Contact Tracing

[Therese S.]

I recently read an article online about a couple celebrating their 25th anniversary on a 5 day cruise from NY to Barbados on the Norwegian Gem.  They were fully vaccinated and pre-boarding test was negative.  They enjoyed the first 24 hrs of the cruise but were then notified that they came in contact with someone who tested positive onboard for Covid.  Even though they were fully vaxxed and not having any symptoms they were quarantined in their cabin for the remaining 4 days of the cruise.  So they essentially missed the rest of their cruise.  What a big disappointment for them.
 

We were exposed to Covid on Christmas Day by someone who previously tested negative twice in the week before Xmas but then felt sick and tested positive the day after Christmas.  We were told by Kaiser to test 3-5 days after exposure, which we did and still waiting on test results and also to quarantine as much as possible.  We’ve stayed in our home except for a quick trip to the store. We never did get any symptoms and feel fine. 
 

I’ve read Princess rules on Covid but don’t think a situation like this was covered.  With Omicron so contagious it’s very possible someone can bring it onboard even after they tested negative.  My question, with the new Medallion app, can Princess contact trace who you’ve come into contact with?  Can they make you quarantine even if you have no symptoms and miss valuable cruise days or ports?  I understand if you’re sick you definitely need to quarantine , but I would hate to be confined to my cabin just for coming into contact with someone who is now sick.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[iamaqt2]

27 minutes ago, Therese S. said:

I recently read an article online about a couple celebrating their 25th anniversary on a 5 day cruise from NY to Barbados on the Norwegian Gem.  They were fully vaccinated and pre-boarding test was negative.  They enjoyed the first 24 hrs of the cruise but were then notified that they came in contact with someone who tested positive onboard for Covid.  Even though they were fully vaxxed and not having any symptoms they were quarantined in their cabin for the remaining 4 days of the cruise.  So they essentially missed the rest of their cruise.  What a big disappointment for them.
 

We were exposed to Covid on Christmas Day by someone who previously tested negative twice in the week before Xmas but then felt sick and tested positive the day after Christmas.  We were told by Kaiser to test 3-5 days after exposure, which we did and still waiting on test results and also to quarantine as much as possible.  We’ve stayed in our home except for a quick trip to the store. We never did get any symptoms and feel fine. 
 

I’ve read Princess rules on Covid but don’t think a situation like this was covered.  With Omicron so contagious it’s very possible someone can bring it onboard even after they tested negative.  My question, with the new Medallion app, can Princess contact trace who you’ve come into contact with?  Can they make you quarantine even if you have no symptoms and miss valuable cruise days or ports?  I understand if you’re sick you definitely need to quarantine , but I would hate to be confined to my cabin just for coming into contact with someone who is now sick.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It certainly sounds like they could in their Covid cruise protocols.

[Therese S.]

33 minutes ago, iamaqt2 said:

It certainly sounds like they could in their Covid cruise protocols.

Does this mean if I’m standing in line at the international cafe to order coffee and a stranger in line in front of me ends up diagnosed with Covid, that I could be quarantined to my cabin for the incubation period even though I feel fine with no symptoms?

 

it’s this situation with crazy contagious Omicron and what happened at Christmas that concerns me the most.  All of us got tested before Christmas dinner so we could be together and obviously the test missed the one person who got sick the next day.  
 

 

 

[Buckeye10640]

I believe close contact is considered within 6 ft for 15 minutes or more (i am sure someone will correct me if i am wrong!). So theoreticlly yes if you are in a really long line for 15 minutes  behind that person you could be considered a close contact.   I have read recently that current rapid tests are not as reliable at detecting omicron in asymptomactic people. So theoretically any passenger on board who tested negative before boarding *could* be positive, especially when one considers possible exposure  when getting off the ship in ports . If choosing to cruise these days I think we have to go into it with our eyes wide open to the possibities of cancelled activities and ports, and possible exposure and quarantine. And make a choice based on personal situation and risk tolerance. There is not a right or wrong answer whether one chooses to cruise or chooses to wait it out. We got our booster and chose to cruise,  and were on Enchanted early last month for 10 days. TBH it might be a harder decision for me right now with the explosion of omicron cases,  more because of the risk of quarantine than worry about getting seriously ill. We are booked for May and I am hoping this settles down a bit by then. 

 

Just my opinion and I am well aware there are many other perspectives......

Edited January 2, 2022 by Buckeye10640

[hllwdcruiser]

@Therese S.This is a great question and tbh I didn't even think about that possibility.

We are still planning to cruise on February 28th with the full understanding that if either of us comes down with Covid we will be quarantined. However, I don't think I would be okay being quarantined with zero symptoms just because my medallion indicated I was exposed.

I'd be interested to hear if this situation has already happened to anyone. 

[Coral]

When on the Grand recently - I realized that my medallion was a perfect contact tracer.

 

Also, with omicron - they are saying "close contact" is no longer 15 minutes. One can be infected far quicker.

[Coral]

6 hours ago, Therese S. said:

t’s this situation with crazy contagious Omicron and what happened at Christmas that concerns me the most.  All of us got tested before Christmas dinner so we could be together and obviously the test missed the one person who got sick the next day.

I know people who tested 2x negative before testing positive. They are also saying home tests are less accurate with omicron.

[iamaqt2]

7 hours ago, Therese S. said:

Does this mean if I’m standing in line at the international cafe to order coffee and a stranger in line in front of me ends up diagnosed with Covid, that I could be quarantined to my cabin for the incubation period even though I feel fine with no symptoms?

 

it’s this situation with crazy contagious Omicron and what happened at Christmas that concerns me the most.  All of us got tested before Christmas dinner so we could be together and obviously the test missed the one person who got sick the next day.  
 

 

 

The biggest issue with Princess' Covid protocols is the lack of clarity.  

The Medallions ARE the perfect contact tracer ..

So say for instance that on day 2 of a 15 day cruise, you have close contact with an infected person.  Now they have to quarantine, and YOU have to quarantine.  Do you have to quarantine the remaining 13 days?  Test 3-5 days later?  If negative you can be released?  

Princess needs very clear policy around this, especially with this new variant.

[CruiseVA]

1 hour ago, Coral said:

Also, with omicron - they are saying "close contact" is no longer 15 minutes. One can be infected far quicker.

Thought I read that somewhere, also the 6 feet rule may not help much either.

[Rick&Jeannie]

I retired from a career in IT. While I was not involved in such activities in relation to my employment, I do have some insights into how the Medallion technology could not be used as the "perfect contact tracer".

 

The Medallion offers up the "front-end" to a system that could conceivably do true ship-wide contact tracing.  But, in order to do true tracing there would need to be a tremendous amount of computing power (i.e. VERY powerful systems) on board to map out the movements of anywhere up to 3000 people across the entire ship throughout a 24 hour period and multiplied by however long the sailing is in days.  And this would have to be replicated across all ships in the fleet.  The bandwidth needed to transmit such information back to a central computer center would totally swamp any satellite based link.

 

I sincerely doubt that Princess has invested in this level of technology...especially when they are struggling so badly just trying to get the actual Medallion App working.  This is "NASA-level" technology...or possibly a Google or Amazon level endeavor.

Edited January 2, 2022 by Rick&Jeannie

[travelhound]

6 hours ago, Buckeye10640 said:

I believe close contact is considered within 6 ft for 15 minutes or more (i am sure someone will correct me if i am wrong!). So theoreticlly yes if you are in a really long line for 15 minutes  behind that person you could be considered a close contact.   I have read recently that current rapid tests are not as reliable at detecting omicron in asymptomactic people. So theoretically any passenger on board who tested negative before boarding *could* be positive, especially when one considers possible exposure  when getting off the ship in ports . If choosing to cruise these days I think we have to go into it with our eyes wide open to the possibities of cancelled activities and ports, and possible exposure and quarantine. And make a choice based on personal situation and risk tolerance. There is not a right or wrong answer whether one chooses to cruise or chooses to wait it out. We got our booster and chose to cruise,  and were on Enchanted early last month for 10 days. TBH it might be a harder decision for me right now with the explosion of omicron cases,  more because of the risk of quarantine than worry about getting seriously ill. We are booked for May and I am hoping this settles down a bit by then. 

 

Just my opinion and I am well aware there are many other perspectives......

Good point, it's the risk of quarantine that makes me want to cancel my cruise.  My family is fully vaccinated and we hope that we will not be required to follow these ridiculous restrictions by the time of our Alaska cruise this summer.

[fpsphil]

Stopping the medallions from contact tracing, which I believe they can easily do since they do know where you are on the ship… is as simple as keeping it in a faraday bag when not in active use

[MissP22]

1 hour ago, Rick&Jeannie said:

The Medallion offers up the "front-end" to a system that could conceivably do true ship-wide contact tracing.  But, in order to do true tracing there would need to be a tremendous amount of computing power (i.e. VERY powerful systems) on board to map out the movements of anywhere up to 3000 people across the entire ship throughout a 24 hour period and multiplied by however long the sailing is in days.  And this would have to be replicated across all ships in the fleet.  The bandwidth needed to transmit such information back to a central computer center would totally swamp any satellite based link.

It sounds like it would be a great way of tracking people. I wonder if the medallion is used at all in Covid tracking? 

If it isn't, then it's just relying on quarantining people after they've found to be sick.

[Coral]

1 hour ago, Rick&Jeannie said:

I retired from a career in IT. While I was not involved in such activities in relation to my employment, I do have some insights into how the Medallion technology could not be used as the "perfect contact tracer".

 

I think it could be. At work - we can tell which access points people are connected to and that information can be logged along with times. I can definitely see it being used for this.

 

I was also thinking when we were in the lounge the other day, they would be able to see which shows are more popular  or what times are more popular by attendance. 

[Ed Hibbard]

Wasn’t there a post a couple of days ago stating that the Princess tracking system is not very precise… something about them only being able to obtain your general location so that when you ordered a drink you need to watch for the waiter walking around searching for you?

 

[PrincessLuver]

18 minutes ago, Coral said:

I think it could be. At work - we can tell which access points people are connected to and that information can be logged along with times. I can definitely see it being used for this.

 

I was also thinking when we were in the lounge the other day, they would be able to see which shows are more popular  or what times are more popular by attendance. 

 

According to several of the crew on the cruise we are on now they all wear Medallions and it is for contact tracing.  They indicated that on one of the earlier Alaska cruises there was one crew member who got sick and 17 others had to go into quarantine also......I really am not sure if they use it for guest....seems like we would have heard something by now of someone being contacted by Princess???

Edited January 2, 2022 by PrincessLuver

[2 cruises a year]

7 hours ago, Buckeye10640 said:

I believe close contact is considered within 6 ft for 15 minutes or more (i am sure someone will correct me if i am wrong!). So theoreticlly yes if you are in a really long line for 15 minutes  behind that person you could be considered a close contact.   I have read recently that current rapid tests are not as reliable at detecting omicron in asymptomactic people. So theoretically any passenger on board who tested negative before boarding *could* be positive, especially when one considers possible exposure  when getting off the ship in ports . If choosing to cruise these days I think we have to go into it with our eyes wide open to the possibities of cancelled activities and ports, and possible exposure and quarantine. And make a choice based on personal situation and risk tolerance. There is not a right or wrong answer whether one chooses to cruise or chooses to wait it out. We got our booster and chose to cruise,  and were on Enchanted early last month for 10 days. TBH it might be a harder decision for me right now with the explosion of omicron cases,  more because of the risk of quarantine than worry about getting seriously ill. We are booked for May and I am hoping this settles down a bit by then. 

 

Just my opinion and I am well aware there are many other perspectives......

I agree with you on all counts. Even 6 ft. 15 minutes is what I've read about for the CA Notify app. 

We're chosen to cruise a bunch of short cruises out of San Francisco, hoping for the best, prepared for the worst. 

[Coral]

1 hour ago, Ed Hibbard said:

Wasn’t there a post a couple of days ago stating that the Princess tracking system is not very precise… something about them only being able to obtain your general location so that when you ordered a drink you need to watch for the waiter walking around searching for you?

 

I saw both sides of that recently. I could find a friend in the theatre based on what side and location it showed him on the app - it was pretty good. I also had drinks delivered to me in obscure locations with out a problem.

 

On the other hand, it said a friend was in the Horizon Court when he was in the pool area, though very close to the Horizon Court. The first table at the end, closest to the pool area.

 

I thought it was actually pretty good when trying to find people.