Any Decoy Cabernet Sauvignon?

[NMTraveller]

8 hours ago, markeb said:

 

Are those nice wines by the glass or by the bottle? And even nice restaurants typically titrate the wine to the buyer's perceived price point. 

 

People drink what they like. I'm fine with that. There are wines that are favorites on this board that I probably wouldn't buy to save my life. But the best wine (rum, whisk(e)y, gin, etc.) is the one you like the way you like it. If that's a chilled California cab, enjoy it and don't let anyone tell you you're wrong.

 

Why does Celebrity keep wines on the menu that are atrocious (in your, and likely my, opinion)? Because 1) people like them, 2) people buy them, and 3) they're produced in sufficient quantities to feed the beast that is RCG. Celebrity, as evidenced by their bottle lists, has an amazing wine program. But by the glass is pretty pedestrian, as are most wine lists. And they're very heavy on easily recognizable wines because that's what people buy. Tariffs have screwed things up a bit but historically you could find a good Bordeaux, definitely a good Super Tuscan, an excellent Tempranillo, a very good Malbec, and maybe even a decent Barolo for what people are paying for an average Napa Valley Cabernet, which you can probably beat in quality for price from either Washington or Paso Robles! But people continue to buy average Napa Valley cabs...

 

I have a restaurant I go to in Manhattan for special events where they actually have a real wine list and the (real) sommeliers will match by the glass wines to your courses. No wine packages. A surprise once or twice on price, but always for an amazing wine. And if they run out of that one, they have others. And yes, I've paid $45 a glass for wine and no it definitely was NOT for Caymus! That just isn't the business model on a cruise ship.

 

Out last cruise ended up not being a wine cruise, even though we're wine people. We'll see for out next cruise, which may well be Celebrity again. That one may be bottle time, and enjoy cocktails, water, and sodas for our drink package. Or DW enjoys whites and rose (as do I to a point) which would balance things out. I'm spoiled these days on reds (you do NOT want to see my Cellar Tracker...) and just can't expect that quality by the glass on any cruise ship on any line...

Those nice wines are by the glass at the restaurants.  I will like them and then go purchase a bottle or so for at home.  At the nicer restaurants I don't purchase a glass and then go ewww.  Perhaps at Applebee's and restaurants in that range.  It has been a while since I have dined there.  Even overseas I purchase a glass in a nice restaurant and I am pleasantly surprised.

 

If people do like Excelsior then why don't you see posts about will Excelsior be aboard?  I get Duckhorn.  Not my favorite,  but it is better than Excelsior.

Edited August 7 by NMTraveller

[Schmoe38]

14 hours ago, markeb said:

Has anyone tried the Bordeaux? It's the same price per bottle retail as Decoy. I'd probably expect about the same from it, but less fruit forward and maybe a little sense of place. Probably a better food wine anyway.

 

(My inner wine geek is annoyed they feel the need to refer to a Bordeaux as a Cabernet Sauvignon blend (at least it is a left bank, so they should be correct) or a Cotes du Rhone as a Grenache blend.)

Mouton Cadet is a blend that is primarily Merlot with a splash of Cabernet Franc and Cabernet Sauvignon. I traditionally order this wine on every Celebrity cruise as a memory to my father (this was actually his favourite wine).

 

Now, in fairness, this is not a wine to open for a special meal or enjoy for that special moment, but for me, it’s OK. Take the retail price of this bottle with a grain of salt. 
 

I’m not here to tell you it’s the answer to your dreams, but I think it’s fair to say that it’s worth a try. Judge this wine on your own terms, as that’s all that matters.

 

Randy

 

[zitsky]

Sometimes I’m open minded about wine.  Sometimes I’m not.  Usually not if the staff can’t talk about the wine and say why it’s good.  Or if it gets bad reviews in an app like Vivino.  And if it doesn’t taste good I don’t care how expensive it is.
 

I’m not against wine from any region.  If it’s from California it doesn’t have to be from Napa.  But why not put something from Livermore on the list, instead of from Lodi nearby, or Modesto?  I understand those are better wines.  Same with the Bordeaux we’ve been discussing.  It’s ok but it’s what I drank when I was 25 and less particular about wine.

[LeeK1]

With the promise of better wines being offered, particularly under the Premium package that we purchase, has there been a noticeable improvement in overall wine selection?  

I agree that the wine quality did take a dive.  Hopefully better quality wines are now beginning to make it into the inventory.  

[DaKahuna]

11 hours ago, NMTraveller said:

When I go to a nice restaurant they have only nice wines on the menu.  Why does Celebrity keep wines on the menu that are atrocious?

 

In a word -- profit.  Only offering wines like that as part of packages adds to their bottom line significantly.  

 

You figure the first glass pays for the bottle and every glass after that is profit. 

 

11 hours ago, markeb said:

Or DW enjoys whites and rose (as do I to a point) which would balance things out. I'm spoiled these days on reds (you do NOT want to see my Cellar Tracker...) and just can't expect that quality by the glass on any cruise ship on any line..

Mark I could not agree more.  My  DW is in love with Moscoto and I refuse to drink it with her.  It's just way too suite for my taste.  

 

I do not have very refined taste buds and all these tasting notes I read and hear people talk about are not very often shared by me. I know what taste good to me and go by taste rather than price.  I like to challenge the sommelier in Luminae by asking for him to choose the wine and not to repeat a wine unless I ask for it.  

 

Our next cruise is on MSC.  Our last MSC cruise I was surprised to be served California wines until I asked and then started getting some Italian wines.  I plan to start out asking for Italian wines on out upcoming cruise and experience as many different ones as I can.  

 

I see cruise drink packages as a way to try wines that I have never tried before or to again enjoy wines that I have found on previous cruises.  

[DaKahuna]

2 hours ago, Schmoe38 said:

Judge this wine on your own terms, as that’s all that matters.

 

 

Absolutely.  Drink what you like, not what other people tell you to like. 

 

24 minutes ago, LeeK1 said:

With the promise of better wines being offered, particularly under the Premium package that we purchase, has there been a noticeable improvement in overall wine selection?  

I agree that the wine quality did take a dive.  Hopefully better quality wines are now beginning to make it into the inventory.  

 

 Time will tell.  I have not seen / heard anything to lead me to believe that the changes in the wine offerening have made it to the ships yet.  I am hopeful it will be forthcoming but who knows what Celebrity's supply chain looks like.

 

 

[George C]

3 hours ago, NMTraveller said:

Those nice wines are by the glass at the restaurants.  I will like them and then go purchase a bottle or so for at home.  At the nicer restaurants I don't purchase a glass and then go ewww.  Perhaps at Applebee's and restaurants in that range.  It has been a while since I have dined there.  Even overseas I purchase a glass in a nice restaurant and I am pleasantly surprised.

 

If people do like Excelsior then why don't you see posts about will Excelsior be aboard?  I get Duckhorn.  Not my favorite,  but it is better than Excelsior.

I like Duckhorn I try to keep the wines we order at restaurants under a hundred so they sell for about 45 at the liquor stores. Many restaurants including our favorite will give you a small sample if you never tried that wine before, pretty sure you can get a small sample on celebrity also. We eat out a lot and try to keep bill under 300. 

[paulh84]

38 minutes ago, DaKahuna said:

Time will tell.  I have not seen / heard anything to lead me to believe that the changes in the wine offerening have made it to the ships yet.  I am hopeful it will be forthcoming but who knows what Celebrity's supply chain looks like.

 

 

 

I thought the messaging was they would have common varietals in both packages (which should be a given - regardless) and they would have more by the glass upgrade wines on hand - not that they would necessarily have better wines. Most people associate better with cost so that one is tough to quantify when often people can't explain why they think one wine is better or worse than another aside from recognizing a price tag at the grocery store. 

[canderson]

1 hour ago, DaKahuna said:

Time will tell.  I have not seen / heard anything to lead me to believe that the changes in the wine offerening have made it to the ships yet.  I am hopeful it will be forthcoming but who knows what Celebrity's supply chain looks like.

 

Could be a while coming.  There must be a lot of large contracts remaining to be fulfilled.  I think it was @markeb that referred to the RCG "monster".  In an effort to assure inventory, you can bet RCG has some multi-year megadeals cut with suppliers.

[DaKahuna]

55 minutes ago, paulh84 said:

I thought the messaging was they would have common varietals in both packages (which should be a given - regardless) and they would have more by the glass upgrade wines on hand - not that they would necessarily have better wines.

 

You are correct that the messaging was that they would have more but being a glass half full kind of guy, I am hoping that they will be better as well as different.  

 

I really do not need more by the glass upgrades.  They have already taken a couple of what were my 'go to' premium package wines and put them on the 'enhanced menu' I do not need more of those.  I do desire an expanded list to choose from on the Premium and Basic packages and, as I said, hope they are not just more of the supermarket variety. 

 

14 minutes ago, canderson said:

Could be a while coming.  There must be a lot of large contracts remaining to be fulfilled.  I think it was @markeb that referred to the RCG "monster".  In an effort to assure inventory, you can bet RCG has some multi-year megadeals cut with suppliers.

 

Yes, and I agree but they can achieve expansion without changing one monster for another.  I am hoping that current monster is flexible enough to add new things versus wholesale replacement.  

 

Time will tell. 

 

[George C]

I like the rccl perk for diamond plus, they give you 40 percent off any wines under a hundred and 20 percent off anything above a hundred and most restaurants have a decent wine list. 

[ch175]

I’m not a huge wine drinker, but all of this has been really interesting.

[goldsmip115]

Just today I went to lunch with a former colleague at PF Chang’s. I don’t drink at lunch, but I was perusing the wine list while I waited for her. A bottle of Decoy Cabernet Sauvignon was $55. A double pour glass was $19.  Just saying…..

[zitsky]

59 minutes ago, goldsmip115 said:

Just today I went to lunch with a former colleague at PF Chang’s. I don’t drink at lunch, but I was perusing the wine list while I waited for her. A bottle of Decoy Cabernet Sauvignon was $55. A double pour glass was $19.  Just saying…..

I usually drink beer with Chinese food.  Only occasionally wine.  What wine goes well with Chinese food?  I’m spoiled because my husband is Chinese.  I’ll have wine if he cooks something like a curry or a meat dish.  He is an American citizen but he refuses to respect my culture by eating pizza and hot dogs.  🙂

[markeb]

11 minutes ago, zitsky said:

I usually drink beer with Chinese food.  Only occasionally wine.  What wine goes well with Chinese food?  I’m spoiled because my husband is Chinese.  I’ll have wine if he cooks something like a curry or a meat dish.  He is an American citizen but he refuses to respect my culture by eating pizza and hot dogs.  🙂

 

Some interesting recommendations on decanter.com...

 

Probably depends on what style. Their general recommendations are "aromatic whites": Dry or off dry Riesling, Gewurtraminer, or Asti Spumante. Champagne or other Chardonnay based sparkling wines. New World Pinot Noir, Gamay, and Barbera, or just fun off-dry whites or rose. Some of those would have been my gut instinct, but some I wouldn't have thought of.

 

I usually do beer as well...

[zitsky]

9 minutes ago, markeb said:

 

Some interesting recommendations on decanter.com...

 

Probably depends on what style. Their general recommendations are "aromatic whites": Dry or off dry Riesling, Gewurtraminer, or Asti Spumante. Champagne or other Chardonnay based sparkling wines. New World Pinot Noir, Gamay, and Barbera, or just fun off-dry whites or rose. Some of those would have been my gut instinct, but some I wouldn't have thought of.

 

I usually do beer as well...

Those are reds I enjoy.  But not so much with Asian food.  I might pick a Riesling or Sauvignon Blanc.  Mostly because of the sauces and flavors.  
 

If you take a Chinese dish like beef with bitter melon (my favorite) those reds would be perfect with the beef, but the bitterness throws me off and makes it hard to pair.  

 

I guess I will experiment with red next time.

[DaKahuna]

1 hour ago, zitsky said:

He is an American citizen but he refuses to respect my culture by eating pizza and hot dogs.

 

My wife is the similar.  I had bbq chicken breast and cole slaw for lunch today.  She had soba. 

 

[DaKahuna]

1 hour ago, zitsky said:

What wine goes well with Chinese food?  

 

I'll pair a good pinot noir with damn near anything but like you, my go to would be beer.  Although, if available a chuhai (shochu highball) goes well with Japanese and Chineese food. 

 

[1Virgo]

on a wine course, the Sommelier said if your dish is hot, go for a sweeter wine like say Reisling.  (yes there are dry reislings).   So, I did a test. Ordered a Thai dish with lots of chilies. ow. Had a sip, maybe 2 of Reisling….heat gone. Being a doubting Thomas, tried that again a few days later. Sommelier was right

[zitsky]

2 minutes ago, 1Virgo said:

on a wine course, the Sommelier said if your dish is hot, go for a sweeter wine like say Reisling.  (yes there are dry reislings).   So, I did a test. Ordered a Thai dish with lots of chilies. ow. Had a sip, maybe 2 of Reisling….heat gone. Being a doubting Thomas, tried that again a few days later. Sommelier was right

Yes that’s a good choice.  I try to find the perfect Riesling between dry and sweet.

[1Virgo]

5 minutes ago, zitsky said:

Yes that’s a good choice.  I try to find the perfect Riesling between dry and sweet.

me too

[canderson]

8 minutes ago, 1Virgo said:

on a wine course, the Sommelier said if your dish is hot, go for a sweeter wine like say Reisling.  (yes there are dry reislings).   So, I did a test. Ordered a Thai dish with lots of chilies. ow. Had a sip, maybe 2 of Reisling….heat gone. Being a doubting Thomas, tried that again a few days later. Sommelier was right

On our last cruise with Silversea, we had superb recommendations for wine .. especially 'off list' items.  I was having a Thai lemongrass dish that had a little kick to it.  Sommelier recommended a well aged (15 years?) Riesling Auslese (not on any list).  Great match.

 

 

[George C]

1 hour ago, zitsky said:

Those are reds I enjoy.  But not so much with Asian food.  I might pick a Riesling or Sauvignon Blanc.  Mostly because of the sauces and flavors.  
 

If you take a Chinese dish like beef with bitter melon (my favorite) those reds would be perfect with the beef, but the bitterness throws me off and makes it hard to pair.  

 

I guess I will experiment with red next time.

Many of our Chinese restaurants here are byob , we bring a dry while wine or possibly a rose . Last Saturday we went to a excellent seafood restaurant which we normally order a nice Chardonnay but they had Caymus Cabernet for 75 which I couldn’t pass for that price.

[LeeK1]

On our first cruise to Alaska, the Sommelier took good care of us with our premium package.  When we got home and had our wine that we were drinking at home we had the same reaction.  Out with that cheap wine and our wine budget got upgraded.  Same happened with our Folgers after Cafe Al Bacio.  Had to upgrade our coffee budget.  Celebrity has definitely cost us more after we got home.  

[1Virgo]

on our Ascent, I ordered champagne. Sommelier asked if I was willing to try something. Well the something was champagne in a wine glass - not a typical champagne glass. The taste difference amazing. in fluted, you get the bubbles/fizz. in wine glass, you get the taste of the wine. He had just come off a course and said new trend coming.    Now our wine budget has gone up. 😁