Arvia Itinerary changes 30th April No Majorca

[Technoman2]

Here we go again. We are booked on Arvia for 30th April for a 14 day cruise . One of the ports was Majorca but this has been dropped due to operational reason and now we are going to Alicante  AGAIN  which is a nice port but i find it irksome that again 3 days after paying the final balance we are informed of this. Anymore changes and it will be a mystery tour cruise.

[Snow Hill]

43 minutes ago, Technoman2 said:

Here we go again. We are booked on Arvia for 30th April for a 14 day cruise . One of the ports was Majorca but this has been dropped due to operational reason and now we are going to Alicante  AGAIN  which is a nice port but i find it irksome that again 3 days after paying the final balance we are informed of this. Anymore changes and it will be a mystery tour cruise.

Possibly related to the Balearic Government’s decision to restrict the number of cruise ships to 3 a day, of which only 1 can be up to 5000 passengers, with total cruise passenger numbers across all 3 limited to 8000 a day. Arvia passenger capacity is 5200, which exceeds the maximum.

Edited February 4, 2023 by Snow Hill

[Technoman2]

19 minutes ago, Snow Hill said:

Possibly related to the Balearic Government’s decision to restrict the number of cruise ships to 3 a day, of which only 1 can be up to 5000 passengers, with total cruise passenger numbers across all 3 limited to 8000 a day. Arvia passenger capacity is 5200, which exceeds the maximum.

Thanks for the information.

[JeanieC,Aston]

This decision was made in Dec 21,,,,a special exception was made for ships already booked for 2022,,,upping the limit to 4 ships.

No exceptions will be made for 2023,,,the rule will last for 5;years.

 

On April 30th there are x3 ships in port…Mein Schiff 2,,Silver Dawn and Celebrity Edge.

[purplesea]

We're booked on Arvia in May and due to call in at Majorca. I have just checked what's in port and Celebrity Edge and MSC Seaview are also in on the same day, so we will see!!

[Technoman2]

3 hours ago, JeanieC,Aston said:

This decision was made in Dec 21,,,,a special exception was made for ships already booked for 2022,,,upping the limit to 4 ships.

No exceptions will be made for 2023,,,the rule will last for 5;years.

 

On April 30th there are x3 ships in port…Mein Schiff 2,,Silver Dawn and Celebrity Edge.

Sorry i should have clarified the cruise starts on 30th April but the stop at Majorca should have been 5th May now its Alicante. Dont Now why MSC seaview is listed on the link so many times. There only appears to be 3 ships and now only 2. Am i missing something.

https://www.cruisetimetables.com/visitingpalmademallorcaspain-05may2023.html

[dallas16]

33 minutes ago, Technoman2 said:

Sorry i should have clarified the cruise starts on 30th April but the stop at Majorca should have been 5th May now its Alicante. Dont Now why MSC seaview is listed on the link so many times. There only appears to be 3 ships and now only 2. Am i missing something.

https://www.cruisetimetables.com/visitingpalmademallorcaspain-05may2023.html

Arvia, Seaview and Celebrity Infinity are in port that day. Arvia and Seaview both have over 5000 passengers. Seaview embarks passengers as an homeport in Palma and is due in almost every time that Arvia is due in. All of the cruises will in theory change as only Seaview would be allowed. At the start of April , Seaview is in drydock I believe so Arvia is the only ship in port. Every other call clashes with Seaview and other large ships , for example Norwegian Epic also in port in September with Arvia and Seaview so both ships will have to cancel the port

[dallas16]

If only two ships were in port and one was Seaview and one Arvia, only one of these would be allowed due to the one  5000 passengers  megaship rule 

[Technoman2]

Bad planning then either with the port authority or P&O or maybe both. Does nobody speak to each other or maybe they need a new abacus to count how many passengers . The mind boggles.

[tring]

8 hours ago, Snow Hill said:

Possibly related to the Balearic Government’s decision to restrict the number of cruise ships to 3 a day, of which only 1 can be up to 5000 passengers, with total cruise passenger numbers across all 3 limited to 8000 a day. Arvia passenger capacity is 5200, which exceeds the maximum.

 

I fear this could be a growing problem, though I can also see the benefits of ports not allowing themselves to be totally overrun by cruise ship passengers. 

 

I know Key West are making restrictions and also Bar Harbour, which is on our North American Eastern Seaboard itinerary on Aurora in September and a ship of Aurora's size could well be cancelled off for there, given the proposals, so we are keeping our fingers crossed.  It  is a bit mean for the ports to take bookings for cruise ships and then changing their minds fairly near the time of the visit though.  The restrictions apply to the immediate season rather than some time o the future.

 

Barbara

 

Edited February 4, 2023 by tring

[tring]

13 minutes ago, Technoman2 said:

Bad planning then either with the port authority or P&O or maybe both. Does nobody speak to each other or maybe they need a new abacus to count how many passengers . The mind boggles.

 

It is just recent changes for the ports I know about which would not have been in place when the ships were booked into the port.  So for once it is not the cruise line's fault.  Of course Venice have already made restrictions on cruise ships as well, but the rumble about that possibly happening was well publicised.

 

 

Edited February 4, 2023 by tring

[Snow Hill]

15 minutes ago, tring said:

 

I fear this could be a growing problem, though I can also see the benefits of ports not allowing themselves to be totally overrun by cruise ship passengers. 

 

I know Key West are making restrictions and also Bar Harbour, which is on our North American Eastern Seaboard itinerary on Aurora in September and a ship of Aurora's size could well be cancelled off for there, given the proposals, so we are keeping our fingers crossed.  It  is a bit mean for the ports to take bookings for cruise ships and then changing their minds fairly near the time of the visit though.  The restrictions apply to the immediate season rather than some time o the future.

 

Barbara

 

So far I have seen restrictions in the Med for Venice, Palma Mallorca. Dubrovnik and Santorini. Discussions are being had in Marseilles and Barcelona, both on numbers and pollution from the ships, it is likely that others will follow suit as ships get larger and maritime cities feel they are getting swamped with cruise passengers. 
 

 

[tring]

14 minutes ago, Snow Hill said:

So far I have seen restrictions in the Med for Venice, Palma Mallorca. Dubrovnik and Santorini. Discussions are being had in Marseilles and Barcelona, both on numbers and pollution from the ships, it is likely that others will follow suit as ships get larger and maritime cities feel they are getting swamped with cruise passengers. 
 

 

 

Thanks for that, though must admit our travel to the Med is generally fairly limited by ship due to the excessive number of ships, so could be a step forward in our books.  We did a cruise in the Med on Azura last October, which included our first ever visit to Dubrovnik (which we were really looking forward to), but one short walk through with crowds and the fact everywhere seemed to be a souvenir outlets or cafes/restaurants (apart from the museums), left us having a drink and heading back to the ship.  It was a real turn of and must affect the ability of places like that to attract visitors for land based holidays.  We did the same in Corfu.

 

Edited February 4, 2023 by tring

[molecrochip]

Having booked the port calls 3 years ago, there was an expectation that a further exemption would be given however it appears this never materialised. If I understand correctly, the port authority have now cancelled that call. 

 

It is likely that further discussions are being had about the rest of the season.

[tring]

27 minutes ago, molecrochip said:

Having booked the port calls 3 years ago, there was an expectation that a further exemption would be given however it appears this never materialised. If I understand correctly, the port authority have now cancelled that call. 

 

It is likely that further discussions are being had about the rest of the season.

 

Thank you, useful to hear from the cruise line's point of view as we well, though be was unlikely to be their fault.  Possibly the calls could have been cancelled earlier, but I can see waiting longer may just have given the chance for a change of heart from the port.  I see that Ventura's US/Caribbean cruise in has had Key West cancelled and I knew it there were restrictions coming in there, which is interesting because we have booked that cruise for Jan 2025 and Key West was not on the itinerary, yet the other ports are identical.

 

I am also aware that Bar Harbour are planning fairly tight restrictions, albeit with some legal challenges when I last heard.  We are booked on the Aurora's Eastern Seaboard cruise next September, so are concerned we may loose that as a port call, so can I please ask if you are aware of any movements which may possibly affect our itinerary?  It would not be too bad if another port was to be substituted, but it seems Key West has just been replaced with a sea day for Ventura's cruise next month, so we are particularly concerned we may just loose a port,

 

Barbara

 

 

[molecrochip]

The problems is that the cruise lines book with the port authority 3-4 years ahead.

 

The local or national law bodies then create new laws restricting numbers of ships or passengers and this creates a massive problem.

 

Inevitably, this is a local issue for port authorities to resolve with their local or national bodies.

 

As I’ve said before, it’s for the port authority to cancel so that the cruise line don’t incur cancellation fees hence why it’s so late on.

[tring]

9 minutes ago, molecrochip said:

The problems is that the cruise lines book with the port authority 3-4 years ahead.

 

The local or national law bodies then create new laws restricting numbers of ships or passengers and this creates a massive problem.

 

Inevitably, this is a local issue for port authorities to resolve with their local or national bodies.

 

As I’ve said before, it’s for the port authority to cancel so that the cruise line don’t incur cancellation fees hence why it’s so late on.

 

Yes, I can see cancellation fees would be applied which is something I had not been thinking about over this.  The conflict between port authorities and local lawmakers is a difficult one though.

 

Thanks for the reply.

 

 

[Snow Hill]

10 hours ago, molecrochip said:

Having booked the port calls 3 years ago, there was an expectation that a further exemption would be given however it appears this never materialised. If I understand correctly, the port authority have now cancelled that call. 

 

It is likely that further discussions are being had about the rest of the season.

It was reported in 2021 that there would be no exceptions in 2023, would appear Balearic Government are sticking to that, giving port authorities no alternative but to cancel calls regardless of how long ago they were booked. 

 

https://cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-news/2021/12/palma-de-mallorca-introduces-new-cruise-ship-limits/

Edited February 5, 2023 by Snow Hill

[ann141]

9 hours ago, molecrochip said:

The problems is that the cruise lines book with the port authority 3-4 years ahead.

 

The local or national law bodies then create new laws restricting numbers of ships or passengers and this creates a massive problem.

 

Inevitably, this is a local issue for port authorities to resolve with their local or national bodies.

 

As I’ve said before, it’s for the port authority to cancel so that the cruise line don’t incur cancellation fees hence why it’s so late on.

We are on the 35 night cruise in February 2024 and it is still showing Key West as a port of call. I can now understand why P and O won't want to cancel it at the moment but could they perhaps have talks with the port authorities in Key West and at least have an idea of a possible substitute port. It seems unfair to keep advertising Key West as a port of call when it's highly likely that it will be cancelled at the last minute 

[Technoman2]

Thanks for all the contributions that have given me a better understanding of why this happens. But like Ann says it does seem unfair to keep advertising a port that is more than likely going to be cancelled. We had so much uncertainty with covid , these kind of issues just take the fun and expectation out of cruising. When i book a holiday to the canaries i dont expect the pilot to say sorry guys we are off to benidorm because the airport wont let us land in tenerife.

[jeanlyon]

Last time I was in Dubrovnik, we had a full day and evening.  We went over and it was so crowded with 5 ships in, we gave up and went back to the ship.  We then went ashore again at 6 and sat in the square having a glass of wine.  Nobody around and a guy came down and played the piano.  It was just lovely.  Such a shame everywhere is being ruined, but that's life.

[Pine Man]

22 minutes ago, jeanlyon said:

Such a shame everywhere is being ruined

🤣

[Megabear2]

59 minutes ago, jeanlyon said:

Last time I was in Dubrovnik, we had a full day and evening.  We went over and it was so crowded with 5 ships in, we gave up and went back to the ship.  We then went ashore again at 6 and sat in the square having a glass of wine.  Nobody around and a guy came down and played the piano.  It was just lovely.  Such a shame everywhere is being ruined, but that's life.

Ironic to say the least, surely you were helping doing the "ruining"?

[Pine Man]

35 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

Ironic to say the least, surely you were helping doing the "ruining"?

You said what I was thinking!

[molecrochip]

Often a substitute port will be lined up but if P&O publicise they might not be calling then they probably they loose out on any cancellation compensation.