How are Covid cases on NCL ships?

[FM]

12 hours ago, MidCitiesMan said:

TheJamesGang, what cruise? We were deck 10 on the Bliss last week when we got Covid. 
 

edit: n/m, I missed you gave the date. 

 

Alaskan cruise?

[MidCitiesMan]

37 minutes ago, FM said:

 

Alaskan cruise?

Correct 

[MidCitiesMan]

4 hours ago, KateQ22003 said:

Thank you so much! I started Paxlovid on Monday and am feeling a little bit better. I am still coughing like crazy and I wake up in the night in coughing fits. It's kind of scary! 

Wow, hope you feel better soon. 

[mking8288]

On 5/24/2022 at 12:37 PM, dcipjr said:

... I stayed in my stateroom a lot and ... I still got it. So honestly, it might not have made a difference! 😄 I hope you have a speedy recovery. 🙂

What's new, I trust you are getting better.  Susan and I doing fine, all things considered - we ordered takeout food & drove to the restaurant to pick it up, worn her KN95 plus the hand wash routines, etc. - to get some fresh air & stretch our legs, sheltering in place for 10 days and haven't gone anywhere.  Since we got a decent inventory of home self-test kits, swab ourselves this Sunday and, as expected & not surprised - 2 lines shown (C and T, pretty solid & easily visible) with Abbott's    On Monday, my BIL on prescribed antiviral from his PCP, swab at home and his result came up negative, his symptoms showed up much later than us and only then, his rapid results turned positive (negative from Sunday's disembarkation and also when he went to see his PCP 2 days later) - he is feeling fine and no longer self-isolating and sleep on a spare, converted sofabed, resumed his outdoor walking exercise.

 

We figured that, while not & let's see if ours are now negative - hey, could do a last minute Memorial weekend cruise if we find a good deal ...  Oops, no can't do.  Antigen Rapid test (by Roche's - 20 minutes to read results) is positive (a faint solid line across, visible ... thus, 2 lines & valid)   Apparently, we are no longer considered contagious and under current CDC and NYC-DOH guidelines, can go about normal routines without masking (past 10 days) and unnecessary to repeat these Antigen rapid tests again.  One of the twin nieces that're probably, almost definitely exposed & infected via household contacts by the sis-in-law was given time off from work, and her HR dept wanted her to test negative before clearing her to return to the office ... their corporate policy is much stricter than healthcare employers.  

 

BTW, I'm not sure if anyone from our CC Roll Call from the 8th. were active or also using that social media, as more than the 1/2 of those that signed up or registered for the CC Meet & Greet came from that private group, few & most never registered on CC or had a screen name/ID ... and probably will not be regulars on CC, which is really annoying - IMHO.  Apparently, more than a handful belonging to that group self-reported that post-cruise or after going home, tested positive for C-19 and commented on a thread.  One of the group "admin" for the group deleted the entire "conversation" as being off-topic & unrelated to a different topic with the group - fine, protected & safeguard privacies and perhaps not risking HIPAA since names were posted.  Testing after disembarkation isn't going to affect NCL's numbers for the cruise, it's the pre-embarkation & while onboard data that NCL is very careful with.  Interesting, isn't it - I know we have to be and are reminded to be careful about "C" discussions here on CC or else.  

 

It's questionable how truthful of a picture we are getting about current covid cases onboard cruise ships and it is a very delicate balance to maintain & juggle for NCL.  Caution is the operative phrase and best advice to share & pass along.  

[TheJamesGang]

4 hours ago, FM said:

 

Alaskan cruise?

No, Panama Canal departed Miami on 4/15.

[TheJamesGang]

16 hours ago, MidCitiesMan said:

TheJamesGang, what cruise? We were deck 10 on the Bliss last week when we got Covid. 
 

edit: n/m, I missed you gave the date. 

Yeah, we were on the Encore.

[Quencups]

5 hours ago, mking8288 said:

What's new, I trust you are getting better.  Susan and I doing fine, all things considered - we ordered takeout food & drove to the restaurant to pick it up, worn her KN95 plus the hand wash routines, etc. - to get some fresh air & stretch our legs, sheltering in place for 10 days and haven't gone anywhere.  Since we got a decent inventory of home self-test kits, swab ourselves this Sunday and, as expected & not surprised - 2 lines shown (C and T, pretty solid & easily visible) with Abbott's    On Monday, my BIL on prescribed antiviral from his PCP, swab at home and his result came up negative, his symptoms showed up much later than us and only then, his rapid results turned positive (negative from Sunday's disembarkation and also when he went to see his PCP 2 days later) - he is feeling fine and no longer self-isolating and sleep on a spare, converted sofabed, resumed his outdoor walking exercise.

 

We figured that, while not & let's see if ours are now negative - hey, could do a last minute Memorial weekend cruise if we find a good deal ...  Oops, no can't do.  Antigen Rapid test (by Roche's - 20 minutes to read results) is positive (a faint solid line across, visible ... thus, 2 lines & valid)   Apparently, we are no longer considered contagious and under current CDC and NYC-DOH guidelines, can go about normal routines without masking (past 10 days) and unnecessary to repeat these Antigen rapid tests again.  One of the twin nieces that're probably, almost definitely exposed & infected via household contacts by the sis-in-law was given time off from work, and her HR dept wanted her to test negative before clearing her to return to the office ... their corporate policy is much stricter than healthcare employers.  

 

BTW, I'm not sure if anyone from our CC Roll Call from the 8th. were active or also using that social media, as more than the 1/2 of those that signed up or registered for the CC Meet & Greet came from that private group, few & most never registered on CC or had a screen name/ID ... and probably will not be regulars on CC, which is really annoying - IMHO.  Apparently, more than a handful belonging to that group self-reported that post-cruise or after going home, tested positive for C-19 and commented on a thread.  One of the group "admin" for the group deleted the entire "conversation" as being off-topic & unrelated to a different topic with the group - fine, protected & safeguard privacies and perhaps not risking HIPAA since names were posted.  Testing after disembarkation isn't going to affect NCL's numbers for the cruise, it's the pre-embarkation & while onboard data that NCL is very careful with.  Interesting, isn't it - I know we have to be and are reminded to be careful about "C" discussions here on CC or else.  

 

It's questionable how truthful of a picture we are getting about current covid cases onboard cruise ships and it is a very delicate balance to maintain & juggle for NCL.  Caution is the operative phrase and best advice to share & pass along.  

Hi mk. We were on the joy sailing the week after you. Tuesday we all felt sick and are all positive as are quite a number of people we met on the ship. I don’t think I will sail again for quite some time. 🫤. Glad you and yours are feeling better. 

[gud2seau]

We just got back from a cruise on the Norwegian Sky.  Tested negative going on board but started to feel sick the last day or two.  Some of the symptoms seemed to align more with a sinus infection but we masked when we went.  Initially, they were mild until we docked to return him.

 

Both of us are vaccinated and boosted.  We were racking our brains of how we got it.  It was likely due to my wife singing Karaoke on the ship.  Through the cruise, there were many sneezing and coughing but some of that happened prior to Covid as well.

 

Having said all of that, we are happy that we got the opportunity to cruise even while getting Covid.  It’s not something anyone would choose but we have no regrets.  A few days to get over this and we will have a new gift - immunity from the latest strain. 

[mking8288]

4 hours ago, Quencups said:

... Tuesday we all felt sick and are all positive as are quite a number of people we met on the ship. I don’t think I will sail again for quite some time ... 

Feel better and get well soon, sending best wishes to you and others that test positive.  As you know, Norwegian Joy wasn't our first back to cruise at sea - we felt reassured after our March Getaway.  It's probably a combo of timing, the latest subvariant that's highly contagious and easily spread, and some of the relaxed measures all over, not just onboard the ship that caught up with us.  We've managed to be very careful, cautious for over 2 years - fully vaxxed and boosted - and in addition to testing negative with Antigen Rapid, also negative with PCR results, 2 days prior to embarkation.  We did not go anywhere else except to take the car service to MCT, masked up inside the cruise terminal, as much as we could.  I would be very interested if contact tracing was possible but not going to happen, to see how & where, and possibly by who ... I would rule out that it happened in Bermuda. Reasonable to say, the virus slipped thru the cracks, somehow despite it all.  

 

Understood what you are saying about not cruising or sailing again for a while ... DW is taking a closer look and has her doubts too.  Others in "my" group aren't so sure either.  I am trying to keep an open mind, fair and reasonable, and want to gain some insights in various theories and assumptions, not rushing to conclusions and finger-pointing, etc.  Two cruises on the calendar for us, this Fall and early 2023 (which is more iffy' since it's more challenging to predict events this Fall/early Winter and where this pandemic is going next.  

 

Pausing for a moment, if this is not good, imagine flying ... no, thanks.  We'll drive instead, even if gasoline is going to be $6 USD a gallon soon ... ours get 40 mpg on the highway and it's not a hybrid.  Not ready to give up and suspend cruising again - rolling up the sleeves for the next booster, we all should get it anyway, sooner or later - no matter what we do and don't, I believe ... 

 

P.S.  Mild symptoms should ease up another day or two, for most anyway - get lots of rest, fluid, vitamins boosters.  Take care. 

[MidCitiesMan]

Last December while the pandemic was at higher levels, I spent a week in Egypt and a week in Jordan. All told it was 40 hours on airplanes. We did not get sick and both countries have lower vaccination rates than the US. Which is much lower than the cruise ship. 
 

There is a Facebook group for our sailing on the Bliss. Nearly 10% of the total passengers from the sailing are in the group, a statistically significant sample. And slightly over 8% of that sample have reported getting covid. Everyone knows cases are generally underreported, so the actual number is higher. 

[CrazyTrain2]

We need to stop talking about vaxxed/boosted.  It is irrelevant since your short term immunity from catching omicron wanes quickly after a shot or exposure.  The clock is ticking from the moment of symptomatic onset.  

 

You have 4 months tops to be protected from getting Omicron.

 

You'll be protected from serious disease and death for more than a year but not a couple days/weeks of feeling miserable.  The CDC has contacted me about my Freedom of Information Act request for actual case counts.  We are working towards some real numbers and I will post them once I get them.

 

Until then, expect to get Covid on a cruise - you might get lucky but expect/plan.  The CDC is currently reporting 85 of the 92 ships in the fleet as Orange, the highest realistic color coding.  The highest number of orange I've seen yet.

[dcipjr]

19 hours ago, mking8288 said:

What's new, I trust you are getting better.

 

A little better every day, @mking8288—thanks for asking! Taste and smell are mostly back, still not quite as sharp as pre-COVID, but still improving daily. Cough is mostly gone, nasal congestion still there but not as much. Feels like a mild cold that's on its way out.

 

I did a rapid test yesterday and still got a positive result. I'll test again in a couple more days. 

 

19 hours ago, mking8288 said:

as more than the 1/2 of those that signed up or registered for the CC Meet & Greet came from that private group, few & most never registered on CC or had a screen name/ID ... and probably will not be regulars on CC, which is really annoying - IMHO

 

When I went to my first CC M&G (in 2012) all of the attendees were from the CruiseCritic Message Boards. But the last couple times I've gone to the M&G, the vast majority are from Social Media. The one person we were talking with didn't even know what CruiseCritic was! 🤦‍♂️

 

I'm not on a Certain Well-known Social Media Site so I am unfamiliar with the roll calls that happen there. I'm just going to chalk up our Meet and Greets as yet another victim of Social Media (see also: decency, democracy, privacy). I'll continue to visit the CC Roll Calls, but at this point, I'll only attend the M&G if there's someone from the Roll Call that I actually want to see.

[Quencups]

10 hours ago, mking8288 said:

Feel better and get well soon, sending best wishes to you and others that test positive.  As you know, Norwegian Joy wasn't our first back to cruise at sea - we felt reassured after our March Getaway.  It's probably a combo of timing, the latest subvariant that's highly contagious and easily spread, and some of the relaxed measures all over, not just onboard the ship that caught up with us.  We've managed to be very careful, cautious for over 2 years - fully vaxxed and boosted - and in addition to testing negative with Antigen Rapid, also negative with PCR results, 2 days prior to embarkation.  We did not go anywhere else except to take the car service to MCT, masked up inside the cruise terminal, as much as we could.  I would be very interested if contact tracing was possible but not going to happen, to see how & where, and possibly by who ... I would rule out that it happened in Bermuda. Reasonable to say, the virus slipped thru the cracks, somehow despite it all.  

 

Understood what you are saying about not cruising or sailing again for a while ... DW is taking a closer look and has her doubts too.  Others in "my" group aren't so sure either.  I am trying to keep an open mind, fair and reasonable, and want to gain some insights in various theories and assumptions, not rushing to conclusions and finger-pointing, etc.  Two cruises on the calendar for us, this Fall and early 2023 (which is more iffy' since it's more challenging to predict events this Fall/early Winter and where this pandemic is going next.  

 

Pausing for a moment, if this is not good, imagine flying ... no, thanks.  We'll drive instead, even if gasoline is going to be $6 USD a gallon soon ... ours get 40 mpg on the highway and it's not a hybrid.  Not ready to give up and suspend cruising again - rolling up the sleeves for the next booster, we all should get it anyway, sooner or later - no matter what we do and don't, I believe ... 

 

P.S.  Mild symptoms should ease up another day or two, for most anyway - get lots of rest, fluid, vitamins boosters.  Take care. 

Ty for the well wishes 😊. Had a rough day yesterday but feeling a little better today. I think I let my guard down with the mask wearing because I was under the assumption that everyone had to test negative to be on the ship and had to be vaccinated so I had a false sense of safety. It came from somewhere so either someone brought it onboard or it was already onboard. This is the chance we take so no one to blame. I just think that all the pre-cruise stress I/we all were under to test negative get the Bermuda travel authorization approved etc. was not worth coming home with Covid so I think I will reevaluate my fall cruise.  

[MidCitiesMan]

3 hours ago, CrazyTrain2 said:

We need to stop talking about vaxxed/boosted.  It is irrelevant since your short term immunity from catching omicron wanes quickly after a shot or exposure.  The clock is ticking from the moment of symptomatic onset.  

 

You have 4 months tops to be protected from getting Omicron.

 

You'll be protected from serious disease and death for more than a year but not a couple days/weeks of feeling miserable.  The CDC has contacted me about my Freedom of Information Act request for actual case counts.  We are working towards some real numbers and I will post them once I get them.

 

Until then, expect to get Covid on a cruise - you might get lucky but expect/plan.  The CDC is currently reporting 85 of the 92 ships in the fleet as Orange, the highest realistic color coding.  The highest number of orange I've seen yet.

Thank you. Your other post was quite informative. I would love to see the numbers as well. 

[BermudaBound2014]

3 hours ago, CrazyTrain2 said:

You'll be protected from serious disease and death for more than a year...

 

Sadly, I don't believe we can make this claim any longer. I track University of Michigan Covid admittance. They do a nice job breaking down by vaccinated/unvaccinated and comorbidity. It has been several months since the number of unvaccinated patients exceeded the number of vaccinated patients who have been admitted to the UofM hospital for covid. 

 

Currently UofM has 45 patients hospitalized for Covid. The majority (65%) are vaccinated while there are only 38% unvaccinated.  The variable that is the most consistent predictor of hospitalization is comorbidity regardless of vaccine status.

 

https://www.uofmhealth.org/coronavirus/covid19-numbers

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mira28]

30 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

Sadly, I don't believe we can make this claim any longer. I track University of Michigan Covid admittance. They do a nice job breaking down by vaccinated/unvaccinated and comorbidity. It has been several months since the number of unvaccinated patients exceeded the number of vaccinated patients who have been admitted to the UofM hospital for covid. 

 

Currently UofM has 45 patients hospitalized for Covid. The majority (65%) are vaccinated while there are only 38% unvaccinated.  The variable that is the most consistent predictor of hospitalization is comorbidity regardless of vaccine status.

This is an eye opener, for sure. A great concern to see that hospitalizations are rising in many areas.

I wonder what the vaccination rates are in the areas served by University of Michigan. Here in New York, vaccination rates are in the 70-75% range for all adults, much higher among older population cohorts. In that regard it makes sense that since there are many more vaccinated people than unvaccinated, they would also be a larger percentage of the hospitalized population. As you say, comorbidity is the key factor. Again, as comorbidity rises with age (and one's comorbidity factors may cause one to seek vaccination) this interplay might be involved as well. 

But I too am concerned, and am rethinking fall cruises at this point.

[Karaboudjan]

33 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

Sadly, I don't believe we can make this claim any longer. I track University of Michigan Covid admittance. They do a nice job breaking down by vaccinated/unvaccinated and comorbidity. It has been several months since the number of unvaccinated patients exceeded the number of vaccinated patients who have been admitted to the UofM hospital for covid. 

 

Currently UofM has 45 patients hospitalized for Covid. The majority (65%) are vaccinated while there are only 38% unvaccinated.  The variable that is the most consistent predictor of hospitalization is comorbidity regardless of vaccine status.

 

https://www.uofmhealth.org/coronavirus/covid19-numbers

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What the UofM chart says is 'Currently Admitted Michigan Medicine Patients That Are COVID-19 Positive' which is very different than hospitalized for COVID.  I believe the evidence shows that vaccination and especially boosted vaccination still are effective against hospitalization from COVID.  For example:  https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7112e2.htm?s_cid=mm7112e2_w

 

And this is why I think some sort of vaccine requirements will continue to be in force for some time.

[BermudaBound2014]

26 minutes ago, Karaboudjan said:

 

What the UofM chart says is 'Currently Admitted Michigan Medicine Patients That Are COVID-19 Positive' which is very different than hospitalized for COVID.  I believe the evidence shows that vaccination and especially boosted vaccination still are effective against hospitalization from COVID.  For example:  https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7112e2.htm?s_cid=mm7112e2_w

 

And this is why I think some sort of vaccine requirements will continue to be in force for some time.

 

I believe the line graph shows 'currently admitted Michigan patients that are covid positive" while pictograph shows those who are admitted from Covid. Regardless how different is it really? In the grand scheme of things, the most common variable associated with hospitalization and Covid 19 is comorbidity.

 

The data has been very consistent. Patients admitted to UofM hospital who are vaccinated outnumber patients who are not. Of course, there are many other variables in play, but the raw data indicates that comorbidity is the variable to be most concerned about (and that makes sense).

 

@Mira28 Washtenaw county (where UofM is located) has 69.2% vaccination rate, while the state of Michigan has 60% who are fully vaccinated. UofM draws from a very large geographic area so I would estimate numbers are somewhere in between. I've tracked the UofM data for nearly a full year now and the data has positively shifted over time. In terms of patients admitted to University of Michigan hospital who are Covid19 positive, those who are vaccinated outnumber those who are unvaccinated. 

 

In terms of cruising, I'd personally be very hesitant to board a ship if anyone in my party had a significant comorbidity. 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 26, 2022 by BermudaBound2014

[rjm11]

1 hour ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

I believe the line graph shows 'currently admitted Michigan patients that are covid positive" while pictograph shows those who are admitted from Covid. Regardless how different is it really? In the grand scheme of things, the most common variable associated with hospitalization and Covid 19 is comorbidity.

 

The data has been very consistent. Patients admitted to UofM hospital who are vaccinated outnumber patients who are not. Of course, there are many other variables in play, but the raw data indicates that comorbidity is the variable to be most concerned about (and that makes sense).

 

@Mira28 Washtenaw county (where UofM is located) has 69.2% vaccination rate, while the state of Michigan has 60% who are fully vaccinated. UofM draws from a very large geographic area so I would estimate numbers are somewhere in between. I've tracked the UofM data for nearly a full year now and the data has positively shifted over time. In terms of patients admitted to University of Michigan hospital who are Covid19 positive, those who are vaccinated outnumber those who are unvaccinated. 

 

In terms of cruising, I'd personally be very hesitant to board a ship if anyone in my party had a significant comorbidity. 

 

 

 

 

I think what you're saying is a tad misleading.... I agree that the comorbidities are an enormous risk factor for hospitalization, but so is being unvaccinated. You can't just compare the vaccination status of the hospitalized people because the vaccination rate is fairly high now. And hospitalizations are fairly low. Think of it this way- prior to vaccination, 100% of hospitalized people were unvaccinated. And hospitalization rates were much much higher (most ICUs were maxxed out- the medical system overrun, etc). Now hospitalizations are a fraction of that, (largely because of the high vaccination rate)- so when you look at that much smaller group and see that 65% are vaccinated, it is, as you say, probably largely due to comorbidities, but to say that vaccine status isn't affecting it is incorrect. It's brought the whole incidence of hospitalization much much lower.

[MidCitiesMan]

That or the prevalent variant isn’t as strong. But we are really butting up against the policy at this point. 

[BermudaBound2014]

2 hours ago, rjm11 said:

 It's brought the whole incidence of hospitalization much much lower.

 

Are you sure vaccinations have brought hospitalization down?  Especially given more people hospitalized today with covid are vaccinated?  I believe that I can make a case that the reason hospitalization rates are lower is because the virus itself is weaker. 

 

Now, of course I agree that vaccinations have helped us along the way.  I'm not anti-vaccine, but I am pointing to raw data that indicates comorbidity is the real issue here. No politics, just the data. So, when people talk about wanting to take a cruise, I think the first question asked should be "do you have a comorbidity?" 

 

I'm not trying to be disrespectful in any way, and appreciate your input on the topic.

 

 

[ontheweb]

This has clearly become a topic about Covid in general as opposed to on NCL cruise ships. I wonder why it has not been closed down.

[Mademypoint]

There's definitely some complacency when it comes to believing being vaccinated and boosted means you won't get sick enough to need hospitalization and therefore, imo, people are choosing not to mask up on ships. I saw very few people in the terminal wearing them and it was inevitable people would leave the ship with it. Spend 90 minutes sitting in a theatre with 200+ people, almost all unmasked is going to lead to cases just given the nature of how the virus is transmitted. 
 

[BermudaBound2014]

@Figmentlover78 We can account for base rate fallacy in that approximately 65% of people in the area surrounding UofM are vaccinated. In that case, you maybe able to say that vaccination is not a determining factor either way (doesn't help, doesn't hurt).  

 

The site was updated again. Today  33 people are hospitalized with covid.  22 are vaccinated (14 of those are also boosted). 13 are unvaccinated.  Yet of the 33 people vaccinated 22 have a comorbidity (regardless of vaccination status).

 

If the goal of NCL is to reduce the amount of serious illness from covid, an equally important question cruise lines should be asking  before boarding is "Do you have a comorbidity?"  

Edited May 27, 2022 by BermudaBound2014

[kayjaypea42]

On 5/24/2022 at 11:28 AM, Quencups said:

Oh no! How long do you have to stay in Italy?

The rule is 10 days after testing positive (officially by an Italian administrator) or until you test negative.  For me, I stayed an additional 5 days after the cruise until I tested negative.