UK disabled being treated v. badly compared to US - RCI please read!!!

[cb at sea]

You are being discriminated against...by your country's laws...not by RCI!

[garycarla]

I was about to blast RCI for poor customer service, then realize you booked a GTY.

 

Why would anyone do that and not accept whatever crap cabin they get.

 

Sorry. RCI has not done anything wrong.

 

Really???

[icsys]

You are being discriminated against...by your country's laws...not by RCI!

 

What utter garbage...... please explain !!

[RDC1]

What utter garbage...... please explain !!

 

Doubt the laws impact a situation where one simply wants to switch to a similar class room. However, they do come into play when it comes to fares. Largely because a booking through a UK travel agent does require to be covered by certain protections (package travel regulations) that a fare sold through a US travel agent does not. You can see the impact of the regulations by comparing US terms and conditions to the UK version. The following is from a description of the intent of the regulation.

 

Alteration to a holiday contract

In the context of a package holiday contract, an alteration to an 'essential term of the contract' is likely to include:

the price

the precise accommodation, standard of accommodation and accommodation facilities

the type and standard of transport

the place of departure and destination

any facility or service advertised or promoted as forming a part of the package

any term required by the Package Travel Regulations or the Abta Code of Conduct to be included as part of the contract

 

The only thing that I could even imagine where the Package Travel Regulations could impact a room change is that they do indicate that any change of the precise accommodation would be considered to be an alteration. While such alteration should be acceptable if initiated by the passenger, I could see where a cruise line might take the stand that to prevent possible claims under the alteration language, they simply do not allow any alteration from the original booking. Thus requiring the passenger to cancel and rebook anytime they want to alter the original booking. As I mentioned the regulations does not require such action, but a company that doesn't want to present any possibility of a claim, might decide to take that approach.

Edited March 18, 2015 by RDC1

[icsys]

Doubt the laws impact a situation where one simply wants to switch to a similar class room. However, they do come into play when it comes to fares. Largely because a booking through a UK travel agent does require to be covered by certain protections (package travel regulations) that a fare sold through a US travel agent does not. You can see the impact of the regulations by comparing US terms and conditions to the UK version. The following is from a description of the intent of the regulation.

 

Alteration to a holiday contract

In the context of a package holiday contract, an alteration to an 'essential term of the contract' is likely to include:

the price

the precise accommodation, standard of accommodation and accommodation facilities

the type and standard of transport

the place of departure and destination

any facility or service advertised or promoted as forming a part of the package

any term required by the Package Travel Regulations or the Abta Code of Conduct to be included as part of the contract

 

The only thing that I could even imagine where the Package Travel Regulations could impact a room change is that they do indicate that any change of the precise accommodation would be considered to be an alteration. While such alteration should be acceptable if initiated by the passenger, I could see where a cruise line might take the stand that to prevent possible claims under the alteration language, they simply do not allow any alteration from the original booking. Thus requiring the passenger to cancel and rebook anytime they want to alter the original booking. As I mentioned the regulations does not require such action, but a company that doesn't want to present any possibility of a claim, might decide to take that approach.

 

Hi RDC1,

 

You have quoted the ‘Package Travel Regulations’.

Those regulations are to protect the ‘Consumer’ not the ‘service provider’ of the holiday (in this case RCI). They are to offer compensation and refund rights if you do not receive the holiday that you booked and paid for.

 

As this is consumer protection, you may have misunderstood the section from the regulations that you have quoted (re-quoted above in bold).

 

If the ‘service provider’ (in this case RCI) makes an alteration to an 'essential term of the contract' (booking) then the Package Travel Regulations come into play and the Consumer has the right to cancel without penalty or claim compensation.

 

In respect of your point regarding the impact on a room change, again you may be misunderstanding the regulation:

 

If the Consumer requests an alteration, the ‘Package Travel Regulations’ have no bearing. The service provider either makes the alteration or refuses. There are no rights to a claim. There is also no requirement for cancelling and rebooking and no requirement for the charging of any fees. This is entirely a term or condition imposed by the provider (in this case RCI).

 

 

To reiterate, the ‘Package Travel Regulations’ are for Consumer Protection not ‘agent’ or ‘service provider’ protection.

 

The regulations are not all one sided, they allow the ‘service provider’ to charge a reasonable administration fee, amendment fee or a cancellation fee if the consumer wishes to cancel for any reason other than covered by these regulations.

Note the word ‘allow’. Fees are entirely optional.

 

Of course all of this has no bearing at all to the OP and their issue with an accessible cabin, they booked a GTY and that is what they got.

In my experience these problems arise because the Representatives on the other end of the phone are either not fully conversant with what can and cannot be done, get confused with RCI imposed terms and conditions, simply refuse to deviate from a script or as a whole, do not seem willing to work towards a compromise.

 

With rgard to the statement... you are being discriminated against...by your country's laws...not by RCI, quite frankly, it is a ridiculous statement to make!

The OP may have been a little harsh with their judgement but the responses are quite judgemental also.

What harm would there be for the CS department to say “lets see what we can do to help your situation”?

Everyone is so quick to jump to Royal’s defence!!

[RDC1]

Hi RDC1,

 

You have quoted the ‘Package Travel Regulations’.

Those regulations are to protect the ‘Consumer’ not the ‘service provider’ of the holiday (in this case RCI). They are to offer compensation and refund rights if you do not receive the holiday that you booked and paid for.

 

As this is consumer protection, you may have misunderstood the section from the regulations that you have quoted (re-quoted above in bold).

 

If the ‘service provider’ (in this case RCI) makes an alteration to an 'essential term of the contract' (booking) then the Package Travel Regulations come into play and the Consumer has the right to cancel without penalty or claim compensation.

 

In respect of your point regarding the impact on a room change, again you may be misunderstanding the regulation:

 

If the Consumer requests an alteration, the ‘Package Travel Regulations’ have no bearing. The service provider either makes the alteration or refuses. There are no rights to a claim. There is also no requirement for cancelling and rebooking and no requirement for the charging of any fees. This is entirely a term or condition imposed by the provider (in this case RCI).

 

 

To reiterate, the ‘Package Travel Regulations’ are for Consumer Protection not ‘agent’ or ‘service provider’ protection.

 

The regulations are not all one sided, they allow the ‘service provider’ to charge a reasonable administration fee, amendment fee or a cancellation fee if the consumer wishes to cancel for any reason other than covered by these regulations.

Note the word ‘allow’. Fees are entirely optional.

 

Of course all of this has no bearing at all to the OP and their issue with an accessible cabin, they booked a GTY and that is what they got.

In my experience these problems arise because the Representatives on the other end of the phone are either not fully conversant with what can and cannot be done, get confused with RCI imposed terms and conditions, simply refuse to deviate from a script or as a whole, do not seem willing to work towards a compromise.

 

With rgard to the statement... you are being discriminated against...by your country's laws...not by RCI, quite frankly, it is a ridiculous statement to make!

The OP may have been a little harsh with their judgement but the responses are quite judgemental also.

What harm would there be for the CS department to say “lets see what we can do to help your situation”?

Everyone is so quick to jump to Royal’s defence!!

 

The key point is that while the laws are set up to protect the consumer, the service providers set up their procedures in response to those laws by 1. setting fares to cover any increase in risk to the service provider and 2. Structure their processes to prevent claims being made against them under the law.

 

While I agree that the law probably should not come into play in this case. Having developed corporate procedures and business practices at a senior level in US corporations prior to my retirement, I can also see how a company could adopt a process to require the individual to cancel and rebook anytime they are requesting to make a change because of the law. By requiring cancellation and rebooking there is absolutely no doubt that the change was initiated by the traveler and not made by the cruise line.

 

Lets say that the cruise line agreed to change the nature of the booking over the phone and made the room change, in this case from a standard room to a accessible room. In order to protect themselves from a claim that there was a change in accommodation (a protection in the law) by the traveler (I would consider an accessible cabin to be a downgrade myself). I am not saying that there would be in this specific case, but corporate policies are not established for specific cases but are instead set up for general situations, to protect the service provider.

 

They could protect themselves if the change request was properly documented. But with their current systems how would that documentation take place. Impractical to save a signed document from the traveler. Notes on their computer system would probably not be sufficient to offset a claim.

So how would the company protect themselves from someone calling in requesting a change in rooms (after they have gotten their booking information) and later making a claim that the company had made the change. They could then submit their original booking info with the claim. The company could say that the person called in and that the change was made at their request, but what would be the proof? Anything the company could produced could be countered by the person saying that they did not receive it nor agree to it. They could save a recording of the conversation, but what changes would their system require to make sure the conversation was saved. Would such a recording even be admissible in UK courts? Is the potential cost of dealing with such potential situations worth it or is it far easier for the company to simply require cancellation and rebooking for any traveler initiated changes.

 

So one can see how a company could put in place such a process in response to the consumer protection law. The interesting way to test if this business practice is in response to the law, is to see if they apply the same requirement of cancel and rebook to traveler requested changes in countries that do that have travel protections concerning precise accommodation.

 

Clearly they do not have that requirement in the US where that protection is not in regulation.

 

As far as the customer service personnel. They are trained to work within specific guidelines. In most cases they are not allowed to deviate from the defined terms and conditions. That is preserved for individuals at a different level with in the organization. Any cases where they are allowed flexibility are in accordance with clearly defined rules. If some change is desired outside of normal procedure one needs to request to talk with someone that has the authority to resolve the issue. In this case the company may have already made the call that exceptions are not allowed and the resolution is cancellation and rebook or remain with existing booking.

Edited March 19, 2015 by RDC1

[Katy_Tbird]

Unfortunately, I seriously doubt they could go back and find that "recorded call". I think a lot of times companies just have that on there to make you think they do. Even if they did actually record the call back then, I seriously doubt that they still have it around. It probably "self-destructs" (erases or is written over) after a certain timeframe.

 

While it could be false claim, it isn't necessarily false. Our phone system records all calls and we have YEARS of archived recordings that can be pulled based on any number of criteria. In less than two minutes, I can have a recording playing on my PC if I know when and who was involved in the call. It's a pretty common feature these days.

[Jackamama]

Let me tell you our experience with RCI and a disabled stateroom.

 

We booked a cruise through a TA for Independence of the seas in 2013.

The travel agent sorted all our reservations for us, chose our stateroom etc.

We looked up our room on the deck plans as you do and it we appeared to have been booked into a disabled room.

Thankfully neither of us are disabled and we never expressed a wish for this type of room.

Here is where things got very silly.

 

We requested that we could change rooms so any disabled person would and should have better use than usthan our booked room.

Because we are from the UK, the option given, were to cancel and loose our deposit!! And rebook paying another deposit.

Passengers from the UK do not have the option to cancel or change staterooms without a financial penalty.

As loosing the deposit appeared unfair and not an option we kept the disabled room, but felt disappointed that RCI couldn't help.

 

Fast forward to embarkation day, we again offered to change staterooms if it would be helpful to another fellow passenger. We went to our staeroom , obviously larger than usual presumably to accomadate a wheelchair.

In the very next stateroom was a disabled child in a wheelchair on holiday with her parents, they were struggling to get through the door with her chair.

We offered to swap rooms , which after going to guest services they allowed us to do with no charge as we were on board.

Due to this we have met 3 wonderful people from Florida who are now great friends with us and we have met 3 times since :)

So I can sympathise with the problem you encountered..UK cruisers do appear to be at a disadvantage at times

 

 

 

What a nice thing to do :)

 

As the mother of a disabled child, I am always heartened by how kind people are to us when we cruise, and you are an example of that. I'm sure that your good deed made the child's family's holiday a much better one than it would otherwise have been :)

 

.

[nelblu]

While I do not know the laws protecting the consumer, companies have a set of policies & procedures that the agents follow. Has the OP tried the C&A desk or e-mailing someone in authority at RCL. Let me give an example that is not quite as serious as the OP. When I booked my Oasis 3/26/16 cruise, I mentioned to RCL's Vacation Planner (VP) that I would become D+ on the Quantum 2/2/16 cruise and would be eligible for an addd'l $25 in balcony discount. She said to call back when that happens.

 

A week after the Q cruise completion, I called the VP and asked for the add'l bd in a form of OBC or reduced pricing. The agent tells me, after checking with a supervisor, that the cruise would have to be re-priced. I said to him are you kidding as it would cost an add'l $200 per. After I hung up, I called the C&A desk and guess what--no problem and applied the add'l monies to the deposit.

 

Ps. There was also a request for a traditional dining at 6pm since DD on Oasis was abandoned. Was told that it was totally booked. Now this makes no sense as the cruise was some 14 months in the future. Told to wait for MTD to open up. I said not thanks as I went thru the ringer with DD reserves and since there are 3 small children involved. At the same time as the discount I asked the C&A desk for the dining request and got it. Sometimes you've got to call multiple times and speak to multiple folks at different levels. This is just a few of the many examples that I've encountered in my cruising life.

[American Bear]

sounds like it is a UK issue, not a Royal issue..as in Royal must abide by UK policy/law/regulation.

 

You're making excuses!

This is an absurd RCL UK rule that should be changed!

[American Bear]

I am so sorry you feel that you are being discriminated against. I understand your feelings. However, changes are not always allowed in the US either. We have had times where they allowed us to change (within the same category) once a GTY cabin has been assigned. However, we have been denied several times also. A GTY is a guarantee and IF they allow the change then they are "being nice". In one instance we had 4 cabins as a guarantee. (All different couples, different last names, etc.) They allowed one couple to change but denied the remaining requests.

 

How soon is your cruise? How long ago did you book?

 

 

Unfortunately, I seriously doubt they could go back and find that "recorded call". I think a lot of times companies just have that on there to make you think they do. Even if they did actually record the call back then, I seriously doubt that they still have it around. It probably "self-destructs" (erases or is written over) after a certain timeframe.

 

If you have documentation from your doctor evidencing the requirement for a handicap room, then I would make a call to the "Resolutions" Department and see if they can assist you. Offer to email or fax the documentation to them. No guarantees they will make the change but worth a try. Hopefully someone else won't snatch up the cabin before you can get to them.

 

 

Noted, but it still doesn't excuse RCL from doing the right thing, give the handicapped person the handicap cabin!

[Paulxyz2004]

You're making excuses!

This is an absurd RCL UK rule that should be changed!

 

I disagree, the stupid rule is the US one here. The reason with offering and booking guarantee cabins is to have a smaller cruise fare for giving the right of cabin choice to the cruiseline.

 

It´s the risk one takes and it´s rather stupid to let people change after the fact that a cabin has been assigned.

 

However as always it´s a matter of different markets. In the US it´s something many (most?, all?) cruiselines do. In Europe you can book guarantees not only with cruiselines, but also Hotels or other Holidays and there´s no Chance of changing.

 

It´s not really something RCI is doing on their own, but more an industry wide matter between markets.

 

While the OP is in an unfortunate Situation I don´t see any blame on RCI here. It was the OP chosing to spend less Money and this backfired now.