Tipping

[UNCFanatik]

1 minute ago, Cigar King said:

You are cheap because you are leaving out the other members of the staff, who are doing stuff for you, behind the scenes.  

 

Can you tell us if all behind the scenes crew members are part of the tipping pool? Like cooks, dishwashers, cleaning staff that are not room stewards, etc...etc..etc. 

 

You could make a case that EVERY crew member behind the scenes is "doing stuff" for you. Are they part of tipping pool? If they are not, then why not if they are "doing stuff" for guests

 

[Cigar King]

2 hours ago, UNCFanatik said:

How is it worth 18% of the cost of a beer for the bartender just to hand a beer to me. Or even a bottled water to me? 

So they buck or two is going to break you?  I mean seriously you can afford to go on a cruise and you can't afford to bring some extra dough along to thank those who are making your cruise special?

 

Oh, and I tip on the free drinks, even the free bottle of water.

[Cigar King]

2 minutes ago, UNCFanatik said:

Can you tell us if all behind the scenes crew members are part of the tipping pool? Like cooks, dishwashers, cleaning staff that are not room stewards, etc...etc..etc. 

I think that until we hear otherwise, we should believe the that the tips from the grat pool go to the crew.  If it turned out Royal was stealing from the pool, I'm thinking we would know by now and it would be a public relations nightmare for them.  

[Hutcha]

46 minutes ago, Sam Ting said:

There must be a reason they are so vague about where the money goes and make it discretionary.

From a post 4years ago by @katiel53.....

This is the breakdown that Royal Caribbean sent me when I asked how the gratuities were broken down:

The gratuities for the dining room are divided among the entire dining services team including those that work in the Windjammer.

 

Additionally, all funds received for gratuities are disbursed to the employees. We do not use it for any administrative purpose or incentive for the crew.

 

Please see the breakdown for the gratuities collected below on a per day basis.

 

Stateroom Attendant: $3.55 Previously $3.45

Dining Room: $6.25 Previously $6.10

Other Hotel Services: $4.70 Previously $3.95

 

Total Standard Staterooms: $14.50 Previously $13.50

 

Stateroom Attendant: $6.20 Previously $6.10

Dining Room: $6.25 Previously $6.10

Other Hotel Services: $5.05 Previously $5.05

 

Total for Suites: $17.50 Previously $16.50

 

 

I asked also what was covered with the "Other Hotel Services." This is the breakdown I received. (Including the spelling)

The other hotel services include the persons who wash the bed linings as well as whoever cleans balconies or restocks the mini bar. Other hotel services include any additional person other than the stateroom attendant that may attend to any stateroom need.

[Ourusualbeach]

42 minutes ago, Sunshine3601 said:

We just returned from a b2b on Anthem.  We found it odd that first week used the new cruise planner system but our 2nd week was still the old cruise planner.    Maybe had to do with when we booked the sailings?   We had 2nd week booked since early 2021 and added the first week fall 2021.

You just hit the changeover date for the sailing. It changes based on the ship departing after the changeover date.  I have had cruises booked years ago change to the new format

Edited April 7, 2022 by Ourusualbeach

[Captain Billy Bob]

10 minutes ago, UNCFanatik said:

 

These same tipping debates happen with All-Inclusives. Some people who like to virtue signal, still think you should tip at an All-Inclusive Resort that markets and advertises as being All-Inclusive including the Tips. What happens is that the same people claiming moral superiority on this thread or any Tipping thread, still tip at All-Inclusives creating more issues among the staff and guests. 

 

 

11 minutes ago, UNCFanatik said:

 

These same tipping debates happen with All-Inclusives. Some people who like to virtue signal, still think you should tip at an All-Inclusive Resort that markets and advertises as being All-Inclusive including the Tips. What happens is that the same people claiming moral superiority on this thread or any Tipping thread, still tip at All-Inclusives creating more issues among the staff and guests. 

 

People are going to do what they are going to do. We found the all inclusive experience much more relaxing and enjoyable. No need to carry around extra cash and worry about what the right amount to tip is. Like I said it's an outdated model that they should revise.

Just my opinion.

Carry on.

[Hutcha]

2 minutes ago, Captain Billy Bob said:

We found the all inclusive experience much more relaxing and enjoyable. No need to carry around extra cash and worry about what the right amount to tip is. Like I said it's an outdated model that they should revise.

They won't, because every cruise line would need to agree to it. If not, the ones that don't gain a competitive edge. They would also need to charge more than $14.50 PD/PP to account for the increased taxes and such that they have to pay, now that it's part of the cruise fare. Additionally, the $14.50 would need to be bumped up, because a "most" people that tip extra now, wouldn't on an all inclusive cruise. I don't, when I go to a resort that has a no tipping policy. 

 

A good reverse example of this is when the budget airlines started charging for bags. They stole a lot of business from the majors, because they were able to advertise a cheaper fare. Eventually, the majors had to follow with the bag fees to remain competitive.

[Captain Billy Bob]

8 minutes ago, Hutcha said:

 

The all inclusive resort chain we go to is expanding all of their existing properties where possible and expanding to more islands throughout the Caribbean so their plan is obviously working. Other land based resorts in the Caribbean are also moving to all inclusive so they must be doing something consumers like.

I could be mistaken but I think there are cruise lines that are all inclusive.

 

[UNCFanatik]

18 minutes ago, Hutcha said:

They won't, because every cruise line would need to agree to it. If not, the ones that don't gain a competitive edge. They would also need to charge more than $14.50 PD/PP to account for the increased taxes and such that they have to pay, now that it's part of the cruise fare. Additionally, the $14.50 would need to be bumped up, because a "most" people that tip extra now, wouldn't on an all inclusive cruise. I don't, when I go to a resort that has a no tipping policy. 

 

A good reverse example of this is when the budget airlines started charging for bags. They stole a lot of business from the majors, because they were able to advertise a cheaper fare. Eventually, the majors had to follow with the bag fees to remain competitive.

 

Look on Trip Advisor forums about all inclusive resorts. There are a good percentage of people who believe that even though tips are promoted and advertised as being included, still tip and do the same kind of shaming you see on here when it comes to tipping.

 

The US tipping  culture is so ingrained into people that they still tip even when not required. Which creates another set of issues at All Inclusive resorts when it comes to the level of service provided at All Inclusive when those not required to tip, do so anyway. 

[PhillyFan33579]

25 minutes ago, Captain Billy Bob said:

 

People are going to do what they are going to do. We found the all inclusive experience much more relaxing and enjoyable. No need to carry around extra cash and worry about what the right amount to tip is. Like I said it's an outdated model that they should revise.

Just my opinion.

Carry on.

I agree that it is an outdated model due to how the passenger demographics has changed over the years. In the past tips were left to the discretion of passengers, which at the time worked well because most people who cruised were upper middle to upper class who could easily afford to tip and understood that a lot of crew members depended on tips. 
 

As cruising became more affordable, you had more and more middle class people cruising who wouldn’t tip, which was hurting the pay of a lot of crew members. So the cruise lines came up with auto gratuities to entice people to tip, but they had to give passengers the option to cancel gratuities, otherwise they couldn’t be considered gratuities. Unfortunately that has led to a lot of people every cruise cancelling gratuities. There is also no doubt in my mind that people out there view cancelling gratuities as a standard practice to keep the cost of their cruise as low as possible. 
 

To me the solution is simple, the cruise fare should include all gratuities. Not only would this eliminate threads like this every other hour, more importantly it would allow crew members to count on a more consistent salary. One of the common comments I read on this board is posters saying the ship was under-staffed. Other posters have stated RCI is having trouble when it comes to hiring staff. If crew members were guaranteed a higher salary and didn’t have to rely on gratuities, perhaps cruise lines would find it easier to hire more staff. 

[Hutcha]

17 minutes ago, Captain Billy Bob said:

I could be mistaken but I think there are cruise lines that are all inclusive.

There are, but it comes at a premium that a very large percentage of the market will not pay. Do you think people that complain about an added $2-300 for a week will pay $2-3000 more for a cruise?

 

I understand your point about the all inclusive resorts. Difference is, people actively seek out all inclusive resorts. Also, you're not held captive on a resort, and you're free to spend money on the local economy. It's in the resorts interest to shift to all inclusive. The average RCI cruiser will not pay the premium to make it all inclusive.

[UNCFanatik]

8 minutes ago, PhillyFan33579 said:

I agree that it is an outdated model due to how the passenger demographics has changed over the years. In the past tips were left to the discretion of passengers, which at the time worked well because most people who cruised were upper middle to upper class who could easily afford to tip and understood that a lot of crew members depended on tips. 
 

As cruising became more affordable, you had more and more middle class people cruising who wouldn’t tip, which was hurting the pay of a lot of crew members. So the cruise lines came up with auto gratuities to entice people to tip, but they had to give passengers the option to cancel gratuities, otherwise they couldn’t be considered gratuities. Unfortunately that has led to a lot of people every cruise cancelling gratuities. There is also no doubt in my mind that people out there view cancelling gratuities as a standard practice to keep the cost of their cruise as low as possible. 
 

To me the solution is simple, the cruise fare should include all gratuities. Not only would this eliminate threads like this every other hour, more importantly it would allow crew members to count on a more consistent salary. One of the common comments I read on this board is posters saying the ship was under-staffed. Other posters have stated RCI is having trouble when it comes to hiring staff. If crew members were guaranteed a higher salary and didn’t have to rely on gratuities, perhaps cruise lines would find it easier to hire more staff. 

 

You make some very valid points.

 

Personally, I would rather see the concept of gratuities go away from cruising in general. I would rather see the cruise lines raise crew pay in general and increase the overall cruise fares. However, this would not alleviate the same issues of people feeling compelled to tip no matter what. Hard for some people to stop virtue signaling or having a savior mentality when it comes to crew members. 

 

But, as you mentioned, with the demographics of cruising, how much would that affect the bottom line. Would those super cost conscious people you mention that remove auto-gratuities from their account, just stop cruising if the fare on a 7 night cruise for a family of 4 increased by $400? How much would a change in cruise pricing affect the booking rates of the cruise lines? 

 

But as long as the cruise lines allow people to remove auto-gratuities no matter the reason, those people should not be demonized. People who do not tip still contribute to crew wages just by booking a cruise. Again, what would happen to booking rates and financials of cruise lines if all those people who remove gratuities just stopped cruising all together

[Hutcha]

2 minutes ago, UNCFanatik said:

. People who do not tip still contribute to crew wages just by booking a cruise.

Like you contribute to the server's wage ($2.15/hr) at your local restaurant when you don't tip. Same-same

[Captain Billy Bob]

2 minutes ago, Hutcha said:

There are, but it comes at a premium that a very large percentage of the market will not pay. Do you think people that complain about an added $2-300 for a week will pay $2-3000 more for a cruise?

 

I understand your point about the all inclusive resorts. Difference is, people actively seek out all inclusive resorts. Also, you're not held captive on a resort, and you're free to spend money on the local economy. It's in the resorts interest to shift to all inclusive. The average RCI cruiser will not pay the premium to make it all inclusive.

Where did you come up with the $2-3000 number?

Your second point makes no sense to me. People actively seek out cruising, ships stop at ports and passengers spend money on the local economy, you are not captive at a land based resort.

If it is in a land based resorts best interest to be all inclusive why wouldn't it be in the cruise lines interest to be all inclusive.

The reason resorts went to all inclusive was to provide a hassle free experience for their customers.  It's huge selling point for that industry.

[UNCFanatik]

4 minutes ago, Hutcha said:

There are, but it comes at a premium that a very large percentage of the market will not pay. Do you think people that complain about an added $2-300 for a week will pay $2-3000 more for a cruise?

 

I understand your point about the all inclusive resorts. Difference is, people actively seek out all inclusive resorts. Also, you're not held captive on a resort, and you're free to spend money on the local economy. It's in the resorts interest to shift to all inclusive. The average RCI cruiser will not pay the premium to make it all inclusive.

 

Yes and No. 

 

Right now, there are many all inclusive resorts that you can book for the price of a cruise especially when you include excursions from the cruise ships ports. And it all depends how secluded the all inclusive is and if its safe to venture outside of the resort as to if one is held captive akin to being on a cruise ship. 

[Sam Ting]

26 minutes ago, Hutcha said:

Like you contribute to the server's wage ($2.15/hr) at your local restaurant when you don't tip. Same-same

The difference is the local restaurant does not decide the appropriate tip, and expect that amount to be handed to them to distribute as they see fit.

[Hutcha]

45 minutes ago, Captain Billy Bob said:

Where did you come up with the $2-3000 number?

Your second point makes no sense to me. People actively seek out cruising, ships stop at ports and passengers spend money on the local economy, you are not captive at a land based resort.

If it is in a land based resorts best interest to be all inclusive why wouldn't it be in the cruise lines interest to be all inclusive.

The reason resorts went to all inclusive was to provide a hassle free experience for their customers.  It's huge selling point for that industry.

What all inclusive cruise lines are you referring to? I don't consider Celebrity to be all inclusive, but they are now including Tips, Wi-Fi and the basic drink package. I book a balcony on them next Feb for $3900. 2 people. An "all inclusive" line boarders luxury, and will be much more. Also, the Celebrity example is a good one that makes other's point. A lot of people don't cruise Celebrity because they don't want to pay the premium. 

 

My 2nd point was that you are captive 80% of the time and do the majority of your eating and drinking aboard the ship. At a land resort, you are not captive. You are free to roam. Yes some are more secluded, but there are a lot within walking distance or a short cab ride for dining and nightlife. 

[Sam Ting]

2 hours ago, Hutcha said:

From a post 4years ago by @katiel53.....

This is the breakdown that Royal Caribbean sent me when I asked how the gratuities were broken down:

The gratuities for the dining room are divided among the entire dining services team including those that work in the Windjammer.

 

Additionally, all funds received for gratuities are disbursed to the employees. We do not use it for any administrative purpose or incentive for the crew.

 

Please see the breakdown for the gratuities collected below on a per day basis.

 

Stateroom Attendant: $3.55 Previously $3.45

Dining Room: $6.25 Previously $6.10

Other Hotel Services: $4.70 Previously $3.95

 

Total Standard Staterooms: $14.50 Previously $13.50

 

Stateroom Attendant: $6.20 Previously $6.10

Dining Room: $6.25 Previously $6.10

Other Hotel Services: $5.05 Previously $5.05

 

Total for Suites: $17.50 Previously $16.50

 

 

I asked also what was covered with the "Other Hotel Services." This is the breakdown I received. (Including the spelling)

The other hotel services include the persons who wash the bed linings as well as whoever cleans balconies or restocks the mini bar. Other hotel services include any additional person other than the stateroom attendant that may attend to any stateroom need.

Other than the stateroom attendant, they are again being vague on where the rest of the money goes.  What does dining room mean?  How do you tip an inanimate object?  It does not say waiters, assistants or any of that.  For all we know, it may only go to the managers or people who decorate the room for that matter.  

 

‘As far as other hotel services, isn’t the cruise line required to provide clean sheets as part of doing business just like any other establishment worth a damn that you would want to sleep in.  How about if you are in an inside room and dont have a balcony?  

[brillohead]

1 hour ago, PhillyFan33579 said:

I agree that it is an outdated model due to how the passenger demographics has changed over the years. In the past tips were left to the discretion of passengers, which at the time worked well because most people who cruised were upper middle to upper class who could easily afford to tip and understood that a lot of crew members depended on tips. 

Not sure how long ago you're talking about "in the past" but I remember VERY clearly that the cruise lines published a list of "recommended tip" amounts back as far as my first cruise in 1982, and this was back when you were giving individual tips to the Maitre d', Headwaiter, Sommelier, Dining Room Cocktail Server, Waiter, Assistant Waiter, Room Steward, and Assistant Steward. 

It was a right royal pain in the keester to compute each amount per passenger per day for each position (remember, this was before everyone carried a calculator with them, too!), divvy it all up into separate envelopes, and have the envelopes handy when everyone came by on the last night -- you'd never see the Maitre d' or Headwaiter all cruise long, but you sure saw them on the last night!

 

So happy when they switched to auto-grats, SOOOOOO much simpler!  



 

[cruisetorelax44]

1 minute ago, brillohead said:

Not sure how long ago you're talking about "in the past" but I remember VERY clearly that the cruise lines published a list of "recommended tip" amounts back as far as my first cruise in 1982, and this was back when you were giving individual tips to the Maitre d', Headwaiter, Sommelier, Dining Room Cocktail Server, Waiter, Assistant Waiter, Room Steward, and Assistant Steward. 

It was a right royal pain in the keester to compute each amount per passenger per day for each position (remember, this was before everyone carried a calculator with them, too!), divvy it all up into separate envelopes, and have the envelopes handy when everyone came by on the last night -- you'd never see the Maitre d' or Headwaiter all cruise long, but you sure saw them on the last night!

 

So happy when they switched to auto-grats, SOOOOOO much simpler!  



 

not knocking auto tips. I did them for years. But since we no longer eat in the dining room or buffet, and and only eat at specialty restaurants (where they add 18% to your cost anyway), we choose to tip in cash. And we tip the state room attendant in cash. I don't understand why so many people have a problem with that. We're not trying to "get away" with anything. In reality, we're paying more in tips than we would if we just auto-tipped and didn't add any extra. It seems some people just want to attack others. I say, to each their own.  

[brillohead]

3 minutes ago, cruisetorelax44 said:

not knocking auto tips. I did them for years. But since we no longer eat in the dining room or buffet, and and only eat at specialty restaurants (where they add 18% to your cost anyway), we choose to tip in cash. And we tip the state room attendant in cash. I don't understand why so many people have a problem with that. We're not trying to "get away" with anything. In reality, we're paying more in tips than we would if we just auto-tipped and didn't add any extra. It seems some people just want to attack others. I say, to each their own.  

First of all, I wasn't replying to you, so unbunch your panties.  I quoted the person and even bolded the part of the quote that I was talking about, and that wasn't you.  

Secondly, just because you choose not to set foot in them, there are still employees in venues like the Windjammer, Cafe Promenade, Sorrentos, El Loco Fresh, Solarium Bistro, Park Cafe, Boardwalk Dogs, etc., in addition to the MDR employees, who all get paid out of the auto-grats.  

Thirdly, by removing your auto-grats and paying your room attendant in cash, all you're doing is reducing the amount that the room attendant gets to keep.  They have to turn in the cash tips from people who removed auto-grats to be included in the tip pool, and we don't know what percentage of that pooled money gets returned to the room attendant.  You may give them $100 and they only get to keep $25 of that amount, where if you had left the auto-grats in place they would have received $50.  

[UNCFanatik]

3 minutes ago, brillohead said:

First of all, I wasn't replying to you, so unbunch your panties.  I quoted the person and even bolded the part of the quote that I was talking about, and that wasn't you.  

Secondly, just because you choose not to set foot in them, there are still employees in venues like the Windjammer, Cafe Promenade, Sorrentos, El Loco Fresh, Solarium Bistro, Park Cafe, Boardwalk Dogs, etc., in addition to the MDR employees, who all get paid out of the auto-grats.  

Thirdly, by removing your auto-grats and paying your room attendant in cash, all you're doing is reducing the amount that the room attendant gets to keep.  They have to turn in the cash tips from people who removed auto-grats to be included in the tip pool, and we don't know what percentage of that pooled money gets returned to the room attendant.  You may give them $100 and they only get to keep $25 of that amount, where if you had left the auto-grats in place they would have received $50.  

 

what is the control that if a crew member is paid in cash to report that amount and turn it in for pooling? 

[cruisetorelax44]

3 minutes ago, brillohead said:

First of all, I wasn't replying to you, so unbunch your panties.  I quoted the person and even bolded the part of the quote that I was talking about, and that wasn't you.  

Secondly, just because you choose not to set foot in them, there are still employees in venues like the Windjammer, Cafe Promenade, Sorrentos, El Loco Fresh, Solarium Bistro, Park Cafe, Boardwalk Dogs, etc., in addition to the MDR employees, who all get paid out of the auto-grats.  

Thirdly, by removing your auto-grats and paying your room attendant in cash, all you're doing is reducing the amount that the room attendant gets to keep.  They have to turn in the cash tips from people who removed auto-grats to be included in the tip pool, and we don't know what percentage of that pooled money gets returned to the room attendant.  You may give them $100 and they only get to keep $25 of that amount, where if you had left the auto-grats in place they would have received $50.  

i wasn't trying to be rude, remember, you can't tell "tone" in text.  I still think people should be allowed to decide how they tip without being judged. you want to just auto-tip, no problem. you want to do it on your own, cool. you want to do both? good on you. why can't we all just sail and have fun?

[Sam Ting]

1 minute ago, brillohead said:

First of all, I wasn't replying to you, so unbunch your panties.  I quoted the person and even bolded the part of the quote that I was talking about, and that wasn't you.  

Secondly, just because you choose not to set foot in them, there are still employees in venues like the Windjammer, Cafe Promenade, Sorrentos, El Loco Fresh, Solarium Bistro, Park Cafe, Boardwalk Dogs, etc., in addition to the MDR employees, who all get paid out of the auto-grats.  

Thirdly, by removing your auto-grats and paying your room attendant in cash, all you're doing is reducing the amount that the room attendant gets to keep.  They have to turn in the cash tips from people who removed auto-grats to be included in the tip pool, and we don't know what percentage of that pooled money gets returned to the room attendant.  You may give them $100 and they only get to keep $25 of that amount, where if you had left the auto-grats in place they would have received $50.  

Absurd that its expected you tip people that work in eateries you never even go to.  Do you do that in your daily life?  Just walk by a random establishment and give the owner some money so he can pay his crew?

[brillohead]

1 minute ago, UNCFanatik said:

what is the control that if a crew member is paid in cash to report that amount and turn it in for pooling? 

Integrity, and loss of employment if cheating is discovered.