Cruise lines are offering extra choices for extra cost

[TWELVEOHONE]

http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/09/05/2392092/cruisers-have-more-options-at.html

 

Cruise lines are increasingly expanding their range of optional services for passengers, whose costs are separate from the ticket fares. Such optional amenities include restaurant dinners, spa treatments and pizza deliveries. "What really is driving a lot of the things we do on board is, our customers say they want variety and they want choice," said Lisa Bauer, senior vice president of hotel operations for Royal Caribbean International. The Miami Herald (free registration) (9/5

[PeggySand]

I read the linked article and left a comment as well.

 

Here is a copy of the comment I left for the article:

 

If the truth is to open up options in dining, etc for guests who wish to pay the extra fee, I have no problem with that. However, my problem is that the quality of the food in the Main Dining Rooms and the Buffets is going downhill at an alarming rate (this being the food that is "included" in the cruise fare). Since it is "included," that food is no longer a priority to the cruise line, which of course encourages people to upgrade to the food they must pay extra for. Come on Carnival and Royal Caribbean, etc. let's just be honest about the changes that are happening, okay??

 

We are frequent cruisers and love, love, love this form of travel. We also take advantage of the Specialty restaurants at least a couple of times during the course of our cruise. My problem is when the cruise lines tell us they are charging more & more frequently for "extras" for OUR benefit. Another example is the quality of the coffee in the MDR or the Buffet....of course we coffee addicts will be buying the better coffee at the coffee bars. Yes, it is our choice, but why let the quality of the "included" coffee go downhill so much?

 

Sorry for the soapbox, just my opinions.

 

Peggy

[mommyz]

I read the linked article and left a comment as well.

 

Here is a copy of the comment I left for the article:

 

If the truth is to open up options in dining, etc for guests who wish to pay the extra fee, I have no problem with that. However, my problem is that the quality of the food in the Main Dining Rooms and the Buffets is going downhill at an alarming rate (this being the food that is "included" in the cruise fare). Since it is "included," that food is no longer a priority to the cruise line, which of course encourages people to upgrade to the food they must pay extra for. Come on Carnival and Royal Caribbean, etc. let's just be honest about the changes that are happening, okay??

 

We are frequent cruisers and love, love, love this form of travel. We also take advantage of the Specialty restaurants at least a couple of times during the course of our cruise. My problem is when the cruise lines tell us they are charging more & more frequently for "extras" for OUR benefit. Another example is the quality of the coffee in the MDR or the Buffet....of course we coffee addicts will be buying the better coffee at the coffee bars. Yes, it is our choice, but why let the quality of the "included" coffee go downhill so much?

 

Sorry for the soapbox, just my opinions.

 

Peggy

 

Peggy I so agree with you. We've noticed the same thing. When we started cruising many years ago "all inclusive" was just that. Our last cruise during spring break was shocking to see how much was not included anymore.

[cruiserone]

I do agree, somewhat. I hate being nickel and dimed. I would rather pay up front and have no real surprises.

 

As you can see we have been traveling many years. When we first decided to cruise there were not many extras. Beer was $1 and mixed drinks were $3. All gym classes were free, there were little upcharges for anything.But one thing has been consistent the coffee has always been awful so DH is glad there is a choice for coffees on board. I do like the idea of A restaurant on board as an option but to have two, three and some ships, four other places to eat? I notice that the up charge has just gone up, also.

 

I can tell you that I do not usually take a cruise for the food. I go for the ship, the destinations and the time to get away from the everyday rat race. /di U want to have decent food on a cruise, of course. We all do.

 

Happy Sailing All. Like everything else change is inevitable.:rolleyes:

[Cruise-A-Hoy]

I agree with you

The food in the MDR and Buffett has gone downhill. I am also a coffee lover and do not like the coffee in the MDS or Buffett. But if I am not mistaking they use "Seattle's Best" coffee which is a good brand I just don't like it.

[SusieV]

Peggy I so agree with you. We've noticed the same thing. When we started cruising many years ago "all inclusive" was just that. Our last cruise during spring break was shocking to see how much was not included anymore.

 

I think the point they are trying to make is that what of the things that you saw were not included, were even available before? It's not like Murano used to be free and then they suddenly started charging for it; it's a new experience.

 

Do I agree that the included stuff is going downhill? Yes, but again, it is a climate of cost cutting and prices aren't going up. I'd be happier paying a little more to keep the included stuff of better quality, but since that isn't going to happen, I'm OK with paying for the extras onboard that I want. We know going in that our spending will be more onboard than for the cost of the trip and we budget that way.

 

You can still have a nice trip without putting your hand into your pocket, but you can have a nicer one if you do!

[EithneMay]

I wish they would just keep quality high and raise the price of the cruise a bit!

[boogs]

Peggy I so agree with you. We've noticed the same thing. When we started cruising many years ago "all inclusive" was just that. Our last cruise during spring break was shocking to see how much was not included anymore.

 

I always have to laugh whenever I read a comment like this. The poster may be correct about certain things not being included as on an all inclusive cruise, but conveniently ignores the fact that the cost of that "non-inclusive" cruise is substantially less than it used to be, even a dozen years ago. You can't expect low cruise fares to include everything that a luxury cruise includes, or what the much more expensive cruises in the past used to include. If you want take advantage of lower prices, you will have to pay extra for those things that are over and above. If you want everything included, then be prepared to pay the price. You can't have it both ways, no matter how 'shocked' and outraged you may claim to be.

[I&J Cruisers]

This has been going on for years. But, I do think that it has accellerated recently. I think the turning point was the "success" of any time dining, once they got passengers to buy into the concept. I do know that I've kept specialty dining choices to one per week with traditional dining because I enjoyed the interaction with people I had gotten to know and enjoy. I didn't think it was fair to request a large table and then not show up for 3 of 7 nights of the week. That said, I recall paying quite a bit more for a much smaller cabin without a balconey, which was unheard of 25 or 30 years ago. I think my tipping point will be if/when they start charging for entertainment. If they start doing that I don't see the difference between a cruise or a land vacation, except for a much larger room on land.

[Denny01]

Interesting on the general comments about how much is being charged extra now...but my specific experience with Celebrity is that they've added the Specialty restaurants ('added' is the wrong word since they were 'added' when the shps were built), charge for specialty coffees and alcholol, and noticed the gelato's were added recently, but not a lot more.

 

Just as any other business (land and sea), those are additions to what I'd consider the norm. When I go to a restaurant and order a regular coffee, I get free refills, but not if I order an expresso or such. If I want an upgraded dessert (gelato), it costs extra anywhere, when I go to a 'free' gym and want a special class, it costs me. If I want a massage, it cost me, and so on. My personal view is, I like them adding costs to 'extras'. That way, you pay for it if you want it, and I don't subsdize your extras in my basic cruise charge. And, yes we buy a few drinks, wines, gelatos, coffees and so on, and may go to a specialty once, but I just enjoy what the ship provides as a basic, and don't sweat the extras.

 

And that is one of the areas I find postive with Celebrity...they don't seem to do the hardsell nearly as much as my experiences on Princess, Carnival, RCL cruises. It is there, but not pressed. I almost lost it when the Princess staff asked me for the 3rd time in one day if I wanted to get the wine tasting tickets, and that was when our waiter was standing behind the specialty coffee/liquor cart brought out after dinner, for $6. I find that type of thing tacky and detracts from an overall enjoyable experience. Went to a 'how to pack efficiently' lecture on Princess, and it was an infomercial for that vacuum packing system they sell, with No other 'tips'.

 

And as for the All-Inclusive - Done the all-enclusive and normal cruise cost comparison, and for me, I'd need a liver transplant to even get close to being 'even'. When I first started cruising, I got a brochure from an upgrade all-inclusive Line and boy, I went nuts....it looked so cheap for a cruise, all the goodies on the ship And airfare!! Then I realized the 1/2 price-off I was looking at was for one person, not two as I mistakenly read it, and realized I was looking at the price of 3+ normal cruises for their price of one. So I have a real problem with the experts (not our other friendly posters!), telling us it comes out equal in the wash....right. I don't knock it, it would seem to make for a very refined crusing experience having it All-Inclusive, and I'm sure there are other postivies, but for the way we cruise, it isn't a cost-effective way.

 

Den

[Orator]

Peggy I so agree with you. We've noticed the same thing. When we started cruising many years ago "all inclusive" was just that. Our last cruise during spring break was shocking to see how much was not included anymore.

 

My first cruise was in 1977 on the Fairwind. We splurged and booked a high deck outside cabin. Balconies were very, very scarce. There was one dining room and a terffic pizzaria. There was an extra charge for the pizza. However, soda was free in that venue and in the MDR. Copies of the menus were available if you paid for them. They were much more elaborate than what you see today. Entertainment was minimal compared to today's standards. I paid about three times what I would pay today for the same type of cruise. My TA did give us a gift of a bottle of sparkling wine and we were surprised to get it. The cruise was great and we became hooked on cruising, but I'll take what we get for the money today compared to what we received then. I wonder what others found to be "all inclusive" if they cruised in the 70's.

[scf1270]

My personal view is, I like them adding costs to 'extras'. That way, you pay for it if you want it, and I don't subsdize your extras in my basic cruise charge. And, yes we buy a few drinks, wines, gelatos, coffees and so on, and may go to a specialty once, but I just enjoy what the ship provides as a basic, and don't sweat the extras.

 

Den

 

Denny - You said it very well!

 

In general, DH and I feel that:

-The basic cost of cruising is very reasonable compared to many other types of vacations.

-If someone wants to pay $150 for a cabana or a massage, $40 for a speciality meal, etc why does anyone else need to have a fit over it???

 

-And yes, the main dining room meals are not as good as they used to be and should be improved.

 

Sara

[tserface]

You could say this about a lot of things. For example, the food at Taco Bell is not as good as it used to be.

 

That said, I think they focus too much on keeping the price of the cruise cheaper and not enough on keeping the quality high. I think most people would rather pay another $100 per cruise and get better food in the MDR rather than have them cheap out on the food and keep the cruise prices down the $100. Of course, we do have the option for the specialty restaurants, but there are some other problems with that. For example, we like the dynamic of the shared tables in the MDR and we've met a lot of people over the years and it's enhanced our cruise. So, for us it's not totally about the food.

 

I know you can get some items in the MDR from the specialty menus, but they always seem to be even more overpriced.

 

The food in the MDR on our last few cruises has not been awful, but certainly not what it used to be. I don't think it's a conspiracy to force us out to the specialties. I think they are just focusing on overall price and cutting costs in different places to keep the posted prices lower.

 

Tom

 

Denny - You said it very well!

 

In general, DH and I feel that:

-The basic cost of cruising is very reasonable compared to many other types of vacations.

-If someone wants to pay $150 for a cabana or a massage, $40 for a speciality meal, etc why does anyone else need to have a fit over it???

 

-And yes, the main dining room meals are not as good as they used to be and should be improved.

 

Sara

[Retty2Go]

I made final payment for a cruise today, and as I would with any large purchase, I brought out my buyer's remorse calculator. For those of us who don't live close to the port, the cost of a 13 night Celebrity cruise in AQ or CC with extras comes awfully close to the all inclusive lines. I was reading the thread about the beverage packages today, and I had to agree with the majority, that, yes, the packages are values, that is, if you have to pay for drinks. However, that "value" for two premium liquor packages adds $1600 to each of our upcoming cruises, plus $1500-$1800 for air for each. Where, after adding $3200 for water, coffee, liquor, and transportation, is the tipping point (speaking of which, I still need to add another $325 for gratuities)? Maybe it's at the $30-40 for the "specialty" venues. A spring TA with Crystal including air and everything is actually less. Even the (upscale) sister line, Azamara, will upgrade me to a suite and give me wine at lunch and dinner for less on the spring TA from NY to Paris. I know that many of you are extremely loyal to Celebrity, but for some of us new to this, the loyalty is being tested.

 

Cheers,

John

 

And as for the All-Inclusive - Done the all-enclusive and normal cruise cost comparison, and for me, I'd need a liver transplant to even get close to being 'even'. When I first started cruising, I got a brochure from an upgrade all-inclusive Line and boy, I went nuts....it looked so cheap for a cruise, all the goodies on the ship And airfare!! Then I realized the 1/2 price-off I was looking at was for one person, not two as I mistakenly read it, and realized I was looking at the price of 3+ normal cruises for their price of one. So I have a real problem with the experts (not our other friendly posters!), telling us it comes out equal in the wash....right. I don't knock it, it would seem to make for a very refined crusing experience having it All-Inclusive, and I'm sure there are other postivies, but for the way we cruise, it isn't a cost-effective way.

 

Den

[bottomfeeder]

I made final payment for a cruise today, and as I would with any large purchase, I brought out my buyer's remorse calculator. For those of us who don't live close to the port, the cost of a 13 night Celebrity cruise in AQ or CC with extras comes awfully close to the all inclusive lines. I was reading the thread about the beverage packages today, and I had to agree with the majority, that, yes, the packages are values, that is, if you have to pay for drinks. However, that "value" for two premium liquor packages adds $1600 to each of our upcoming cruises, plus $1500-$1800 for air for each. Where, after adding $3200 for water, coffee, liquor, and transportation, is the tipping point (speaking of which, I still need to add another $325 for gratuities)? Maybe it's at the $30-40 for the "specialty" venues. A spring TA with Crystal including air and everything is actually less. Even the (upscale) sister line, Azamara, will upgrade me to a suite and give me wine at lunch and dinner for less on the spring TA from NY to Paris. I know that many of you are extremely loyal to Celebrity, but for some of us new to this, the loyalty is being tested.

 

Cheers,

John

 

On the flip side, my guarantee balcony cabin for my cruise this fall (12 day Med on the Solstice) was $949 each plus taxes and gratuities (prepaid since we are doing select dining) which if I recall works out to a little over $1200 each in total. Airfare was $805 for me, $840 for my son who lives in a different city. So say $2100 each since we are also eating in Tuscan Grill one night. I certainly don't drink enough to make an alcohol package worthwhile, so even if I add on 2 drinks a day plus a coffee (say $25 per day, which is more than I will spend on drinks most days and I expect my son will be about the same) that still only totals to $300 more each for drinks, bringing our total to $2400 each all-inclusive. I can't imagine that we could get a 12-day cruise including air on one of the premium lines for anything close to $2400. So I think it is dependent on how good a deal you get on your cruise and airfare as well as how much you drink! I am certainly not feeling any buyer's remorse at all, especially since I've been lucky enough to be upgraded to CC. :)

[kkid]

I have a different perspective on how Celebrity and I assume other cruise lines operate. They operate a business and need to make a profit to survive. They have a lot of overhead investment in sparkling ships. It is a very competitive industry. They have to keep prices down, because customer loyalty only goes so far. They work very hard to fill ships for every cruise and will drop prices to do so. I suspect every cruise would be a profit loss, if cruise fare and tips were the only income for a cruise. So they add high-profit non-included options to make a real profit. I don't have to partake in the high cost extras, and usually don't. I'm obviously not normal because I have yet to dine a specialty restaurant. Many of you have and Celebrity has noticed you are willing pay a relatively high price to do so. You can blame Celebrity for charging an extra fee when you apparently think the extra fee is worthwhile. It is really no different than gas stations that make all their profit selling high priced snacks, sandwiches, and drinks.

[63galaxie]

In the beginning of our cruising addiction, we spent zip on shore excursions, speciality restaurants, drinks, and gambling. Along the way we would spend money on some of those things and less on others. Now, we have it down to bringing our own wine, having a few drinks onboard, buying one souvenier onboard, booking our own excursions, not gambling, getting a few trinkets at some of the ports, dining at a specialty restaurant or two, taking our own photos, and tipping more than we first did. We've learned what we want to spend our money on and what we don't want to. Shore excursions mean more to us than most items for sale on the ship. For us, it's great that we have options onboard, and if we want them, we'll buy them. I've spent very little above and beyond the initial cost of the cruise simply because I had everything I needed and/or I just didn't want to spend the money. Looking back, the trinkets are okay, but the memories we made are the things we treasure the most. That's one reason we pay more for a big balcony (we love our private time watching the ocean). My "two cents" would be to continue keeping the base cost of the cruise down and continue to offer extras for those who want to pay for them.

[4774Papa]

I read the linked article and left a comment as well.

 

Here is a copy of the comment I left for the article:

 

If the truth is to open up options in dining, etc for guests who wish to pay the extra fee, I have no problem with that. However, my problem is that the quality of the food in the Main Dining Rooms and the Buffets is going downhill at an alarming rate (this being the food that is "included" in the cruise fare). Since it is "included," that food is no longer a priority to the cruise line, which of course encourages people to upgrade to the food they must pay extra for. Come on Carnival and Royal Caribbean, etc. let's just be honest about the changes that are happening, okay??

 

We are frequent cruisers and love, love, love this form of travel. We also take advantage of the Specialty restaurants at least a couple of times during the course of our cruise. My problem is when the cruise lines tell us they are charging more & more frequently for "extras" for OUR benefit. Another example is the quality of the coffee in the MDR or the Buffet....of course we coffee addicts will be buying the better coffee at the coffee bars. Yes, it is our choice, but why let the quality of the "included" coffee go downhill so much?

 

Sorry for the soapbox, just my opinions.

 

Peggy

Peggy,

We have only been cruising since July 2010, so we cannot compare prior to that date.

We find that the specialty dining options are better, but have found the MDRs to be more inconsistent. One meal might be just as good as a specialty dining meal, another will be a notch below, or smaller quantity of food.

While on NCL, my DW ordered an Italian dish in the Italian specialty rerestaurant, so I ordered it later, when it was offered in the MDR. The quality was the same, but the serving was about half what my DW's had been in the specialty.

[dabear]

My first cruise was in 1977 on the Fairwind. We splurged and booked a high deck outside cabin. Balconies were very, very scarce. There was one dining room and a terffic pizzaria. There was an extra charge for the pizza. However, soda was free in that venue and in the MDR. Copies of the menus were available if you paid for them. They were much more elaborate than what you see today. Entertainment was minimal compared to today's standards. I paid about three times what I would pay today for the same type of cruise. My TA did give us a gift of a bottle of sparkling wine and we were surprised to get it. The cruise was great and we became hooked on cruising, but I'll take what we get for the money today compared to what we received then. I wonder what others found to be "all inclusive" if they cruised in the 70's.

 

My 1st cruise was in 1969 on the Carla C and 1971 on the Jason). The ships then were older transatlantic styled with fewer amenities. However, it was all inclusive, although fewer choices, the food in the MDR was excellent ( Greek Island cruise food was so so)and the entertainment was very good (more bands and less broadway type shows). The drinks also were very cheap ($1) since there was no federal or state tax on it (same as today but it now is a profit center). Today the ships are better but the mass market lines tend to nickel and dime you. We have taken a few near luxury lines (O and A) and they were more expensive but the food and service were substantially better than the mass mkt lines. To some extent, you get what you pay for!

[Jimbo59]

In 2000 we paid $700 for an inside cabin for a seven day Carnival Caribbean cruise in high season (February).

 

Now, you can book a similar cruise for February 2012 for essentially the same price. What other major purchase costs the same as twelve years ago?

 

Of course photos were $7.00 each (now 19.95), drinks cost more, and most cruise lines have extra-cost restaurants.

 

Cruise lines have adopted the airline model: low basic cost and many extra-cost options.

[Lsimon]

In 2000 we paid $700 for an inside cabin for a seven day Carnival Caribbean cruise in high season (February).

 

Now, you can book a similar cruise for February 2012 for essentially the same price. What other major purchase costs the same as twelve years ago?...

 

Computers, HDTV's and electronics.

[nycmode]

I'm kind of a simple guy I guess. As long as the food isn't terrible, and I can get a good night's sleep, I'm happy. The cruise liners are probably now targeting people like me who are overworked, exhausted and just grateful to get away from it all lol :)

[Bridge Maven]

Years ago only a small segment of the population could afford to cruise and they were a lot more expensive than most land based vacations. Today the opposite is true. By keeping cruise prices low and offering numerous extras to enhance one's overall cruise experience, Celebrity can be all things to all people from every socio-economic class.

[Retty2Go]

It is impossible for any body or thing to be everything to everyone across the entire socio-economic spectrum. Inevitably, quality will decrease and certain customers will be alienated (meaning feel they are slumming). All inclusive resorts, like all-inclusive cruise lines, regardless of the type of customer they target, are at their lowest prices in years. Celebrity, likewise, is having to keep prices low to fill their new mega-ships, and to compete with the next-level-up cruise lines who are competing for those vacationers who want something more than an inside room with no extras and surrounded by 3000 people.

 

Years ago only a small segment of the population could afford to cruise and they were a lot more expensive than most land based vacations. Today the opposite is true. By keeping cruise prices low and offering numerous extras to enhance one's overall cruise experience, Celebrity can be all things to all people from every socio-economic class.

[boogs]

Celebrity, likewise, is having to keep prices low to fill their new mega-ships, and to compete with the next-level-up cruise lines who are competing for those vacationers who want something more than an inside room with no extras and surrounded by 3000 people.

 

The current trend is to give as many passengers as possible a decent cruise experience for a reasonable price. It used to be that only the wealthy could afford to cruise, most in small inside or porthole type "ocean view" cabins, with only a few in very expensive balcony cabins. Now most cruise lines are building ships with a very high percentage of balcony cabins, a stateroom category that in the past only a few people could afford. On the Silhouette, for example, there are only 143 inside cabins and 12 ocean view cabins, while the clear majority, 1342 of them, are balcony cabins. We are indeed getting much more for our money than ever before, even considering that the food in the MDR is no longer gourmet quality like before. That people still complain about food quality being lower than before while ignoring the fact that they now enjoy a cruise experience with many more activities and venues than ever before, all at a cost that is significantly lower, indicates that they suffer from a severe case of "selective memory".

 

Another difference, in the 'good old days' people had to dress up for dinner every night in a style similar to what is now requested for the occasional formal night. How many people want to go back to that kind of cruising?? :D