HAL Music styles, loudness etc.

[SLove]

Hi HAL CC'ers!

 

I saw Vic's post below and proactively followed up on the thread the uncialman (Where did you go Uncialman?) started back in the summer about onboard music issues. I had emailed HAL a few months back and basically didn't get an answer. So, I called and didn't get an answer either and basically dropped the issue. After seeing Vic's post, I decided to call again and this is what is listed below is what I was told. Seems like uncialmen was right on target last summer:

 

• The entertainment dept. has now adopted a fleet-wide change in the overhead and enviromental or ambiant music played in hallways, pools, and public rooms. This change reflects the preferences of the younger demographic that HAL hopes will choose over their competition in the market.
  
• Music for Caribbean and Mexican Riviera itineraries will be a mix created by DMX called "Beach Party" that is a blend of pop/rock favorites of the 80's, 90's, and 00's
  
• Music for Alaskan itineraries will be a DMX channel called "Adult Contemporary" that offers current and recent top chart hits.

I asked if HAL's entertainment department had done any scientific polling to come to their conclusions or if passengers have had the opportunity to comment on their selections. HAL has neither polled their current cruisers or solicited opinions on this issue from their passengers. The current direction they have taken was done with the advice of the Entertainment Dept. and the consultants at DMX. Contemporary, pop, emotionally-charged music will now be played in all public areas.

 

Let me say that my husband and I loved the old HAL from just a very short few years ago: quiet, classy, sophisticated. What I think might be part of the problem is that a lot of folks that are being hired in key management and crew positions are not from Holland America Line and certainly don't have any loyalty to HAL's tradition. Did anyone notice that the branding line changed from "A Tradition of Excellence" to "A Signature of Excellence" ?

 

I hope that the solution is not what they currently do on Princess: charge $20 a day to go into the "quiet" sanctuary of the ship. Right now, there is no escape.

[luvtravel]

We too are fans of a quiet atmosphere (eg. were on Carnival once, but never again) but didn't really notice on our May cruise on HAL to Alaska any 'too loud' music in the common areas, but may have been that we didn't spend much time there just because of cruise itinerary. We too remember when there was a string quartet playing and a bit of a different atmosphere on HAL...and we liked it for that reason. We are thinking this change is just a generational thing ... as we,(the older generation - speaking for ourselves who are in our 50's), are not the focus of most businesses anymore. Music it seems has always been a sore point between generations..defining them in some way, really. We're going on HAL in January to Mexico, just for a quick and close get-away and will be interesting to see what we experience music-wise and atmosphere-wise this time. Will look forward to reading other HAL fans' thoughts on this.

[Vic The Parrot]

 

[*]The entertainment dept. has now adopted a fleet-wide change in the overhead and enviromental or ambiant music played in hallways, pools, and public rooms. This change reflects the preferences of the younger demographic that HAL hopes will choose over their competition in the market.

[*]Music for Caribbean and Mexican Riviera itineraries will be a mix created by DMX called "Beach Party" that is a blend of pop/rock favorites of the 80's, 90's, and 00's

 

 

 

Hello, Lady S!

 

:)

 

 

 

Thanks for your feedback on this. On going over the above list, I have no problem with the selections these people offer. (I'm a baby-boomer ... love the classic rock tunes,and everything else ... ) I just don't like it blaring in my ear when I want to read a book, or enjoy a smoke and after-dinner coffee.

 

If it's kept at a decent level by the aft pool (like on the Feb maiden voyage) I will enjoy it more. When they start setting up amplifiers, and additional speakers, it's time to move! :rolleyes:

 

 

I too hope that HAL management will take this into consideration. If not, the next time I'm trying to enjoy friends company over a drink, while yelling at the top of my lungs because we can't hear each other, we could avoid that room (can they spell 'boycott'? )..... take the party on the promenade deck outside. ;)

[LolaWiz]

How unfortunate.

I think we (husband and I) are the type of people HAL is looking to attract (20somethings) but this is NOT the way to do it.

It is sad that HAL has not asked/polled/researched what their pax wanted before they chose to do it.

 

I can see fun, pop-like music at the bar at HMC with the DJ there... it is like a beach party, but not in hallways, the lounges before shows, etc.

[twinkletoes4445]

It is sad that HAL has not asked/polled/researched what their pax wanted before they chose to do it.

 

I can see fun, pop-like music at the bar at HMC with the DJ there... it is like a beach party, but not in hallways, the lounges before shows, etc.

 

This is a tad bothersome. We picked HAL because we thought it was going to be a bit more upscale (and quiet). I'm with you, I don't mind music in the bars, etc., but I do not want to have to hear loud music in the hallways, and lounges before the shows.

 

Hubby has ear issues and loud music really bothers him.

[Vic The Parrot]

I'm with you, I don't mind music in the bars, etc., but I do not want to have to hear loud music in the hallways, and lounges before the shows.

 

Hubby has ear issues and loud music really bothers him.

 

 

 

The Ocean Bar on Noordam won't be a good place. If you happen to be in that room, go for the sitting area on the other side. The side with the bar and dancefloor gets pretty noisy when the trio starts to play at 400 decibels.

[rkacruiser]

Taste in music is just as subjective as whether one enjoys the cuisine or not. I cannot say that I noticed any music in the public areas during my recent Noordam cruise that was objectionable or particularly loud. The piano music in the Crow's Nest during Happy Hour provided a pleasant back drop for conversations, I thought. I did not particularly care for the group playing in the Ocean Bar. The lead singers for the production shows had pleasant singing voices, but seemed to "shout" the words for their songs rather than just singing them. This, I found annoying, enough so I made made a comment about this on the end of cruise comment form.

[twinkletoes4445]

The Ocean Bar on Noordam won't be a good place. If you happen to be in that room, go for the sitting area on the other side. The side with the bar and dancefloor gets pretty noisy when the trio starts to play at 400 decibels.

 

Thanks for the info. Hubby has such a problem with one ear that he usually carries an ear plug in case we're in an area that's noisy. Louder isn't better for him.

[Orlandocruiser]

On our recent Ryndam cruise I never noticed the canned music to be anything more than backgroud level. Really the only time I noticed it was by the Lido pool in the morning when there weren't many people there - once the area began to fill up the noise of so many people took over. It was a bit louder the one time we used the Nav deck pool but we were in port at the time so there was no wind noise and there were hardly any people in the area at the time. They did have live music by the Lido pool on sea days and that could get quite loud.

[RuthC]

Do bands these days think that "loud" equals "good? It would seem so. Either that, or they think loud is an adequate substitute for good. :rolleyes: It isn't.

I do wish that HAL's entertainment would ask it's passengers what style/volume of music we're looking for before it begins to mess with something that's worked well for a long time. Or maybe they're just too young to know what good music sounds like? :confused:

Back to the put it on the Comment Card suggestion. You remember, don't answer the questions they ask without answering the questions they don't ask, too.

[island lady]

ehhh??....

Me thinks my "youngster ear" has betwittled my "oldster ear"...and now I can't even remember any music crawling though the hallways at all??

Cheers! :)

[cruisinjudy]

Well, we will be on Oosterdam in January and if the music has changed we will certainly be disappointed. I do not appreciate loud music. I just talked to a friend who just returned from an NCL cruise and complained about the loud music. I told her to take HAL next time. Guess I spoke too soon!

[cruznon]

I just don't like LOUD music on a crusie ship in public areas. I find it unreal that HAL doesn't seem to even care what passengers think via surveys/questionnaires, etc.

[MrsMuir]

I'm like the Princess and the Pea when it comes to ambient noise. On our Zaandam cruise to Alaska two months ago, Richard and I were nestled in a couple of loungers in the Crow's Nest one afternoon, watching the bow slam into the waves during some medium-high seas. Our idea of heaven, except the mood was spoiled by the heavy metal music grinding at high volume from the sound system. I asked Sir Richard if he would have a polite word with the staff about the music. They seemed genuinely surprised -- and concerned -- that we (aged 59 and 63) weren't enjoying it, and they immediately switched to an appropriate classical station on the sound system. Five minutes after we had settled back in our chairs, blissed out by the sea and the music, we were driven back to our cabin by the Invasion of the Line Dance Lesson. Oh well. We did appreciate the way the Crow's Nest staff changed the music when we brought it to their attention. Being much younger than we, they probably had no clue that the music they live with was grating on our nerves and spoiling our experience. After awhile they may not even hear it consciously. I have left retail stores because of the unpleasant music, but each time I have told the manager why I was leaving without spending any money there.

 

Guys, it's worth a try. If you don't feel comfortable mentioning the loud or inappropriate music to the staff, Richard and I would be only too pleased to show you how it's done.

 

Mrs Muir (Linda)

[Krazy Kruizers]

HAL has given us the signal not to go to any of the lounges and spend money on drinks -- we old timers can't stand LOUD music.

 

And we have noticed it too often on our last several cruises.

[michmike]

I had read about this issue prior to our October cruise on Westerdam and had planned to see if it was an issue while we were onboard. Evidently it wasn't, since I forgot to listen for it and yet I can't honestly say that I noticed ambient music of any sort during that trip. I guess that MAY mean that I'm lost in my own little world, or it simply serves to bolster DW's claim that I don't hear anything that I choose not to hear.

 

Music in the Ocean Bar was not overly loud either. But I'm with others here.. when it DOES become intrusive I'd certainly be one of the first to complain and request that something be done about it. What the heck is wrong with silence?? Failing that, a little light classical or smooth jazz. But the problem with that is that just as I abhor loud rock music and 98% of what passes for top 40 these days, there are others who have no use for classical or jazz. So again, lets opt for slience and those who MUST have music buzzing 24/7 can bring their IPOD and tight fitting head phones that spare the rest of us.

[Krazy Kruizers]

We have written on our comment cards about the loud music in the lounges on our last several cruises -- doubt if anyone reads them -- and if they do -- they don't care.

 

Have also mentioned it to several people on the ship -- they just shrug their shoulders.

[kryos]

[*]The entertainment dept. has now adopted a fleet-wide change in the overhead and enviromental or ambiant music played in hallways, pools, and public rooms. This change reflects the preferences of the younger demographic that HAL hopes will choose over their competition in the market.

If this is true, then HAL needs to send some of their executives back to school. You don't do "fleet-wide" anything.

 

The passenger that opts for a seven-day Caribbean cruise is a far different one than that who takes a 19-day Panama Canal or Repositioning cruise. Thus, the music and other "atmosphere" type ammenties on the ship should be different. While I personally don't care for loud music blaring through the hallways, I am "progressive" enough to accept that perhaps the younger crowd who would be onboard a HAL ship for a seven-day sailing to the Western Caribbean might have other ideas. And, if that demographic is in the majority on those type of cruises, then I can understand HAL making this change. But when you have a ship populated mostly by older "baby boomer" passengers, you can't tell me that they would necessarily be appreciative of this change.

 

HAL needs to re-examine their policy on this matter, in my opinion ... and make the choice of ambient music more a factor of the ship and the anticipated passenger makeup of the particular cruise. One size does not necessarily fit all.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[uncialman]

Holland America Line: Before I state anything on this particular thread I would like to remind you that I did not start this thread or "fan the flames" prior to posting. Anything that I state on this forum is only for the purposes of constructive criticism for the cruise line that my wife and I fell in love with just 6 very short years ago (When I was in my early thirties). My groups, especially the conservative and higher end clientele appreciated the rich heritage, refinement, and elegance of Holland America Line prior to the current changes.  My sincerest hope is that the comments of this board, and of your loyal passengers, will be considered.

 

I’ve never had an issue with what live music is being played in the lounges and bars of Holland America Line. In some segments of the ship, such as the Explorer’s Lounge, the Rosario Strings entertain a sizable group during the evenings. In the lounges on deck 3, the competent musicians play favorites from the 50’s and 60’s at a tolerable listening and dancing level. The crows nest always has a good variety at night and the Northern Lights Disco exists for those that are looking for a bit more *edgy* dance experience. I have no issues with any of this. The problem comes with the inescapable pop-rock musical wallpaper that exists throughout the entire ship for 24 hours a day that is only of *one* particular style. The current line of thinking from the entertainment dept. states that they are trying to appeal to a younger, 30-45 age group so they play pop rock. This, of course, assumes that anyone in that demographic wants to hear nothing but the same pop rock songs played constantly over a seven day period - which of course is false. As a thirty something, I really don't want to hear any of this during what is supposed to be a relaxing cruise vacation. I don’t hear jazz, I don’t hear country, I don’t hear classical, I don’t hear new age: I hear only pop rock. We are forced to eat with it in the Lido, read to it in the Erasmus Library, work to it in the internet café, drink to it in the Windstar café, attempt to relax with it by the pool, and have it follow us around wherever we are in public areas of the ship. However, I believe the core of the matter should be what face or brand Holland America Line wants to put on their product as opposed to trying to find a middle road. The ambiance should be reflective of the product offered, in this case premium and traditional, not necessarily what age group it hopes to bring aboard. This is the way that Disney, Four Seasons, Ritz Carlton, JW Marriot, Celebrity, Crystal and other view the issues surrounding the branding of ambiance.

 

Secondly, the issue goes far beyond age. If the product that Holland America Line is offering is supposed to resemble “Traditional Cruising” and “Premium Cruising”, then the general ambiance should be consistent with the claims. For instance:

 

1. When entering the Waldorf Astoria in New York City, what kind of music will be playing when you walk through the lobby and public rooms of the hotel?

 

2. When dining at a traditional, 3 star (Michelin rating) restaurant, will the restaurant play pop rock or musical selections that fit the ambiance of the dining experience?

 

3. When entering an exclusive spa or Country Club, will you find the musical selections to be pop rock or musical selections that exude class and social prominence?

 

4. When entering the atrium of a Celebrity Cruise ship, will you here pop rock or classical chamber selections being played throughout the ship? How about Crystal, Radisson (Regent), or Silver Sea?

 

5. In Panera Bread, one of the nations fastest growing restaurant chain, do they play pop rock for the mostly young crowds that crowd their eateries or do they weave a tapestry of light classical and jazz to create a calming, reflective atmosphere?

 

The answer to all of these items is that the musical selection will be based upon the product that is being offered to the consumer. In all of these examples, the customer is looking for particular elements that define a premium, luxury experience. Please understand, this is one of the reasons that I have brought these particular groups to HAL: the groups are looking for a refined, relaxed, quiet atmosphere. I believe that I can also say with confidence that this is the case with the vast majority of your repeating Mariner Cruisers (which is obvious by this thread on Cruise Critic ). The Oosterdam, unfortunately, has not lived up to that promise. The music in the public areas has lead to a hurried, tense environment on board; much like the experience aboard the Carnival and RCI ships that I am on many, many days out of the year. Can you imagine hearing “Super Freak” or “My House” (Mary Jane Girls) when first walking into the lobby of the Waldorf Astoria or any Ritz Carlton? No, because such a vision is absurd with a premium, traditional product.

 

Thirdly, there has been a claim from Hotel Managers and Bar staff that the average age of some of your cruises is "45" or "50" and the music should be tailored to accommodate that age group. Firstly, yes, the average age of a cruise could be 50 if you have a tremendous amount of seniors and then 20 or so families aboard with infants and small children in tow. However, as we have already stated, being "40" (Which is right around the corner for me in a few years) does not mean that you prefer the Go-Go's, Van Halen, Hootie and the Blowfish, and Cheryl Crow 24/7 in public rooms and pool areas when you are trying to enjoy an Alaskan or Caribbean Cruise.

 

I was just recently on the HAL Veendam this past November and will never forget the moment that, at breakfast in the lido deck, one of my older passengers in my group ( she is in her late 70's), was walking through the restaurant looking for her husband searching high and low with Van Halen's version of "Dancing in the Streets" blaring overhead in the speakers. Again, it was surreal.

 

With the advent of the I-Pod, DJDitty and other portable MP3 players, why would HAL continue to justify DMX's existence by playing ambient music that only possibly 2% of their cruising passenger would actually choose to listen to? Why force all of the passengers to listen to music either completely foreign to them or, to put it mildly, is simply inappropriate for the elegance and style exhibited by the surroundings in a HAL cruiseship? If HAL was to continue to play ambient music, why not find a musical style that is neutral?

 

More later...