Explorer Cancellation 7820 and 7821

[mrlevin]

Expedition leader just had long conversation with three “suits “ that just boarded. Wasn’t able to eavesdrop. Hopefully we will hear something about the drastic modification of our cruise tonight. Changes made to shorten distance and avoid ice make more sense with email excerpts posted.

[Daveywavey70]

In a way, SS's announcement/explanation reminds me of -

Chuckles @ Bill

[Bill B]

Expedition leader just had long conversation with three “suits “ that just boarded. Wasn’t able to eavesdrop. Hopefully we will hear something about the drastic modification of our cruise tonight. Changes made to shorten distance and avoid ice make more sense with email excerpts posted.

 

What "drastic modification" of your cruise? Has the itinerary been changed? If so, from what to what?

 

The 'corporate speak' :rolleyes: email posted -

'Following the insourcing of technical operation from an external manager our technical manager has run different analysis on our whole fleet. In specific one recent test pointed out the need to increase the ship's operational flexibility before starting cold water cruising to be able to allow our guests to enjoy longer-range cruises in the future.'

The dry dock will result will result in enhancements in the ship hull to allow for increased ship's operational flexibility in ice cold cruising.'

Seems to me to imply they will increase the ship's fuel capacity, and 'ice strengthen' the hull.

[rojaan19]

Expedition leader just had long conversation with three “suits “ that just boarded. Wasn’t able to eavesdrop. Hopefully we will hear something about the drastic modification of our cruise tonight. Changes made to shorten distance and avoid ice make more sense with email excerpts posted.

 

 

Marc who is the expedition leader ?

[Observer]

I understand that the posted explanation is not very elegantly written. But it seems clear that there is no sinister motive: Perhaps out of an abundance of caution, Silversea is strengthening the ship's hull to ensure that the ship can safely engage in extended cruising in icy/very cold water.

 

The dry dock is clearly upsetting to some. I would be upset if I were affected. But can one really complain so if Silversea is undertaking action to ensure that future Arctic/Antarctic cruises can be safely and uneventfully executed? Would one prefer that management ignore their observations on this matter and that the ship is stranded in cod/icy waters?

[UKCruiseJeff]

Explorer is an ice class 1a.

[mrlevin]

I understand that the posted explanation is not very elegantly written. But it seems clear that there is no sinister motive: Perhaps out of an abundance of caution, Silversea is strengthening the ship's hull to ensure that the ship can safely engage in extended cruising in icy/very cold water.

 

The dry dock is clearly upsetting to some. I would be upset if I were affected. But can one really complain so if Silversea is undertaking action to ensure that future Arctic/Antarctic cruises can be safely and uneventfully executed? Would one prefer that management ignore their observations on this matter and that the ship is stranded in cod/icy waters?

It is upsetting to some because our itinerary was modified to remove/minimize ice cruising. We spent three days behind an icebreaker on this ship four years ago; the hull was fine. Btw, those suits I mentioned might be bear guards; at least that is what they told my friends.

 

Marc

[tgh]

There may be an issue with the rating in terms of maintenance or age.

A cash strapped Silversea may have minimised the maintenance work and taken more risk, RCI may want less risk.. who knows

The following is a quick primer in ice ratings :

http://www.engr.mun.ca/~cdaley/8074/Ice%20Class%20Rules_CD.pdf

[Observer]

There may be an issue with the rating in terms of maintenance or age.

A cash strapped Silversea may have minimised the maintenance work and taken more risk, RCI may want less risk.. who knows

The following is a quick primer in ice ratings :

http://www.engr.mun.ca/~cdaley/8074/Ice%20Class%20Rules_CD.pdf

 

The deal with RCI has not closed yet, has it? Is RCI calling the shots now and funding such work? I hadn't thought so. But I suppose that it is possible that there are provisions in the contract with RCI that certain work on the fleet must be undertaken -- just as, for example, a real estate transaction can be contingent on the replacement of the HVAC system, etc.

[mrlevin]

First I was wrong about the suits; they are bear guards. Second brad deferred discussion about changes to itinerary to 0800 tomorrow. Third the Chronicle indicates a change to the itinerary even from the one emailed four days ago. I really think they are avoiding any ice which greatly impacts our opportunities to see polar bear. I was hoping to stay quiet at tommorows briefing but my ire is rising.

 

More tomorrow if we still have internet

[zigtraveller]

Marc, sorry to hear that your itinerary is being impacted. I'll be interested to hear news from your briefing tomorrow if you still have internet access.

[Fletcher]

Thanks JP, those voyages were unique taking in the Pitcairn Islands as well as EI.

 

Far from unique, zigtraveller. There are a few cruise operators using 100 pax expedition vessels which do this routing, the Island Sky for instance. However, what made this now cancelled itinerary fairly unusual was that it went south from Tahiti to the Austral Islands before heading for Mangareva and the Pitcairn group. One of the Australs, Raivavae, is often regarded as the most beautiful island in the South Pacific.

 

I would be seriously upset had I booked this. In fact, I could have sailed on this ship all the way down from Hawaii via Kiribati to Easter Island and Juan Fernandez.

 

The Pitcairners will be very disappointed as visiting ships provide much needed revenue.

[tgh]

Some illumination

 

This was published in the Australian last October :

 

• LOUISE GOLDSBURY
  
• The Australian
  
• 12:00AM October 21, 2017
  
• 
  
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  [*]1

A new polar code is set to promote safety and protect the environment from the increasing number of ships in the Arctic and Antarctic. But will these regulations lead to significant changes or end up reducing cruising opportunities in these regions?

The technical document by the International Maritime Organization covers ship designs, equipment, operations, search and rescue, marine pollution prevention and crew training for passenger vessels sailing anywhere in the Antarctic continent, through the Northwest Passage, in Greenland and Norway’s Svalbard.

The first phase was introduced in January and applies to all ships built this year, while the second phase, from next January, affects existing ships. As cruise ships are certified every five years, this means existing vessels certified in 2017 have until 2021 to comply with the new code.

But even with this distant deadline, many ships will not obtain the certification, according to specialist cruise agency Landmark Travel’s director Gerd Wilmer.

“My estimation is that available ships [in 2021] will be less than half of [the total] today,” Wilmer says.

“There will be a huge gap because not every cruise line will go for it. It’s horribly expensive to build a ship to polar class.”

Hapag-Lloyd Cruises’ MS Bremen was one of the first passenger ships to undergo the process to receive the new Polar Ship Certificate. The two-month refit included technical modifications, extra equipment and the preparation of a manual to guide younger officers navigating in ice. Other small ships in the Hapag-Lloyd fleet will also be upgraded this year in time for the 2018 Arctic season.

“Compasses don’t work in these places, normal GPS doesn’t work,” Wilmer says.

“You need a lot of rescue equipment, manuals and training because a disaster in a polar region would make [the sinking of] the Titanic look like a picnic.”

In Antarctica, bigger ships carrying more than 500 passengers, from lines such as Celebrity, Princess and Holland America, will still not be permitted to make landings, but are expected to continue offering “sail by” itineraries.

A spokesperson for International Association of Antarctica Tour Operators says these “cruise only” ships are already restricted to sailing in ice-free polar waters, so although the new code formalises these requirements, it does not necessarily mean changes to operating procedures.

The IAATO says, “Like all vessels operating in polar waters, [these ships] will have to go through an assessment process for certification that ensures they continue operating within safe, appropriate limits.”

Australian-owned Aurora Expeditions is building an expedition vessel that will meet the latest polar code specifications. Now operating Antarctic and Arctic adventures on the 35-year-old Polar Pioneer, the company is making a big leap to a purpose-built, high-performance, ice class 1A ship in time for the 2019-20 Antarctic season. Debuting a revolutionary design, the as-yet-unnamed 155-passenger vessel will have a bow that can pierce waves with greater stability, essentially smoothing out the rough ride of notoriously wild waters such as the Drake Passage. Viewing platforms will also unfold from the sides of the bow so passengers can get a closer look at, say, penguins without leaving the ship.

Scenic’s new Scenic Eclipse, Crystal Cruises’ Endeavor, One Ocean Expeditions’ RCGS Resolute, Silversea’s and Ponant’s expedition vessels are also expected to meet with the new polar code.

There’s still more that can be done, such as banning heavy fuel oil in the Arctic, but every step helps protect these incredible cruise destinations.

[tgh]

Some Cruise companies clearly had a plan.. others perhaps did not

 

The International Code for Ships Operating in Polar Waters (Polar Code) – adopted by the International Maritime Organisation – contains regulations concerning the ships’ construction, equipment and training and their crews that intend to operate in the polar regions. Issued by the classification society DNV GL, the Polar Ship Certificate confirming compliance with the Polar Code will be mandatory for all ships from January 2018. The Polar Code is intended to increase the safety of ships and pay greater attention to environmental protection.

“The Polar Code will improve the safety of navigation in polar waters significantly. We have taken a pioneering step in certifying the BREMEN and paved the way for the other ships in the fleet of Hapag-Lloyd Cruises to comply with the Polar Code. I am happy to have contributed”, says Captain Thilo Natke, who oversaw the certification process for Hapag-Lloyd Cruises. Natke prepared a Polar Water Operational Manual that will, in particular, familiarise younger officers with the ship-specific particularities of navigating in ice.

Certain technical modifications have to be carried out on board the ships in order for them to meet the requirements of the Polar Code. For instance, fire lines located on deck were fitted with additional insulation and an additional ice spotlight was installed when the BREMEN was in dock in October 2016. A wide range of extra equipment has also been sourced in order to ensure the survival of passengers and crew members in potential emergencies in the polar regions. During 2017, as part of their routine dry-dock periods in the shipyard, the other ships in the Hapag-Lloyd Cruises’ fleet will also be brought in line with the criteria of the certificate in order that they meet the requirements of the Polar Code at the latest by the Arctic season in 2018 and are able to operate in the regions successfully.

[SeekingShelter]

Thanks tgh, for sharing. Very informative.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Forums

[drron29]

Thanks tgh.It now begs the question why wasn't this done during the 2017 dry dock?

However I believe this problem has little to do with the new polar code.The only way it could would be if the Silver Explorer was due for recertification this year and this is due to the inspection for the polar code certificate.But SS would have known that and surely would have checked before her dry dock last year so everything could have been done at the one time.I don't think SS are that incompetent.

 

The quote from the email upthread states that all ships in the fleet were inspected.The only likely reason that I can think of is that it was part of the due diligence consequent on the RCI takeover.

[MLeh]

Reading the information posted on the requirements for cruising in arctic (and antarctic) waters, it points out a major flaw with the popularity of cruising, especially to places that are a bit more dangerous. It really is a 'Wild West' out there. We trust the cruise lines and the crews on the ships to keep us safe. (I'm reminded a bit of how climbing Everest has become almost a tourist thing, "just mind the dead bodies off the trail".) I'm glad the Explorer will be safer for future passengers, although the change in itinerary really sucks for those who paid and planned so far in advance.

 

The 2020 World Cruise on the Whisper includes Antartica. What upgrading will need to be done to accommodate that itinerary, and will the safety of the passengers be paramount? Upgrading ships costs money, both in actual work done and the loss of income while the vessel is out of commission.

[mrlevin]

Cruise going well. Changes due to updated Russian rules and ice. Ship still planning to sail through ice but not thick ice. Still no mention of upcoming dry dock.

[zigtraveller]

Cruise going well. Changes due to updated Russian rules and ice. Ship still planning to sail through ice but not thick ice. Still no mention of upcoming dry dock.

 

Pleased to hear that the cruise is proceeding well for you, thanks for the update.

[rojaan19]

I received my "official" email from Silversea this morning - saying my cruise was cancelled !!!

 

"Dear xxxxxxxxxxx 28 Jul. at 5:30 am

We are writing to inform you of a change that is impacting your upcoming Silver Explorer voyage. Initially scheduled for May 2019, Silver Explorer’s planned dry dock period is being brought forward to September 24th, 2018. We have very recently been advised by our technical experts that in order to continue to operate extended ocean cruises we are required to make some technical enhancements to Silver Explorer. Therefore, the ship will enter dry-dock on September 15th and return to service in Valparaiso on November 5th. I am sure you will understand that having received this advice we have to act upon it and therefore have brought forward the planned 2019 dry dock to this September.

 

We sincerely apologize for the inconvenience this has caused. In addition to providing a full refund for your cruise as well as assisting in mitigating cancellation fees for air and land arrangements not made with Silversea, we are extending to you a 25% savings which can be used on any Silversea cruise departing between today and April 1, 2019; for any sailings beyond this time frame excluding World Cruise itineraries, we will be offering a 10% savings. Silversea will be working with your travel professional in order to ensure your refunds are issued.

Roberto Martinoli,

Chief Executive Officer

Silversea Cruises

 

 

JUST A TAD LATE Roberto - I saw it here first on CC !!!!!

[drron29]

Took 3 days but I also finally got the email.Not once but twice.Now this part is interesting-

"we are extending to you a 25% savings which can be used on any Silversea cruise departing between today and April 1, 2019"

We do have a cruise booked on the Muse in February so have now put in our claim for a refund of 25% of the amount paid.The above line makes no mention of it needing to be a new booking.

[Daveywavey70]

Took 3 days but I also finally got the email.Not once but twice.Now this part is interesting-

"we are extending to you a 25% savings which can be used on any Silversea cruise departing between today and April 1, 2019"

We do have a cruise booked on the Muse in February so have now put in our claim for a refund of 25% of the amount paid.The above line makes no mention of it needing to be a new booking.

 

Good Luck DrRon, I hope they honour the wording of the email.

[turtlemichael]

rojaan19, "as well as assisting in mitigating cancellation fees for air and land arrangements not made with Silversea" ? That statement has so much wriggle room. I would, at a minimum, be looking for full reimbursement of such out of pocket expenses.

[Daveywavey70]

rojaan19, "as well as assisting in mitigating cancellation fees for air and land arrangements not made with Silversea" ? That statement has so much wriggle room. I would, at a minimum, be looking for full reimbursement of such out of pocket expenses.

 

It might be what you're looking for but considering the recent actions and conveniently vague wording, I wouldn't hold out much hope. Fingers crossed they might honour their obligations on this one.

[Bill B]

rojaan19, "as well as assisting in mitigating cancellation fees for air and land arrangements not made with Silversea" ? That statement has so much wriggle room. I would, at a minimum, be looking for full reimbursement of such out of pocket expenses.

 

One can always ask. Whether or not one receives is another matter. I could be wrong, but would expect a reply (from SS to a request for full reimbursement of such out of pocket expenses), in essence stating -

 

"We (SS) called your airline(s) and hotel(s). We are sorry to inform you they will not waive your non-refundable cancellation/change fees. Sorry... you should have bought travel insurance."

 

EDIT:

... and of course insurance will not pay because cancellation of the trip by the operator is not a 'covered reason'. ;)

Edited July 28, 2018 by Bill B