Looks like misbehaving kids aren't only on Carnival

[kc58ab]

Of course she doesn't want to hang out with grown men or you with 13 yr old girls. I would question if either did. I think being home only with ppl u allow in her vicinity doesn't require her to hang with you. Vacation is different, not as controlled as home. Also not as much exposure at once, generally.

My kids wouldn't choose maybe to spend time with us the whole vacation, but I'm the parent, I paid for it, so I decide.

This march I did a cruise with my daughter, my best friend, and her daughter. In this case she did her own thing with her friend some of time.

[kc58ab]

Definitely agree. You need that relationship to parent well, particularly as they get older. If you don't lay some kind of foundation when they're younger on what is appropriate and not, you'll have a lot more trouble trying to get that later on in life. My daughter is the stubborn type, but not an envelope pusher. She'll dig her heels and complain and complain, but when the final word comes she'll accept it. She's not the risk taker type in general. For us, I learned the best thing to do is give her a chance to come up with a valid reason if she wants to do something I might not agree with initially in many cases (some things are just "NO" of course, and sometimes there just is no time or place to do so). I in turn try to explain why I won't let her. This gives her a chance to at least feel like she has been given a chance. And sometimes she does come up with very good reasons and I'll change my mind (depending what it is of course). Of course, being married to a lawyer, I'm used to this *grin* In the end though, I get the final word and decision. It's a relationship, but it's still not a Democracy.

Couldn't agree more here :)

[Organized Chaos]

@Organized Chaos save your keystrokes. I admit I was taken aback by the rudeness of this board but appreciate the decent responses from folks like you. So, save your keystrokes for those that can appreciate them.

Thank you for the kind words. :) I appreciate it.

[Strophic]

The fact that people actually believe the world is safer today is kind of scary to me. We have news reports of disappearing kids and bodies being found daily. The thought people live with rose tinted glasses and think it's perfectly find for minors to be left unattended to their own devices on a cruise just astonishes me.

 

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People are safer today in basically every objective measurement of safety that matters. Crime is at the lowest rate it's been in decades—that doesn't mean that murder and kidnapping doesn't exist at all, of course, and news sources are eager to broadcast those cases because blood = ratings. So that makes it appear like violent crime is more prevalent than it actually is.

[sambolina]

On our cruise last year young kids were hitting and throwing the golf balls from the putt putt course down onto lower decks to see if they could hit someone. There was 6 of them. I flipped out on them yelling at them, they ran away from me but remembered who I was , every time they saw me they would try to hide and avoid me

 

 

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[Crusingdiva62]

People are safer today in basically every objective measurement of safety that matters. Crime is at the lowest rate it's been in decades—that doesn't mean that murder and kidnapping doesn't exist at all, of course, and news sources are eager to broadcast those cases because blood = ratings. So that makes it appear like violent crime is more prevalent than it actually is.

 

 

 

There was a woman murdered on a princess cruise by her spouse in front of her 3 kids this week on the emerald princess. Stuff does happen

https://www.transportation.gov/sites/dot.gov/files/docs/mission/safety/278981/cruise-line-incident-report-1-jan-31-mar-2017.pdf

 

 

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[FLSteve11]

There was a woman murdered on a princess cruise by her spouse in front of her 3 kids this week on the emerald princess. Stuff does happen

https://www.transportation.gov/sites/dot.gov/files/docs/mission/safety/278981/cruise-line-incident-report-1-jan-31-mar-2017.pdf

 

 

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Because that definitely wouldn't have happened at home. Of course some stuff happens. It just does not happen very often, and less often then it did in the past 50+ years. Nothing is completely safe, even locking yourself in your house forever by yourself.

[bUU]

Crime is at the lowest rate it's been in decades

Just a clarification about this. Overall crime has been declining in the United States year-over-year, for the last 25 years. However, it looks like 2016 will be the first year that crime has increased year-over-year since the 1990s. And the inflection is even more pronounced with violent crime, and with murder, which are definitely on the increase. [source: FBI Uniform Crime Reports (1990-2015) and Brennan Center Analysis (2016).] Maybe it is short-term anomaly but it is important to understand that that's probably not the case, and that something has changed in our society that has switched us from a path where crime was on the decline to a path where crime is on the increase. Clearly, we can expect society's trends like that to be reflected on North American-based cruise ships.

[CruisingUS]

Darn the original video is down. Anyone have mirror link?

[Strophic]

There was a woman murdered on a princess cruise by her spouse in front of her 3 kids this week on the emerald princess. Stuff does happen

https://www.transportation.gov/sites/dot.gov/files/docs/mission/safety/278981/cruise-line-incident-report-1-jan-31-mar-2017.pdf

 

 

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What is the point of this comment? How does this in any way run counter to anything I said? I said "crime still exists, but statistically it's way down" and you replied "well this one instance of murder happened so nuh-uh!!"

[Crusingdiva62]

What is the point of this comment? How does this in any way run counter to anything I said? I said "crime still exists, but statistically it's way down" and you replied "well this one instance of murder happened so nuh-uh!!"

 

 

 

The point of my comment is that crime does happen on ships as well. If you clicked on the link I supplied it shows just this year from January to March 27 crimes reported most sexual assault. In a 3 month period. I realize today people don't want to parent their kids but at least keep yourself aware of dangers that can occur. A cruise ship is not a floating babysitter for unattended children.

 

 

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[cruziJenn]

https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/latest-crime-statistics-released

 

2016 report said that there was a 2.6% decrease in property crime but a 3.9% increase in violent crime.

[cruziJenn]

Chart.....

 

http://www.factcheck.org/UploadedFiles/2016/07/Violent-Crime-Rate-Chart1.png

 

1992 was the peak year during the past several decades. According to that chart we are still above the rate of violent crimes before the mid 1970‘s.

 

Everyone knows that 'statistics' can be used to support either side of a debate :) and politicians know it better than anyone.

[Strophic]

>According to that chart we are still above the rate of violent crimes before the mid 1970‘s.

 

 

In other words, crime is at some of its lowest rates in over 40 years.

[bUU]

In other words, crime is at some of its lowest rates in over 40 years.

But seemingly turning a corner and heading back to higher rates.

[cruziJenn]

>According to that chart we are still above the rate of violent crimes before the mid 1970‘s.

 

 

In other words, crime is at some of its lowest rates in over 40 years.

 

What about the rest of what I wrote? Didn't want to quote any of that?

[FLSteve11]

The point of my comment is that crime does happen on ships as well. If you clicked on the link I supplied it shows just this year from January to March 27 crimes reported most sexual assault. In a 3 month period. I realize today people don't want to parent their kids but at least keep yourself aware of dangers that can occur. A cruise ship is not a floating babysitter for unattended children.

 

 

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Yes, crime can happen. The odds of crime happening is still very small, including (and maybe even more so) then cruise ships. I read the link to the article, according to it there were 62 sexual assaults out of 24,000,000 passengers. A rate of .0003% according to that article (is there more unreported, I'm certainly sure there are quite a lot more, but still very low). There is a difference between those people that don't want to parent their kids (there certainly are some, who use vacation as a chance to let their kids do anything with no guidance), and those that teach their children how to handle themselves.

 

Almost every parent today was given more freedom to do things on their own when they were children. So would you say that of your parents then, that they didn't want parent their kids?

[FLSteve11]

But seemingly turning a corner and heading back to higher rates.

 

Maybe, but one year doesn't mean anything. In 1998 and 2004 the rates went up for a year or two, then continued going down as it had been for many years. It's possible it's turned a corner, or stagnated, or will just continue to go down. We don't know yet. It's just as likely it's a statistical blip. At some point it will level off, but even if it's goes up, it's still well below what it has been, and will be for a long time.

[Shaded Lady]

It's not always the parents fault. At some point the kids have to take responsibility for their actions and at that age, they know right from wrong.

 

Last year, I let my then 16 YO daughter bring her friend who was 17 on our cruise with my brother and I. They had a room a couple of doors down from us. A few weeks prior, I took the girls out for pizza to discuss the rules. Their curfew was midnight, which they followed, as I went to their room each night and we talked about their day. They had to meet up for lunch and dinner with us and go on the excursions we had planned.

 

I told them they had to keep the cabin clean and under no circumstances to drink any alcohol at all as we could all be put off the ship for underage drinking. The girls understood. I told them if they follow the rules, she can come with us again on other cruises, if not, never again.

 

Well, one day, I left my cabin and walked down the hall past their room, the door was open and the steward was cleaning it. I was shocked, it looked like a bomb went off in there. There were clothes and towels everywhere. It was so bad! I apologized to the steward, went back to the room and handed him $40 and said this will never happen again for the remainder of the cruise. I'll never forget the look on his face. :(

Then I found out when we got home, my daughter told me her friend was drinking beer this guy got for her one night.

 

Needless to say, my daughter has asked to bring her friend on our last couple of cruises and the answer has been absolutely not!

There will be no friends joining her on our cruises anymore.

I applaud you for accomplishing the goal of helping your daughter grow up as an independent, strong-thinking person, with rules and guidance, but with freedom as well!

 

I'm a strong believer in giving some latitude (with oversight!) but teaching kids that there are consequences for their actions... I make the rules clear, let them follow them, and if they break them, THEY pay the price. Sometimes that means I have to pay it too (can't go here, can't do that) but it's the best way for them to learn!

 

My daughter is constantly amazed at how well-behaved and reasonable my 8 YO grandson is with me... he knows my rules, and he follows them! why? He's broken them a few times and knows that the sweet generous grandma who lets him do pretty much whatever and spoils him like crazy gets pretty mean when he doesn't do what he's supposed to. Of course the consequence has to be in line with the infraction.

 

I'm willing to bet that the next time your daughter is around people who are a bad influence, like her friend who cruised with yall, she'll make better decisions than many kids will who never face consequences!

[bUU]

Maybe, but one year doesn't mean anything.

It's only been one year of an increase. The inflection point was about five years ago. There were measurable decreases in the rate of decrease.

[Blackjack22]

Because it IS. The only difference is now they plaster the news over the internet so you know about anything going on in the country. Fear sells, tap into a persons fear and you'll get them to spend money to cover it (hopefully, to them, by buying their news coverage or those of their advertisers). Every statistic shows the US (not saying anything about other countries) is twice as safe as it used to be during it's high point, which was about 25 years ago. When many of us were kids and thought nothing of going out. Why? Because we had maybe 10 television channels and no internet, so we knew nothing of what was going on. That and the dozens of serialized television shows dramatizing works of fiction over hundreds of cable channels (because, fears sells and you'll watch it). Is it perfectly, zero proof safe? No, but it's definitely safer then it used to be. The vast majority of disappearing kids are runaways, followed by custody disputes. Yet we fixate on every story as the boogeyman has come to get them.

 

 

Steve is abolutely correct. Our news media perpetuates the myth of us living in a sick sad world, but as a whole, society becomes much more peaceful every year. Unfortunately, our decency in the media has regressed and amount of time consuming media has increased so we all live in fear of our neighbors and strangers on the street. I'm just so done with the fake news only reporting negativity. My local newspaper runs more stories about overdoses than anything else despite the fact that there is so much positive and resurgence in the community since the economy has started to recover. We had two new breweries and local restaurants open in the past month (by people in their 20s) and they haven't even had an article, instead they print stories about overdoses by people in their 20s. Overdoses may be a problem but it is fake news in the sense that it isn't noteworthy and some junkie who doesn't contribute to society as a whole has no bearing on my life. That may sound callous to say, but it is true.

[FLSteve11]

It's only been one year of an increase. The inflection point was about five years ago. There were measurable decreases in the rate of decrease.

 

Well, it almost has to level off, as it's not going to go down to zero. That's why I said it had to stagnate at some point. That doesn't mean it's going to go up. There's only so much they can stop crime. Might it go up, sure. More likely this is the more normal, unless there is a softening on crime control. I don't see that happening so far. We're still "Tough on crime", and the prison sentences are getting longer and longer (outside of a few high profile exceptions) The only spot I see it softening is in marijuana usage, which doesn't fall under violent crime.

[bUU]

Well, it almost has to level off, as it's not going to go down to zero.

Fair enough, but you're saying that 350 violent crimes per 100,000 people and 5 murders per 100,000 people is the best we can hope for. :(

[Organized Chaos]

Statistics show that those who cite statistics are statistically speaking.

 

To those who blow it off by saying crime happens sometimes, how would you feel if you (or your child if you have any) were a victim of said crime and someone told you, "It happens?" ;)

 

We jumped from a delinquent kid jumping into a cruise ship pool to national crime statistics. :confused: Fact is, it's ok to be cautious. If a parent doesn't want to let their child roam free on a cruise ship out of cautiousness, that's their decision to make.

[Strophic]

To those who blow it off by saying crime happens sometimes, how would you feel if you (or your child if you have any) were a victim of said crime and someone told you, "It happens?" ;)

 

You're missing the point of the whole discussion. This whole thing started because someone said "I can't believe all these people in this thread who think the world is safer." When, objectively speaking, it IS safer. Obviously no one enjoys being the victim of a crime, but that has nothing to do with the conversation.