Pre-paid Gratuities - Service Charge?

[vulcan1971]

The email confirms what I wrote earlier . drinks aren't covered in the prepaid gratuity. They are considered optional purchases, like haircuts or massages. The housekeeping services and waiter services are not optional, even if you don't eat in the dining room you are eating somewhere, so those services are included in the prepaid system. Optional services have their own gratuities,

 

Thank you... well said!!

[4Mast]

If you look at the drinks packages (and there are plenty of posts on those!!) you will see that the package charges so much per day and then 15% is added to that cost. What we tend to see is of course the final cost i.e. the package cost + service charge.

[Natalia&Nick]

I know. But it's still a con. The wait staff get both!!

 

Just looking to protect my parents money. We only book offers inc drinks packages so nice and easy.

 

 

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[cle-guy]

I know. But it's still a con. The wait staff get both!!

 

The wait staff get the prepaid gratuities. These people serve food.

 

The bar staff get the beverage package gratuities. These people MAKE AND SERVE drinks.

 

2 different groups of staff, 2 different positions, 2 different jobs.

 

It's not a con, it's a custom.

[neverbeenhere]

Maybe I'm missing something, but the person who serves your dinner will not be the person that serves your wine.

Edited July 9, 2014 by neverbeenhere

[WestLakeGirl]

So if they have a drinks package make sure they fully understand what is covered in their particular package, especially w/regards to bottles of wine (not covered unless they bought a wine bottle package, ) drinks over the package price limit, room service, minibar, enomatic machines, wine tastings and there may be other exclusions

[dkjretired]

I know. But it's still a con. The wait staff get both!!

 

Just looking to protect my parents money. We only book offers inc drinks packages so nice and easy.

 

 

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Its not a con and I don't get all these questions. You've been on previous cruises, even mention going to a bar, its not like this is your first time. This has been explained several times by different people, I even quoted the web site which could not be any clearer. Am I missing something here....

Edited July 10, 2014 by dkjretired

[Project_gal]

I know. But it's still a con. The wait staff get both!!

 

Just looking to protect my parents money. We only book offers inc drinks packages so nice and easy.

 

 

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It is not a con. It is just that the global tourist industry, which includes most cruise lines, adopts the US "custom" of tipping. It is unfortunate, perhaps, but that's life! It was not until I had an American friend who probably over-tipped for someone from the USA, I learned all the people I had been omitting to tip when travelling the in the USA!

 

In the UK, at least if you are of my baby-boomer generation, you grew up understanding that you tipped the hairdresser every time, the dustmen [refuse collectors], paperboy and postman [mailman] at Christmas [their Christmas box]. We just did not eat in restaurants. In a pub, you may have said "... and have one on me" to the barmaid at times. Very much has changed. Who tips the postman at Christmas any more? In the UK, we now habitually tip in restaurant and the taxi driver but rarely [i think] hotel chambermaid or in a bar. The Inland Revenue now assumes that those in certain professions get a certain amount of tips. Our norms have changed.

 

If you travel to countries where you may read that tipping is not the norm you can almost guarantee that, if you are off a cruise ship, they will expect you to tip like you are an American. So, it is pretty certain that the global service sector has adopted the tipping culture because of our American friends but, then, who can blame them. Tipping would have to be culturally pretty offensive to not accept a practice that paid you money.

 

So, most of the cruise industry uses the US model of tipping which is basically: everyone below a certain pay level is assumed to have much of their income made up of tips/gratuities. SOME of these gratuities - those for services to HAVE to use [restaurant staff and housekeeping staff] - are automatically collected if they are not prepaid. Tips for those providing DISCRETIONAL services - beverages [above and beyond those included in the price of your cruise], salon services, etc - are NOT included in the auto-gratuities because you may not use those services. To ensure the staff providing these services also receive their rightful dues, a gratuity is usually added to the bill.

 

Do not get me wrong: I greatly dislike the concept of tipping. I was never tipped in the whole of my working life. Would I have liked the additional cash or found it demeaning? I am not sure. Do I find it difficult to understand when I should tip in different circumstances? Yes, and probably over-tip because of it. Do I find that over-tipping pays? Yes. So I am complicit in a practice that I do not like. In view of that, you decide if you want to listen to what I say.

 

It is admirable that you wish to protect your parents but even my 86 year old mother understands that the world has changed. She may not understand what it is appropriate to tip but she just asks us.

Edited July 10, 2014 by Project_gal

[Elaine0138]

I know. But it's still a con. The wait staff get both!!

 

Just looking to protect my parents money. We only book offers inc drinks packages so nice and easy.

 

 

/QUOTE]

 

hi it is the wording that is confusing I don't know why Celebrity don't just show the full price like P&O do then it saves any confusion.

The wait staff don't get both, the 15% goes to the bar staff not the dining room waiters as they will get their tips from your parents pre paid gratuities.

 

I hate shopping in the US they show one price then fleece you at the tills by adding a tax on, which seems to vary from place to place.

[Adidas4fun]

 

hi it is the wording that is confusing I don't know why Celebrity don't just show the full price like P&O do then it saves any confusion.

The wait staff don't get both, the 15% goes to the bar staff not the dining room waiters as they will get their tips from your parents pre paid gratuities.

 

I hate shopping in the US they show one price then fleece you at the tills by adding a tax on, which seems to vary from place to place.

Whilst I agree it is annoying that the price ticket on the shelf, or on the menu or drinks list is not the price you really need to pay I do not view it as "being fleeced". I just wish the operators of businesses would pay their staff a decent rate and include that in the price.

 

What I find objectionable is the delusion that paying a tip at the end of the "service" some how influences that servers behaviour. It doesnt.

[heathluvsing]

What about the 123 Classic package? We got x2 promos--Grats & Drinks.

 

Do we have to pay more grats?

 

 

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[Big Kev]

What about the 123 Classic package? We got x2 promos--Grats & Drinks.

 

Do we have to pay more grats?

 

 

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Grats are included in drinks packages, and pre paid grats for stateroom and dining staff naturally covered in the grats option... (Apart from Kids Club or Spar/ hair stuff). So, you can rest easy, but bet you probably want to reward bar staff or room steward extra if you get, or ask for more than the exceptional service you will get normally. ;)

 

 

S and P

[WestLakeGirl]

Gratuities are included in the drinks packages but not all drinks are included in the drinks packages. If you decide, for instance, to buy a bottle of wine, you'll pay a gratuity, if you order a beer from room service, you'll pay a gratuity, if you go to a wine tasting, you'll pay a gratuity there etc.

[cherylroslyn]

Today's confirmation says "because you have prepaid gratuities your stateroom and dining charges are prepaid"

Surely that applies to wine in the dining room?

 

 

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No surely it doesn't....the wine packages or nightly wine at dinner are separate purchases and I think at least five people have told you that already.

[cherylroslyn]

Maybe I'm missing something, but the person who serves your dinner will not be the person that serves your wine.

No, there are generally at least four people serving the table at night. First there is a wine sommelier who serves wine, then there is a bar server who serves sodas and cock tails, then there is an assistant waiter who brings bread, has water on the table, helps clear dishes and gets tea and coffee at the end of the meal, finally there is a head waiter who answers questions about the menu, makes recommendations, takes the order, serves the food, serves dessert.

[cle-guy]

Today's confirmation says "because you have prepaid gratuities your stateroom and dining charges are prepaid"

Surely that applies to wine in the dining room?

 

I'm not sure if they have the 123 perk and selected the beverage package, but IF they did AND they select a wine by the glass at dinner that is covered under the package then yes the gratuity on the wine is paid. If however they select something that is not covered within their package, they will be billed for the wine and have the 15% automatic gratuity added on.

 

If they select a full bottle of wine, they will be billed the appropriate menu price plus gratuity, less any discount offered under their package (10% per bottle off on classic, and 20% off per bottle on premium).

 

The covered wines are very limited on the classic package, if they upgrade to the premium package for 11.50 per day (10 plus 15% gratuity) the selection os broader. Additionally, if they want a wine proved OUTSIDE her package price, they only pay for the ":overage" in cost, versus classic package if it;s not covered they have to pay the full menu price for anything not in the package.

 

For example, if they select a $15 glass of wine, on classic they pay $15 plus 15%, on Premium they pay $2 ($15 - $13 covered = $2) plus 15% on the $2.

 

If they are confused they can simply ask the steward "for a glass of wine covered under my package" and the steward will happily do so.

 

As to not wanting your parents to be conned, Celebrity does not mess up with the accounting of gratuity, any time they place it on a bill it will be called for and not a scam, so as long as they sign their sales slips they will be fine, there is no instance where they should be feel obliged to tip anything further, except some would say slip the room service delivery guy a buck (or pound). The sales slips all have a line to add EXTRA gratuity, your parents should just be aware that is discretionary and not needed unless they feel they got superior service and want to tip above the obligatory amount.

[cherylroslyn]

It is not a con. It is just that the global tourist industry, which includes most cruise lines, adopts the US "custom" of tipping. It is unfortunate, perhaps, but that's life! It was not until I had an American friend who probably over-tipped for someone from the USA, I learned all the people I had been omitting to tip when travelling the in the USA!

 

In the UK, at least if you are of my baby-boomer generation, you grew up understanding that you tipped the hairdresser every time, the dustmen [refuse collectors], paperboy and postman [mailman] at Christmas [their Christmas box]. We just did not eat in restaurants. In a pub, you may have said "... and have one on me" to the barmaid at times. Very much has changed. Who tips the postman at Christmas any more? In the UK, we now habitually tip in restaurant and the taxi driver but rarely [i think] hotel chambermaid or in a bar. The Inland Revenue now assumes that those in certain professions get a certain amount of tips. Our norms have changed.

 

If you travel to countries where you may read that tipping is not the norm you can almost guarantee that, if you are off a cruise ship, they will expect you to tip like you are an American. So, it is pretty certain that the global service sector has adopted the tipping culture because of our American friends but, then, who can blame them. Tipping would have to be culturally pretty offensive to not accept a practice that paid you money.

 

So, most of the cruise industry uses the US model of tipping which is basically: everyone below a certain pay level is assumed to have much of their income made up of tips/gratuities. SOME of these gratuities - those for services to HAVE to use [restaurant staff and housekeeping staff] - are automatically collected if they are not prepaid. Tips for those providing DISCRETIONAL services - beverages [above and beyond those included in the price of your cruise], salon services, etc - are NOT included in the auto-gratuities because you may not use those services. To ensure the staff providing these services also receive their rightful dues, a gratuity is usually added to the bill.

 

Do not get me wrong: I greatly dislike the concept of tipping. I was never tipped in the whole of my working life. Would I have liked the additional cash or found it demeaning? I am not sure. Do I find it difficult to understand when I should tip in different circumstances? Yes, and probably over-tip because of it. Do I find that over-tipping pays? Yes. So I am complicit in a practice that I do not like. In view of that, you decide if you want to listen to what I say.

 

It is admirable that you wish to protect your parents but even my 86 year old mother understands that the world has changed. She may not understand what it is appropriate to tip but she just asks us.

Excellent explanation.

[Natalia&Nick]

I appreciate the time you took to write this but I still think it's a con to prepay gratuities for wait staff and then be charged 15% on wine they serve.

 

The US are entitled to their own way.

 

 

 

 

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[alexspepa]

I appreciate the time you took to write this but I still think it's a con to prepay gratuities for wait staff and then be charged 15% on wine they serve.

 

The US are entitled to their own way.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

 

then I don't think you are paying attention to all the great responses.

 

I do hope your parents enjoy their cruise and don't let a few dollars in well-earned gratuities ruin it for them.

Edited July 10, 2014 by alexspepa

[WestLakeGirl]

You have prepaid gratuities for food wait staff, not for beverage wait staff. It isn't really that complicated

[cle-guy]

I appreciate the time you took to write this but I still think it's a con to prepay gratuities for wait staff and then be charged 15% on wine they serve.

 

The US are entitled to their own way.

 

If you don't appreciate the way this line does things then sail one that follows UK custom. You have a choice. There are many more lines that include all things, even gratuities, and you will find the cabin fares to be appropriately higher and may find they have limited sailing options, probably because most consumers don't care for the "all in" pricing model worldwide. At least the way X does it, you have choices and pay for only what you use as you go.

 

I find it silly to have to go to a bar and order my food when I visit a pub in the UK, why don't the wait staff come take my order? It's just custom, so I accept it and move on. I don't bang on about how ridiculous it is and what a scam it is. And that pub worker is making a far larger hourly wage than the server is on the ship, and doesn't even offer service to me!

 

Oh and a Starbucks coffee that costs US $3 in the USA costs GBP 3 in the UK, $5.14. So even though you THINK you aren't paying a gratuity, you are paying for it hidden in the inflated prices you pay on common items., kind of like how many UK people call our sales tax a hidden cost, as it's added on at the sale point, not included in the item price. At least we itemize out the add on cost of the tax, Starbucks doesn't tell me how much of the extra $2.14 cost of the cup of coffee is subsidizing the added labor costs (i.e. gratuity).

[Project_gal]

 

Oh and a Starbucks coffee that costs US $3 in the USA costs GBP 3 in the UK, $5.14. So even though you THINK you aren't paying a gratuity, you are paying for it hidden in the inflated prices you pay on common items.,

 

Ok, I am going off topic but, then, I think that the topic has been explained to death!

 

Paying in the same in GBP as USD is fairly standard for more things than just the Starbucks coffee you mention. It tends to apply for many items that a tourist would not necessarily notice - e.g. books - which have nothing to do with hidden gratuities [nor tax which we do not pay on books] and probably much more to do with our minimum wage and National Insurance contributions. However, all this just adds further complications to this subject.

 

Returning to the topic: many people enjoy travelling to experience different lifestyles. Part of that is accepting different customs when overseas [or on an American-oriented ship] - "when in Rome ...." as they say. If you do not want to accept that "things" are done differently in different places, perhaps you would be happier with a staycation [as the modern jargon calls it].

[Elaine0138]

It is the wording of the wording from the TA that is confusing if you have been told you have prepaid all your gratuities then you discover that infact you haven't. A lot of TA's haven't a clue about cruising and think they are all inclusive holidays and sell them on that bases I know a few people here in the UK who have been caught out on that one.

[jkgourmet]

Standard on all cruise lines, it is not a con, the prepaid gratuities have nothing to do with drinks.

 

Except MSC, if you pre order drink packages or vouchers, you do not pay the 15%. You can either prepay for the packages or add the cists to your sea card account.

 

I strongly suspect this will change in the near future, at least for US departures.

[bobsfamily]

Wow, 3 pages about a 15% tip?

 

Regardless of what you think Should Be, the fact is if you want a bottle of wine bought thru the ship 15% is going to be added to the bill. Period.