It appears the tide is turning

[boogs]

I appreciate where you are coming from and I expect you don't own ripped designer jeans or $250 basketball shoes--but some people do.

 

It's disappointing that for some people the above styles of clothing are considered dressing up, if only because of the high cost of these "designer" items. In my 60-something world, the high price of such an article of clothing does not excuse it's inappropriateness.

[boogs]

Sorry, have to disagree. X does not leave the definition of Smart Casual as Street Casual, as you suggest. We're talking about adults who should be able to exercise a little common sense. Don't think anyone needs to be a Rhodes Scholar to understand that Smart Casual is clearly not street casual or that flannel pants and workout wear are not acceptable. Those who don't respect the dress code fail to do so not because they don't understand but rather because they don't care and/or simply choose not to. JMHO.

 

The Achilles heel of your statement is the fantasy that the lost art of common sense is still being practiced by the average person.

[ken85121]

Is somebody interpreted as casually dressing on a formal night, if they are wearing a dress shirt and tie with no jacket?

 

I for example wear suits and jackets with nice slacks almost everyday, because of my profession. I don't get a major thrill out of dressing up. However I realize its importance and appreciate a formal affair. Plus its a pain in the wazoo to pack a jacket or suit for a cruise. Again, not saying I wouldn't.

 

If I were to wear just a pair of dress slacks and a dress shirt and tie, is that dressing casual on formal night.

 

Would I be offending people if I just dressed in a shirt and tie?

 

I also live in suits in the real world so when it comes to vacation, they stat at home. I don't know if I'm offending people or not but I wear what you describe. I don't even pack a jacket or suit. I'm far more "offended" what some people wear to the pool then what they wear to dinner. LOL :D

[Can'tstopcruising]

We are attending a Black-tie Wedding this weekend, and we wouldn't think of dressing in anything less than the invitation requested. It would be disrespectful.

 

I don't think we're in era of casual dressing, for all occasions and venues. There are still people that enjoy the atmosphere and sense of excitement, that you get from dressing in a gown and tux.

 

I have to laugh when I read this. Often there is someone who completely ignores the formal aspect (Usually some Black Sheep relative!!!) We have a couple in our family (of course, my husband's side!!) We take it in our stride. My late mother-in-law, however, used to be horrified!

 

OMG! I just realized what an old thread this is!

[Denny01]

.......OMG! I just realized what an old thread this is!

Yes, we have so few Dress Code threads, someone had to go back 3 months and dig this one up!

 

Den

[swedish weave]

I also live in suits in the real world so when it comes to vacation, they stat at home. I don't know if I'm offending people or not but I wear what you describe. I don't even pack a jacket or suit. I'm far more "offended" what some people wear to the pool then what they wear to dinner. LOL :D

 

It seems that most of the mainstream cruise lines are leaning toward allowing dress shirt and slacks (with or without tie) into the MDR on formal nights.

 

So far, I have seen it published on Carnival and NCL, but in practice, many others are leaning that direction.

 

There is no question that you may dress up in more formal attire if you choose.

[artmc]

My husband and I just came back from an annual scientific convention that I have been going to with him since the middle seventies. When I first started to go to these meetings people were always dressed in suits, but a few years ago many were wearing jeans. At this meeting, however, I was surprised to see a significant number wearing either a suit or sports jacket with a tie, while women were similarly dressed up.

 

While it was not the level of dress from years ago, it was somewhere between that and the way they dressed a few years ago. I've also noticed this same trend when we dine out lately at a good restaurant.

 

Do you think that maybe the tides are turning and this will have an affect on the way people dress on a cruise?

 

 

 

One can only hope!!!!

[Fixit2010]

I think it is also to do with a class system.

Think of it like this, Celebrity is a premium line that has a higher reputation and standard than a lot of lines. OK it is not in the Cunard league of pomp but it is a good level above the likes of Princess, Carnival and Royal Chavabean.

 

The clientèle on Celebrity are also of a certain caliber. Mixed with the classier atmosphere, it is no wonder passengers feel elevated in status and want to appear smarter. I am very glad that people are smartening up on their own. It does tell you that is what the trend it. I certainly don't want to be dressed smart or smart-casual and mix with the likes of shorts and t-shirt wearing chavs in the evening. Ewww keep those common folk in steerage. Dirty dirty people. :D

[phoebecat]

We are seasoned Cunarders but have seen standards across the board plummet over the past year. We are mid 30s early 40s couple so not old fussy duddies but we loved Cunard for the formality and dressing up. That seems to have gone out the window or port hole! We have raised it ad nauseum with staff and crew and shoreside but to no avail. They say the code is enforced. It plainly isn't.

 

So we are leaving Cunard and coming to celebrity Not because we expect to find the dress code enforced to a higher level, but because we know it is more casual and therefore our expectations hopefully won't be disappointed! We are happy not to pay the premium we were paying on Cunard for so called elegance and formal nights, which plainly weren't,and instead enjoy a more relaxed approach. Of course the evg dresses and tux will come out on formal night, but I know it won't be as smart as previous Cunard cruises. It doesn't bother me as its not being sold to me as such.

 

But like many in here, I abhor the decline in standards, the general laziness of those who just can't be bothered and I do wonder where it will end.

[gymjudge55]

We are seasoned Cunarders but have seen standards across the board plummet over the past year. We are mid 30s early 40s couple so not old fussy duddies but we loved Cunard for the formality and dressing up. That seems to have gone out the window or port hole! We have raised it ad nauseum with staff and crew and shoreside but to no avail. They say the code is enforced. It plainly isn't.

 

So we are leaving Cunard and coming to celebrity Not because we expect to find the dress code enforced to a higher level, but because we know it is more casual and therefore our expectations hopefully won't be disappointed! We are happy not to pay the premium we were paying on Cunard for so called elegance and formal nights, which plainly weren't,and instead enjoy a more relaxed approach. Of course the evg dresses and tux will come out on formal night, but I know it won't be as smart as previous Cunard cruises. It doesn't bother me as its not being sold to me as such.

 

But like many in here, I abhor the decline in standards, the general laziness of those who just can't be bothered and I do wonder where it will end.

 

I vowed after getting chewed out the last time that I would not post in another dress code thread.

First of all I will state that I agree that if you are dining in the MDR on formal night you should follow the code. But there are options for those who don't and I don't think that those of us who choose a slightly less formal look (DH will wear a tie and long sleeved shirt, just no jacket) have declining standards or are lazy! It makes my blood boil when posters come on and state that no one should be allowed out of the buffet on formal night if not in a tux.

My suggestion of where it will end is to set aside a smaller venue that is strictly black tie and enforce it. Then everyone who wishes to dress may have the evening they have dreamed of.

[swedish weave]

I vowed after getting chewed out the last time that I would not post in another dress code thread.

First of all I will state that I agree that if you are dining in the MDR on formal night you should follow the code. But there are options for those who don't and I don't think that those of us who choose a slightly less formal look (DH will wear a tie and long sleeved shirt, just no jacket) have declining standards or are lazy! It makes my blood boil when posters come on and state that no one should be allowed out of the buffet on formal night if not in a tux.

My suggestion of where it will end is to set aside a smaller venue that is strictly black tie and enforce it. Then everyone who wishes to dress may have the evening they have dreamed of.

 

You certainly have a valid point in making a venue available for the declining numbers of those who wish to dress to the max.

 

The cruise lines are adjusting their dress code application to the changing wishes of their guests, and I don't consider it lazy or declining. It is changing with the times and I feel much more comfortable in a dress shirt and slacks. I don't recall seeing anyone rejected from the MDR's if they were dressed neatly.

[MaritimeGuy]

Generally, I've found that guests on Celebrity follow the dress code. Of course, there are always a few exceptions - but they're usually a very small minority. I have noticed, however, that these "exceptions" are often more common on "sunshine" cruises (i.e. Caribbean, Bahamas, Bermuda, etc.). Probably has to do with the nice weather and people feeling a little more "relaxed".

 

I also agree that the enforcement can change from one cruise to the next. We've seen cruises where men were getting turned away from the Elite party for having open-toed sandals while the following cruise some were getting in with jeans and t-shirt. Why the change? Who knows... It could be the CC host, or a directive from his boss, etc...

 

I've also found in everyday life that there seems to be an increase in the number of men wearing suits. Spoke to my tailor a few weeks ago and he agrees. He said that the number of thirty-something clients has gone up considerably over the past two years. Guess we can blame it all on Mad Men!

 

Cheers,

Luc

[Fixit2010]

It should be the other way around. More people want to dress smartly so have the main restaurants on formal nights for them and keep the mad buffet for those who don't want to dress smart. Out of sight, out of mind.

 

I can understand that some cruises such as Caribbean cruises are less formal but after spending the day in day wear, isn't it nice to put something smart on for the evening regardless of it being black tie/tux or smart casual?

 

What annoys me is 90% in smart or smart casual and then you get a minority in shorts and a vest who think they can do as they wish. When you go on a cruise, you abide by the rules. You know the rules before you go and if you don't like it go and find a lower grade line where you can do what you like.

[Christine Frances]

I agree - if you look at the "Formal Dress Code" poll http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1662009 over 75% wish to dress according to the code. Only 7 1/2% want to wear a shirt and no jacket. So maybe the smaller venue should be for people who wish to dress casually.:)

[Bridge Maven]

When I started this thread in February (five months ago) I didn't expect it to be the typical dress code thread. I had commented that after years of people dressing more casually, I had noticed a trend of people starting to dress up a little more in the past year or so, and wondered if other people had noticed it, as well.

 

BTW - when someone resurrected this old thread a few days ago, I almost forgot that I was the OP on it...LOL :)

[swedish weave]

The statistics from CC polls do not reflect the application of dress codes by any cruise line. The true story is seen in what is allowed into the MDR on formal nights.

 

If the cruise line accepts a variety of attire, that negates the written dress codes.

[iancal]

Smart casual is fine with us. We have Celebrity cruises coming up in Oct. and Nov. We will not attend MDR as we have an extensive land trip wrappted around these cruises. We do not plan on packing the clothing necessary for formal nights just for 6 nights out of a 4 month trip.

[gymjudge55]

It should be the other way around. More people want to dress smartly so have the main restaurants on formal nights for them and keep the mad buffet for those who don't want to dress smart. Out of sight, out of mind.

 

I can understand that some cruises such as Caribbean cruises are less formal but after spending the day in day wear, isn't it nice to put something smart on for the evening regardless of it being black tie/tux or smart casual?

 

What annoys me is 90% in smart or smart casual and then you get a minority in shorts and a vest who think they can do as they wish. When you go on a cruise, you abide by the rules. You know the rules before you go and if you don't like it go and find a lower grade line where you can do what you like.

 

Once again my argument for that is believe it or not formal dressing is not the only reason to pick a cruise line! If you would list in order of importance I bet you would find for the majority that formal nights are way below itinerary, service, cabins, food quality etc.

Yes, you know the rules when you book Celebrity and you should either comply or find another venue. It just would be nice if Celebrity offered a comparable dinner without an upcharge for those who don't wish to don a tux. Booking Aqua Class with access to Blu is a step in the right direction but a costly one.

[PNW Traveler]

For those from the U.S., there are definitely regional and demographic differences in style and formality of dress. While cruise lines have written dress code policies, these policies are not always specifically worded and interpretations of policies will vary. The pacific northwest, outside of its major metropolitan areas, is very casual. Dressing up, for many men, means wearing a shirt with some sort of buttons. Dressing up, for women, may mean wearing shoes with heels, albeit with jeans. In rural areas of the west people usually dress up only for church, weddings, or funerals, and that isn't even a given in some communities. Contrast these modes of dress with those in the metropolitan areas of the east coast - big difference. Age demographics are also a consideration. Those under 40 are the frequent cruisers of tomorrow and cruise lines are working to recruit new and repeat cruisers. Too much rigidity is never good. Most passengers are doing their best to look nice while on vacation. There will indeed be variances in mode of dress due to age, locale, and interpretation. A generous spirit and outlook is a good thing. Leave the rigid opinions at home.

[Oville]

I agree - if you look at the "Formal Dress Code" poll http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1662009 over 75% wish to dress according to the code. Only 7 1/2% want to wear a shirt and no jacket. So maybe the smaller venue should be for people who wish to dress casually.:)

 

Not true, only 32% wish to dress according to the code.

[Rick-cruiser]

For those from the U.S., there are definitely regional and demographic differences in style and formality of dress. While cruise lines have written dress code policies, these policies are not always specifically worded and interpretations of policies will vary. The pacific northwest, outside of its major metropolitan areas, is very casual. Dressing up, for many men, means wearing a shirt with some sort of buttons. Dressing up, for women, may mean wearing shoes with heels, albeit with jeans. In rural areas of the west people usually dress up only for church, weddings, or funerals, and that isn't even a given in some communities. Contrast these modes of dress with those in the metropolitan areas of the east coast - big difference. Age demographics are also a consideration. Those under 40 are the frequent cruisers of tomorrow and cruise lines are working to recruit new and repeat cruisers. Too much rigidity is never good. Most passengers are doing their best to look nice while on vacation. There will indeed be variances in mode of dress due to age, locale, and interpretation. A generous spirit and outlook is a good thing. Leave the rigid opinions at home.

 

A very rational interpretation of this highly controversial and combative issue.. Nicely written and well thought out.. Also explains what the cruiselines are up against - trying to satisfy the most people possible.... while trying not to completely alienate the formalwear traditionalists.. It's a slippery slope for the cruiselines to navigate... for sure.

.

[Christine Frances]

Not true, only 32% wish to dress according to the code.

 

And only 22% want to dress casual:) And dark jacket, dark pants and tie is pretty close to a suit.

[gymjudge55]

That poll asked what is APPROPRIATE, not what you would like.

[Ma Bell]

Most people who vote for and abide by Celebrity's dress code actually sail on Celebrity ships.;) I notice that many who answer these polls saying they don't like to dress up either haven't been on a Celebrity ship or are very infrequent cruisers.

 

As to the original question, I agree that young people in particular dress up a lot more than they did a few years ago. It's evident in what we see in fashion mags as well. Just a few years ago the jeans with jacket look was fashionable even at "events"....not so much any more. Young women were wearing torn jeans with sparkly tops but more recently they are wearing cocktail dresses.

[iancal]

We prefer casual but we have absolutely no issue in following the Celebrity guidelines.

 

There are other alternatives to the MDR on formal evenings that are available to us. No issue whatsoever.

 

There is room for everyone on Celebrity.

 

The notion that cruisers should not select Celebrity if they prefer casual attire on formal evenings makes no sense whatsover.

 

It implies that the only worthwhile attribute of a Celebrity cruise is formal evenings and formal attire. Nothing could be further from the truth.