DIY or Private tours???

[takeavacation]

I'm a "do it yourself" kind of girl -- but....I'm debating about private tours/guides in Livorna and Rome. The reason is that: 1) I think there is a lot to see and I wonder if having a driver will make the timing easier and 2) will I miss out by just "seeing" the David or the Colesseum,etc. -- rather than having someone tell me the story of the sites we are seeing.

 

Usually I can just go and see and enjoy wandering -- but, when I was in the in St. Petersburg -- we had a guide for our 3 days there and she was incredibly knowledgable and I learned so much about the Russian history. I'm wondering for those that have gone without a guide -- did you feel that you missed the "details" -- or is a guide book enough???

 

All advice welcome! And Thank you!

[ab0si]

There is a big difference between a guide and a driver. A driver (for certain places) can be useful by decreasing inconveniences and time spent in transit. Guides run the gambit from very interesting and useful to PITAs who are more interested in having you stop by their uncle's <fill in some item> shop then in explaining the background of what you are seeing. they also would (or should) take care getting tickets in advance (note: for most sites you can do this on your own) thus avoiding many lines.

 

If you show up cold to see Michelangelo's you will, indeed, not understand or appreciate it as much as if you do some research (art and social history, Michelangelo's biography, Florentine history, etc.) I would agree that between research and a good guide, I'd go for the research for most places. But, then, I'd a dweeb and this probably does not apply to normal humans. Even so, unless you are traveling simply to "check off" various places, a guidebook is insufficient background and either a good guide or deeper research will be well rewarded.

[Go-Bucks!]

I'm a "do it yourself" kind of girl -- but....I'm debating about private tours/guides in Livorna and Rome. The reason is that: 1) I think there is a lot to see and I wonder if having a driver will make the timing easier and 2) will I miss out by just "seeing" the David or the Colesseum,etc. -- rather than having someone tell me the story of the sites we are seeing.

 

Usually I can just go and see and enjoy wandering -- but, when I was in the in St. Petersburg -- we had a guide for our 3 days there and she was incredibly knowledgable and I learned so much about the Russian history. I'm wondering for those that have gone without a guide -- did you feel that you missed the "details" -- or is a guide book enough???

 

All advice welcome! And Thank you!

 

 

I think it depends. I always do research before I go somewhere, but sometimes it is great to have a person bring the place "to life." I was recently in Europe on a DIY, ride-the-trains land vacation. We went to most (but not all) museums on our own with my handy-dandy Rick Steves guidebook. We saw David on our own, and incredibly, with only 4 other people there!! We got to get up close and circle him, looking carefully. Actually, we went to all the museums in Florence on our own and it was fine.

 

But in Rome, we had a private guide (who was fantastic!) take us around the ancient Roman ruins. The tour was 2.5 hrs. and included the Colosseum. Without a guide, much of it just looks like lots of scattered pieces of fallen down buildings - which is what it is. But the guide had a nice book that showed us what the buildings had looked like in Roman times and he told us the stories of the people and govt. of that day. I loved it. You could see the lines in the stones paving the Via Sacra from where the chariots drove! The tour company is Roman Odyssey Tours. Just cost 25 euros.

 

We also had guided tours in the Vatican museum and the Borghese gallery. Also very glad we did those. Another great option in many museums and/or palaces are the audioguides. They're usually very good. Get some Rick Steves books or check out his website to get more info.

[cruisemom42]

I agree with abosi's excellent comments. For me, half of the pleasure is thoroughly researching things before I visit a new place. I read history, guidebooks, art history, novels, and have even been known to take classes. But it's not everyone's cup of tea.

 

My two cents is this: if you enjoy doing things on your own, and you are going with the assumption that this will not be your "one and only" visit to these places, there's no reason not to do things on your own. Concentrate on the things you are most interested in seeing and then research them to learn the history, background, politics....or even the food and fashions.....whatever floats your boat.

 

If this is a "once in a lifetime" trip, or you have mobility issues, or you would just rather have someone else do the heavy lifting, then by all means go with a private tour -- nothing wrong with doing it that way. Do look for recommendations from others in terms of guides (keeping in mind what the previous poster said about drivers vs. guides).

 

Whatever you decide, try to build in a little time in these two wonderful cities just to enjoy being there -- whether that's a stop for lunch and people-watching, or a gelato (or two...;)).

[chipmaster]

I'm a "do it yourself" kind of girl -- but....I'm debating about private tours/guides in Livorna and Rome. The reason is that: 1) I think there is a lot to see and I wonder if having a driver will make the timing easier and 2) will I miss out by just "seeing" the David or the Colesseum,etc. -- rather than having someone tell me the story of the sites we are seeing.

 

Usually I can just go and see and enjoy wandering -- but, when I was in the in St. Petersburg -- we had a guide for our 3 days there and she was incredibly knowledgable and I learned so much about the Russian history. I'm wondering for those that have gone without a guide -- did you feel that you missed the "details" -- or is a guide book enough???

 

All advice welcome! And Thank you!

 

 

As OP said most private tours include only a driver and the guide is extra. We found that our driver in all the cities were excellent at sharing history of attractions, history of country and trivia. At the actual attractions some drivers would spend 10-15' telling us about it, but you have to GO in by yourself. Of course in places like Vatican you can hire a guide for seperate, well worth it.

 

If you are going as an individual you'll likely need to find a group to share to make the private tour a value.

 

Private versus DIY, personally if you got the $$$ get the private tour! With only a day in each port i find using valuable time hiking in the heat of summer and using taxi and public transportation versus having a private vehicle drops you off meters away from each attraction makes little sense. Sure you don't get to experience the city like a local, but I ain't there for weeks, months or years like a local either :D I also find guides well worth the money. Hearing it from a person is always more interesting then reading it in a book. I always do a little reading ahead of the time, but when at the site I'd rather look at the real thing with my eyes and listen with my ears versus read a book standing in front of David / Sistine Chapel or other famous thing ;)

 

Good luck

[BurBunny]

Sometimes when time is of the issue, a driver/guide can be worth their weight in gold. They can drop you off on one side of an attraction and pick you up on the other, and off you go again. With a guide, you can often jump lines, like at the Vatican. A guide in the Tuscan Hill Towns can save you a ton of uphill walking and give you more time seeing what you want, rather than hiking to and from whatever transportation you used to get there.

 

It's all about priorities and your agenda. I've done both, and both have their place. I do feel in a city like Rome if you're there for one day, at least a driver is preferred and a driver/guide optimum to really get an appreciation of what you're seeing and make the most of it. Florence is more compact for the major attractions, but still takes a lot of research to get the most out of a single day on your own. Venice on the other hand keep the guides as far away from me as possible - this is a town to experience at a slower pace with less of an agenda if at all workable.

 

My other rule of thumb - the more distance to cover, or the more complicated the itinerary, the more valuable a driver is. Relying on public transportation for longer distances and times gives more room for error and less ability to "fix" it if something goes awry.

[Hlitner]

I am a long time proponent of DIY travel in Europe (and elsewhere), but when posters express some doubts about DIY I tell them to try and book private tours (we hate cruise line tours which are over crowded and overpriced). DIY is great for those of us who like the freedom (we are currently in France on a driving trip after a cruise) but it does not suit all tastes. Between Livorno and Civitavecchia, the latter is much easier for DIY since you can easily get to the train station (free port shuttle + 4 block easy walk). They even sell a cheap BIRG ticket (9 Euros) which covers round trip train to Rome + all days use of buses and the metro. As to Livorno, you need to get a taxi to take you to and from the train station, and it can be hard to get taxis to do that short run (a big problem from the port). Some taxis will make the trip to the train station for about 20 or 25 Euros (this would be total for up to 4). Do not listen to those that tell you that you can take the shuttle bus in Livorno. Not only does that bus cost money, but it still leaves you a taxi or local bus ride from the train station. And, most of the time, the shuttles in Livorno do not even start until after 8:00.....and you want to try and be on a train by 8....not waiting for a silly shuttle.

 

Hank

[mountainmare]

I am also a DIY person and had the same concerns for our first Med cruise. I studied every guidebook I could get my hands on, watched every DVD, studied street maps and train schedules. DH is a great history buff and I am the art person so we knew in advance what each city could offer. In the end we decided to go the private driver route with a guide for the Vatican museums.

In each of the cities we did see everything, had a chance to climb the Leaning Tower and toss a coin in the Trevi Fountain and go inside the Colsseum. That being said it did feel more like "check off the sites" days. BUT--the upside is that for the visits that we had done since we have "checked off the sites" so we have the freedom to wander and do our DIY thing without wondering if we are missing anything.

For our recent cruise I carefully looked at the ports and for one (Cadiz) I picked a private driver because to do what we wanted this was the only way. It was the best choice.

Between Livorno and Civitavecchia if you were going to pick just one with a guide I would say Livorno, but since this is your first trip consider a driver/guide for both. Ask yourself--will you be happy just wandering Rome, or will you be frustrated trying to see the things you have read about. Then on your next trip you can DIY.

[mountainmare]

I'll try to find my trip reports from the first trip and the most recent so that you can compare.

[mountainmare]

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=430226&highlight=

This was our first trip--do not be put off by our Rome experience--when we got around to looking at our pictures DH said--wow we did really get to see alot. BTW--we just book Fabrizio this April to take our us back to our hotel (we were traveling with friends who are NOT DIY people) and he was wonderful again.

[mountainmare]

And this is our recent cruise. http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=962710&highlight=

We have just decided to slow it down a bit.

[cruiseprincepessa]

We were on the same cruise as mountainmare this spring and booked Fabrizio at her recommendation. He was awesome!!! We went to Pisa and Florence with him and he was very entertaining as well as experienced. He really took special care of us...knew where to get the tickets to skip the lines (which saved an unbelievable amount of time!)Got us back to the ship in time, made all 4 couples comfortable-even though we didn't really know each other...met on cruise critic. Great price as opposed to ship's tour...more valuable really on account of it beeing private. Can't say enough about his company...he also does tours and transport to Rome. allarounditaly.net

[Holly g]

I am also a DIY person and had the same concerns for our first Med cruise. I studied every guidebook I could get my hands on, watched every DVD, studied street maps and train schedules. DH is a great history buff and I am the art person so we knew in advance what each city could offer. In the end we decided to go the private driver route with a guide for the Vatican museums.

In each of the cities we did see everything, had a chance to climb the Leaning Tower and toss a coin in the Trevi Fountain and go inside the Colsseum. That being said it did feel more like "check off the sites" days. BUT--the upside is that for the visits that we had done since we have "checked off the sites" so we have the freedom to wander and do our DIY thing without wondering if we are missing anything.

For our recent cruise I carefully looked at the ports and for one (Cadiz) I picked a private driver because to do what we wanted this was the only way. It was the best choice.

Between Livorno and Civitavecchia if you were going to pick just one with a guide I would say Livorno, but since this is your first trip consider a driver/guide for both. Ask yourself--will you be happy just wandering Rome, or will you be frustrated trying to see the things you have read about. Then on your next trip you can DIY.

 

 

How do you find these private drivers and or guides in the different cities? I would especially want one in Rome to get us into Vatican city without having to wait on the long, long lines.

[travelteach326]

Beachfe, could you pass along your guide information? We are taking our cruise next year and I would like to start to do my research. If you would, email me fonquen326@aol.com

 

 

Thanks!

[lauderdalelady]

I am going on the Ruby Princess Mediterranean cruise and wondered how I could get in touch with the guide Fabrizio that you reccommended so highly. My e-mail is ruthnbernie@yahoo.com.

Thanks for all the informative posts.

[CathyCruises]

How do you find these private drivers and or guides in the different cities? I would especially want one in Rome to get us into Vatican city without having to wait on the long, long lines.

 

Yiu don't HAVE to have a guide--just prebook a tour here: http://mv.vatican.va/3_EN/pages/z-Info/MV_Info_Servizi_Visite.html, take the train from Civitavecchia for 9 euros r/t, and get off at the San Pietro station. The museum entrance is about a 20 minute walk right past the front of St. Peter's Square, and when you're done with the tour, take the back RIGHT hand door out of the Sistine Chapel and you will be right at the basilica! Worked like a charm for us. Multiple times.

 

Cathy

[Bruin Steve]

Here is my take, specific to these two ports:

 

First, undertand the difference in Italy between a "guide" and a "driver" is a LEGAL distinction...Under Italian law, a "guide" requires a special license...Very few of the typically recommended private tour purveyors are actual licensed guides.

 

Unlicensed tour people, typically "drivers" are forbidden from providing actual onsite tours--they cannot accompany you through sites like churches, museums, palaces or archaeological sites. They can only drive you from site to site, though they can provide commentary WHILE IN THE CAR. If one wants a continued narrative while inside, say, the Vatican, the Forum, Pompeii or wherever, one needs to hire an additional licensed guide.

 

My BEST recommendation would be to hire a tour company that can provide you with BOTH transportation AND licensed guides.

 

Now, generally, here is where I stand on the DIY vs. tour issue:

 

I have done BOTH many times. I understand how many people actually THINK they covered things very well doing it on their own...but, after many times visiting many European cities, I have come to believe that with a short port stop, it is usually best to hire a guide or take a tour of some sort...of course, depending on the port in question and on your own individual knowledge and experience...

 

I for one, feel very comfortable doing several ports on my own--typically either smaller ports where most sites are within a short distance of the pier...or...cities which I have veisited several times and with which I am very comfortable with the layout and transportation systems...For me, ports like Mykonos, Dubrovnik or Rhodes would fall into the first category, cities like Copenhagen, Barcelona or Stockholm fall into the second...

 

But there are many ports that I have actually already visited several times that still fall outside these categories for me--Both Rome and Livorno would fall into that area with me...

 

Why? First of all, both are cities where most of the tourist sites are quite distant from the ports...Second each has so much to see and the sites cover a wide area.

 

In order to adequately see a significant part of either city (or in Livorno's case, region) in the very limited port stop...if one were doing it on their own, it would take an incredible effort in coordinating the logisics of the variousl transportation systems...time, scheduling, coordination, ditrections...One of the great benefits of a driver, even if not a licensed guide, is that the logistics of fitting in all of the sites you need to get to will be handled for you...waiting, delays and confusion are minimized...it makes for a much more organized day, allowing you to fit so much more in without making any of it too hectic.

 

Ideally, with a driver AND licensed guide, you get the best of everything...If you just have a "driver", definitely consider adding a licensed guide for the Vatican...

 

Yes, some people enjoy the "adventure" of DIY...the stories that come with getting lost, stumbling upon the unknown, seeing things noone else has...For me, that's all great--when I have lots of time...When I spent three weeks in Rome and vicinity on my college summer tour, doing everything on my own was great...I found more offbeat eateries, more bars with character, more virtually undiscovered works of art and architecture, ran into more offbeat characters and learned of more dark corners and hidden hangout spots than anyone could hope for...BUT, when one has nine hours and that includes getting back and forth to Civitavecchia, it sure pays to have it all scheduled and organized for you and have someone to lead you around...Heck, as a student in Rome with no set schedule, I could spend all day at the Piazza Navona, soaking my feet in the fountain, eating Gelato, shooting the bull with my buddies, hitting on girls from all over the world, just soaking in the culture and oozing out the attitude...And that's a great way to spend a day in Rome...when you don't have to see everything on a tight schedule--when you're a "grown-up"...

 

Of course, maybe some grown-ups like to spend the day that way too...So, I guess, figure out what makes sense for YOU...

[cruisemom42]

Bruin Steve, I agree with a lot of your post, but I think you come down a little hard on the side of private tours. I do think there are a subset of passengers that are willing and able to put in the work, figure out their day, and execute their plans in such a way that they enjoy a full and satisfying day on their own.

 

I am an experienced traveler, but I haven't been everywhere. I find myself "DIY" even in ports I haven't been to before, because once you get used to figuring out the logistics, be it train, bus, metro, map reading, internet research, etc -- it doesn't differ that much from place to place. For example, I am planning to "go it alone" on a trip to Japan this summer. I realize there's no ship to miss but I'm sure I'll face my share of challenges on the busy Tokyo subway and taking the train from city to city, among other things.

 

With research and advice from past cruisers (including me) my sister and BIL, who had not traveled to Europe in a long time, managed to "DIY" in every port on their first Med cruise, including seeing Rome, Athens, Florence/Pisa (Livorno), Naples, and Istanbul. They didn't get lost, see less, or miss their ship. In fact, they had such a great time that they booked another Med cruise about 6 months later.

 

The important thing is to know yourself -- your physical limits, your comfort zone with getting around a large, unfamiliar city, your enthusiasm for doing all the necessary research in advance, and so on. If you're not the type of person who can take this on, then definitely look into a private tour. But if you are the type of person that thinks DIY is for you, don't be discouraged by others who say that "it can't be done"!

[hightownCO]

Cynthia, I so enjoy reading your posts and travel advise! Wish you were still doing the Grand in November. I booked that just about the time you changed your plans.

DD (turns 16 on our cruise) and I will have 1 1/2 days in Rome and I really want to DIY there. First to save costs but also just to do whatever we want at our pace.

Research is key like you point out. Also besides books and on line articles, the library is a good source for travel related DVDs - like Rick Steve's programs & others. It's helpful to actually see the sights and hear someone talking.

[cruisemom42]

Cynthia, I so enjoy reading your posts and travel advise! Wish you were still doing the Grand in November. I booked that just about the time you changed your plans.

 

DD (turns 16 on our cruise) and I will have 1 1/2 days in Rome and I really want to DIY there. First to save costs but also just to do whatever we want at our pace.

 

Research is key like you point out. Also besides books and on line articles, the library is a good source for travel related DVDs - like Rick Steve's programs & others. It's helpful to actually see the sights and hear someone talking.

 

 

Thanks, Sharon. You can't imagine how unhappy I was about cancelling that cruise! You and your daughter will have a great time. I'm now planning to take DS in June 2010 on the Princess Greek Isles itinerary instead.

 

If you'd like my "DIY" notes for the weeklong visit to Rome I made last November, drop me an email at cmkahn(at)bellsouth(dot)net and I'll be happy to send them. Maybe some info will be helpful, depending on what you plan to do. In fact, I could also send you my detailed port notes for the whole itinerary from 2006.

[Holly g]

Yiu don't HAVE to have a guide--just prebook a tour here: http://mv.vatican.va/3_EN/pages/z-Info/MV_Info_Servizi_Visite.html, take the train from Civitavecchia for 9 euros r/t, and get off at the San Pietro station. The museum entrance is about a 20 minute walk right past the front of St. Peter's Square, and when you're done with the tour, take the back RIGHT hand door out of the Sistine Chapel and you will be right at the basilica! Worked like a charm for us. Multiple times.

 

Cathy

 

If you prebook the tour then you don't have to wait on the lines? :confused:

[mountainmare]

Again--it is all about what you want. With a combo of driver/guide and licensed guide we saw everything in Rome that first time---the only thing we missed was Rome itself, but then we also really enjoyed poking around Civitavecchia and loved the city of Naples.

On our trip Greece Turkey and Egypt we were traveling with a family with three teenage kids--the kids did not like the get lost and savor the city approach, they loved the private guided days we had.

I do think we are in the minority when it comes to our travel style...to some people it sounds good but for many people it is just a source of frustration. In our 60s we still have the mindset described by BruinSteve in his college days. Don't worry don't rush ..be happy. We always know the train scedule--always have the port agent contact info and always know how to get to the next port if we need to. For most Med ports missing the ship is not a good thing---but the next port is easier to get to than if you miss the ship in the Caribbean and have to get to some different island.

[Bruin Steve]

Cynthia,

I never said "it can't be done"...

It certainly can...but to varying extents by different people...

Very few can do it really well in an unfamiliar port with limited time and the constrictions of a ship's schedule and timing...

It takes an incredible amount of planning...and often an incredible amount of luck.

It usually takes a willingness to take in a little less and be satisfied seeing less at the port as, quite simply, public transportion, usually the backbone of the DIY, requires pinpoint timing--not always possible--or else waiting around on the train and bus schedules.

As the port regions get more and more complex (like with Livorno, for example), it becomes more and more difficult to fit as much in--one typically concentrates on one or two stops--say just going to Florence and back.

I usually end up in a debate with DIYers on Athens. The typical DIYer walks to the subway from the port, deals with the schedule of the subway and with the crowds of the city, makes it to the Acropolis and the Plaka and gets back to the ship and considers themselves to have adequately "covered" Athens...

Of course, they ARE "satisfied"...and they've seen everything they set out to see in Athens...and they've had an enjoyable visit (assuming they didn't get lost and/or frustrated)...and, yes, with proper instructions and planning, you CAN do this...

Now, on the other hand, I have visited Athens three times now...doing it once as a DIY, once with a ship's shore excursion and once with a private tour. Now, I am a VERY experienced tourist compared to most, but I can honestly state that I saw as much IN Athens on the Shorex, including spending as much time at the Acropolis as I did with DIY...AND had the bulk of the afternoon out at Cape Sounion in addition. Going with a private driver on my most recent visit, we were able to fit so much more into our port day than would ever be conceivable on a DIY--we did a full day private tour for two through the Pelopennese, stopping at Epidaurus, Mycenae, Corinth, Nafplion and more...an incredible array of ancient archaeological sites, museums, scenic vistas and great experiences that I guarantee could not be duplicated by ANYONE doing a DIY--unless they had several days to spend.

 

Bottom line, really, is what you want to get out of your port stop...what is "enough" for YOU to be satisfied. A day of adventure is a day of adventure. And I have no doubt you can plan your own days and make them work if you do the research. Definitely have contingency plans. After many trips to Europe, both cruises and "land trips", I've learned there is a good likelihood that all your planning goes awry...We have encountered transportation strikes, construction changes, unknown local holidays or events and things just not running on time.

 

But among the things I always seem to see from the DIY crowd that rankle me are the notion that EVERY port is easy to do yourself and that THEY somehow saw EVERYTHING there was to see in Rome, Athens, Naples, Monte Carlo, Livorno or wherever doing it on their own...

 

I still insist that...a MAJORITY of cruisers are not capable of dealing with traveling completely on their own...they will get frustrated, lost, taken advantage of and worse...they will end up missing things they've always dreamt of seeing--which is a shame since a lot of people don't just get back to Europe every year like some of us might.

 

Some folks sincerely might not like tours or guides...but I am sure a lot of those would certainly get to appreciate them once they tried it...I think a lot of folks DIY in attempts to save money (though many just won't admit it). If this is the "trip of a lifetime" for you, why spend thousands and thousands on a cruise and airfare and such, then try to save a couple hundred dollars maneuvering through a complex foreign city where you don't speak the language, don't know the local customs and so on? Especially when you have very limited time to spend...

 

So, to all, ask yourself why, really, are you attempting this?

Do not just set out to do everything on your own. Every port is different. Ports where you stumble off the ship right into the downtown tourist zone and all the sites are right in front of you, sure, don't bother with a tour...But, when the ship dumps you in Livorno and the sites are spread across Tuscany--in Florence and in Pisa, in San Gimignano and Volterra, in Lucca and in the Cinque Terra, consider CAREFULLY the advantages of a shore excursion or a tour, a guide or a driver.

[cruisemom42]

If you prebook the tour then you don't have to wait on the lines? :confused:

 

That is correct.

[bunnyette]

If your ship is overnight in Rome - why not combine the best of both worlds. We took the train into Rome (9 euros), then did a walking tour of the Colesseum and Forum with Through Eternity. That gave us a good description of what we were looking at.

 

Then we took the HOHO bus, had some lunch wandered around and had a great day. Through Eternity has a variety of walking tours which will meet your needs and by doing your research you can see some of the city on your own.