My public letter to Royal: why do you keep pushing me away?

[knittinggirl]

Hear hear! We'd all like to think that everyone does their research and so forth, but as we've all noted, ship's impact is limited to on the ship.

 

Bruce makes a great point, from what I have seen when it comes to Customer versus Staff on here, we all ask for rules enforcement in the aggregate but then at the same time discuss how those rules can be bent or broken (count the number of posts on how to circumvent the beverage policy in the past week), AND we get upset at the staff for enforcing the rules that we personally don't like. And based on what I have seen, the line will more often than not take the side of passenger over staff if it comes down to individual confrontation. After all, staff members are easy to replace, there's a long waiting list I suspect. So I can't say I am surprised when staff chooses not to make a scene over a kid in the pool. OFFICERS on the other hand are a different matter.

 

It's the customer wins until they decide to change the perks, like they did a few years ago when they removed the CL for the Diamond Members. I wonder if the average age of Diamond Plus is higher than Diamond, and they were trying to tone down the disruptive behavior. Back to someone else's post about Diamond Breakfast crashers. We just returned from a Princess cruise in a suite, and they had a list of all suite passengers for the special breakfast. They had the same staff each day working that breakfast.

[Scotty G]

How did you know they didn't have hidden disabilities? If you wish to wait yourself, that's your choice. But why should someone with a hidden disability who can't take stairs have to take a backseat to someone in a wheelchair if the ambulatory person was there first? What gives you the right to control elevator access?

My DW has a hidden disability and would never board an elevator before someone in a scooter. Some of us are more fortunate than others.

[booze brothers]

So those with hidden disabilities should have their needs be any less valid simply because they don't use a mobility device? Is it a double standard?

 

And we're supposed to know of a hidden disability, HOW????

 

If I knew of a person with a hidden disability , I'd be the first in line ,to help,If that's what they wanted.

 

Ducklite, you must have some hidden issues and I'm sorry. I took care of my elderly Mother and I'm very sensitive to anyone with a disability.

[ducklite]

My DW has a hidden disability and would never board an elevator before someone in a scooter. Some of us are more fortunate than others.

 

So let's say you've been standing there waiting for 30 minutes for an elevator with room. As someone in a scooter pulls up, the doors open and there's room for the scooter, but not you and your wife. What if you had been waiting 45 minutes? An hour?

 

Also, do you think it's acceptable for a random passenger to tell you and your spouse that you can't enter the elevator because the scooter gets priority? I certainly don't.

[Scotty G]

I agree with the OP. After reading all the responses it appears that there is a regular crowd on each side of the issues. We have paid our dues to RCL by way of choice. Celebrity is an alternative but we find RCL to be more attuned to our needs. We hardly cruise during times when there are too many children on board. It is time for all Captains and Hotel Directors to enforce the rules RCL established or abolish them. Obviously all customers are not happy with RCL. Time for corporate to pay attention!!!

[ducklite]

And we're supposed to know of a hidden disability, HOW????

 

If I knew of a person with a hidden disability , I'd be the first in line ,to help,If that's what they wanted.

 

Ducklite, you must have some hidden issues and I'm sorry. I took care of my elderly Mother and I'm very sensitive to anyone with a disability.

 

My only issue is that I think you are wrong to make assumptions that one person needs an elevator more than the next and to request that someone who has been waiting for an elevator give up their place in line to someone in a wheelchair who hasn't been waiting as long. You don't know why they aren't taking the stairs, and it's none of your business.

[bplazo]

I hope that you did not allow your child to press the buttons if there were other people in the elevator with you. That would be rude.

 

It was rude anyway because I am sure that someone was waiting for an elevator. Just another parent not wanting to tell their child no.

[lv2cruisgrl]

It all sounds so easy - and it was until a few years ago. Then the cruise lines got a bit greedy. We started building bigger and bigger ships, taking advantage of economies of scale to improve the bottom line. It worked. But to fill those ships we were forced to market our cruises to all of humanity. We made cruises so inexpensive that people who would normally never cruise are on our ships - filling every cabin to improve profitability.

 

Many of those people have never stayed in a hotel in their lives; they have never traveled anywhere in their entire lives. They do not know how to behave in an international setting.

They cannot or will not afford a passport.

They cannot or will not afford to buy clothing to meet dress codes.

They have not trained their children how to behave in public.

Many of them cannot afford to pay their bar bills at the end of the cruise.

 

In the not so old days, if a passenger tried to wear shorts or inappropriate clothing in the dining room, he was politely informed that he would need to change his clothing for entry. He would apololgize and come back better dressed.

 

Today we need to inform a much larger percentage of our passengers that they are not properly dressed. Do they apologize and come back better dressed? No.

They throw a punch at the crewmember who informed them, then make up a wild story that he insulted them, trying to get the employee fired. They are often successful. Many of today's crew are not willing to sacrifice their careers in order to enforce a dress code.

 

I do not blame those raised by wolves for wanting to take a cruise. I blame the cruise lines for making it possible.

 

OH WOW so true....I agree...

[lafngas]

It's enlightening that this type of dialogue is totally absent on the Princess threads,and probably others cruise lines.

Hmmmm.

[Loonbeam]

Oh trust me it happens on the Princess boards. Usually about formal wear or tipping. Just right now the regulars have been smacking some of those down..

 

It's enlightening that this type of dialogue is totally absent on the Princess threads,and probably others cruise lines.

Hmmmm.

[Loonbeam]

I was careful to make note of individual confrontations. When a specific passenger has a beef with a specific employee it seems the employee gets short shrifted.

 

It's very different at the corporate level, where customers are treated in the aggregate.

 

 

 

It's the customer wins until they decide to change the perks, like they did a few years ago when they removed the CL for the Diamond Members. I wonder if the average age of Diamond Plus is higher than Diamond, and they were trying to tone down the disruptive behavior. Back to someone else's post about Diamond Breakfast crashers. We just returned from a Princess cruise in a suite, and they had a list of all suite passengers for the special breakfast. They had the same staff each day working that breakfast.

[ducklite]

It all sounds so easy - and it was until a few years ago. Then the cruise lines got a bit greedy. We started building bigger and bigger ships, taking advantage of economies of scale to improve the bottom line. It worked. But to fill those ships we were forced to market our cruises to all of humanity. We made cruises so inexpensive that people who would normally never cruise are on our ships - filling every cabin to improve profitability.

 

Many of those people have never stayed in a hotel in their lives; they have never traveled anywhere in their entire lives. They do not know how to behave in an international setting.

They cannot or will not afford a passport.

They cannot or will not afford to buy clothing to meet dress codes.

They have not trained their children how to behave in public.

Many of them cannot afford to pay their bar bills at the end of the cruise.

 

In the not so old days, if a passenger tried to wear shorts or inappropriate clothing in the dining room, he was politely informed that he would need to change his clothing for entry. He would apololgize and come back better dressed.

 

Today we need to inform a much larger percentage of our passengers that they are not properly dressed. Do they apologize and come back better dressed? No.

They throw a punch at the crewmember who informed them, then make up a wild story that he insulted them, trying to get the employee fired. They are often successful. Many of today's crew are not willing to sacrifice their careers in order to enforce a dress code.

 

I do not blame those raised by wolves for wanting to take a cruise. I blame the cruise lines for making it possible.

 

Lake of experience doesn't equal lack of class.

 

A few years ago I sat on a flight next to a gentleman (and he was truly a gentleman) who had never even traveled outside of the State he was born in. He was 70-some years old. He wore his "Sunday Best," a suit, starched shirt, bow tie, and spit shined shoes. He kept his hat in his lap through the flight. His manners were impeccable.

 

He was on his way to visit his sister on the west coast, they hadn't seen each other since they were children during the Depression as she had been sent to live with distant relatives who could afford to care for her. When the flight attendant asked if he wanted a beverage, he inquired to the cost, as he "wanted to make sure he could afford it." The words "please," "thank you," and "ma'am" were used often in his vocabulary.

 

He might not have been well traveled or well educated, but I would have loved to have had him as a table mate. His life stories must have been fascinating, just by the history he had lived through. He was a true class act.

[Debde]

No offense taken--I'm pretty thick skinned :) --actually, as I recall (and it was awhile ago) when I first joined C & A, one needed to get to Diamond level to access the concierge lounge, and all it's benefits (priority on excursions, reservation assistance, etc.) So, while not my number one priority, was certainly looking forward to those benefits once I got there. Just saying that the benefits continue to get watered down as the membership grows--not sure there's anything that can be done about that, and again it certainly won't stop me from cruising--but my point was: someone can take a cruise one time, get a junior suite, and enjoy all the benefits of the concierge club, while I, after spending lots of $$$$$ on RCCl cruises cannot. Just a pet peeve of mine

 

phewww! ;)

But-I don't think booking a JS includes CL service. Only GS and up!

also-look at what that person can pay for that one time cruise in a suite. It can be pretty hefty.

That's really why this thread poped up. Changes are probably coming and people are already in panic mode!

[Coralc]

And we're supposed to know of a hidden disability, HOW????

 

If I knew of a person with a hidden disability , I'd be the first in line ,to help,If that's what they wanted.

 

Ducklite, you must have some hidden issues and I'm sorry. I took care of my elderly Mother and I'm very sensitive to anyone with a disability.

 

When I headed for the disabled entrance at a government building, my husband asked, "Are you allowed to use that entrance?'

 

I said, "Yes dear, they don't make you wear the handicapped placard around your neck!"

 

:D:):D

[nikimouse]

Niki, it's not just about kids. There are a LOT of people on CC that are uptight about darn near EVERYTHING. Don't be put off on Royal, the ships (reality) are not like this board. Trust me if they were I could never have made it through 10 cruises without getting arrested.

 

 

hey struther1 ! you took my side a few months ago when I first came on RCI and was under attack lol nice to see you again and I hope if I do sail with RCI one day I will meet like minded fun people who havent even heard of cruise critic lol

[honeybee85]

Lake of experience doesn't equal lack of class.

 

A few years ago I sat on a flight next to a gentleman (and he was truly a gentleman) who had never even traveled outside of the State he was born in. He was 70-some years old. He wore his "Sunday Best," a suit, starched shirt, bow tie, and spit shined shoes. He kept his hat in his lap through the flight. His manners were impeccable.

 

He was on his way to visit his sister on the west coast, they hadn't seen each other since they were children during the Depression as she had been sent to live with distant relatives who could afford to care for her. When the flight attendant asked if he wanted a beverage, he inquired to the cost, as he "wanted to make sure he could afford it." The words "please," "thank you," and "ma'am" were used often in his vocabulary.

 

He might not have been well traveled or well educated, but I would have loved to have had him as a table mate. His life stories must have been fascinating, just by the history he had lived through. He was a true class act.

 

He sounds like a true gentleman. I do not the think previous poster meant to imply everyone that is inexperienced is classless, only that when you find those with appalling behavior they are often not experienced.

 

I will say this: those former clients of mine that made the most unreasonable demands were often the ones that paid the least. They sure did throw around their status, though.

[ducklite]

He sounds like a true gentleman. I do not the think previous poster meant to imply everyone that is inexperienced is classless, only that when you find those with appalling behavior they are often not experienced.

 

I will say this: those former clients of mine that made the most unreasonable demands were often the ones that paid the least. They sure did throw around their status, though.

 

I apologize if I took the post incorrectly. I can't speak for others, but we usually book club/concierge level when we travel. It's not for the free booze (which is usually low quality well brands) but rather the various conveniences and extra space that we're willing to pay for. If I want a drink, I'll spend the money to buy one worth drinking, it's certainly not going to break me.

 

I am Platinum with Marriott, and I can count on one hand the times I've had an alcoholic beverage in the club level lounge. The last time I spent more than a few minutes in a lounge to grab a cup of morning coffee or print something out on the computer was to watch Wills and Kate marry on the wide screen. :D

[ryano]

So let's say you've been standing there waiting for 30 minutes for an elevator with room. As someone in a scooter pulls up, the doors open and there's room for the scooter, but not you and your wife. What if you had been waiting 45 minutes? An hour?

 

So tell us, just how many times have you personally witnessed this type of rude behavior by someone in a scooter or wheelchair? :confused: Keep in mind, that I have a very limited cruising experience but I have yet to see anyone in a scooter or wheelchair that thinks they are entitled to jump in front of the line at the elevators. I have witnessed it many times vice versa though.

 

In fact, I would almost bet a months pay, that if me and you were on the same cruise, for every ONE person in a scooter you see bumrushing the elevators in front of those that have been waiting that you can show me, I will be able to show you 50 able bodied people that bumrush in front of the person waiting there in a wheelchair or scooter so it works both ways here.

 

It has been posted about many times here by some fellow cruisers that are mobility challenged such as myself.

 

I dont mind waiting my turn for the elevator but I totally expect the same in return and I dont feel like that is asking too much.

[Aquahound]

I swear every single time I have been on the RCI boards there has been an argument...

 

The hot topic threads that get heated are easy to avoid. Any title complaining about anything will undoubtably turn into a flame fest. If you open them and participate, you just need to look at it different, recognize the usual flamers, and read it for its comic value.

 

Otherwise, for every flaming thread, there are dozens of friendly threads. :)

[ducklite]

So tell us, just how many times have you personally witnessed this type of rude behavior by someone in a scooter or wheelchair? :confused: Keep in mind, that I have a very limited cruising experience but I have yet to see anyone in a scooter or wheelchair that thinks they are entitled to jump in front of the line at the elevators. I have witnessed it many times vice versa though.

 

:::heavy sigh:::

 

I was responding to someone who stated that he has told people to stand aside so people in wheelchairs could have priority boarding, even if they had just arrived, and without concern that some people who had been waiting might be ambulatory but have hidden disabilities.

 

I dont mind waiting my turn for the elevator but I totally expect the same in return and I dont feel like that is asking too much.

 

And if you'd read the post I was initially responding to, I feel the same way.

[ryano]

:::heavy sigh:::

 

I was responding to someone who stated that he has told people to stand aside so people in wheelchairs could have priority boarding, even if they had just arrived, and without concern that some people who had been waiting might be ambulatory but have hidden disabilities.

 

my apologies then :) I have only been able to read bits and pieces of this thread.

 

I would NEVER expect to cut in line just because Im in a wheelchair.

[nikimouse]

You are just reading the wrong threads. Most of the time its a very friendly bunch on the RCI boards who just like to help others and talk about cruising. And I think you would find the passenger mix on an RCI ship to be anything but uppity. And... I make regular stops at Walmart.;):p

 

 

oceanboy you are probably right. And I think I was a little too touchy and took things too personal.

We dont have walmart over here but I loved the one in florida :D

I suppose the passenger mix is pretty much the same on RCI, NCL and carnival. Or do you think there will be differences? I just dont want to feel out of place or get dirty looks from people who disaprove of something :o

I even felt that disney was a bit upmarket for me and carnival was much more fun, but a bit cheesy, and I think I would prefer something more classy but not too formal if you get what I mean.

Im sorry too if I offended anyone but it gets my back up when people make assumptions about me when they dont know me at all. There are some friendly people on here and my rant wasnt directed at everyone.

[crisndeefromde]

Well said. We saw the writing on the wall several years ago with the Freedom class and waiting for Oasis. RC has changed their marketing stategies. It is amazing how many people can't seem to figure this out. We have been on Celebrity for about 2 yrs now, and just love it. Can't wait to leave this Thursday for a 9 day b2b.

Seems to me like the OP is only concerned about free drinks. She whines about an $8 drink in the hot tub, and about freebies being taken away. There are still numerous good benefits for a D or D+ member. Get over it OP, or better yet, find another cruise line.

 

No actually you are missing the point. Its not about freebies in the CL. its about manners....I was taught to get up when adults were present to give my seat. Its about...you picked up that piece of food...put it on your darn plate and take it...do NOT put it back. GERMS... Secondly...you or your child not matter what the age knocks over my drink in the plasticware the bar service provided me with that IS allowed in pools and hot tubs and you are going to be serving me another one and using your sea pass. I have grown children and yes I have a grandchild. enough is enough when it comes to some of the things we have endured because parents think one is being cute. Give me a break. My butt got busted. It's not whining. Wait till it happens to you. Enjoy your next cruise. I applaud the OP for great letter. Yes I am loyal to Royal, USAir, BMW, and the list goes on.

[lv2cruisgrl]

Hear ... Hear!!!

 

Never once have I witnessed anything on-board RCI ships that comes close to the attitudes displayed on these boards!

 

We have and I should have kept a journal of each cruise and the crazy stuff we have seen of adults and children.

 

Kids skating thru the halls with sneakers with small roller blades on them smashing into people. Kids running up and down the halls outside of our room at all hours of the night.

Woman threw a bottle of red wine at her husband smashed it in their room and they both got thrown off the ship.

People and kids being rude in the windjammer by cutting in front of others and eating as they are taking food.

Parents fighting with the staff because they announed that kids couldnt be in the first 3 rows at the theatre. They were so bad and kept argueing with the staff they almost canceled the show.

Not to mention people trying to sneak drugs onto the ship, they ended up in the panama jail. Kept us from leaving the port for 3 hours.

Kids in the adult pool hot tub - staff thew them out, they came back 10 minutes later.....

Formal night we were in the champagne lounge having a before dinner cocktail. A family in their bathing suits bring in pizza and sat there making a mess and being loud.

The list is endless.....after more than 20 cruises I am taking a break from RCI...

[bplazo]

When I headed for the disabled entrance at a government building, my husband asked, "Are you allowed to use that entrance?'

 

I said, "Yes dear, they don't make you wear the handicapped placard around your neck!"

 

:D:):D

 

I always use the handicapped bathroom. I hate those small stalls that you can not even move around in and then you find yourself trying to open the door and you are backing up against the nasty toilet.