Is it time to exit the "X"?

[Spif Barwunkel]

12 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

Not really.  We have different cruising styles.  I prefer to be by a window watching the sea.  Even when walking around the ship or by the bar.  Show me a window in the Martini Bar on E class.  I can tell you that I would have missed most of the sea life if there were not windows.  The sea life does not wait for you to go outside.

It is a known fact, those sea-life animals that do not like E-class ships, will wait for you to go outside when sailing on M and S class ships. Science thinks it has to do with the wake.

Edited July 28, 2023 by Spif Barwunkel

[NMTraveller]

4 minutes ago, C4HCG said:

Different styles you are right. Viewing sea life is nice but nowhere near the top of cruise priorities but clearly it is yours, each to their own.

What are your cruise priorities?

[C4HCG]

18 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

What are your cruise priorities?

Visiting parts of the world we wouldn’t see otherwise, travelling in luxury (which we think Celebrity offers, not getting into a debate on it, a personal view), reasonable food but not foodies, nice bars, good and varied entertainment, and an adult environment as in minimal number of kids running around wildly - entertainment geared for older people.

Edited July 28, 2023 by C4HCG

[C4HCG]

23 minutes ago, RichYak said:

To be fair, that was an in-kind response was to a completely ridiculous poster. The point is that to "watch the sea and world go by" you cannot do that in most indoor public spaces that you enjoy anyway. It's just different, more like a floating hotel than a ship. You asked where E-class falls short and IMO that's a big one. Either way, I can assure you that you won't have a bad time.

Was not meant to be unkind at all.

[OysterD]

41 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

1.  No Sky Lounge or forward looking view.

2.  Very few balconies.

3.  There are fewer bars on E class and they are larger and loud and shouty.  The martini bar on S class is much nicer than on E.  It is much easier to get a drink on S class.

4.  No Cellar Masters or World Class bar.

5.  There are very few windows while walking around the ship.  You do have views of the expensive stores.  Ugghh.

6.  You can easily take pictures from the lawn club while sailing into port from multiple angles.  The deck on E is obscured.

7.  The magic carpet is nice for excursions but it is overhyped as it is too windy when the ship is moving.

8. The specialty restaurants on E class tend to be more loud and shouty.  S class Muranos has rooms of rooms which are more intimate and quiet.

9.  I could add more but do not want to pile on.

1. We know you don't like the lack of a Sky Lounge, which as I've mentioned before doesn't bother me and probably won't bother most people (given how empty it always was on Reflection the last 2 times I've sailed on her). 

2. IV cabins have been debated ad nauseum. Some people love them, some like, some are indifferent and some hate. I'll try one for the first time in September and may change my mind then, but I will probably like it. I know I will enjoy the IV being more private. I was sick of hearing the old woman in the cabin next to me coughing her guts up everytime she sat on her balcony last year. Didn't love hearing phone conversations from people below and above. Didn't love being able to see the aforementioned old womans feet underneath the balcony divider or smell her nauseating perfume! 

3. There aren't fewer bars on E class compared to S class. I counted. 

4. There is a World Class Bar on Beyond and presumably there will be on Ascent. Losing Cellar Masters is no big loss, it was ALWAYS empty whenever I walked past last year and we didn't set foot inside for a drink, ambience was all wrong for a Mediterranean cruise. Far too dark and gloomy. I don't want to sit in what looks like a 19th Century London Gentleman's Club after returning from walking around Greece in 35c temps.

5. You mentioned views/windows in a previous post and I was tempted to reply to that but couldn't be bothered because it was so ridiculous I figured everyone else already thought the same...you posted a photo of a shop to claim that E class ships have no views. Please find a photo of a shop on any ship which has views, and why would you want views from a shop anyway?! S Class ships have just as many enclosed expensive pointless shops. There are very few windows on decks 3, 4 or 5 on S Class ships and looking at my photos of those decks, most of the windows had shades.

6. Not even sure what that means. Not once did I try standing in the middle of the lawn club and taking photos of ports or the shore. There were cabanas in the way. Why would anyone want to stand in the middle of any ship to take photos of the shore? Walk 20 yards to the edge of the ship! (Which is possible on E class btw, in lots and lots of places).

7. Looking forward to trying the magic carpet. Wind or no wind. 

8. We dined in Murano last year and decided we probably wouldn't again. Food was great, atmosphere was too stuffy and quiet. 

 

[Whinenowine]

1 hour ago, NMTraveller said:

Here is your view of the spouting whales and dolphins on E class.  Enjoy the sea life 🙂 🙂 

 

Ah the very rare Cartier whale (hunted to near extinction for its gold bracelet and rectangular shape)...usually found around pods of Beluga (caviar) whales and the occasional Blue (diamond) whale.  This is why I don't take the wife/daughters whale watching....to dangerous for my wallet.  😇

 

[OysterD]

1 hour ago, NMTraveller said:

10.  Grandiosity.  S class has a view to the sky in the public areas.  E class has a view of individual ceilings.

11.  On S class you feel like you are at sea.  On E class you feel like you are crusing inside of a strip mall.  On S class when I was not on the balcony (real balcony) and I was in other parts of the ship I had the at sea experience about 80% of the time.  On E class it was about 30 or less%.  Very few views from inside and not as many exits to go to the outside and walk around.

12.  E class has several hundred more people on board.  In the OVC they expanded it but it still feels crowded.  

13.  In Eden I had a difficult time finding a seat in the evening as it was crowded.  In the martini bar I also had a difficult time finding a seat.

14.  I view E class as the first step in the Royalfication of Celebrity.

15.  No usable libraries on E class.  S class has libraries and plenty of quiet areas to chill and relax.

 

 

In summary I would describe S class as quiet and refined vs E class crowded loud and shouty.  S class At Sea vibe vs E class sailing in the Hellen Keller strip mall with a lack of outward facing views.  S class as having more smaller and quieter public areas.  E class as having fewer and larger public areas and more loud and shouty.

 

 

Fab, there are more! 🙂

 

10. Actually, I'll probably give you that one. I do love the deck 3 to top of the ship open atrium on S Class ships, together with the glass lifts which run all the way up. 

 

11. Aww, back to having to disagree! Definitely can't see the sea from 80% of S Class interior public places. Not even close. Perhaps just have another look at a deck plan of an S Class ship and remember that there are just as many shops, art galleries, photo galleries, the casino, conference centre, celebrity central, more shops etc blocking any views out. I don't recall ever sitting anywhere on decks 3, 4 or 5 on Reflection to take in the 'view'.

 

12. S Class 122,000GT and 2,850 pax (Reflection 125,000GT and 3,047 pax). E Class 131,000GT and 2,918 (Beyond 141,000GT and 3,260 pax). Actually more interior space per passenger on E Class than S Class. Either way, Edge and Apex only carry 68 additional pax than most S Class ships but are 9,000GT larger.

 

13. I believe Eden can get crowded, we'll just have to get there early or stand. I agree, from what I've read maybe they should make the shows bookable or something to avoid the crowding. However, Martini bar on Reflection is much smaller and has far fewer seats around. On busy evenings it was very difficult finding a seat there. Luckily we eat later and stay up later so could normally find a seat by the time half the people had gone to bed!

 

14. Not sure how to respond to that one?!

 

15. I take one book with me, it's enough. So many people around the ships read on Kindle's or tablets, I'm not sure how much libraries are actually used now. Sure, there might be half a dozen people who might miss a library, but 5 or 6 people using it out of a ship of 3,000 probably isn't enough to warrant keeping them on new ship designs. Times change, people and habits change. The S Class ships were designed almost 20 years ago, before tablets and Kindles etc.  

 

We all like different things, and it's fine that you prefer S Class ships. But I sometimes wish people would preface blanket statements such as 'E Class ships are dreadful' with something like, 'in my humble opinion'. A lot of first time cruisers or new to Celebrity cruisers read these boards and when they see statements being extremely critical of something like a whole class of ships, (but don't have the context to realise that you're just very difficult to please! 😛 ) it can be quite off putting and make people nervous about an upcoming holiday they've just spent a lot of money on. I always believe there are two (or more) sides to every story and rarely take opinions on face value unless I've properly researched something or experienced it myself. Also figured it was worth rebutting some of your statements just to provide a bit of balance 🙂

 

[RichYak]

46 minutes ago, C4HCG said:

Was not meant to be unkind at all.

Sorry, to be clear, I wrote that NMTraveler's response was "in-kind", not that your response was "unkind", which I didn't think you were at all.

[OysterD]

2 hours ago, NMTraveller said:

Over the years we have seen many whales spouting,  dolphins following the ship,  beautiful sunsets all while walking around or sitting in public areas of the ship.  Not to mention the beautiful sunsets.  Mostly on S class.

 

I was thoroughly disappointed with the views on E...

 

 

I doubt you would have seen any of that from decks 3, 4 or 5. Dolphins following the ship could only be seen from the Sunset bar on S class and you must surely agree the sunset bars on E class are far superior, especially the one on Beyond? Also have the option of sitting in Eden to watch dolphins following the ship, no interior spaces on S class to do that. 

 

I'm looking forward to spending a lot of time at the massive Sunset bar on Beyond in September, also enjoying the outdoor space in the rooftop garden. As much of a novelty I find the grass on S Class, there's just nowhere to sit unless you find a blanket and sit on the ground. To me it's just wasted space. Much like the solstice deck which was rarely used by anyone, probably because it was very often windy and too far from a bar. 

 

Don't get me wrong, I love Reflection and S Class but there is more I'm looking forward to about trying Beyond. The changes made between S and E are probably the exact changes I'd make if I was given the job of coming up with a new class of ship. 

[NMTraveller]

52 minutes ago, OysterD said:

The changes made between S and E are probably the exact changes I'd make if I was given the job of coming up with a new class of ship. 

Let me help you.

 

"The changes made between S and E are probably the exact changes I'd make if I was given the job of coming up with a new class of ship" AND maximizing revenue.

 

The IVs are the most common complaint WHILE on an E class ship.  People expect a balcony and get an open/close window.  You normally don't hear too many complaints while on a cruise yet you do on E class.

 

I think that most of our differences are due to age and cruising preference.  To me Cellar Masters and Sky Lounge is a gem because it is not crowded.  To you it must be crowded to be useful.  Royal has all of the crowded venues one could ask for.

 

We will have to agree to disagree on the missing E class windows.  Show me windows in the Martini Bar on E.  We could go on and on with this one.  You spend most of your day outdoors during the day,  I spend more of mine in the AC.

 

You like crowded, I like to be able to talk to my DW and hear the conversation.

 

As far as exiting X.  I have seen more people try other lines.  As far as S vs E, I exited E class on my first cruise.  I will leave open the option of sailing E in a suite,  but will not in a non suite.

Edited July 28, 2023 by NMTraveller

[Gracie115]

Not only are there NO windows in the Martini Bar on E class ships it's more like a cavern at that bar.  Situated basically between 3 decks, not accessible except by stairs from the top as I remember, and very loud music a good bit of the time.  It is not a welcoming atmosphere although some enjoy it no doubt.  Not for us.  Much prefer the Ice Bar of the "S" class.  

 

Luminae on the E Class is closer to being a small MDR than a specialty restaurant for Suite class.  Ask the wait staff that have worked on both which they prefer. We sailed on Apex twice and the staff that we spoke with prefer the other classes. (they do like the crew quarters more on E class) Luminae is far smaller and more intimate on both M&S ships.  It is a VERY noisy room during busy hours and we were told that for the Beyond and Ascent it has been made even larger.  This REALLY detracted from the ambiance in the room.  

 

We found Eden impossible to find a seat for any show unless you showed up WELL in advance.  Most of the chairs have very low seats and are not particularly comfortable. The small "deli" type restaurant that serves lunch on sea days was good but again, if you didn't show up well before noon it was basically a "to go" experience as there was no seating available at a table.

 

Something good?  The theater.  It is amazing, best we've seen at sea.  Also, although we did not like the ship itself the staff did their best to take care of all the guests.  Our room attendant, butler, wait staff were wonderful.  We hope we encounter them again sometime but it will have to be on a different class as we have no plans at all to sail on the E class again. This class, in our opinion, was built for younger demographic and it appears they have achieved that.  

[Spif Barwunkel]

1 hour ago, Gracie115 said:

Not only are there NO windows in the Martini Bar on E class ships it's more like a cavern at that bar.  Situated basically between 3 decks, not accessible except by stairs from the top as I remember, and very loud music a good bit of the time.  It is not a welcoming atmosphere although some enjoy it no doubt.  Not for us.  Much prefer the Ice Bar of the "S" class.  

 

Luminae on the E Class is closer to being a small MDR than a specialty restaurant for Suite class.  Ask the wait staff that have worked on both which they prefer. We sailed on Apex twice and the staff that we spoke with prefer the other classes. (they do like the crew quarters more on E class) Luminae is far smaller and more intimate on both M&S ships.  It is a VERY noisy room during busy hours and we were told that for the Beyond and Ascent it has been made even larger.  This REALLY detracted from the ambiance in the room.  

 

We found Eden impossible to find a seat for any show unless you showed up WELL in advance.  Most of the chairs have very low seats and are not particularly comfortable. The small "deli" type restaurant that serves lunch on sea days was good but again, if you didn't show up well before noon it was basically a "to go" experience as there was no seating available at a table.

 

Something good?  The theater.  It is amazing, best we've seen at sea.  Also, although we did not like the ship itself the staff did their best to take care of all the guests.  Our room attendant, butler, wait staff were wonderful.  We hope we encounter them again sometime but it will have to be on a different class as we have no plans at all to sail on the E class again. This class, in our opinion, was built for younger demographic and it appears they have achieved that.  

Here is the perfect example of this threads title. Is it time to exit the 'X', or cruise only on the 'S' & 'M' class ships? It's okay not having the ability or the desire to contemporize. Celebrity will continue to offer beautiful ships to those who dislike change while at the same time moving forward in space and time, for the sake and enjoyment of everyone.

Edited July 28, 2023 by Spif Barwunkel

[doghog]

4 hours ago, Gracie115 said:

Martini Bar on E class ships it's more like a cavern at that bar.  Situated basically between 3 decks, not accessible except by stairs

You can take the elevators down to deck 3. Walk past Guest Relations (port side) and into the Martini Bar. 

[NMTraveller]

1 minute ago, davehathy said:

You can take the elevators down to deck 3. Walk past Guest Relations (port side) and into the Martini Bar. 

It is still more of a stadium than a bar ...

[doghog]

2 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

It is still more of a stadium than a bar ...

We like it. Plenty of ringside seating. 

[NMTraveller]

1 hour ago, davehathy said:

We like it. Plenty of ringside seating. 

So how do you get ringside seating 🙂 

 

Asking for a friend.  In my experience all of the first level seating was filled and we had to go up a level or so.  At least that was the case for us in early dining and coming back later.

Edited July 29, 2023 by NMTraveller

[NMTraveller]

12 hours ago, C4HCG said:

Verging on to the ridiculous now. If we want to watch the sea and the world go by we go to an outdoor area on the Equinox, we will do the same on the Edge. We use the inside areas evening and night.  You are unwittingly giving us more and more confidence that we will love Edge class.

And yet you asked for the difference between S Class and E Class.  If you are already a fan why ask why?  The E class inside does not have the view that S class does.  If you find different please post the pictures and post the pictures of the whales spouting through these windows on the interiors.  We want E class pictures...  Good luck ...

[swigso]

@OysterD I love your responses, you will have a great time the ship is beautiful.l remember when the Solstice was first muted the boards lit up. “Will never sail on those class of ship” was the theme. But hey ho many years later the same class is being praised. People tend to like what they know but I have been sailing with X since the Summit was new and will continue whatever ship we choose. The only thing that may change our view is if they allow vaping inside.

Have a great cruise 🛳👍

[C4HCG]

2 hours ago, NMTraveller said:

And yet you asked for the difference between S Class and E Class.  If you are already a fan why ask why?  The E class inside does not have the view that S class does.  If you find different please post the pictures and post the pictures of the whales spouting through these windows on the interiors.  We want E class pictures...  Good luck ...

You’ve lost me. Not already a fan of E class, never sailed it, all I said was we would sail open minded and nothing you’d said we either didn’t know, or it didn’t put us off. The view from inside is not a big deal to us. 

[Gracie115]

5 hours ago, NMTraveller said:

So how do you get ringside seating 🙂 

 

Asking for a friend.  In my experience all of the first level seating was filled and we had to go up a level or so.  At least that was the case for us in early dining and coming back later.

 

Same here...every time

[Gracie115]

7 hours ago, davehathy said:

You can take the elevators down to deck 3. Walk past Guest Relations (port side) and into the Martini Bar. 

 

True but I also seem to remember that the actual bar area is still not accessible for those who may be in wheelchairs.  There are a few steps up to the bar area itself.  I don't remember a ramp to get to that area, is there one?  Neither of us use a wheelchair but last fall on the Apex I was recovering from hip surgery and still using a cane, didn't like this area for several reasons but the  lack of  access was one of them.

[NMTraveller]

1 hour ago, Gracie115 said:

 

Same here...every time

We also had a difficult time finding seating in Eden for the evening shows...

Edited July 29, 2023 by NMTraveller

[cruising43]

I'm in the middle group that would like to cruise with Celebrity, when and if I can find a cruise that fits the budget.  Inflated pricing is daunting.

[Gracie115]

1 hour ago, cruising43 said:

I'm in the middle group that would like to cruise with Celebrity, when and if I can find a cruise that fits the budget.  Inflated pricing is daunting.

Boy is THAT ever an understatement.

Edited July 29, 2023 by Gracie115

[doghog]

10 hours ago, NMTraveller said:

So how do you get ringside seating 🙂 

 

Asking for a friend.  In my experience all of the first level seating was filled and we had to go up a level or so.  At least that was the case for us in early dining and coming back later.

Tell your friend 😉 that we also had early dining. 6:00 PM on the Apex, March 2023. We always arrived at the MB  around 5:00 P.M. and gone by 5:45 P.M.  We never had a problem getting a good seat and service.