Holland America Reduces Bring-On Wine Allowance

[Cruising-along]

good point Sapper - and our previous Prinsendam cruise before the last one we had nearly 100!

 

Aside from what percentage of passengers are cc members the other thing worth bearing in mind is how much or how long or how often the members cruise.

 

The length of the cruise, especially, is worth bearing in mind. If I took only 7-day cruises, this change in wine policy wouldn't matter to me either. One bottle/person for in-cabin consumption, plus purchasing a glass here and there, that would be plenty for me. :)

[serendipity1499]

It's not 40% of it's passengers.

 

It's 40% of the people on cruise critic

 

Which is 2-5% of it's passenger base.

 

It is not 40% of the people on Cruise Critic.. Cruise Critic has hundreds if not thousands of members don't forget that..And only a couple of hundred voted..

It is 40% of those who voted in the poll..

 

 

The thing is that people say they will do something but they don't. I try not to let my mouth write a cheque that I'm not willing to cash. For me, my word means something. For others, they are mad and when they cool down it will be a different story. I think Hal will relax the new policy but it will be interesting to see how many people will follow through if they don't.

 

Agree with you..However even if HAL only looses or alienates 5% of it's Psgrs & there is a discussion at check-in, this could become a real problem for HAL..

I hope you are right in that the HAL Mgmt. Team will rethink this policy & tweak enough in order not to loose any Psgrs..IMO most people opposed to the new hard & fast rule of one bottle per cruise are willing to pay a corkage when they take a few more bottles on board..At least HAL will still get some revenue..

Betty

[cruz chic]

How will you know?

I'm speaking of the most vocal posters here. The first clue might be a countdown clock with a HAL ship or them saying when I go on my HAL cruise on the such and such ship:D.

[cruz chic]

I am not in the least "mad" or even upset. I just like bringing my own wine on board and, if I can't in the future, I really will move on. No question about that.

 

As long as there are other lines that allow carry-on wine, they are the lines I will choose.

I will have respect for you if you do that (I'm sure you don't care if I do). Many people have said they will stop sailing HAL for various reasons yet they still are. That makes me doubt many things they say.

[startwin]

I will have respect for you if you do that (I'm sure you don't care if I do). Many people have said they will stop sailing HAL for various reasons yet they still are. That makes me doubt many things they say.

 

 

They may still be here, Lorene, because this is a community - but some, like me, may have booked future cruises on another cruise line. I have one more HAL cruise, then back to RCI. But I'm still hoping the policy will be amended somewhat, but it's not the actual policy - as has been stated many times by many posters - it was the arbitrary way it was initiated back in July. The damage was done.

[taxmantoo]

They may still be here, Lorene, because this is a community - but some, like me, may have booked future cruises on another cruise line. I have one more HAL cruise, then back to RCI. But I'm still hoping the policy will be amended somewhat, but it's not the actual policy - as has been stated many times by many posters - it was the arbitrary way it was initiated back in July. The damage was done.

 

Too late to cancel our fully paid February cruise with HAL but next one booked with Princess.

 

Like you, hoping HAL does change the policy, hopefully to mirror the Princess one.

[cruz chic]

They may still be here, Lorene, because this is a community - but some, like me, may have booked future cruises on another cruise line. I have one more HAL cruise, then back to RCI. But I'm still hoping the policy will be amended somewhat, but it's not the actual policy - as has been stated many times by many posters - it was the arbitrary way it was initiated back in July. The damage was done.

I guess some folks have more time than I do. The only time I go on the Princess board is when I have a cruise booked on Princess. Generally I don't really care what is going on over there. This board doesn't constitute a big part of my life although sometimes I'm on here way too much.

[BruceMuzz]

Here are some interesting statistics that may be of help in your debate:

 

We all know (most of us anyway) that beverage sales are a major element in the cruise industry revenue and profit stream.

 

For the past 12 consecutive years, the entire worldwide cruise industry (approximately 240 cruise ships at this point), has been unable to sell an average of one bottle of wine per passenger per cruise.

 

If you take away all the underage passengers who shouldn't be able to purchase wine, and all those who have religious or health restrictions on drinking wine, we still have not been able to sell a full bottle of wine per passenger per cruise for the past 12 years.

 

Looking at individual cruise lines, not one has been able to achieve one bottle of wine sold per passenger per cruise.

CLIA has averaged all cruises of any length on all major cruise lines to get these numbers.

 

The questions the cruise lines are asking:

 

1. Is every cruise line just really poor at selling wine to cruise passengers?

2. Does every cruise line have such a poor selection that the passengers are not interested?

3. Does every cruise line charge too much for their wines?

4. Are most cruise passengers not wine drinkers?

5. Are so many passengers bringing so much wine onboard that they do not want or need to purchase any from us?

6. If we are serious about selling more wine, are we marketing to the right demographic?

[Wakepatrol]

Here are some interesting statistics that may be of help in your debate:

 

We all know (most of us anyway) that beverage sales are a major element in the cruise industry revenue and profit stream.

 

For the past 12 consecutive years, the entire worldwide cruise industry (approximately 240 cruise ships at this point), has been unable to sell an average of one bottle of wine per passenger per cruise.

 

If you take away all the underage passengers who shouldn't be able to purchase wine, and all those who have religious or health restrictions on drinking wine, we still have not been able to sell a full bottle of wine per passenger per cruise for the past 12 years.

 

Looking at individual cruise lines, not one has been able to achieve one bottle of wine sold per passenger per cruise.

CLIA has averaged all cruises of any length on all major cruise lines to get these numbers.

 

The questions the cruise lines are asking:

 

1. Is every cruise line just really poor at selling wine to cruise passengers?

2. Does every cruise line have such a poor selection that the passengers are not interested?

3. Does every cruise line charge too much for their wines?

4. Are most cruise passengers not wine drinkers?

5. Are so many passengers bringing so much wine onboard that they do not want or need to purchase any from us?

6. If we are serious about selling more wine, are we marketing to the right demographic?

 

I love your posts... Always informative.

 

I've always wondered why Hal let passengers bring "unlimited" amounts of beverages aboard? Just the word unlimited seems absurd.

[kazu]

Here are some interesting statistics that may be of help in your debate:

 

We all know (most of us anyway) that beverage sales are a major element in the cruise industry revenue and profit stream.

 

For the past 12 consecutive years, the entire worldwide cruise industry (approximately 240 cruise ships at this point), has been unable to sell an average of one bottle of wine per passenger per cruise.

 

If you take away all the underage passengers who shouldn't be able to purchase wine, and all those who have religious or health restrictions on drinking wine, we still have not been able to sell a full bottle of wine per passenger per cruise for the past 12 years.

 

Looking at individual cruise lines, not one has been able to achieve one bottle of wine sold per passenger per cruise.

CLIA has averaged all cruises of any length on all major cruise lines to get these numbers.

 

The questions the cruise lines are asking:

 

1. Is every cruise line just really poor at selling wine to cruise passengers?

2. Does every cruise line have such a poor selection that the passengers are not interested?

3. Does every cruise line charge too much for their wines?

4. Are most cruise passengers not wine drinkers?

5. Are so many passengers bringing so much wine onboard that they do not want or need to purchase any from us?

6. If we are serious about selling more wine, are we marketing to the right demographic?

 

Very good questions Bruce - to clarify we bring wine on board and yes, we buy a bottle at the MDR.

 

But the selection is poor - it's a little tiresome to have to order the same bottles over a 31 day cruise. I don't know how world cruise people do it.

 

Everyone who brings wine on board is NOT cheap. Trust me, I have my mariner days earned to prove it.

 

there is a happy half way medium - allow more wine to be brought on on longer cruises and improve the choices and pricing on HAL.

 

Pretty simple - if you want to sell it - then price it reasonably and have things that appeal. How hard is this to figure out?

[cruz chic]

Here are some interesting statistics that may be of help in your debate:

 

We all know (most of us anyway) that beverage sales are a major element in the cruise industry revenue and profit stream.

 

For the past 12 consecutive years, the entire worldwide cruise industry (approximately 240 cruise ships at this point), has been unable to sell an average of one bottle of wine per passenger per cruise.

 

If you take away all the underage passengers who shouldn't be able to purchase wine, and all those who have religious or health restrictions on drinking wine, we still have not been able to sell a full bottle of wine per passenger per cruise for the past 12 years.

 

Looking at individual cruise lines, not one has been able to achieve one bottle of wine sold per passenger per cruise.

CLIA has averaged all cruises of any length on all major cruise lines to get these numbers.

 

The questions the cruise lines are asking:

 

1. Is every cruise line just really poor at selling wine to cruise passengers?

2. Does every cruise line have such a poor selection that the passengers are not interested?

3. Does every cruise line charge too much for their wines?

4. Are most cruise passengers not wine drinkers?

5. Are so many passengers bringing so much wine onboard that they do not want or need to purchase any from us?

6. If we are serious about selling more wine, are we marketing to the right demographic?

 

Hal needs to improve the service for wine. I always buy packages and don't bring on. Getting them to serve it is like pulling teeth.

[startwin]

I guess some folks have more time than I do. The only time I go on the Princess board is when I have a cruise booked on Princess. Generally I don't really care what is going on over there. This board doesn't constitute a big part of my life although sometimes I'm on here way too much.

 

That's what happens when you retire:D Your turn will come.

[startwin]

Very good questions Bruce - to clarify we bring wine on board and yes, we buy a bottle at the MDR.

 

But the selection is poor - it's a little tiresome to have to order the same bottles over a 31 day cruise. I don't know how world cruise people do it.

 

Everyone who brings wine on board is NOT cheap. Trust me, I have my mariner days earned to prove it.

 

there is a happy half way medium - allow more wine to be brought on on longer cruises and improve the choices and pricing on HAL.

 

Pretty simple - if you want to sell it - then price it reasonably and have things that appeal. How hard is this to figure out?

 

 

I agree with you - I was going to say, the answer to questions 2 and 3 are definitely "YES". But with regard to your point about the WC pax -they bring on lots of their own wine according to many reviews, and we have already heard from Linda that the new policy will not apply to the World Cruise next year.

[LindaM]

Very good questions Bruce - to clarify we bring wine on board and yes, we buy a bottle at the MDR.

 

But the selection is poor - it's a little tiresome to have to order the same bottles over a 31 day cruise. I don't know how world cruise people do it.

 

Everyone who brings wine on board is NOT cheap. Trust me, I have my mariner days earned to prove it.

 

there is a happy half way medium - allow more wine to be brought on on longer cruises and improve the choices and pricing on HAL.

 

Pretty simple - if you want to sell it - then price it reasonably and have things that appeal. How hard is this to figure out?

 

I agree that if it were priced fairly, people would buy it. Back in the day when we first started cruising, in the late 70's, Heiniken was $1/bottle. We thought that was a great price at that time. I recall most of the alcohol prices being low. Then, they started going up, up, up!! The price of alcohol rose at a much greater percentage than cruise fares have.

 

The statistics on selling wine on cruiseships was most interesting. Thanks to Bruce.

[LindaM]

Hal needs to improve the service for wine. I always buy packages and don't bring on. Getting them to serve it is like pulling teeth.

 

On Prinsendam, we had great service. DH went through his share of our wine package way too fast because they kept coming back to pour. Hope it will be the same next year!!

[kazu]

On Prinsendam, we had great service. DH went through his share of our wine package way too fast because they kept coming back to pour. Hope it will be the same next year!!

Our service on the P'dam was impeccable both cruises Linda -:D that's about 53 days of great service.

[Wakepatrol]

Very good questions Bruce - to clarify we bring wine on board and yes, we buy a bottle at the MDR.

 

But the selection is poor - it's a little tiresome to have to order the same bottles over a 31 day cruise. I don't know how world cruise people do it.

 

Everyone who brings wine on board is NOT cheap. Trust me, I have my mariner days earned to prove it.

 

there is a happy half way medium - allow more wine to be brought on on longer cruises and improve the choices and pricing on HAL.

 

Pretty simple - if you want to sell it - then price it reasonably and have things that appeal. How hard is this to figure out?

 

 

 

The world cruisers and the Prinsendam are a small sliver of Hals business.

 

I would bet that the bulk of Hals business/fleet is made up of the Joe Schmoe cruiser (7-14 days but leaning towards 7)

 

This is where they're going to attempt to figure out the wine market,since this is the bulk of their business (oh yea,I'm a member of the Joe Schmoe cruiser club as well)

[kazu]

The world cruisers and the Prinsendam are a small sliver of Hals business.

 

I would bet that the bulk of Hals business/fleet is made up of the Joe Schmoe cruiser (7-14 days but leaning towards 7)

 

This is where they're going to attempt to figure out the wine market,since this is the bulk of their business (oh yea,I'm a member of the Joe Schmoe cruiser club as well)

 

They might be a small sliver - but they are quite profitable - maybe as was suggested earlier there should be different rules for longer cruises. And really, a small sliver? A lot of P'dam cruises are for many days. anyways, I'm sure you have the inside scoop so I will not argue with you.

 

To figure out the wine market based on 7 day cruises makes no sense as they could alienate those who sail on pricier longer cruises.

 

either set two rules (dumb) or get something figured out.

 

It's really not that hard you know - even I can do it - wonder how much HAL is paying these marketing gurus.

 

If you are a Schmoe as you say then I can understand how you don't 'get it' with the people who are cruising to Australia, Europe, etc who would like to bring a bottle back on board.

 

Smooth Seas:D

[cruz chic]

That's what happens when you retire:D Your turn will come.

 

I have my doubts that day will ever come. Just glad it wasn't today because 19 colleagues lost their jobs today were I work.

[cruz chic]

On Prinsendam, we had great service. DH went through his share of our wine package way too fast because they kept coming back to pour. Hope it will be the same next year!!

 

Our service on the P'dam was impeccable both cruises Linda -:D that's about 53 days of great service.

 

They need to send some of those servers over to the Eurodam and quick!

[startwin]

I have my doubts that day will ever come. Just glad it wasn't today because 19 colleagues lost their jobs today were I work.

 

Oh that's awful. I remember how I felt when I was a victim of "corporate downsizing" some years ago. And at an age where it is so difficult to find another job. Fortunately, I did, but am so glad I don't have to stress about such things anymore.

[startwin]

The world cruisers and the Prinsendam are a small sliver of Hals business.

 

I would bet that the bulk of Hals business/fleet is made up of the Joe Schmoe cruiser (7-14 days but leaning towards 7)

 

This is where they're going to attempt to figure out the wine market,since this is the bulk of their business (oh yea,I'm a member of the Joe Schmoe cruiser club as well)

 

The majority of my cruises are Joe Schmoes as well. And have you seen how much those World Cruisers pay for their cruise - some of them every year?? No wonder HAL doesn't want to upset them and are making them exempt from the new policy.:rolleyes:

[cruz chic]

Oh that's awful. I remember how I felt when I was a victim of "corporate downsizing" some years ago. And at an age where it is so difficult to find another job. Fortunately, I did, but am so glad I don't have to stress about such things anymore.

 

It's happened to me a few times but not since I've been divorced. It hasn't been exactly a pleasant existence at my job but the market is not vibrant. I'll be glad to get out of the workforce someday.

[pris993]

Here are some interesting statistics that may be of help in your debate:

 

We all know (most of us anyway) that beverage sales are a major element in the cruise industry revenue and profit stream.

 

For the past 12 consecutive years, the entire worldwide cruise industry (approximately 240 cruise ships at this point), has been unable to sell an average of one bottle of wine per passenger per cruise.

 

If you take away all the underage passengers who shouldn't be able to purchase wine, and all those who have religious or health restrictions on drinking wine, we still have not been able to sell a full bottle of wine per passenger per cruise for the past 12 years.

 

Looking at individual cruise lines, not one has been able to achieve one bottle of wine sold per passenger per cruise.

CLIA has averaged all cruises of any length on all major cruise lines to get these numbers.

 

The questions the cruise lines are asking:

 

1. Is every cruise line just really poor at selling wine to cruise passengers?

2. Does every cruise line have such a poor selection that the passengers are not interested?

3. Does every cruise line charge too much for their wines?

4. Are most cruise passengers not wine drinkers?

5. Are so many passengers bringing so much wine onboard that they do not want or need to purchase any from us?

6. If we are serious about selling more wine, are we marketing to the right demographic?

 

Interesting... we usually buy 1 or 2 bottles on board, even though we have always bought wine in ports.

 

For us, the prices on board are too high for the quality, so restricting what we can bring on will not change our behavior in favor of the cruise line.

 

We cruised NCL last year in the Mediterranean. We purchased beer vs wine, actually spend less on board over all.

 

On our next HAL cruise a TA, we will bring two bottles on, buy 2 bottles, then enjoy some beer. Plan to buy some wine/alcohol in Gilbrater, HAL can hold for us for when we disembark in Barcelona. We are getting off the ship on Easter Sunday, so doubt much will be open in Barcelona. We plan to spend 3 days in Barcelona... want to take some wine/alcohol with us.

[BruceMuzz]

Very good questions Bruce - to clarify we bring wine on board and yes, we buy a bottle at the MDR.

 

But the selection is poor - it's a little tiresome to have to order the same bottles over a 31 day cruise. I don't know how world cruise people do it.

 

Everyone who brings wine on board is NOT cheap. Trust me, I have my mariner days earned to prove it.

 

there is a happy half way medium - allow more wine to be brought on on longer cruises and improve the choices and pricing on HAL.

 

Pretty simple - if you want to sell it - then price it reasonably and have things that appeal. How hard is this to figure out?

 

It is extremely difficult to figure out.

This is the HAL Board - but I am talking about the numbers for ALL MAJOR CRUISE LINES.

Some of them have rather nice wine lists and some of them have very reasonable wine prices.

Some of them charge very high fares and attract a very toney crowd.

But those lines with great lists, great prices, and high fares do not sell any more wine than HAL does.

12 years ago, when several major cruise lines allowed guests to bring their own wine onboard, they were selling the same number of bottles onboard that they are today - less than one per passenger per cruise.

All of us face the same challenges.

 

Why are today's cruise passengers - ON ALL MAJOR CRUISE LINES - purchasing less than one bottle of wine per person per cruise, regardless of selection, prices, or fares?