My FORMAL NIGHT Experience...(AND RANT)

[kyriecat]

I found it especially interesting that your table mates weren't speaking to you.....seemingly because of your ill-fitting jacket. Did no one at the table have a sense of humor? I hope it's not routine for dinner companions to only speak to those wearing attire they feel is up to their own individual standards.

The OP doesn't mention how many tablemates that he had - only that he had anytime dining. I'm going to guess that he may have been seated with a group that was together. I have had that happen to me during open seating at breakfast/lunch in the MDR. Hubby and I were seated with a group of 6 who were all together. They didn't even acknowledge us. Another guess is that the other people at the table were strangers to the OP since anytime dining seats you with different people each night. They probably simply didn't know what to think about the attire so chose not to comment. If the OP had been at a fixed seating with tablemates he had dined with for several days, I'm sure his tablemates would have found the situation humorous.

 

I'm not surprised that RC didn't have an issue with less-than-formal attire on a formal night. My mom and I sailed RC in January for a Caribbean cruise. We had fixed seating at a table for 6. One of the men at our table wore shorts every night to dinner, including both formal nights. The other 2 men at our table wore shorts every night but formal nights. On formal nights they wore trousers with Caribbean-print shirts.

[Boatdrill]

We sailed September 8-15 on Holland Volendam round trip from Vancouver to Alaska...this experience did not take away from my cruise enjoyment, but come on...it is 2010 and not 1920. If people want to dress up, then let them. But don't turn away people who are cleanly and neatly dressed.

 

And who will decide who is "cleanly and neatly dressed" ?

 

A tie is a tie. A coat is a coat. A tux is a tux.

Very easy for all to understand.

[Boatdrill]

On the Veendam last fall (Mexico) 3 in my group were turned away from dinner when they arrived in casual clothes on a formal night.

They had just come from the movie and had forgotten it was formal night.

 

Our waiter politely reminded them about the dress code and they immediatley realized their mistake before they sat down.

 

No arguments, just a quick apology, and they were back in minutes

in jackets and ties.

 

Oh, and this was in 2009, not 1920. :)

[SwissMyst]

On the Veendam last fall (Mexico) 3 in my group were turned away from dinner when they arrived in casual clothes on a formal night.

They had just come from the movie and had forgotten it was formal night.

 

Our waiter politely reminded them about the dress code and they immediatley realized their mistake before they sat down.

 

No arguments, just a quick apology, and they were back in minutes

in jackets and ties.

 

Oh, and this was in 2009, not 1920. :)

 

I think this is even more important on the small ships where the whole dining room is part of the feel of the place. On the Vista ships and larger you really don't have a feeling you are part of the whole room the way it is broken up. Thank you for sharing your very nice story and glad the Veendam urged a different dress choice, without incident.

[navybankerteacher]

Therein goes my point - to me dress jeans are smart casual and your opinion that they aren't really has no impact on me - nor should it. To my generation this is dressing up. For clarity "good jeans" as you call them are not Levi's you have recently bought. They are denim pants that have been designed to be worn in more formal settings and are structured that way. Denim, once again, to my generation, is much preferred to polyester or cotton "dress pants."

 

I have never been turned away at dinner, regularly receive compliments from my table mates for both my attire and my manners, and I consider what I do to be much more important than what I wear.

 

Your definition of "dress jeans" while perhaps fully acknowledged by your "generation" (your repetition of the term is significant) is fine for you -- but if a dress code excludes jeans (dress or otherwise) why do you feel that your generation's fashion sense trumps that of others?

 

Try to understand that when you wear something that you are requested not to, you are, in fact do-ing something : specifically showing disregard to the request of your host and disrespect to your fellow guests. And that, my generation-conscious friend, should be considered.

[fridayeyes]

With the exception of Formal Night, the HAL dress code as currently stated does not exclude jeans.

[SwissMyst]

Therein goes my point - to me dress jeans are smart casual and your opinion that they aren't really has no impact on me - nor should it. To my generation this is dressing up. For clarity "good jeans" as you call them are not Levi's you have recently bought. They are denim pants that have been designed to be worn in more formal settings and are structured that way. Denim, once again, to my generation, is much preferred to polyester or cotton "dress pants."

 

I have never been turned away at dinner, regularly receive compliments from my table mates for both my attire and my manners, and I consider what I do to be much more important than what I wear.

 

Levi's or polyester pants for my Medicare generation, nope not me. I get my "mature cut" jeans from Eileen Fisher and I would never dream of wearing them for smart casual in the main dining room. http://www.eileenfisher.com/EileenFisher/Shop_By_Item/Denim.jsp?bmLocale=en_US

 

Lido and shore excursions yes, MDR no. My vote goes to good manners and good dressing sense. There are so many travel-worthy dark blue blazers out there, there is little reason a man can't at least pack that. And look good on any occasion through out his travels.

 

You probably look great dressed up. You are young. Enjoy it. I'd rather be jealous of how you look dressed up, than offended by your intentional dressing down.

[vbmom87]

With the exception of Formal Night, the HAL dress code as currently stated does not exclude jeans.

 

You are correct. Jeans were allowed in the dining room on non-formal nights on our 2008 HAL ALaska cruise. However, I will say that VERY FEW people wore jeans in the main dining room on my cruise.

 

This is a topic that people will never agree on. There are cruiselines out there, like NCL, that do not require formal wear. I think people who don't want to dress up should go with a cruiseline like that.

[soldham]

Your definition of "dress jeans" while perhaps fully acknowledged by your "generation" (your repetition of the term is significant) is fine for you -- but if a dress code excludes jeans (dress or otherwise) why do you feel that your generation's fashion sense trumps that of others?

 

Try to understand that when you wear something that you are requested not to, you are, in fact do-ing something : specifically showing disregard to the request of your host and disrespect to your fellow guests. And that, my generation-conscious friend, should be considered.

 

That would be a moot point - HAL's policy does not exclude them:

 

"Evening dress falls into two distinct categories: Formal or Smart Casual. Smart Casual can be defined as slacks and collared shirts for men and casual dresses, slacks and informal evening wear for women. T-shirts, swimsuits, tank tops and shorts are not allowed in the restaurants or public areas during the evening hours. On festive Formal evenings, ladies usually wear a suit, cocktail dress or gown and gentlemen wear a jacket and tie, dark suit or tuxedo. There are approximately two formal nights per week."

 

The Oxford Dictionary defines slacks as "casual trousers for men or women." They also define trousers as a "two legged outer garment from waist usually to ankles." Jeans fit into that definition my friend and HAL seems to agree given the number of times we wear them during smart casual evenings without being run out of the MDR.

 

So - to clarify - jeans are appropriate as they are not on the banned list for smart casual evenings and if you take issue with them you as well are do-ing something. You are imposing your values with regards to clothing on someone else which I am sure you would never wish to do.

 

 

(PS I always abide by the dress code and would NEVER wear jeans on a formal night. If anything I often think myself overdressed on smart casual nights since I enjoy wearing a tie and will usually pair that with a blazer and the aforementioned jeans.)

[mallbucks]

sphincter muscles are getting ever tighter :D

[fridayeyes]

sphincter muscles are getting ever tighter :D

 

Of course they are. Kegels make your behind look great in jeans! (just not on Formal Night.) :D

[taxmantoo]

...So - to clarify - jeans are appropriate as they are not on the banned list for smart casual evenings and if you take issue with them you as well are do-ing something. You are imposing your values with regards to clothing on someone else which I am sure you would never wish to do.

 

You may want to rephrase that!

The fact that someting is not banned does not make it appropriate ;)

Rude people are not banned...

Speedos at the Lido Pool are not banned...

Loud people are not banned...

Smoking is not banned...

Need I go on?

[teacherman]

Over 3,200 views and all of these comments in only 2 days. WOW! Just to clarify...we do a lot of research before we travel. In reading the Alaska boards, I seemed to see a lot of comments about Alaska cruises being a little more casual than other cruises. Since we were going to be gone for 28 days, staying at hotels in 3 different cities, traveling by auto, train, automobile, and 2 different cruise ships, while also packing for Alaska and Hawaii, I didn't take a suit. That is all there is to it. No desire on my part to circumvent any rules or codes. I was really surprised when I was "not accepted". It was just a word of "advice" to others who may be planning the same type of cruise. I have stated that I really enjoyed the cruise, LOVED the happy hour each day where we met so many different people, and am going on HAL, again, next month. So, nice to hear the different comments, but I think you have me figured wrong. I will be writing my reviews later this week. If you read them, you will find them to be most positive. Travel safe and take care.

[GrammieK]

I resent that smokers are classified with rude people and speedos. Now, if I was smoking in my speedo and being rude (perhaps blowing smoke in your face) then you could ban me!

[jcrandle]

Ohhhhh noooooo.... :eek: baseball caps are being allowed in the MDR on formal night....was it being worn backward? :cool:

 

If sweatpants and ball caps are accetable, perhaps we're seeing a trend where robes and ball caps will be acceptable formal wear attire....but only if the ball cap is sporting the logo of the latest World Series winner -- a line must be drawn somewhere. ;)

 

And, if the MCD kicks their show up a notch and adds lap dances to their r'epertoire, the dress code for that night might go out the door...so to speak. :D

 

My pet peeve. I believe that if someone wears a baseball cap backwards, they should be required to present documentation that they spent some time at the catcher position!

[iancal]

Lap dances would be better than the Chef's dinner or whatever they call it these days.

[soldham]

You may want to rephrase that!

The fact that someting is not banned does not make it appropriate ;)

Rude people are not banned...

Speedos at the Lido Pool are not banned...

Loud people are not banned...

Smoking is not banned...

Need I go on?

 

A very true statement but if HAL is OK with it, my partner is OK with it and my table mates are not squirming in their seats with embarrassment I think I will continue to dress as I do. Anyone may feel free to come up and give me a fashion citation if we are ever on a cruise together and I offend your sensibilities :D

 

I think this one will have to be added the some of the great fashion discussions of our time:

 

- Is it OK to wear white after Labour Day?

- Is there such a thing as too much jewellry?

- Should one wear a bathrobe to the Lido pool?

- Can anyone but Elton John wear 'puffy' shirts and get away with it?

- At what age should you stop be trendy and settle for just fashionable?

- <Insert your own fashion conundrum here.>

[Stevesan]

A formal night dress code doesn't exist when it's prefaced by "Usually". That's a suggestion, not a code. To assume that the word applies only to women is a poor argument. Men's attire is a part of the same sentence, thereby calling for inclusion.

 

Even the definiton for "Smart Casual" is clouded with the preface "can be diefined as...".

 

I have empathy for the headwaiters. They're damned when they do and damned when they don't.

 

 

"Evening dress falls into two distinct categories: Formal or Smart Casual. Smart Casual can be defined as slacks and collared shirts for men and casual dresses, slacks and informal evening wear for women. T-shirts, swimsuits, tank tops and shorts are not allowed in the restaurants or public areas during the evening hours. On festive Formal evenings, ladies usually wear a suit, cocktail dress or gown and gentlemen wear a jacket and tie, dark suit or tuxedo. There are approximately two formal nights per week."

 

For final affirmation of a "non"code, take note of the use of "suggested" in the following:

 

In order to complement your fellow guests, Holland America Line asks that you observe the suggested dress code throughout the entire evening.

[GeriatricNurse]

You may want to rephrase that!

The fact that someting is not banned does not make it appropriate ;)

Rude people are not banned...

Speedos at the Lido Pool are not banned...

Loud people are not banned...

Smoking is not banned...

Need I go on?

 

 

And what's not appropriate with Speedos at the Lido Pool? :confused: I have Speedos and I always wear them at the Lido Pool (or any other pool for that matter)!:)

[navybankerteacher]

I resent that smokers are classified with rude people and speedos. Now, if I was smoking in my speedo and being rude (perhaps blowing smoke in your face) then you could ban me!

 

Sadly, no! Self-absorbed behavior is generally accepted, as cruise line staff are reluctant to risk antagonizing any of the my-vacation-my-rules cruising pulic.

[Aruba]

Lap dances would be better than the Chef's dinner or whatever they call it these days.

Now there's an image! :rolleyes:

[bunzo]

we (after many years of travelling with one suitcase and economy accomodataion)are booked on our first ever ocean cruise, and one of the things that appeals to me is the dress code. In this informal life in which we live , we have become accustomed to jeans and cords at the Centre of the Arts and fine restaurants and that really is OK with us. But...I love dressing up and I am anticipating with pleasure the opportunity to feel that this occasion is something special(as much as that word has been belittled). I expect to enjoy dressing with care and seeing other people also enjoy the sense of "class".It will enhance my enjoyment of the meal I know. And I also know thousands disagree.

[Boomer47]

I know going into the cruise that there are formal nights and many folks look forward to this as part of the cruise experience. The MDR on formal nights is FORMAL not cruise casual. In December we will be on-board and for the first time ever we will not participate in Formal night activities, this is our choice and I know going into the cruise that on those nights I will either do room service or use the Lido. It is no big deal! I don't see where the problem is here. We all know it is Formal and we are free to participate or not to participate.

 

I feel this is more a courtesy to our fellow passengers than to any ship policy or rule that is strictly complied with or not or consistently applied.

 

It is a matter of respect to those people who wish to do the formal thing. Been there, done that and enjoyed it. Let those who still want to enjoy the formal dress have at it. And let those who do not go elsewhere. We will be on the Westerdam in Nov. and will choose not to be formal, but we will not "crash" the MDR. In the past, we've made reservations at the Pinnacle on formal nights, and my DH wears a jacket, no tie, no problem. There's always the Lido or room service otherwise. Those of us who have cruised for a number of years need to remember that there are first time cruisers (and die-hard formal wearers) who look forward to dressing up. Let them have their fun--we did it for years and enjoyed. Now it's their turn.

[drcpa]

While I realize this would be a guesstimate (and then vary by ship and itinerary), but what % of men would actually wear tuxedos on the formal nights?

Thanks

[kakalina]

On our last 33 day cruise I would say less than 10% wore tuxes.