European couple told the maitre 'd very loudly, eating before 6:30 is not what we like!

 

People were very angry and unhappy, and the MDR staff was too.....they knew we were unhappy and they couldn't do anything to fix it. The most galling part was that when you talked to people from the group at breakfast, they were all annoyed at having to eat dinner so terribly late! But they had their concert (standing room only) before dinner so they had to eat late. As a result, all shows in the main showroom were late and there were no enrichment lectures during the day as the showroom was fully occupied by gospel.

 

Never again....I will cancel before doing that again![/quote']

 

 

Oh My..I too would be very angry if that happened to us.. We are late seating eaters..So sorry you experienced this..

 

I wonder if this only happens on the shorter cruises such as B2B 7 day cruises?

[alibabacruisers]

Maybe someone could ask Bill and Mary Ann who are on the Amsterdam WC to check with the big wigs (when the big wigs board) about this issue?:confused:

[CowPrincess]

Cruisin'Chris, I am so sorry this has happened to you. DH and I would be very unhappy if we were in a similar situation. I hope that with some of the suggestions in this thread, you can get a reasonable resolution.

[sail7seas]

The big wigs are well aware of this circumstance. They have been doing it for a great many years. There is nothing new about it and the 'pattern' does not change. What the group wants, the group gets. Other guests not a part of the group are not significant on such a cruise. IF they had any intent to make any changes in how this happens, they would have made those changes long ago. HAL is certainly not the only cruise line that operates in this manner with respect to large groups.

 

Groups bring in big money. Everything to do with any cruise line is all about the $$.

 

[CruisinChris]

 

I'm really sorry this is being done by HAL to guests on their ships.

When you sail with a large group, that group Rules. Everything is provided as the group wants it and others lose use of venues and get what is left.

 

We once sailed with a very large group and to answer your question about them taking over the pool or Crows Nest, the answer is yes.

 

We were aboards 10 days and lost use of Crows Nest for just about the whole cruise. We literally were told by the group's coordinator there was a private party there every night of the cruise and we were not included. :eek:

 

We also lost use of the aft pool, on a beautiful Caribbean sea day and the group had a private pool party. We were a bit more than 'miffed' with the way we were so pushed aside.

 

Count on being denied use of one venue or another whenever it suits the large group.

 

 

HAL claims to have "learned a lot" about having big groups onboard and have "improved" and limited the impact that these groups have on other passengers. But, since they're not making good on their promises before I'm even onboard, I have doubts as to their sincerity and commitment to what they have learned. My agent is furious and even more so by the lying in the notification. He is willing and able to fight with HAL to make it right on my behalf as well as the 6 other staterooms the agency has booked on this cruise.

 

I would never have booked a cruise with a group - I'm pretty savvy. The only reason this happened is that my sister is having some bone graft surgery and can't accompany me, so I decided to change the trip right at final booking. I tried to get on a Princess sailing the same day, but the last room booked while I was waiting on my agent. I am so ticked about not being on the Princess cruise at this point. I was looking forward to the suite and trying HAL, but now I am totally ticked and I'm not even onboard yet. I will not be doing the Norwegian fjords trip with them that I was contemplating for August no way.

 

I think HAL's role in the Carnival brand portfolio is partially to provide an attractive offering for large groups. HAL has TONS of these types of sailings, even in high season. Princess has very few. It's clearly one of the only ways HAL can fill their ships.

[propwash]

We had a very similar situation last January on our Eastern Caribbean cruise on the Westerdam. I think because we were in suite, it didn't matter, we got our 8pm dinning anyway. Our cruise had a very large group on board too and like it has been said, they trend to take over the ship.

Danny

[Lizzie68]

HAL claims to have "learned a lot" about having big groups onboard and have "improved" and limited the impact that these groups have on other passengers. But' date=' since they're not making good on their promises before I'm even onboard, I have doubts as to their sincerity and commitment to what they have learned. My agent is furious and even more so by the lying in the notification. He is willing and able to fight with HAL to make it right on my behalf as well as the 6 other staterooms the agency has booked on this cruise.

 

I would never have booked a cruise with a group - I'm pretty savvy. The only reason this happened is that my sister is having some bone graft surgery and can't accompany me, so I decided to change the trip right at final booking. I tried to get on a Princess sailing the same day, but the last room booked while I was waiting on my agent. I am so ticked about not being on the Princess cruise at this point. I was looking forward to the suite and trying HAL, but now I am totally ticked and I'm not even onboard yet. I will not be doing the Norwegian fjords trip with them that I was contemplating for August no way.

 

I think HAL's role in the Carnival brand portfolio is partially to provide an attractive offering for large groups. HAL has TONS of these types of sailings, even in high season. Princess has very few. It's clearly one of the only ways HAL can fill their ships.[/quote']

 

It's not going to help you much at this point, but perhaps you should fire off an email to OfficeofthePresident@hollandamerica.com Yes, I know he on the Amsterdam right now, but his emails are being read and responded to. You and every other independent sailing with you should be compensated in some way. The crux lies in the fact that you were not informed until way after final payment so you have no option to switch.

[NCLbigfan]

The wife and I are on this sailing but I'm probably not understanding this so maybe someone can clarify. We have as you wish dining but never received an email on this. Is this just for the people who have late seating after 8pm?

[RuthC]

The wife and I are on this sailing but I'm probably not understanding this so maybe someone can clarify. We have as you wish dining but never received an email on this. Is this just for the people who have late seating after 8pm?

Everyone has "as you wish dining"---but not on this cruise. The way I read the letter, and the subsequent discussion, there is no main fixed seating, and no open seating in the dining room after 6:30.

Outrageous.

Edited February 13, 2016 by RuthC

[Jade13]

 

 

 

I'm really sorry this is being done by HAL to guests on their ships.

 

When you sail with a large group, that group Rules. Everything is provided as the group wants it and others lose use of venues and get what is left.

 

 

 

We once sailed with a very large group and to answer your question about them taking over the pool or Crows Nest, the answer is yes.

 

 

 

We were aboards 10 days and lost use of Crows Nest for just about the whole cruise. We literally were told by the group's coordinator there was a private party there every night of the cruise and we were not included. :eek:

 

 

 

We also lost use of the aft pool, on a beautiful Caribbean sea day and the group had a private pool party. We were a bit more than 'miffed' with the way we were so pushed aside.

 

 

 

Count on being denied use of one venue or another whenever it suits the large group.

 

 

 

 

 

What was the resolution?

[sail7seas]

Ahhh, yes, there was a resolution.

DH left it to me and I was rather frank about our disappointment and displeasure.

HAL made us feel as though 'we'd been heard'.

 

[TiogaCruiser]

HAL claims to have "learned a lot" about having big groups onboard and have "improved" and limited the impact that these groups have on other passengers. But' date=' since they're not making good on their promises before I'm even onboard, I have doubts as to their sincerity and commitment to what they have learned.....[/quote']

 

This is horrible.

 

It really sounds like HAL has learned to tell people about it now before they board, but AFTER final payment. That is no help nor relief for those who are stuck with the "seconds".

[joepeka]

HAL claims to have "learned a lot" about having big groups onboard and have "improved" and limited the impact that these groups have on other passengers. But' date=' since they're not making good on their promises before I'm even onboard, I have doubts as to their sincerity and commitment to what they have learned. My agent is furious and even more so by the lying in the notification. He is willing and able to fight with HAL to make it right on my behalf as well as the 6 other staterooms the agency has booked on this cruise.

[/quote']

Chris, I can only sympathize with you on this and thank you for raising this here on CC. While I realize that similar situations happen on other cruise lines, it would appear that HAL is more willing bow to the groups at the expense of other guests who have paid for full access to all the ship venues only to be ultimately denied access, with little or no notice. We have not sailed on HAL in quite a while but believe me, we will be watchful for any large groups advertising for our sailing in 2017 and will also think twice before booking HAL in the future. :mad:

[TiogaCruiser]

I would be very tempted to order room service and then port it to the Lido.

[Texasgirl52]

He didn't specify. He just said they told him I was welcome to dine 5:45-9:00. I think they say that and when you get on board and ask for a later time you find out that time isn't available. How many people are in this group?

[Danish]

I prefer late dinning. Then cruising in the Med it would 9:00 or later.

 

I just noticed that my cruise papers now says early dining. I think 5 or 6 is way to early - would not have left the pool deck yet.

 

I hope, that it will be possible to get later reservation once onboard - else it might be buffet or specialization restaurants ::confused: not really what I want....

 

Well - let us hope the best :):)

[Tarpeian Rock]

Were we thus affected by a large group,with the loss of services and access described here, it would be awfully tempting to have Jim Walker on speed dial. However tightly written the Cruise Contract might be, it would seem that a pattern of "bait and switch" could be established.

[sail7seas]

Where are all the make lemonade people?

 

So many times we get that 'suggestion' when someone has a complaint or disappointment about a cruise.

 

No more lemonade?

 

[barb-ottawa]

Is there somewhere on the HAL website that one can look to see if there is a large group booked on your sailing? It's too late for me to change anything for my March 20th cruise, but I would like to be prepared.

[Cruising-along]

Where are all the make lemonade people?

 

So many times we get that 'suggestion' when someone has a complaint or disappointment about a cruise.

 

No more lemonade?

 

 

I'm usually a half-full kind of person, but I think this thread hit a nerve for all of us. If it was just one part of my cruise that was affected (such as dining time, show times, lounge access) that would be bad enough. But all of that and more.....too much. :(

[Old As Dirt Mom]

Is there somewhere on the HAL website that one can look to see if there is a large group booked on your sailing? It's too late for me to change anything for my March 20th cruise, but I would like to be prepared.

 

No, HAL doesn't want us to know. CJcruzer (Carol) compiles a list of all the HAL dry docks, charters, and groups. Here's a link to her Feb 2016 update:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2309427

 

Before I book a cruise, I do an internet search to see if my cruise experience will be compromised by a group on board. I type in the cruise ship, destination, and date of departure. Even that is not 100% effective.

 

I don't worry about groups like "Road Scholars" or "Anesthesia Seminars", or any type of medical seminar, nor do I worry about "knitting groups". Their numbers are small, in my experience.

Edited February 13, 2016 by middle-aged mom