Foster children on Alaskan cruises

[NanaChar]

I would like any advice on taking foster children from US to a cruise starting in Vancouver. We are going over our documents and are nervous about having everything. We called the Captains Club, but she was unsure. She read the the documentation and agreed with my interpretation.

I have passports, birth certificates and court order permission. Can anyone tell me if there are any other documents needed? I would also like any advice. They are 6 and 9 years old.

 

 

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[martincath]

I would like any advice on taking foster children from US to a cruise starting in Vancouver. We are going over our documents and are nervous about having everything. We called the Captains Club, but she was unsure. She read the the documentation and agreed with my interpretation.

I have passports, birth certificates and court order permission. Can anyone tell me if there are any other documents needed? I would also like any advice. They are 6 and 9 years old.

 

 

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If you've checked with Celebrity, who can of course have their own rules for anything they like, this is more of a general 'crossing the Canadian border with kids who are not biologically mine and may have a different name' question. You'll maximise your chance at a response from someone who has done the same thing here on CC in the Canada/Pacific or Alaska boards.

 

Not a foster parent myself, but folks I know who are (in the UK - so documentation is going to be different than yours) have paperwork that explicitly states that they are the sole guardians of the kids and bio-parents are not involved. If your paperwork is similar, that plus the usual passports/other WHTI documents will fit the Canadian rules about bringing kids in without their bio-parents - the crux is whether or not the bio-parents still retain any rights and whether or not that is clear on the docs.

 

You mention 'court order permission' - if that's specifically 'you can take the kids on this vacation' then you are definitely good; if it's a more general 'you are appointed as foster parents to these kids' then it may need clarified depending on the wording. If the bio-parents are still involved, then you need to get a signed agreement from them that it's OK to take the kids across the border, arrange medical treatment for them in emergencies, etc. or else another court order allowing the vacation if they refuse or cannot be reached to sign a document.

 

Even my friends who are divorced or widowed - whose kids look just like them, no issues of different ethnicity/obviously different appearance/different names - are consistently asked by CBP and CBSA for proof that they have permission to cross the border with their own kids - my widow friend travels with a copy of her husbands death certificate at all times.

 

Since it's all about protecting kids it's hard to be too annoyed at the border guys being careful - but they shouldn't be tough with you, they simply want to ensure that you do have the legal right to bring the kids across the border.

[CHEZMARYLOU]

We've never done this but I cannot imagine what else you would need except a notarized letter from the agency responsible for the foster. Seems the court order would supersede this but if you can get a letter it would be belts and suspender. Have you contacted Canadian immigrations with your question?

[Husky61]

Why don't you seek legal advice from a professional?

[dkjretired]

Why don't you seek legal advice from a professional?

 

Yes, especially since foreign courts do not necessarily have to follow orders by US courts. I would try and get something in writing from Celebrity. Remember they are only following the rules of the countries you sailing in.

Edited August 14, 2016 by dkjretired

[hcat]

Try the U.S. State Dept and Canadian equivalent as to what might be needed beyond what you have gathered,

Try to get it in writing so Celebrity will follow along,

Edited August 14, 2016 by hcat

[pasto5]

We have cruised with our granddaughter when we had custody. We brought all of the legal documentation which was scrutinized by the cruise personnel but no issues getting on the ship.

[Cruising Is Bliss]

I would like any advice on taking foster children from US to a cruise starting in Vancouver. We are going over our documents and are nervous about having everything. We called the Captains Club, but she was unsure. She read the the documentation and agreed with my interpretation.

I have passports, birth certificates and court order permission. Can anyone tell me if there are any other documents needed? I would also like any advice. They are 6 and 9 years old.

 

The potential problem with framing your question to Celebrity the way you did is that it influenced the answer. She was unsure and you convinced her it was okay.

 

The real problem is the person who checks you in at the dock has no reason to be biased in the direction of your interpretation. You might have problems unless you have specific documentation with very specific language. You might not. There's no way of knowing.

 

This is also a CYA situation for you. If one of them gets sick or injured on the cruise and it turns out that you were wrong, it might even cause problems with your fostering of the children.

 

I'm not a lawyer and tend to be quite risk adverse so take this with a very large grain of salt. But I would get at least one, and probably both, of the following.

 

An answer in writing from the fostering agency on what documentation and specific wording is needed so that you are authorized to take them out of the country on this vacation.

 

An answer in writing from Celebrity to this. "I have two foster children living with me in the US that I'm taking on this Alaskan cruise leaving from Vancouver. We're all US citizens and what documents do I need to bring with me and be specific."

 

This is a wonderful opportunity for them and they're blessed to have you as their foster parent!

[cruisestitch]

There are three issues here.

 

The first is what is needed to enter Canada.

 

The second is what is needed to re-enter the US (presumably at Canada Place)

 

And then what is needed to board the ship.

 

You have to satisfy all three agencies

[Cancun01]

We've never done this but I cannot imagine what else you would need except a notarized letter from the agency responsible for the foster. Seems the court order would supersede this but if you can get a letter it would be belts and suspender. Have you contacted Canadian immigrations with your question?

 

I agree that you should contact Citizenship and Immigration in Canada and ask for something in writing to present at point of entry if necessary. It is the Canadian officials who have the final decision-making authority whether the children can enter Canada and whether your documents are acceptable. With all due respect, the Captain's Club and a costly legal opinion issued by a US based lawyer do not supercede Canadian legislation and related regulations and policies. What a wonderful opportunity for those lucky kids. Enjoy your cruise!

[Cancun01]

There are three issues here.

 

The first is what is needed to enter Canada.

 

The second is what is needed to re-enter the US (presumably at Canada Place)

 

And then what is needed to board the ship.

 

You have to satisfy all three agencies

 

Exactly right!

[NanaChar]

Thanks. I have a US lawyer who knows the laws for foster care. We have talked extensively to our state agencies. Our dealings with the State Department has been educational, but never thought about Canadian laws. I wanted to make sure I covered all angles. And asking for advise from knowledgeable people never hurts and often helps.

 

 

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[Cancun01]

I am sure that you have all bases covered, but if you go on the Canadian Government Citizenship and Immigration website, there is a section regarding minor children visiting Canada and the requirements for various situations. There is also a call center that you could contact and perhaps ask for the requirements for your specific situation in writing. Again, enjoy your cruise.

[Cancun01]

I am sure you have all bases covered, but if you go on the Canadian Government Department of Citizenship and Immigration site there is a section about minor children visiting Canada and various categories and documentation requirements. There is also a call center that you can contact. Again, enjoy your cruise.

[wendychloecruiser]

"No? but cruise critic said I could."

 

 

For goodness sake get some professional advice.

[casper106]

Don't email but call in person to the appropriate Canadian agency and ask for the policy in writing and take it with you.

[hometoosoon]

While we haven't cruised, we did travel with our foster kids. If you have passports and birth cert. then you should be all set. The only thing I would possibly get would be a letter from their placing agency. Hand over their documentation, but refrain from explaining unless asked.

[Husky61]

"No? but cruise critic said I could."

 

 

For goodness sake get some professional advice.

 

Exactly!:)

[NanaChar]

Come on guys. I'm not asking for legal advice. I have worked with lawyers and judges. I have talked to the State Dept. I've done my research. I want to talk to some who has been through it. And believe it or not, someone suggesting to call Citizenship and Immigration was helpful. None of the lawyers involved mentioned that.

 

 

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[NanaChar]

The potential problem with framing your question to Celebrity the way you did is that it influenced the answer. She was unsure and you convinced her it was okay.

 

 

 

The real problem is the person who checks you in at the dock has no reason to be biased in the direction of your interpretation. You might have problems unless you have specific documentation with very specific language. You might not. There's no way of knowing.

 

 

 

This is also a CYA situation for you. If one of them gets sick or injured on the cruise and it turns out that you were wrong, it might even cause problems with your fostering of the children.

 

 

 

I'm not a lawyer and tend to be quite risk adverse so take this with a very large grain of salt. But I would get at least one, and probably both, of the following.

 

 

 

An answer in writing from the fostering agency on what documentation and specific wording is needed so that you are authorized to take them out of the country on this vacation.

 

 

 

An answer in writing from Celebrity to this. "I have two foster children living with me in the US that I'm taking on this Alaskan cruise leaving from Vancouver. We're all US citizens and what documents do I need to bring with me and be specific."

 

 

 

This is a wonderful opportunity for them and they're blessed to have you as their foster parent!

 

 

 

FYI. I didn't tell her what my interpretation was. I simply asked what was needed for a foster parent sine we are neither parents or legal guardians. I didn't want to influence her.

We have discussed this with the children's lawyer, the parents' lawyer, the case worker, her supervisor, we have court approval. But someone could interpret something differently.

Even talking to Canadian immigration and citizenship seems to be different than what I read. I'll go with the strictest.

I understand why rules are in place, I just want to cover all my bases.

 

 

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