Rhine water levels 2018 and similar topics

[sjde]

We found it interesting that German employees seemed to congregate at the gluwein stands after work as a happy hour.  Very festive . 

[sjde]

Does Belgium have Christmas markets? 
It’s not just Germany- I believe Basel and Strasbourg do as well? 

Speaking to Netherlands being agnostic and therefore not having Christmas markets, I can’t say as I remember the German ones being particularly religious on our Rhine and Danube Christmas Market cruises. More secular goods for sale.  

[notamermaid]

The situation on the Rhine is more or less unchanged since yesterday. The current river levels: Maxau 319cm, Kaub 29cm, Koblenz 32cm. For the next three days virtually no change is forecast or anticipated for Kaub. Maxau, after the rain that we are supposed to be getting in the next five days shows a rise but I do not expect enough to get to Kaub to make the situation substantially better soon. By Friday we will know a bit more how Kaub could fare next week. To be honest, I do not expect much, but I am happy to be mistaken in this case.

 

Onto the weather forecast. "Rain is coming", is correct. Today there is not much to speak of yet, tomorrow and Thursday the map frustratingly leaves out where we actually want the rain. Friday will cover the area with a fair amount in many parts, whereas Saturday will leave most of them out again. However, by then some rain has drained into the river from the hills. It is a start. Sunday will finally bring some decent amounts with Sunday containing the promise of even more. Do not expect rain by the bucketload. But the amount at least gives us hope for better sailing in the following week. And nature will appreciate the rain, too.

 

The problems of chemical giant BASF have reached the regional publications in the US: https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/business/article222184215.html

 

And this is an article by a business paper in Germany: https://global.handelsblatt.com/companies/rhine-drought-germany-shipping-transport-983991

 

And now, shopping! At least I can walk to the (some) shops to safe fuel.

 

notamermaid

 

[pully8]

1 hour ago, peasmith said:

Yes let's hope so AUFan83 - we have the Silver Spirits Drinks Package so who cares what the week may bring!

 

We have done many with Viking at this time of year (November/December including Christmas) and have never had any problem over the past few years with water levels but was bound to happen sooner or later and will put it all down to a new experience! 

 

With a cruise you expect to unpack just the once and not twice during the holiday - when we dock in Basel we will be returning to Heathrow for a couple of nights then joining the Viking Sky on the 23rd December (without returning home in between) so I think it may mean a trip to the launderette on the Sky for a washing and ironing session! 

 

I rang Viking yesterday and they said that a ship swap is likely but so far we are still booked on the Mani but as far as I can see the Mani hasn't moved far since the 9th November!  The lady I spoke to said that they had an update on the situation yesterday morning and that snowfall and rainfall were likely - I think the snowfall is nearer Vienna than Germany at the moment though as I can't find any mention of snowfall for the places we are visiting.

 

 

 

 

When get the same rain is forecast...as if a bit of rain will fix this? it will eventually next year with any luck.  

[notamermaid]

9 minutes ago, sjde said:

We found it interesting that German employees seemed to congregate at the gluwein stands after work as a happy hour.  Very festive . 

Happy hour indeed. It is a tradition that brings employees closer in an often stressful time of year. Have done it myself several times. It is great.

 

9 minutes ago, sjde said:

Does Belgium have Christmas markets? 
It’s not just Germany- I believe Basel and Strasbourg do as well? 

Speaking to Netherlands being agnostic and therefore not having Christmas markets, I can’t say as I remember the German ones being particularly religious on our Rhine and Danube Christmas Market cruises. More secular goods for sale.  

Brussels has a fabulous Christmas market. And great atmosphere. It is just that the food is a little different and they speak French (mostly) of course. Just a different feel to it, but still great.

 

Time to post some recommendations from others. What does the British "Standard" think for example? https://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/travel/best-christmas-markets-in-europe-2018-a3981051.html

 

G.M.T. recommends the one in Birmingham and I recommend the one in Metz (France).

 

notamermaid

 

[Merc85]

We are on the Nov. 26 AmaKristina from Amsterdam to Basel.  Ama did send an email to us a couple weeks ago warning about the impact low Rhine water levels could have on the cruise giving two possible changes.  Unfortunately the worst of the two has occurred with the Kristina group (ours) having four days in the North, one day on the bus from Antwerp to Strasbourg via Luxembourg, and two days in the South after transferring to the Stella. 

It sure isn't turning out to be a Christmas market cruise,  but Ama has no control over the water levels.  At least we will see a Christmas market in Luxembourg as we move South and will get a full day in Strasbourg which is very nice. 

I just wish we had one more day in the South and one less in the North like the Stella group is getting so we could see another day of Christmas markets in that part of the Rhine.  So in that regard the Stella's new itinerary in better since we have seen the Amsterdam/Rotterdam/Antwerp areas before and really took this itinerary for the Christmas markets.

Ama is treating us very well and the water levels aren't under their control, it's just sad we only get two days in the Southern area before disembarking in Basel.

[disnefile]

Any compensation from Ama. They should refund at least half the cruise price. This is not even close to a decent cruise it itinerary. No christmas markets except Strassberg. Benelux is dull dreary and boring

[G.M.T.]

2 hours ago, peasmith said:

Thank you G.M.T. - we did consider a trip there a couple of years but decided to do another Viking trip.  I think travelling to Germany for us is easier than getting to Birmingham and I like to get out of this country! lol! May be one year when we have stopped travelling abroad we will make a visit. 

 

 

Ah, your own Brexit so to speak.

Have a great time.

[G.M.T.]

1 hour ago, sjde said:

Does Belgium have Christmas markets? 
It’s not just Germany- I believe Basel and Strasbourg do as well? 

Speaking to Netherlands being agnostic and therefore not having Christmas markets, I can’t say as I remember the German ones being particularly religious on our Rhine and Danube Christmas Market cruises. More secular goods for sale.  

Boy, thats even louder than dear MiL.

[hbr777]

42 minutes ago, disnefile said:

Any compensation from Ama. They should refund at least half the cruise price. This is not even close to a decent cruise it itinerary. No christmas markets except Strassberg. Benelux is dull dreary and boring

I agree. But the compensation should be higher.

[Mark_T]

5 hours ago, pully8 said:

Thank you so much for the details about the ship swap and day river excursions.

With the train transfer to Budapest would imagine hand luggage would be with you on board, not sure about the space available on board? We try to minimise our luggage especially if packing and unpacking but some things are essential. 

 

On the train they were able to store everyone's carry-on and heavy coats in a luggage compartment at one end of the carriage. They were returned to people as they left the train. Given the spacing between tables in the carriage it was a good idea to make use of that facility. 

[Merc85]

2 hours ago, disnefile said:

Any compensation from Ama. They should refund at least half the cruise price. This is not even close to a decent cruise it itinerary. No christmas markets except Strassberg. Benelux is dull dreary and boring

The letter we received upon boarding said compensation will be determined and sent to us in a letter/email after the cruise in order that the final itinerary/impact is determined.  So it is yet to be seen what will be done.  While I agree the new itinerary is not anything like we paid for or expected, the water levels are clearly outside of cruise lines' control.  We'll see what Ama thinks is fair in a week or two I would guess.

[ural guy]

Here is some great Gluhwein from 't Galgenhuis, on the Groetenmarkt Square in Ghent.  I've never had it that 'fancy' before, where you could add your own cinnamon stick or cloves.  After I finished my blond beer, I switched to Gluhwein with my daughters.  We got super lucky, and rented an apartment overlooking the square for 2 nights post-cruise.

 

For the record, Bruge, Ypres and Ghent all have Christmas markets, they were all being set up when we visited.  Really enjoyed Belgium.

[luv2travelandcruise]

16 hours ago, sjde said:

Well said   sky blue waters. Many Christmas markets sell just about the same items , so seeing 3 maybe rather than 6 isn’t a big loss in my opinion. These Christmas Markets cruises start around Thanksgiving and if you are on one of the early ones you do miss some anyway as there are some that don't open until  Dec 1.

 

The Christmas Markets are about buying some gifts but mostly about the atmosphere and specialty foods, watching the joy on children's faces...  

 

I am on the AmaStella that left Basel yesterday. We had hours to go to the markets in the pedestrian area although not every stall was open but so many were. Such a great feeling for my first Christmas Market. Today we went to Riquewihr  (one of two options) and did some shops and wine caves, cafes. They're just gearing up for the market but it was a fun way to spend a drizzly day. Tomorrow we have 4 options and the next day Ama has arranged for a full day in Strasbourg. There are 4 markets there and it is a great place to get into the Christmas mood. 

 

I know we are missing the beautiful part of the Rhine and some awesome markets. I will just have to come back. I wish things were different but what can you do? I feel we will be compensated by the cruise line. Our ship is awesome and so is everyone on the crew. I LOVE AmaWaterways so far... BUT that doesn't mean that they will not be hearing from me regarding the total lack of communication. Yes, the situation is ever changing, day to day... but they could have just made us feel better knowing what was going on and an email from them would be sooooo easy. I feel for the company and the fires but it is no excuse for no communication.

 

 

[disnefile]

No excuse at all.

[odie714]

15 hours ago, pvalent58 said:

Deb, we’re on scenic opal 12/5, I suspect the same cruise.  The only communication I’ve received from Scenic has been this.  

 

 

“Thank you for making Scenic part of your upcoming travel plans.

Currently in Central Europe, the Rhine and Danube rivers have experienced localised instances of low water levels. Low water can give rise to navigational restrictions, which may force us to make adjustments to your itinerary at short notice.

As these restrictions occur, we respond to each event based on the situation at hand, always remaining focused on delivering your itinerary.

If we are required to make any adjustments we will communicate this to our guests as specific detailed information becomes available, both prior to, and during the cruise.

We look forward to welcoming guests to Europe.

Kind regards

Scenic Europe Operations Team”

 

As far as dress is concerned, I’m not bringing a jacket or tie and my impression is that the Aussies like to keep it casual.   

 

This Scenic Facebook group is informative.  You might consider joining. 

 

https://www.*****/246898725642004/

 

regards, 

Pete

Pete,

 

Thank you for the reply.  I'll look at the FB page.  Also, we received an email from Scenic today, it went to our spam folder. Please check yours if you have not received an update.

 

Deb

[notamermaid]

While it is not possible to get through the gorge on a 135m ship, it is possible to enter it. Up to Boppard and a little beyond. Who has done it today? The Robert Burns!

 

This is the data:

 

You can see two blue lines, one is going upstream, one going downstream. A little after Kestert her signal shows her turning round. She returned to Koblenz and is now sailing on the Moselle. For the record, this is the gauge for Sankt Goar, nearby where she turned:

 

notamermaid

 

[Jimmy_Buffett]

23 hours ago, notamermaid said:

Lunch on the excursion boat. That is a nice idea to bridge that gap of river and time. I doubt it will be sumptuous, probably more typical German fare. Enjoyable nevertheless with all the castles adorning the landscape outside your window.

 

Have a great day and a smooth swap.

 

notamermaid

 

It was a fine meal aboard the Rhine Star, salad, chicken breat and fries, lemon pie,all the beer or wine and wine and Gluvine,warm inside,too warm maybe heated boat, 2 or 3 hour cruise. Viking did a great job today.

[paia40]

27NOV2018

We received email from viking todayabout our upcoming cruise on VIKING TIALFI 12-15-2018

 

Dear Viking Guest,

Thank you for choosing Viking for your upcoming European voyage. This message is to advise you regarding low water levels on the Rhine River that will likely impact your itinerary.

As this summer has been unusually dry, many European rivers have reached historically low levels. Unlike ocean sailing, as little as an inch or two determines whether navigation is possible, and river levels have been changing quickly throughout the season. Our nautical team continues to monitor the river levels closely to determine if and how your cruise may be affected.

At this time, we expect to enact what we call a mid-cruise "ship swap" part way through your itinerary to bypass the affected area. Because Viking operates identical ships traveling in opposite directions along the river, we are able to transfer you by motorcoach from your ship to an identical sister ship further along the river. There, you can resume your itinerary with minimal impact.

If water levels remain low, we may also need to dock in alternate locations where our regular docking locations are adversely affected by the conditions to ensure you are able to see the sights you came to see.

While we strive to give you as much information regarding how your cruise may be impacted ahead of time, river conditions today may be very different than on the day you pass through the affected area. This means we cannot confirm exact details until closer to departure, or even possibly after.

Rest assured, we have considerable experience in navigating situations like this and we are confident you will enjoy your journey with us, despite the low water conditions.

Should you have any questions regarding your cruise before your departure, please contact Customer Relations at customerrelations@vikingcruises.com

We look forward to welcoming you on board and wish you a wonderful journey.

Sincerely,

Viking

 

We have been following the viking posts and appears there is a boat swap in cologne, with a bus ride to Marksburg castle and day cruise of the castles on the rhine, missing koblenz from rudesheim ,returning to another viking ship .

We purchased cancel any reason insurance from our TA, If this is the only modification to our cruise we will not cancel. Looking forward to our journey..

Alan & Kathryn

[AUFan83]

10 minutes ago, paia40 said:

27NOV2018

We received email from viking todayabout our upcoming cruise on VIKING TIALFI 12-15-2018

 

Dear Viking Guest,

Thank you for choosing Viking for your upcoming European voyage. This message is to advise you regarding low water levels on the Rhine River that will likely impact your itinerary.

As this summer has been unusually dry, many European rivers have reached historically low levels. Unlike ocean sailing, as little as an inch or two determines whether navigation is possible, and river levels have been changing quickly throughout the season. Our nautical team continues to monitor the river levels closely to determine if and how your cruise may be affected.

At this time, we expect to enact what we call a mid-cruise "ship swap" part way through your itinerary to bypass the affected area. Because Viking operates identical ships traveling in opposite directions along the river, we are able to transfer you by motorcoach from your ship to an identical sister ship further along the river. There, you can resume your itinerary with minimal impact.

If water levels remain low, we may also need to dock in alternate locations where our regular docking locations are adversely affected by the conditions to ensure you are able to see the sights you came to see.

While we strive to give you as much information regarding how your cruise may be impacted ahead of time, river conditions today may be very different than on the day you pass through the affected area. This means we cannot confirm exact details until closer to departure, or even possibly after.

Rest assured, we have considerable experience in navigating situations like this and we are confident you will enjoy your journey with us, despite the low water conditions.

Should you have any questions regarding your cruise before your departure, please contact Customer Relations at customerrelations@vikingcruises.com

We look forward to welcoming you on board and wish you a wonderful journey.

Sincerely,

Viking

 

We have been following the viking posts and appears there is a boat swap in cologne, with a bus ride to Marksburg castle and day cruise of the castles on the rhine, missing koblenz from rudesheim ,returning to another viking ship .

We purchased cancel any reason insurance from our TA, If this is the only modification to our cruise we will not cancel. Looking forward to our journey..

Alan & Kathryn

 

We received the same email and we are good with this modification also. 

[masonpips]

9 minutes ago, paia40 said:

 We have been following the viking posts and appears there is a boat swap in cologne, with a bus ride to Marksburg castle and day cruise of the castles on the rhine, missing koblenz from rudesheim ,returning to another viking ship .

We purchased cancel any reason insurance from our TA, If this is the only modification to our cruise we will not cancel. Looking forward to our journey..

Alan & Kathryn

I’m impressed with their communication!  Still waiting to hear on Antoinette for next Wed (12/5). Since they do not have another ship south by Basel and she is currently sitting in Cologne empty of people, I’m expecting a cancel. I just hope we hear on Wed/Thurs this week so we can enact Part B.  The not knowing is the hard part.  We don’t leave til Sunday so having a few extra days to confirm our Plan B will go a long way towards helping 

 

I just don’t think they can get her down to Basel and I don’t think they’ll bus us up there and just cruise around there. 

[pully8]

9 hours ago, Mark_T said:

 

On the train they were able to store everyone's carry-on and heavy coats in a luggage compartment at one end of the carriage. They were returned to people as they left the train. Given the spacing between tables in the carriage it was a good idea to make use of that facility. 

Thank you for that information. Yes we have seen footage of the train and wondered how the luggage would be managed. Originally it was a day trip to Salzburg meaning no one would be taking hand luggage.

Meanwhile we wait for confirmation nothing yet apart from we will let you or your TA know and rain is forecast. Wonder how the current cruise is going? 

[bubbulz]

1 hour ago, masonpips said:

I’m impressed with their communication!  Still waiting to hear on Antoinette for next Wed (12/5). Since they do not have another ship south by Basel and she is currently sitting in Cologne empty of people, I’m expecting a cancel. I just hope we hear on Wed/Thurs this week so we can enact Part B.  The not knowing is the hard part.  We don’t leave til Sunday so having a few extra days to confirm our Plan B will go a long way towards helping 

 

I just don’t think they can get her down to Basel and I don’t think they’ll bus us up there and just cruise around there. 

 

My cruise on the Danube is 12/2 and Uniworld just made the operational decision finally today that they would not be starting in Budapest, but in Vienna instead (as I expected). You should certainly hear in the next couple of days but you may want to try calling and see if you can cut through some of the red tape before the 'official' email is sent out regarding cancellation or deviation. I was fortunate to find someone who was able to give me an early heads up about what likely would happen, but I know they didn't make the final decision until today.

[sjde]

I still don’t understand why some 135 m ships are making it through the Rhine Gorge and not others. 

[notamermaid]

sjde,

Currently none do. I refer back to me post about the Robert Burns yesterday which both shows that she could not pass through and that she went to a very far point in the gorge in the low levels before returning to Koblenz.

Generally speaking it is a combination of slight difference in built (under water), the captain knowing the terrain and what is possible which will change with just a couple of centimetres of water and corporate saying what is logistically sensible for them.

 

Remember that a ship has a minimum draft to which added are the weight of water in the tanks, fuel and the passengers. Of those three the passengers add the least weight.

 

By, the way, Viking also enters the gorge going up to Braubach. That is as far as it makes sense for them as that is the port for the Marksburg excursion. Then the ships return to Koblenz. Last week a German ship went up to St. Goarshausen, almost as far as the Robert Burns yesterday, and then returned to Koblenz.

 

Makes me wonder even more why Ama is not even going into Germany. Yup, I am puzzled by that still, to the point of annoyance.

 

I shall cheer myself up with the though of my neighbour's cats in fluffy winter fur. They are adorable. Now I am off to do some shopping.

 

It is cold by the way but not frosty really in my part of the valley. Precipitation in the middle Rhine valley will be almost all rain, not snow.

 

notamermaid