Celebrity: 2006 vs. 2016

[phoenix_dream]

:cool:

Will only address the maintaining of the ships. The M class ships are great. Keeping up a ship is absolutely needed otherwise Celebrity would not longer have people booking. Things almost always work well and if anything breaks it is repaired as fast as humanly possible.

 

Celebrity has made cuts in order to keep the cabin price low, but has not sacrificed on spending $$ for compfort and safety.

 

No offense meant, but in what fantasy land is the cabin price low??? Certainly not on the sailings I've considered/booked! Yes, you can compare prices from many years ago and from that perspective, there has not been a huge change in prices. But consider that the ships and companies were much smaller then and did not have the advantage of the bulk pricing they can take advantage of now. Also, larger ships reduce their cost per passenger ratio quite a bit as well. For example, common areas for a ship with twice as many passengers do not need to be twice as large - perhaps 1/3 as large. Most common areas were never at full capacity anyway; now they tend to be wall to wall people on many cruises. I am sure there are many other economy of scale savings as well.

 

But compare prices these days to prices just five years ago. Or even two or three years ago for that matter. A base cabin price (again, on sailings I view, mostly Caribbean, US west coast, or Alaska) for a veranda or concierge as compared to two years ago is running sometimes double (yes, double), and virtually always at least $500-$600pp higher. That does NOT make up for the 'free' perks included. I drink little alcohol so that perk does not add much value for me (and I know I am not the only one). As Elite+ I already get a lot of internet and frankly don't want to spend my time on a cruise reading my emails - I could stay home if I wanted to do that. If I try to book another way (using a senior or state discount) the discount is often just $100 less off the base cabin price - netting out to a SUBSTANTIAL increase in prices. And suite prices - fuggetaboutit.

 

And yet ships are filling up. So either there are a lot of people out there much richer than I am, or people willing to take one cruise rather than the two or three per year we have been enjoying for years and hoped to continue into our upcoming retirement. Or there are many people who really believe that the 'free' perks are actually free and that they are keeping base prices down. I'd like to personally meet them as I have a few bridges to sell them:). Companies these days are not happy to settle for a good profit - they want more and more and more and more (look at what Disney just did with their park prices - yeah, they need the money:confused:)

 

For the first time in literally years, we booked an outside cabin on an upcoming cruise as everything above was just ridiculously priced. And for the first time in years, after trying a few other lines and being disappointed, we are once again considering other lines for our future cruises. It saddens me. I love Celebrity (have cruised on them since 1992 for more than 25 times) but they are pricing me out.:( But then again, I am in the retiring generation that Celebrity wants to dump anyway (even though my loyalty helped them build their company to where it is now, and for that matter I hopefully have a good 15-20 more cruising years left in me - not an inconsiderable number!)

 

I realize this is a business, and companies are in the business to make a profit so please, no lectures about that as responses. It's the continued greed of these corporations to squeeze as much out of people as possible that is getting so far out of hand. That and the naiveté of those who don't seem to recognize it for what it is that drives me nuts. I know it won't change, but I had to get that off my chest..

[benbess]

:cool:

 

No offense meant, but in what fantasy land is the cabin price low??? Certainly not on the sailings I've considered/booked! Yes, you can compare prices from many years ago and from that perspective, there has not been a huge change in prices. But consider that the ships and companies were much smaller then and did not have the advantage of the bulk pricing they can take advantage of now. Also, larger ships reduce their cost per passenger ratio quite a bit as well. For example, common areas for a ship with twice as many passengers do not need to be twice as large - perhaps 1/3 as large. Most common areas were never at full capacity anyway; now they tend to be wall to wall people on many cruises. I am sure there are many other economy of scale savings as well.

 

But compare prices these days to prices just five years ago. Or even two or three years ago for that matter. A base cabin price (again, on sailings I view, mostly Caribbean, US west coast, or Alaska) for a veranda or concierge as compared to two years ago is running sometimes double (yes, double), and virtually always at least $500-$600pp higher. That does NOT make up for the 'free' perks included. I drink little alcohol so that perk does not add much value for me (and I know I am not the only one). As Elite+ I already get a lot of internet and frankly don't want to spend my time on a cruise reading my emails - I could stay home if I wanted to do that. If I try to book another way (using a senior or state discount) the discount is often just $100 less off the base cabin price - netting out to a SUBSTANTIAL increase in prices. And suite prices - fuggetaboutit.

 

And yet ships are filling up. So either there are a lot of people out there much richer than I am, or people willing to take one cruise rather than the two or three per year we have been enjoying for years and hoped to continue into our upcoming retirement. Or there are many people who really believe that the 'free' perks are actually free and that they are keeping base prices down. I'd like to personally meet them as I have a few bridges to sell them:). Companies these days are not happy to settle for a good profit - they want more and more and more and more (look at what Disney just did with their park prices - yeah, they need the money:confused:)

 

For the first time in literally years, we booked an outside cabin on an upcoming cruise as everything above was just ridiculously priced. And for the first time in years, after trying a few other lines and being disappointed, we are once again considering other lines for our future cruises. It saddens me. I love Celebrity (have cruised on them since 1992 for more than 25 times) but they are pricing me out.:( But then again, I am in the retiring generation that Celebrity wants to dump anyway (even though my loyalty helped them build their company to where it is now, and for that matter I hopefully have a good 15-20 more cruising years left in me - not an inconsiderable number!)

 

I realize this is a business, and companies are in the business to make a profit so please, no lectures about that as responses. It's the continued greed of these corporations to squeeze as much out of people as possible that is getting so far out of hand. That and the naiveté of those who don't seem to recognize it for what it is that drives me nuts. I know it won't change, but I had to get that off my chest..

 

Wow. Quite a post. You make some very good points that come from experience. And you've clearly been very loyal to Celebrity over the years.

 

Have you considered a transatlantic? Those Celebrity cruises seem to be real bargains....

[benbess]

What are the nicknames for the various Celebrity ships? I know a few, but probably there are others.

 

Millennium="Millie"

Constellation="Connie"

Infinity=?

Summit=?

 

Silhouette="Big Silly" according to one CC member.

Solstice=?

Eclipse=?

Equinox=?

Reflection=?

[benbess]

Actually Horizon was their first new build. Meridien was Celebrity's first ship.

 

I'd forgotten about Meridian, which was a tiny ship by today's standards. Sold off in the late 1990s, it seems she had a bad accident after that.....A few fondly remembered her on this thread from 8 years ago:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=821621

[ptrpanpens]

Well stated... unfortunately, this simple but amazing fact is not recognized by a great many people. :cool:

 

 

 

 

Awesome post! Agree completely on almost all points. :)

 

I am as "value driven" as anyone can be, and for the last 5+ years I have ALWAYS been able to find incredible deals on Celebrity. Not everyone may enjoy repeated transatlantic cruises, but they are the very best vacation value I have found! (especially on Celebrity!!)

 

The best example right now is the 14 night Equinox T/A in a balcony for $679pp! :eek: :D ;)

 

And if anyone is willing to take a risk, the October 12 night Holy Land from Istanbul is priced at $799 pp OV and as low as $1,449 aqua, for resident rates. Yes, I am aware that Israel was cancelled at the last minute last year, but at those rates it is worth taking a chance. This itinerary was so outstanding in 2014 and we DID get to all ports, so hopefully we will make it again this year. Last time I checked, the 11 night cruise prior was also an outstanding value.

 

So there are deals other than transatlantic and you dont have to necessarily wait until after final payment to snag one!:D

[benbess]

And if anyone is willing to take a risk, the October 12 night Holy Land from Istanbul is priced at $799 pp OV and as low as $1,449 aqua, for resident rates. Yes, I am aware that Israel was cancelled at the last minute last year, but at those rates it is worth taking a chance. This itinerary was so outstanding in 2014 and we DID get to all ports, so hopefully we will make it again this year. Last time I checked, the 11 night cruise prior was also an outstanding value.

 

So there are deals other than transatlantic and you dont have to necessarily wait until after final payment to snag one!:D

 

That does sound like a great cruise at a great price. Wish I could take it!

[benbess]

Reading through a few of the recent passenger reviews on Cruise Critic for the M-class ships, I notice that the reviews for the Summit seem to be better than for her sister ships. It could just be chance, but I wonder if the Summit's Captain, Kate McCue, runs an especially good ship? Anyway, it is interesting that on some of the other M-class ships there are complains about service, and even maintenance issues, while Summit seems to get pretty consistently good reviews over the last few months.

 

Here's are a couple of articles about Captain Kate McCue:

 

http://www.wsj.com/articles/what-captain-kate-carries-onboard-1441143004

 

http://www.examiner.com/article/newly-refreshed-celebrity-summit-to-cruise-spring-and-fall-from-ny-metro-area

Edited February 28, 2016 by benbess

[dkjretired]

I'd forgotten about Meridian, which was a tiny ship by today's standards. Sold off in the late 1990s, it seems she had a bad accident after that.....A few fondly remembered her on this thread from 8 years ago:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=821621

 

Everything is relative, when Century came out there were people on this board who swore they would never sail on such a big ship.

[El Crucero]

I'm usually a happy camper most of the time and see the glass as half full.

 

On a 2016 Celebrity cruise you will find your glass 99% full!

[benbess]

Everything is relative, when Century came out there were people on this board who swore they would never sail on such a big ship.

 

Indeed. When we cruised on Infinity in 2006 I was stunned by how gigantic (and yet elegant) she was. Just stunned. Couldn't quite believe my eyes. But I was just reading recent reviews of Infinity, and a few said things like "nice for a small ship" or even "I don't like being on ships that are so small"! Infinity is almost a thousand feet long and has twice the tonnage of the Titanic....

 

It's interesting that the new Edge-class ships are going to be c. 117,000 tons, compared to c. 90,000 for M-class and c. 122,000 for the S-class ships. And so they aren't going larger for the next generation, but instead slightly smaller.

 

My guess is that the M-class ships will be slowly phased out as the E-class is introduced. It seems like RCL doesn't keep any ships more than about 20-years or so, as far as I can tell. My guess is that there will be a bit of an overlap for a few years, just as there was with the Century-class. The first E-class is scheduled to take its first cruise in late 2018, and second one in 2020, and the third one maybe in 2021. Probably they'll order a 4th one as well for c. 2022?

 

That might mean that the Millennium will be kept through 2020 or so, for her 20th anniversary, and perhaps some special farewell cruises, but then....?

Edited February 28, 2016 by benbess

[Quo Vadis?]

 

No offense meant, but in what fantasy land is the cabin price low??? Certainly not on the sailings I've considered/booked!

 

Itineraries that have a high risk of being cancelled and those with no obc have great prices but the desirable routes are way beyond basic prices over the last few years. We too are looking elsewhere for itineraries and better pricing.

[El Crucero]

but the desirable routes are way beyond basic prices over the last few years.

 

Supply and demand?

[benbess]

Itineraries that have a high risk of being cancelled and those with no obc have great prices but the desirable routes are way beyond basic prices over the last few years. We too are looking elsewhere for itineraries and better pricing.

 

And, if I may ask, from your Latin name (more or less) "where are you going?" Are the prices at Princess or Holland America on average better for such cruises?

[neverbeenhere]

What are the nicknames for the various Celebrity ships? I know a few, but probably there are others.

 

Millennium="Millie"

Constellation="Connie"

Infinity=?

Summit=?

 

Silhouette="Big Silly" according to one CC member.

Solstice=?

Eclipse=?

Equinox=?

Reflection=?

 

 

All Celebrity branded cruise ships are to be referred to by its proper name. The Celebrity Millennium, Celebrity Constellation... It would be inconsiderate and unconscionable to do otherwise. ;)

[Quo Vadis?]

And, if I may ask, from your Latin name (more or less) "where are you going?" Are the prices at Princess or Holland America on average better for such cruises?

 

The itineraries are much more desirable and going to Australia/NZ for example is possible at a much lower cost.

[teecee60]

All Celebrity branded cruise ships are to be referred to by its proper name. It would be inconsiderate and unconscionable to do otherwise. ;)

 

Wow! I didn't know that! :o

 

Especially considering that I just got off the Connie for the second time. It was really great, but not quite as nice as my three recent trips on the Silly, or two other trips on the Flex. :eek: :D ;)

[benbess]

Wow! I didn't know that! :o

 

Especially considering that I just got off the Connie for the second time. It was really great, but not quite as nice as my three recent trips on the Silly, or two other trips on the Flex. :eek: :D ;)

 

Reflection="Flex"

 

Thanks!

 

(Equinox="Eek"?? No, that's not right.:D)

[neverbeenhere]

Celebrity Infinity = Baby

Celebrity Equinox = Goldy

Celebrity Summit = Summy (not much of an abbreviation)

Celebrity Solstice = Soul man

Celebrity Eclipse = Clipper Ship 2010

 

 

Made them up on the fly... obviously.

[Ma Bell]

I took my first cruise in 1974 and have been on many since then. There are so many comparisons that could be made but there really isn't any point to it. Those days are gone. I'm just so happy that I was there for the golden days of cruising and that I can still appreciate the way things are today.

 

There's an old saying that what you don't know won't hurt you and I think that's very true but I also think that those of us that were there can't help but feel just a bit of nostalgia for what it once was.

[dkjretired]

Celebrity Infinity = Baby

Celebrity Equinox = Goldy

Celebrity Summit = Summy (not much of an abbreviation)

Celebrity Solstice = Soul man

Celebrity Eclipse = Clipper Ship 2010

 

 

Made them up on the fly... obviously.

 

Agree completely

[Sabbycat]

I have to disagree with those that comment that the price of a stateroom has increased. The price of our 14 night med cruise in 2007 or 8 cruise (in a simply balcony stateroom) was over $8000 Canadian dollars! We have never paid that much for any of our subsequent X cruises (all CC or AQ class)! Base cruise prices have only dropped over the last 10 years.

 

With that said, what is included in the base price, as well as service have decreased. Alas, this is to be expected, but I wish they would stop shelling their base product. I miss the enhanced service and other things that made X unique.

Edited February 29, 2016 by Sabbycat

[TravelerThom]

I'd forgotten that Celebrity sold five ships in just a few years...

Sold is not quite the correct word for most of those. Celebrity is wholly owned by Royal Caribbean Cruises Ltd (RCCL). Horizon and Zenith are at Croisieres de France (CDF) also wholly owned by RCCL. Galaxy and Mercury are at TUI Cruises which is a Joint Venture between RCCL and TUI AG - I think (not positive) that RCCL still owns the physical ships. I have seen those four ships within the last two years. Century has gone to Ctrip; I don't think RCCL has any ownership there but again I am not positive.

 

I have fond memories of sailing on all five of those ships as well as the M-class (as recently as last month on Connie) and S-class, but as far as I have seen my favorite Celebrity ship has not been mentioned at all in this thread: the Celebrity Xpedition:)

 

Thom

[benbess]

Sold is not quite the correct word for most of those. Celebrity is wholly owned by Royal Caribbean Cruises Ltd (RCCL). Horizon and Zenith are at Croisieres de France (CDF) also wholly owned by RCCL. Galaxy and Mercury are at TUI Cruises which is a Joint Venture between RCCL and TUI AG - I think (not positive) that RCCL still owns the physical ships. I have seen those four ships within the last two years. Century has gone to Ctrip; I don't think RCCL has any ownership there but again I am not positive.

 

I have fond memories of sailing on all five of those ships as well as the M-class (as recently as last month on Connie) and S-class, but as far as I have seen my favorite Celebrity ship has not been mentioned at all in this thread: the Celebrity Xpedition:)

 

Thom

 

It's fascinating (as Mr. Spock might say) that they haven't really sold most of them, but just keep them for their "lower level" cruise lines. Very interesting.

 

My guess is that this is what's going to happen to the M-class ships in c. 4-6 years.

[benbess]

Take a look at this post from the thread on the new Summit dry dock from a long-time Celebrity passenger :

 

 

"Blue Ribbon Cruiser

 

Join Date: Jul 2004

Posts: 3,213

 

cabin needs more than new linens

 

Recently completed my 5th cruise on the Summit since the previous drydock. The cabins seem to be the place that gets passed by. On my most recent cruise in Jan. 2016, my cabin looked shabby. There was a large hole in the carpeting, stains on carpeting and some bedding, sagging beds, sofa had worn spots, bathroom sink had lots of dings, tile was chipped, latch on sliding glass door didn't latch, peep hole had lost its cover, rack in the closet to hold belts/ties was broken off, and furniture had worn spots. It was clean and the essentials worked. AC, TV, lights, and toilet were all working well. When I heard about the upcoming drydock, I hoped that the cabins would be renovated. They really need a face lift. I am sorry to hear that the indoor pool is going to be renovating. I loved it as it was. I also liked the chairs in the indoor spa pool area. They had soft pads. The outdoor chaises are like sitting on a brick. The proposed changes are set and I am sure they will look nice. I hope that some changes are made in the cabins. I will be on the Summit again in May."

 

 

 

Hmmm. Probably most cabins aren't in such rough shape. But this raises some questions. When I was on Infinity in 2006 it seemed like everything was being kept ship shape and repaired or replaced. But this sounds like they have really let things slide in some cabins. Is this typical? Anyway, that is perhaps a change from 10 years ago. But maybe it's also just part of the nature of the life-cycle of the ship?

 

I looked up parent company RCL's profits, and they seem to be doing very well, making hundreds of millions of dollars of profit a year. But one way they are doing it seems penny-wise and pound foolish. I've read a few reviews that sound like this one, but unlike this forgiving passenger a few are saying they are moving on to other lines....Yikes.

 

But I'm hoping that conditions like this are the exception rather than the rule. And here's hoping the dry dock this month fixes most of these issues....

Edited February 29, 2016 by benbess

[The_Big_M]

Sold is not quite the correct word for most of those. Celebrity is wholly owned by Royal Caribbean Cruises Ltd (RCCL). Horizon and Zenith are at Croisieres de France (CDF) also wholly owned by RCCL. Galaxy and Mercury are at TUI Cruises which is a Joint Venture between RCCL and TUI AG - I think (not positive) that RCCL still owns the physical ships. I have seen those four ships within the last two years. Century has gone to Ctrip; I don't think RCCL has any ownership there but again I am not positive.

 

Actually, Century was the first ship in a joint venture with Ctrip and the Chinese operator. They're trying a few angles to access the Chinese market, and that's one of them.

 

So like the others, still 'in the family.'