Frustration with P&O re Vaccine Exemption Certificate

[Selbourne]

Forgive my rant, but this has really irritated me. 
 

My wife and I are going on the 65 night Aurora cruise (America and Caribbean Discovery) departing 3rd January, for which there is a compulsory requirement to have a yellow fever vaccination or an exemption certificate. I have had the jab and as my wife has Multiple Sclerosis she has been exempted on medical advice.

 

The little yellow certificate booklet that they give you when you have the jab also has a specific page for those who have had a medical exemption, so my wife’s booklet has been completed and stamped on that page (photo below with my wife’s name blanked out). 
 

We have received quite a few emails and prompts from both P&O and our TA to say that anyone who is travelling but hasn’t had the vaccination must have an exemption certificate to be allowed to board, which we assumed this was. However, all these communications continually refer to the exemption certificate as being a letter from your GP, on headed paper. All the information that must be on this letter is contained on the exemption certificate that we already have. 
 

As I know that last year 40 or so passengers were denied boarding due to not having the correct documentation, I asked our TA to clarify with P&O that we didn’t need a GP letter, as my wife has an official yellow fever exemption, signed and dated, in a yellow fever vaccination booklet, with the info that they require. P&O claim to know nothing about this and say that we must have a GP letter. Thankfully we have a first class GP surgery, but it irritates me that when they are already under pressure I will be adding to their workload by asking them to write a pointless letter when we already have an official signed and stamped exemption that P&O claim to know nothing about. Utterly stupid, but we can’t afford the risk of of being denied boarding. Rant over. 

[CarlaMarie]

I am not surprised you are frustrated with this. I just read the guidance about it on the website and even that seems very contradictory, plus they seem to want alot of information in the letter. 

 

You must provide the original certificate which must be fully completed, signed and stamped by the medical practitioner. The vaccination must be given 10 days before entering a yellow fever area for it to be effective and valid. If a yellow fever vaccination is contraindicated for a medical reason an exemption can be issued by your medical practitioner and this must be brought with you to the ship. Local port health authorities will decide if a vaccination waiver can be issued. The exemption should either be documented in the international vaccination booklet or on a headed letter. The letter should be signed by the clinician and contain the practice stamp. Your name, date of birth and dates of travel must be included in the letter. Guests without the correct documentation will be denied boarding.

[gsmt47471015]

As somebody who had this issue in January I now know that nothing but an official gp or yellow fever clinic exemption certificate ( or the vaccination) will suffice .

We have paid for said exemption certificates as we do not want to be treated like naughty schoolchildren again ,even though P and O have said we do not need them for our upcoming world cruise , just as they never told us we DID need them for the aurora cruise in January!

Believe me this time we will be taking no chances and have our shoe size, waist size and inside leg measurements amongst other things .

The attitude at Southampton in January was nothing short of diabolical, also I believe the number who had to make alternative arrangements to be more than 40 , some losing the whole trip🤢    

[Selbourne]

11 minutes ago, gsmt47471015 said:

We have paid for said exemption certificates

Are they different to the official Yellow Fever Exemption certificate that my wife was given (as in the photo) that P&O don’t seem to recognise?

[Selbourne]

22 minutes ago, CarlaMarie said:

The exemption should either be documented in the international vaccination booklet or on a headed letter.

Now that’s very interesting. My wife’s exemption is in the international vaccination booklet so, according to that info, what we have is acceptable - yet when my TA called P&O today they said only a GP letter would suffice. Left hand, right hand.
 

Much as I like the on board experience and staff on the P&O ships, their shoreside staff are as useless as a chocolate fire guard when it comes to things like this 😡

[yorkshirephil]

This seems to be another case of P&O making it up as they go along, and it is not as if they don't have years of experience with this issue.

[Winifred 22]

Just wondered was the exemption certificate signed by a doctor or other health care professional? Is it P &O are insisting on evidence signed by a doctor ? Which is why they want the G P letter ? 

[Selbourne]

6 minutes ago, Winifred 22 said:

Just wondered was the exemption certificate signed by a doctor or other health care professional? Is it P &O are insisting on evidence signed by a doctor ? Which is why they want the G P letter ? 

The exemption certificate was signed by the dispensing pharmacist at a Boots Travel Clinic who was the one who administered my yellow fever vaccine, so presumably he is covered to do this or wouldn’t be working in a hub dispensing such vaccinations and certificates. I had my other (precautionary rather than mandatory) jabs today and that was just done by a nurse.

[Winifred 22]

4 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

The exemption certificate was signed by the dispensing pharmacist at a Boots Travel Clinic who was the one who administered my yellow fever vaccine, so presumably he is covered to do this or wouldn’t be working in a hub dispensing such vaccinations and certificates. I had my other (precautionary rather than mandatory) jabs today and that was just done by a nurse.

I don’t doubt for one minute he is not licensed  to do this but it seems P &O are requiring an exemption letter / certificate signed by a G P which may be what Port Health authorities require. I have noted your issues and will be prepared for my cruise next year. 

[yorkshirephil]

16 minutes ago, Winifred 22 said:

I don’t doubt for one minute he is not licensed  to do this but it seems P &O are requiring an exemption letter / certificate signed by a G P which may be what Port Health authorities require. I have noted your issues and will be prepared for my cruise next year. 

It seems odd that P&O are asking for a GP certificate which effectively says the same as the official exemption certificate. These certificates are accepted around the world, I am not sure I would be happy rolling up at a port in some far flung country with a letter from my doctor and the border control people saying it is a meaningless piece of paper where is your official certificate. I do wonder if someone at P&O is getting confused? as it is not like such things don't happen too often.

[CarlaMarie]

51 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

Now that’s very interesting. My wife’s exemption is in the international vaccination booklet so, according to that info, what we have is acceptable - yet when my TA called P&O today they said only a GP letter would suffice. Left hand, right hand.
 

Much as I like the on board experience and staff on the P&O ships, their shoreside staff are as useless as a chocolate fire guard when it comes to things like this 😡

 

It is a good job that you checked with your TA, because if the requirements have changed then many passengers in the same situation as your wife could be denied boarding. 

 

I never understand why P&O create so much confusion with conflicting advice. Transparency is so important and I am sure that passengers would understand for example if P&O were to say "the vaccination booklet is normally accepted however in some ports a GP letter is recommended so please carry both". 

 

This is the link from which I copied that information: 

 

https://www.pocruises.com/essential-information/travel-information#:~:text=If a yellow fever vaccination,with you to the ship.

 

 

[Megabear2]

Certainly something to note for the future.  Assumedly you had to pay for this exemption certificate as when I looked into it when I considered this cruise last year I was quoted a fee.  If I had to get a GP leter on top that would have been another £75.  Seemed a large expense to acquire the second letter to say the same thing so I chose to do something else instead.

[gsmt47471015]

We paid £25 pp for the official gp letter , in January we were lucky? That our gp e mailed us with a covering letter stating our exemption with fifteen minutes left before our luggage was to be removed from the ship  , we are taking no chances this time and that’s why we have paid for the official letter , even though P and O have said we don’t need one , I just don’t believe anything they tell us tbh

[terrierjohn]

2 hours ago, Selbourne said:

Forgive my rant, but this has really irritated me. 
 

My wife and I are going on the 65 night Aurora cruise (America and Caribbean Discovery) departing 3rd January, for which there is a compulsory requirement to have a yellow fever vaccination or an exemption certificate. I have had the jab and as my wife has Multiple Sclerosis she has been exempted on medical advice.

 

The little yellow certificate booklet that they give you when you have the jab also has a specific page for those who have had a medical exemption, so my wife’s booklet has been completed and stamped on that page (photo below with my wife’s name blanked out). 
 

We have received quite a few emails and prompts from both P&O and our TA to say that anyone who is travelling but hasn’t had the vaccination must have an exemption certificate to be allowed to board, which we assumed this was. However, all these communications continually refer to the exemption certificate as being a letter from your GP, on headed paper. All the information that must be on this letter is contained on the exemption certificate that we already have. 
 

As I know that last year 40 or so passengers were denied boarding due to not having the correct documentation, I asked our TA to clarify with P&O that we didn’t need a GP letter, as my wife has an official yellow fever exemption, signed and dated, in a yellow fever vaccination booklet, with the info that they require. P&O claim to know nothing about this and say that we must have a GP letter. Thankfully we have a first class GP surgery, but it irritates me that when they are already under pressure I will be adding to their workload by asking them to write a pointless letter when we already have an official signed and stamped exemption that P&O claim to know nothing about. Utterly stupid, but we can’t afford the risk of of being denied boarding. Rant over. 

 I think your GP will want to charge you for the letter.

[Selbourne]

22 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

Certainly something to note for the future.  Assumedly you had to pay for this exemption certificate as when I looked into it when I considered this cruise last year I was quoted a fee.  If I had to get a GP leter on top that would have been another £75.  Seemed a large expense to acquire the second letter to say the same thing so I chose to do something else instead.

There was a fee for the exemption certificate. I can’t remember what it was because the very nice pharmacist said that he would waive it. When you say you did something else, do you mean you booked a different cruise that didn’t have the requirement, or did you come up with a cunning plan to circumvent the bureaucracy?  

[Selbourne]

9 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

 I think your GP will want to charge you for the letter.

Quite possibly John, although they didn’t mention a fee when they gave me an email address to send the request do. I doubt that they will do it for nothing though and I don’t blame them. This will add to my irritation with P&O, as I remain convinced that my wife already has the official exemption certificate and our TA has been given duff info by P&O saying that we also need a GP letter. 
 

I wonder if @molecrochip has any knowledge of this?

[Bill Y]

4 hours ago, Selbourne said:

Forgive my rant, but this has really irritated me. 
 

My wife and I are going on the 65 night Aurora cruise (America and Caribbean Discovery) departing 3rd January, for which there is a compulsory requirement to have a yellow fever vaccination or an exemption certificate. I have had the jab and as my wife has Multiple Sclerosis she has been exempted on medical advice.

 

The little yellow certificate booklet that they give you when you have the jab also has a specific page for those who have had a medical exemption, so my wife’s booklet has been completed and stamped on that page (photo below with my wife’s name blanked out). 
 

We have received quite a few emails and prompts from both P&O and our TA to say that anyone who is travelling but hasn’t had the vaccination must have an exemption certificate to be allowed to board, which we assumed this was. However, all these communications continually refer to the exemption certificate as being a letter from your GP, on headed paper. All the information that must be on this letter is contained on the exemption certificate that we already have. 
 

As I know that last year 40 or so passengers were denied boarding due to not having the correct documentation, I asked our TA to clarify with P&O that we didn’t need a GP letter, as my wife has an official yellow fever exemption, signed and dated, in a yellow fever vaccination booklet, with the info that they require. P&O claim to know nothing about this and say that we must have a GP letter. Thankfully we have a first class GP surgery, but it irritates me that when they are already under pressure I will be adding to their workload by asking them to write a pointless letter when we already have an official signed and stamped exemption that P&O claim to know nothing about. Utterly stupid, but we can’t afford the risk of of being denied boarding. Rant over. 

I am sorry that P&O are putting you through this they have history on demanding documentation that is no longer relevant. In 2000 I was given six injections including yellow fever by the company nurse and a company booklet detailing this when I visited Brazil in 2000, in those days I had to work for a living. In about 2013 I visited my GP practice nurse as I was going to Brazil again, I was told that as I was now in my sixties there could be side affects and I would be exempt and given a “contraindication” letter /certificate. I had the impression that this would be issued just due to the fact that I was in my sixties. I did not ask for one as vaccination was only recommended not mandatory. In 2015 we went on P&O cruise to Brazil. P&O were totally incapable of discussing the entry requirements for Brazil and would only parrot that it was compulsory, In fact the entry requirements for Brazil was irrelevant but most Caribbean island regarded Brazil as a yellow fever zone so required evidence of vaccination if having visited there recently.  We visited the practice nurse again as DW had not had any YF vaccination, I had been told that my 2000 one still give me protection. We were expecting to be given the “contraindication” letter /certificate but there was a volte face and we were advised to have the vaccination and we were given the yellow booklets. Until you mentioned it I had no idea that it included an exception page I notice this has to be signed by a “supervising clinician” not a Doctor, so I would conclude that this supersedes the aforementioned “contraindication” letter /certificate. We are now in the realms of P&O setting themselves up as the regulating authority which I suppose as the suppler of the holiday they can under their T&C’s demand anything they want (as in the Monty Python sketch re BR and their restrictions on tickets). I don’t know if P&O to cover their backs want a Doctors signature as “Winifred 22” suggests, The P&O term practitioner is wide spread and vague these days. Unfortunately for peace of mind you have little option to obtain this letter that will probably not see the light of day.

 

I have just noticed that the 2024 65 nights grand tour does not go to Brazil so do not know what triggers the YF requirement.

[Megabear2]

8 hours ago, Selbourne said:

There was a fee for the exemption certificate. I can’t remember what it was because the very nice pharmacist said that he would waive it. When you say you did something else, do you mean you booked a different cruise that didn’t have the requirement, or did you come up with a cunning plan to circumvent the bureaucracy?  

I chose not to go with P&O and looked elsewhere.  I can confirm virtually every line I looked at favours this belt and braces approach on their UK booking terms, and I found a great many archived CC threads going back years where this topic had been raised.  I would say it's a known situation and as a result the cruise lines should be very much more on top of it and explain it in the minutiae at the time a booking is being made.  Unfortunately the onus is left more or less entirely on the passengers who can become extremely confused. I found one thread on the Cunard board of a guy booked on a WC section going nowhere near a YF area but told 8 days before sailing he had to have a YF certificate or exemption despite that.  He was understandably completely confused.

[Selbourne]

9 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

I chose not to go with P&O and looked elsewhere.  I can confirm virtually every line I looked at favours this belt and braces approach on their UK booking terms, and I found a great many archived CC threads going back years where this topic had been raised.  I would say it's a known situation and as a result the cruise lines should be very much more on top of it and explain it in the minutiae at the time a booking is being made.  Unfortunately the onus is left more or less entirely on the passengers who can become extremely confused. I found one thread on the Cunard board of a guy booked on a WC section going nowhere near a YF area but told 8 days before sailing he had to have a YF certificate or exemption despite that.  He was understandably completely confused.

Very interesting. This thread has been extremely useful, especially the info that @CarlaMarie posted from P&Os small print, which confirms that the exemption certificate in the international vaccination booklet, which is what my wife already has, is acceptable. However, out of the countless emails that we have had about the yellow fever requirement, not a single one has referred to this and all bar none has insisted that we need a letter from our GP. The bloody minded side of me is tempted not to pay for this letter and at check in just show the certificate and if they try to refuse boarding point to their own website info which confirms that we are OK. However, whilst I would be prepared to take them to the cleaners legally if they still denied us boarding, it would mean that we would have lost the holiday completely. Flying out to join the cruise at Madeira (the first stop) is simply not an option for us. I might, as a point of principle, try to reclaim the cost of the unnecessary GP letter from P&O. Like you I now have a contact in the executive office. I think I might alert them to this nonsense anyway. 

[Megabear2]

45 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

Very interesting. This thread has been extremely useful, especially the info that @CarlaMarie posted from P&Os small print, which confirms that the exemption certificate in the international vaccination booklet, which is what my wife already has, is acceptable. However, out of the countless emails that we have had about the yellow fever requirement, not a single one has referred to this and all bar none has insisted that we need a letter from our GP. The bloody minded side of me is tempted not to pay for this letter and at check in just show the certificate and if they try to refuse boarding point to their own website info which confirms that we are OK. However, whilst I would be prepared to take them to the cleaners legally if they still denied us boarding, it would mean that we would have lost the holiday completely. Flying out to join the cruise at Madeira (the first stop) is simply not an option for us. I might, as a point of principle, try to reclaim the cost of the unnecessary GP letter from P&O. Like you I now have a contact in the executive office. I think I might alert them to this nonsense anyway. 

@CarlaMarie's wording is also that used by Cunard, this from a 2017 post by a contributor on that forum (my bold):

 

"Important Reminder - Yellow Fever Vaccination**

We hope you are looking forward to joining us on board. We would just like to take a final opportunity to remind you that a yellow fever

vaccination is required for this cruise. Failure to provide a valid International Vaccination Certificate may result in you being denied boarding or

being asked to leave the ship before the relevant port of call. The vaccination must be given 10 days before entering a yellow fever area in order

for it to be effective and valid. If yellow fever vaccination is contraindicated for medical reasons an exemption can be issued by your Medical

Practitioner and this must be brought with you to the ship. Local Port Health Officials will then decide if a vaccination waiver can be issued. The

exemption should be either detailed in a headed letter or recorded in the International Certificate of Vaccination. It should be signed by the

clinician and include the practice stamp. We look forward to welcoming you on board."

[Selbourne]

4 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

@CarlaMarie's wording is also that used by Cunard, this from a 2017 post by a contributor on that forum (my bold):

 

"Important Reminder - Yellow Fever Vaccination**

We hope you are looking forward to joining us on board. We would just like to take a final opportunity to remind you that a yellow fever

vaccination is required for this cruise. Failure to provide a valid International Vaccination Certificate may result in you being denied boarding or

being asked to leave the ship before the relevant port of call. The vaccination must be given 10 days before entering a yellow fever area in order

for it to be effective and valid. If yellow fever vaccination is contraindicated for medical reasons an exemption can be issued by your Medical

Practitioner and this must be brought with you to the ship. Local Port Health Officials will then decide if a vaccination waiver can be issued. The

exemption should be either detailed in a headed letter or recorded in the International Certificate of Vaccination. It should be signed by the

clinician and include the practice stamp. We look forward to welcoming you on board."

Yep, so that’s the same as what the P&O info on their website says. Interesting that not a single one of the countless messages that we have received says that the exemption in the international certificate of vaccination is acceptable and when asked directly they say that it isn’t. As I said earlier, left hand, right hand stuff. 

[cruising.mark.uk]

Just a thought.  Do you and your wife use the NHS App?  And, if so, is not the fact that she is exempt recorded on here records on there?  If it is, I would have thought that would negate the need for a letter from your GP to support the hard copy certificate.  It might be worth exploring that option with your executive office contact as well.

[Selbourne]

1 minute ago, cruising.mark.uk said:

Just a thought.  Do you and your wife use the NHS App?  And, if so, is not the fact that she is exempt recorded on here records on there?  If it is, I would have thought that would negate the need for a letter from your GP to support the hard copy certificate.  It might be worth exploring that option with your executive office contact as well.

Yes we use the app and no it doesn’t show! The really annoying thing is that I know that what we already have is the proper documentation and the P&O website confirms this, but we cannot run the risk of not having a GP letter given that every communication from P&O has insisted on it and a phone call to P&O querying this also resulted in a “you must have a GP letter” 😡

[Winifred 22]

35 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

Yes we use the app and no it doesn’t show! The really annoying thing is that I know that what we already have is the proper documentation and the P&O website confirms this, but we cannot run the risk of not having a GP letter given that every communication from P&O has insisted on it and a phone call to P&O querying this also resulted in a “you must have a GP letter” 😡

I am probably going to need a yellow fever vaccine next year but I think will all this talk I shall just get the G P letter which will cheaper than the vaccine and just roll with that. I couldn’t be doing with all the back and forth. I don’t use a TA so don’t have the time to be sorting. It is a Cunard cruise but I am sure the rules will be the same and the folk on that phone lines will be the same. I would just worry too much I didn’t have exactly what was specified even though the alternative should be acceptable. 

[david63]

I am starting to get an uneasy feeling that unqualified/inexperienced people within Carnival are making medical decisions and it would not surprise me if they have an AI bot that they tap into when faced with a question.