Are these two the same?

[sjde]

There is a Danube cruise  I was told about for next year on Amadeus Silver III. I can't seem to find that company and am wondering if it's the same as AMA (Amadeus) Waterways.

[Haqdeluxe]

46 minutes ago, sjde said:

There is a Danube cruise  I was told about for next year on Amadeus Silver III. I can't seem to find that company and am wondering if it's the same as AMA (Amadeus) Waterways.

Amadeus is the cruise line. Silver lll is one of their ships. 

[Host Jazzbeau]

19 hours ago, sjde said:

wondering if it's the same as AMA (Amadeus) Waterways.

AmaWaterways is a different company from Amadeus.  AMA was originally known as Amadeus but there was a copyright dispute and AMA was forced to change their name to AmaWaterways.

 

Amadeus Silver III was built in 2016; it is 135m long and holds 168 passengers.  It is operated by Lüftner Cruises of Austria.  The most recent Berlitz guide gave it 4 stars.

 

AmaWaterways' newer 135m ships have 156 passengers and are rated 4 1/2 stars.

 

I'm not sure if Lüftner cruises are multi-lingual or only German – but you may be looking at a full-ship charter which would probably be in English if you are seeing it advertised in the US.

[CastleCritic]

The only other user Im aware of for AMAWaterways ships is APT (Australian Pacific Touring).  AMA provides the ships for their cruises.

[Host Jazzbeau]

Just now, CastleCritic said:

The only other user Im aware of for AMAWaterways ships is APT (Australian Pacific Touring).  AMA provides the ships for their cruises.

There is some cross-ownership between AmaWaterways and APT, just as there is (was?) between APT and Noble Caledonia.  Tangled webs in cruise line financing!

[CastleCritic]

3 minutes ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

There is some cross-ownership between AmaWaterways and APT, just as there is (was?) between APT and Noble Caledonia.  Tangled webs in cruise line financing!

Apparently, Yes, the always accurately Wikipedia has this to say 

 

In 2005, APT entered another expanding travel market when the company invested in river cruise business AmaWaterways, in partnership with longtime friend and North American tour expert, Jimmy Murphy and cruising expert, Rudi Schriner.

 

Jimmy Murphy has since passed away but Rudi and and other Co-Owner Kristin Karst are still running the company.

 

They are private so I have no idea if they ever bought APT back out.

[sjde]

Thank you. Their prices seem much more reasonable than the usual river cruise lines normally seen on these boards, with the possible exception of Gate 1 and Grand Circle.

[steamboats]

To make it more confusing... When AMAWaterways started out they chartered river cruise ships from Lueftner which were by then already named "Amadeus...". Hence the name Amadeus Waterways. Then AMAWaterways started to build their own ships and had to change the company name from Amadeus Waterways to AMAWaterways.

 

BTW Amadeus by Lueftner is multi-lingual. They also have brand new ships like the Amadeus Riva which entered service this spring.

 

steamboats

[steamboats]

4 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

Amadeus Silver III was built in 1996; it is 135m long and holds 168 passengers.  It is operated by Lüftner Cruises of Austria.  The most recent Berlitz guide gave it 4 stars.

 

The Amadeus Silver III is built in 2016 - see here.

 

steamboats

[CastleCritic]

8 hours ago, sjde said:

Thank you. Their prices seem much more reasonable than the usual river cruise lines normally seen on these boards, with the possible exception of Gate 1 and Grand Circle.

I dont know the first thing about them, but take a close look at what their fare includes and what they charge extra for.

 

One good thing about AMAwaterways is that ALL their excursions are included. This isnt true of viking for example.  This can add up quickly.

[Host Jazzbeau]

13 hours ago, steamboats said:

 

The Amadeus Silver III is built in 2016 - see here.

 

steamboats

Yes, you're right.  I lost track from one screen to the next...

 

I corrected my post above to avoid confusion.

[Coral]

When I sailed Amawaterways - it was known as Amadeus..... It was confusing back then.

[terry&mike]

My cousin, who is also in the travel industry, sailed an Amadeus river ship last Fall; she brought along my Aunt. She enjoyed the sailing and thought the ship was very nice, and that everything onboard was quite well done. The ship was multi-lingual, and she had no problems with communication. She felt the style and service were slightly below that of most of the major river lines that market in the US (AMA, Scenic, Viking, Uniworld), but she would not hesitate to sail with them again. There were only a few passengers from the US onboard, but she did not see that as a negative herself (some may). From hearing her verbal review upon review, it sounded a lot like the CroisiEurope river cruise experience, very good, but a little different experience than Americans are used to having - in my mind, this is a plus, but I am aware that not everyone has the same perspective. 

[sjde]

So are you saying that the European lines like CroisieEurope , Amadeus , Riviera are not as upscale as the American lines  like Viking and AMA? 

[steamboats]

40 minutes ago, sjde said:

So are you saying that the European lines like CroisieEurope , Amadeus , Riviera are not as upscale as the American lines  like Viking and AMA? 

 

Nope, but I also wouldn´t say that Viking is upscale. For German/European river cruise lines there´s a different concept. No drinks included (except for VIVA or A-Rosa when you book the Premium fare), no excursions included...

 

steamboats

[terry&mike]

1 hour ago, sjde said:

So are you saying that the European lines like CroisieEurope , Amadeus , Riviera are not as upscale as the American lines  like Viking and AMA? 

I'll try to answer that as best I can, keeping in mind that every line has its loyalists, and sometimes a person will rate one line well above another line based on that line is a better fit for their personality, and they relate more to the vibe; kind of like hotels have their guest "tribes" it's the same for cruise lines and river cruise lines. 

 

A lot of it has to do with familiarity, so the lines of CroisiEurope which is French owned and sells mostly to the European market will offer a more French and European feel, and Amadeus which is Austrian owned and sells mostly to a European market, especially Germans, will have a different feel; these lines don't market heavily in the U.S. and will have a limited number of US passengers on board.The general ambience and protocol are not geared to the US market, not bad, just different. 

 

Viking, while foreign owned, does major marketing in the US and draws the majority of its clients from there, and offers a product very geared to those clients; I would like to add that I do not consider Viking river upscale in comparison with Scenic and AMA (who I do consider upscale), but a very nice product, although Viking loyalists may revolt at this. Scenic (and their little sister Emerald) is also foreign owned, but in the past few years has made major strides in the US market and is now pulling a large portion of their clients from the US. AMA is US owned, mostly markets in the US, and mostly has US clients. Products that mostly have US clients are catering to, geared to, and courting that market with food, service, tours, style, and so on. Sometimes it's in the little things, for example, I love a dirty vodka martini, generally speaking this is an American cocktail (although it can be found all over the world). On an AMA ship I am able to order a dirty vodka martini and have one served to me without much pause, and it will likely be right. On a foreign owned and marketed ship, they may have to Google how to make it, or it could be not quite right, such as the time a bartender used olive oil instead of olive brine to add the dirty (the drink got remade, and the bartender and I became fast friends over this connection). Announcements may be in German first, and English second. I find this kind of thing fun and interesting about travel, I have clients who find this kind of thing frustrating. 

 

To answer your question, I would say that for upscale river cruise lines, I put Scenic at the top, giving them just a bit of an edge over AMA. I'd probably put Emerald next, and Uniworld (although their decor may drive you crazy). Then I'd put Viking, as they offer a stable product that many are comfortable with. Then I guess I'd put foreign lines next, as I think for some Americans the experience may feel a bit more foreign to them, and it'd probably look like Amadeus, then Croisi, then Riviera. That's just personal perspective based on my personal sailings and feedback from other travel agents and from clients over the years, many people may feel differently. 

Edited July 6, 2023 by terry&mike
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[sjde]

And there are others- Avalon, Gate 1, Tauck….

[pontac]

16 hours ago, terry&mike said:

I'll try to answer that as best I can, keeping in mind that every line has its loyalists, and sometimes a person will rate one line well above another line based on that line is a better fit for their personality, and they relate more to the vibe; kind of like hotels have their guest "tribes" it's the same for cruise lines and river cruise lines. 

 

Very thoughtful and true.

 

16 hours ago, terry&mike said:

Viking, while foreign owned, does major marketing in the US and draws the majority of its clients from there

 

Viking markets different boats to different markets, so if one were to book a cruise with Viking USA the boat used may be full of US passengers. That's not necessarily true of boats marketed in other countries. (unsold places may be offered to other countries near cruise time. It happened to me, I went on a boat not listed on the Viking UK site and we found ourselves one of 6 Brits on a boat of Americans. Lovely people, I'm not complaining, just saying.)

 

16 hours ago, terry&mike said:

I would like to add that I do not consider Viking river upscale in comparison with Scenic

 

As your first para goes, this is a personal choice. I took a Viking and a Scenic cruise last year and I thought the Viking was more upscale. Depends on measurement criteria, and cabin booked. And cost!

[sjde]

 

 

 RE: I took a Viking and a Scenic cruise last year and I thought the Viking was more upscale. Depends on measurement criteria, and cabin booked. And cost!"

 

And I've taken 2 GCCL (Grand Circle Cruise Lines) and 3 AMA river cruises and didn't see much difference, outside of GCCL was about 1/3 the cost!  And only has twin beds. They save by not using travel agents and by not advertising (except to past guests ) and pass those savings onto guests.

Edited July 7, 2023 by sjde