No shorts in the Windjammer at dinner

[caviargal]

You say RCI has changed and I have no doubt that it has. And I am also sure that their are those who find this disappointing. But most things that cannot evolve and adapt usually end up extinct.

 

Maybe Celebrity was not "revamped" but it is clear that the expectations for dress are different than on the RCI ships. Difference and choice are good things.

.

 

I view that differently.

 

I am one who is loyal to brands I prefer, airlines I enjoy flying (few these days) and hotels where I enjoy the rooms and service. I patronize a handful of restaurants regularly where I live and also have favorites in cities that I visit often.

 

I am loyal because these businesses generally provide a consistent product of a quality that I enjoy, in an atmosphere that I find pleasing. When that product no longers what I am have come to expect and anticipate, I see that as a decline not as an evolution. When a new chef is hired in a restaurant and the fish is no longer quite as fresh, that is IMO, a decline. When a hotel does not maintain their standards of service, that is a decline.

 

That is what I have personally experienced with RCI. The ships are - generally speaking - still quite pretty and well maintained. But the standards long held have fallen to the wayside. The difference over the last 5 years is significant.

 

Celebrity has always been a traditional and elegant cruising experience. There are many things about them I quite enjoy, including their formal atmosphere and understated elegance. Under RCI's unbrella, some of their formerly high standards have declined as well, which is unfortunate. Only time will tell how that all shakes out.

 

I used to prefer RCI's energy and entertainment but the compromises are not worth it to me these days in terms of food, service, and onboard atmosphere. It has "evolved" into an anything goes cruise line in too many ways for my tastes.

 

Five years ago, I would have chosen RCI first for any cruise vacation. Now, I do not consider them at all.

 

Yes, having choices is a good thing and luckily there is a cruise out there for everyone.

 

JMO.

[Giorgi-one]

Your opinion.

 

I, of course, think you don't get it.

 

And that's the end of that:)

 

One queation for everyone. Do any of you just get in peoples faces over how they are dressed?

 

No I don't, but I have been tempted. And it's not just the way people are dressed on formal nights. Lots of the people on casual nights look like they just finished mowing the lawn and came right to dinner. If they have to wear khakis, at least iron them. And banlon shirts went out with Nehru jackets and leisure suits.

[Guest cvbart]

No, unfortunately you're wrong cvbart, It's not the end until the MODERATORS say it's the end!!!

 

Why so rude?

 

The comment was ment for the person I quoted.

 

I don't recall quoting you at all.

 

If I did anything to make you mad I'm sorry.

[critterchick]

And banlon shirts went out with Nehru jackets and leisure suits.

 

Nehru jackets are out??????:eek: Seriously, though, what's wrong with clean khakis at dinner on casual night? That's a staple of both of our wardrobes! And wrinkles come with the territory of natural fabrics, I'm afraid.

 

CVBart, Emily Post would NEVER condone getting in somebody's face, no matter how heinous the fashion infraction.:rolleyes: What you or anybody else is wearing has no impact on the enjoyment of my vacation (actually the more outrageous the more fun I have being catty about it, but well out of earshot:D ), but (and forgive the sexist-ness of this remark) men and women generally view clothing in wildly different ways (I'm assuming Bart is a man's name, BTW). Most women I know notice (they don't care, but they notice) everthing down to whether a purse & shoes go with an outfit (and I shop mostly at Land's End online, so I hardly qualify as a fashionista). We're just wired or trained that way, perhaps both. In contrast, many men of my acquaintance would walk into a wall before they saw it coming, so any comment as to the wrong shade of lipstick would elicit desperate blinking as they try to comprehend what just came out of their woman's mouth. (I say that in jest, at least partly.)

[johnjen]

That statement really bothers me.

 

For example I always follow whatever dress guidelines are set. I don't even own a pair of jeans and seldom wear shorts.

 

I spent 22 yeatrs in the Navy so I know all about dress codes and how to dress for any event.

 

But I will never understand why some people have to find fault with what others wear. It's really NOYB. I am sure that you can find a cruise line that will enfoce the dress code as you see it.

 

The last thing I want in the dining room is people and staff fighting over the dress code.

 

Why do some people find it so easy to find fault with just about anything?

 

I am happy with RCCL as it is now. I cruise to have fun, not to impress you with how I'm dressed?

 

Many of you need to just lighten up and have fun.

 

Funny thing is, once onboard, it's a totally different scene. No one really cares about what others wear. During formal nights I spotted a couple of guys in shorts. Good for them.

 

I can definitely agree with you being in for 22 years and having to live with a dress code your entire career. You got me beat by two years, and oh boy, I bet you are as glad to be out as I am! Those winter blue changeovers from summer whites used to really antagonize me.

[Guest cvbart]

Nehru jackets are out??????:eek: Seriously, though, what's wrong with clean khakis at dinner on casual night? That's a staple of both of our wardrobes! And wrinkles come with the territory of natural fabrics, I'm afraid.

 

CVBart, Emily Post would NEVER condone getting in somebody's face, no matter how heinous the fashion infraction.:rolleyes: What you or anybody else is wearing has no impact on the enjoyment of my vacation (actually the more outrageous the more fun I have being catty about it, but well out of earshot:D ), but (and forgive the sexist-ness of this remark) men and women generally view clothing in wildly different ways (I'm assuming Bart is a man's name, BTW). Most women I know notice (they don't care, but they notice) everthing down to whether a purse & shoes go with an outfit (and I shop mostly at Land's End online, so I hardly qualify as a fashionista). We're just wired or trained that way, perhaps both. In contrast, many men of my acquaintance would walk into a wall before they saw it coming, so any comment as to the wrong shade of lipstick would elicit desperate blinking as they try to comprehend what just came out of their woman's mouth. (I say that in jest, at least partly.)

 

Yes it is, thanks.

 

And your right.

 

My wife tries to keep me as welll dressed as possable

[Treven]

Unless they truly cannot affort a suit (for a man), that is exactly what it means.

I don't even own a suit. Not planning on buying one any time soon either.

[Ocean Boy]

I view that differently.

 

I am one who is loyal to brands I prefer, airlines I enjoy flying (few these days) and hotels where I enjoy the rooms and service. I patronize a handful of restaurants regularly where I live and also have favorites in cities that I visit often.

 

I am loyal because these businesses generally provide a consistent product of a quality that I enjoy, in an atmosphere that I find pleasing. When that product no longers what I am have come to expect and anticipate, I see that as a decline not as an evolution. When a new chef is hired in a restaurant and the fish is no longer quite as fresh, that is IMO, a decline. When a hotel does not maintain their standards of service, that is a decline.

 

That is what I have personally experienced with RCI. The ships are - generally speaking - still quite pretty and well maintained. But the standards long held have fallen to the wayside. The difference over the last 5 years is significant.

 

Celebrity has always been a traditional and elegant cruising experience. There are many things about them I quite enjoy, including their formal atmosphere and understated elegance. Under RCI's unbrella, some of their formerly high standards have declined as well, which is unfortunate. Only time will tell how that all shakes out.

 

I used to prefer RCI's energy and entertainment but the compromises are not worth it to me these days in terms of food, service, and onboard atmosphere. It has "evolved" into an anything goes cruise line in too many ways for my tastes.

 

Five years ago, I would have chosen RCI first for any cruise vacation. Now, I do not consider them at all.

 

Yes, having choices is a good thing and luckily there is a cruise out there for everyone.

 

JMO.

I used to be a believer in brand loyalty also. But as I learned more about business I realized that was a one way street. Business is loyal to its bottom line. If you help improve that line so be it. If you don't then they could care less about you. If a brand moves, or evolves, in a direction you don't like then you have to leave it. RCI will care about that only when enough people have done the same thing. They could care less if you, as an individual, have left. Apparently you have done just that since you do not even consider RCI for a cruise vacation according to your post. As I said before, I do understand your disappointment with the changes. But what disappoints some will be what attracts others.

 

Your last line says it all. There is a cruise out there for everyone and right now RCI is the one for me though I won't bore you with all the reasons why that is. If they change in ways that I do not like maybe someday I'll be sailing a different cruise line also.

[Ocean Boy]

Most women I know notice (they don't care, but they notice) everthing down to whether a purse & shoes go with an outfit (and I shop mostly at Land's End online, so I hardly qualify as a fashionista). We're just wired or trained that way, perhaps both. In contrast, many men of my acquaintance would walk into a wall before they saw it coming, so any comment as to the wrong shade of lipstick would elicit desperate blinking as they try to comprehend what just came out of their woman's mouth. (I say that in jest, at least partly.)

You'd probably be fun to have a table with in the dining room.:)

 

I don't even own a suit. Not planning on buying one any time soon either.

You might be too..... and the two navy guys......

[Merion_Mom]

<sigh>

[Ocean Boy]

<sigh>

LOL!! I got sucked into this one big time!! Now I think I understand how hard it is for people to quit smoking...

[pcur]

Contrary to popular myth:

 

1. Clothes CAN be wrinkle-free, even natural cottons, which I wear a lot of in hot weather. It's called an iron or the ship's pressing service, which is very reasonable.

 

2. Yes, RCCL does care what it's individual pax have to say, and they would not be happy about a repeat customer of 30 years / cruises, like caviargirl, leaving them. That's what the comment cards are for, and they LIVE (and get fired) by those cards.

 

3. Yes, people on cruise ships look and comment about what other people are wearing, just like they do on these boards. They just don't have an opportunity to chat about it on board, because, yes, they are having a good time. But, they notice. Hence, the infinite number of these dress code threads.

 

4. Just because we feel one way about the subject, doesn't make us a snob. I found an interesting definition a while back and saved it:

 

 

inverted snob

noun

1. Someone who makes a point of practicing, approving, etc things that a snobbish person would find objectionable.

 

5. And....Bethwte is absolutely correct: the Cruise Fashion board is much nicer. Must be because it's about 99% women, huh?:D :D :D

[pcur]

Oh, and I forgot this, too, by Micki. From a previous thread on the (SURPRISE!!) very same subject. I thought it was so good, I told her so and saved it:

 

RCI has spelled out their version of a dress code. The problem is in how dress codes are defined in general in the fashion world.

"Casual can include anything from clothes worn for manual labor to jeans and a t-shirt. For women this can include shorts and tank tops; for men, exposure of shoulders, thighs, and back. Swim/beachwear is also considered casual."

"Casual is the dress code which emphasizes comfort and personal expression over presentation. It includes a wide variety of costume so it's better defined by what it isn't than what it is."

By RCI's definition, men are requested to wear slacks, which are considered a lighter weight cotton than a jean (denim) material.

Then you go to smart or business casual.

"This is a potentially confusing dress code due to its oxymoronic construction. Consider it to mean, for men no jeans, no ties. ONLY in the United States are nice jeans generally accepted as smart casual provided a sport coat is worn. But smart casual is usually a collared shirt and cotton trousers (such as khakis) for men and a nice shirt and trousers for women."

Next you would have semi-formal.

"This requires a jacket and tie for men. For women, a dress or dressy pant and top, usually of a fine material."

Then you have formal. I think that one everybody knows.

This information gathered from several fashion definitions of dress codes, with all stating pretty much the same thing. I quoted from the one that was easily understood.

As for me, I look at RCI, or any line, as being my host while on their ships. I know and understand what the requested dress code means and dress accordingly.

That being said, I do not let how others dress on a cruise bother me. That could change when I start seeing the "torn" look in jeans in the dining room.

P.S. Yes, by definition of trousers, shorts can be worn in the dining room but it does clearly state "not at dinner."

__________________

Micki

[Fran Harp]

Contrary to popular myth:

 

1. Clothes CAN be wrinkle-free, even natural cottons, which I wear a lot of in hot weather. It's called an iron or the ship's pressing service, which is very reasonable.

 

 

I guess I'm a little mystified as to WHY they should be wrinkle-free. My wonderful Tilley travel pants are made from a crinkle-wrinkle fabric, which is cool even in the hottest weather. Literally they come wrinkled - and they look just fine and never need ironing.

 

Have another boo at the dead horse........

 

Fran in Toronto

[rvrgirl]

Our formal night table consisted of two tuxes (DH & one other man), 1 Hawaiian shirt and one black shirt, no tie, with jacket. You know what? We had a blast! The Hawaiian shirt fellow wasn't going to come because he didn't want to dress up and we talked him into being a dresscode scofflaw because we enjoyed his & his DW's company so much we didn't want to see them banished. I guess that's 40 lashes with a wet noodle for me.:rolleyes:

 

 

What:confused: Hawaiian shirt on formal nite? You mean he was respectful, and had good manners and you liked his company. And he did not follow the RULES:confused:

Good for you! That just goes to show, you can't judge a book by it's cover

(or hawwaiian shirt)

[pcur]

Contrary to popular myth:

 

1. Clothes CAN be wrinkle-free, even natural cottons, which I wear a lot of in hot weather. It's called an iron or the ship's pressing service, which is very reasonable.

 

 

I guess I'm a little mystified as to WHY they should be wrinkle-free. My wonderful Tilley travel pants are made from a crinkle-wrinkle fabric, which is cool even in the hottest weather. Literally they come wrinkled - and they look just fine and never need ironing.

 

Have another boo at the dead horse........

 

Fran in Toronto

 

It was in response to critterchick's comment above, and I was saying (tongue in cheek) that natural fabrics don't have to be worn wrinkled to dinner (anywhere).

[Merion_Mom]

You must have posted just before my post got zapped... why it was deleted, I dont know, seeing as all I said in a nutshell was let's just get along! :confused: But like Merion Mom's picture post so aptly said, we're beating a dead horse here anyways.

Beth, I believe that it was your asterisks that got you in pouf-trouble. :D

[Bethwte]

Beth, I believe that it was your asterisks that got you in pouf-trouble. :D

 

Oh... jeez, And here I thought I was trying to censor myself :D Guess I'll just say fudge next time or something... lol

[Merion_Mom]

Would you believe, they actually address this issue DIRECTLY in the rules for posting? Here, I'll find it and highlight it:

 

"The use of profanity and foul or vulgar language is not acceptable. Keep in mind that members come in all ages and all have access to our Cruise Boards. Using asterisks to blank out several letters of a word is *still* considered a violation if the vulgarity is discernible, as are acronyms for a series of vulgar words. There are far more powerful ways to get a point across. Discussions of any nature that Cruise Critic staff feels inappropriate for the Cruise Boards will be removed."

 

Pretty funny, eh? ;)

[barbie5401]

but I remember when there was no alternative dining - it was the dining room or else. What I remember is the parade of bridemaid dress and men in rented tux's. Anyone else remember this? It seems that weekend cruises are much more lax than the 7 day. We just got off the Sov. of the Seas and hubby wore shorts (long ones) with a starched nice shirt on the casual nights and a pair of slacks with a turtleneck on formal night. We didn't have our picture taken with the group so as not to often them, however, they liked our company so we have a great picture of all of us.

 

You or who started talking about this - I have the same problem at work, the idea of casual wear as taken on a whole new idea. If anyone has a great work dress code policy I would love to have a copy? My starts, "proper undergarments", no white pants without underwear so all the partners and google all day long. Help! Apparently, unless a policy is carefully laid out - everyone has an opinion of what is okay.

 

Seriously I welcome any suggestions.

[critterchick]

You'd probably be fun to have a table with in the dining room.:)

 

 

You might be too..... and the two navy guys......

 

My DH makes the third Navy guy.

 

I'm either fun or the disruptive person who totally ruined the cruise of the person at the next table (we've only been merciless with our own tablemates once).

 

rvgirl, I don't know about "respectful." Entertaining, fun to talk with, neat wife, great company. Tux? We don't need no stinkin' tux (ref: Blazing Saddles)!

 

And Bart, I feel your wife's pain. What is it about you squids?;)

 

pcur, I have lots of cotton and linen pants that start the day ironed (not by me, just so we're perfectly clear on that). By the time I get to work 45 minutes later, fuggedaboutit. So it sometimes seems kinda silly to bother with the initial ironing job.

 

Barbie, I feel your pain, too. Our firm seems to have a policy that dressing like a hooker is ok. But no logowear is allowed. Seriously - it's not written that way, but the lipo-enhanced secretary who showed up in a black skirt that looked remarkably like a half slip and super-tight top that showed off her, um, attributes, got no flack, while the older one who showed up in a Florida State shirt was reprimanded.

[wrp96]

You or who started talking about this - I have the same problem at work, the idea of casual wear as taken on a whole new idea. If anyone has a great work dress code policy I would love to have a copy? My starts, "proper undergarments", no white pants without underwear so all the partners and google all day long. Help! Apparently, unless a policy is carefully laid out - everyone has an opinion of what is okay.

 

Seriously I welcome any suggestions.

 

The firm I worked for before law school had a 3 page dress code - one for men and one for women. They went down and listed every single type of clothing that you could imagine and had 3 columns, one for appropriate every day, one for approriate on casual fridays, and one for never appropriate. It even went into how long skirts must be (had to hit the middle of the knee), how wide the straps on a ladies top had to be. For anything that the women were allowed (or not) there was a corresponding item on the men's list - so as to seem fair.

[36kruzes]

cvbart, I get what you get -- and I'm getting sick of it.

 

Warning to self-appointed fashion police: stay away from Navigator July 15 or you will yet again be scandalized. This family will be aboard wearing lots of Hawaiian shirts, Bermudas, sandals, sundresses, etc. And nary a "formal" in sight! Oooooohh -- scary.......

 

 

 

Your opinion.

 

I, of course, think you don't get it.

 

And that's the end of that:)

 

One queation for everyone. Do any of you just get in peoples faces over how they are dressed?

[shortstuft]

We just got off the Adventure of the Seas in May and we ate almost every meal in the Windjammer. We only brought a carry on bag each and the only thing I had that covered anything was my jeans. We not only wore shorts everynight, but tank tops and flip flops!! No body said anything and everyone was very nice.

What's next??? We can't order room service naked:D

[beachbuzzard]

That's it. I have to say it.

 

FORMAL FOR ALL EVENING DINING... ANYWHERE ON SHIP... EVERY NIGHT!

 

That should be the dress code. Like in the days of the Titanic!!

 

A tux in the Windjammer would be elegant, don't you think??

 

;) ;) ;) ;) ;)