Britain's biggest cruise operator is becoming 'Butlins on Sea', Which? survey finds (today's Telegraph)

[crompton21]

"it happens on every cruise wen the sea is rough" !!!!

 

Cruise ship passenger in sea shocker!!!!!!!Other headlines are available.

[AndyMichelle]

22 minutes ago, Harry Peterson said:

All I’ve ever encountered is pub act comics and singers. Can’t recall anything more than that.

I have seen some fantastic comedians and excellent singers on P&O.. 

I have also seen some absolute rubbish ones.. 

It's hit and miss, but overall, we tend to enjoy it. 

Andy 

[AndyMichelle]

1 minute ago, Harry Peterson said:

Actually, I’ve seen conflicting reports, most of which suggest that performances will be limited. How many performances are there?

Tony Hadley is doing 6 shows in 2 days in the theatre with every passenger getting an allocated ticket. 

Andy 

[AndyMichelle]

5 minutes ago, Harry Peterson said:

New cruisers may well use this forum to decide which ships to cruise on.  Don’t you think they deserve some sort of balanced approach?  Do you really want to censor all criticism?  How, for example, do you defend the smell of sewage on the same ship for years? Should that information be suppressed?

Of course it shouldn't be suppressed Harry, but it also needs balancing with our good experiences. 

Andy 

[Harry Peterson]

2 minutes ago, AndyMichelle said:

Of course it shouldn't be suppressed Harry, but it also needs balancing with our good experiences. 

Andy 

Absolutely, Andy.  Couldn’t agree more.  And I don’t think any poster has suggested otherwise.

 

All views are inevitably very subjective, of course, but the difference about this thread is that it’s centred on a report from a respected independent consumer magazine. I can understand that those who choose P&O might not like to read criticisms of it, but I still struggle to understand the attacks on Which?  Again, it’s all a question of balance, and I’ve yet to see any reason why Which? should view, or report on, P&O any differently from any other company.  Why would they?

[crompton21]

The day Which do a report on their top ten bad smells (obviously with a best buy recommendation so that they can get some revenue in) will be manna from heaven.

[Adawn47]

We tried RCI once. It wasn't our cup of tea. Never complained just didn't go back. Each to their own. 

Oh Harry you've certainly stir up a hornets nest with this thread. 

[Britboys]

6 minutes ago, Harry Peterson said:

Absolutely, Andy.  Couldn’t agree more.  And I don’t think any poster has suggested otherwise.

 

All views are inevitably very subjective, of course, but the difference about this thread is that it’s centred on a report from a respected independent consumer magazine. I can understand that those who choose P&O might not like to read criticisms of it, but I still struggle to understand the attacks on Which?  Again, it’s all a question of balance, and I’ve yet to see any reason why Which? should view, or report on, P&O any differently from any other company.  Why would they?

But whatever way you look at it, it was a very small survey.  If there were around 500 responses from P&O customers, that's around a quarter of the pax on one single cruise on one of the smallest ships of 6+ vessels in the fleet.  And as I have previously suggested, Which members/responders are perhaps not likely to be terribly representative of the P&O customer base as a whole.

[Adawn47]

Maybe a more honest review of P&O would be to survey P&O cruisers and not Which  subscribers, many of whom have probably never sailed with or have even heard of Butlins.        I can remember a game we used to play as children, Chinese Whispers.......

[Host Sharon]

On 1/27/2020 at 11:17 AM, awmartin said:

We are veritably new comers to cruising only done 8 since 2012 all on  P& 0 so I  am interested to know what major changes have been taking place. I know the sweets and the flower have gone from the cabin and the silver service from the MDR  and the gratuities have gone but I can’t think of anything major that has affected us personally. Would be good to know what we have missed.

But the cabin flower hasn't gone. We had one on oceana last week. We also had an excellent wine waitress (again reported as "gone"). The only noticeable difference was we had to  request face cloths (instantly supplied) and no turndown on the first night. 

[Adawn47]

We found the same on Aurora. It didn't spoil the holiday one bit. 

[Harry Peterson]

4 minutes ago, Adawn47 said:

Maybe a more honest review of P&O would be to survey P&O cruisers and not Which  subscribers, many of whom have probably never sailed with or have even heard of Butlins.        I can remember a game we used to play as children, Chinese Whispers.......

What makes you think that the people responding, all of whom would have been asked whether they had cruised with P&O, hadn’t done so?

 

That suggestion could apply equally to any other cruise company.  What possible motive would Which? have for dishonesty? 

 

These attacks on the integrity of Which? defy all logic and commonsense.

[Adawn47]

I'm not attacking Which. I'm merely saying that more people have cruised with P&O than were surveyed by Which. 

[Harry Peterson]

2 minutes ago, Adawn47 said:

I'm not attacking Which. I'm merely saying that more people have cruised with P&O than were surveyed by Which. 

That’s the nature of statistics, which are well understood by Which?, and all such reports.  How would they survey every customer? You have to take a sample, and the P&O sample is probably larger than any other sample.

[Adawn47]

And we all know how reliable statistics are.

[grapau27]

53 minutes ago, AndyMichelle said:

Of course it shouldn't be suppressed Harry, but it also needs balancing with our good experiences. 

Andy 

I wonder if anyone is on Azura now and can give an update on the sewage smell that Harry mentioned.

[grapau27]

10 hours ago, KnowTheScore said:

 

 

There seem to be attempts to play down the which? report and other criticisms.   Pointless exercise because there are tons of people disenchanted with P&O at the moment.  I spoke to loads of them on the Christmas cruise just gone, most resolved to switch to another line.  But one doesn't need to even look at the Which? report.  One needs only read the various cruise reviews on this very site to see the picture:

 

A sprinkling here:

 

Worst food and service at sea
https://www.cruisecritic.co.uk/memberreviews/memberreview.cfm?EntryID=674293

Tatty
https://www.cruisecritic.co.uk/memberreviews/memberreview.cfm?EntryID=676314

Last time with P and O
https://www.cruisecritic.co.uk/memberreviews/memberreview.cfm?EntryID=677051

Holiday camp at sea
https://www.cruisecritic.co.uk/memberreviews/memberreview.cfm?EntryID=676621

P&O poorly operated.
https://www.cruisecritic.co.uk/memberreviews/memberreview.cfm?EntryID=675011

Benidorm at sea.
https://www.cruisecritic.co.uk/memberreviews/memberreview.cfm?EntryID=674747

 

 

 

I wonder how much the loss of tip money has accounted for a lot of the cutbacks.

[cjthedjeu]

Samples are just that...samples. They may have picked 50/100/500 people who have been "traditional" P&O customers that are horrified at the so called dumbing down of the cruises, but equally they could have picked 500 new generation cruisers who may have a completely different take on the P&O experience as they are not comparing now to what the experience was in the past. It is conceivable to think that the Which members surveyed are possibly more likely to fall into the traditional bracket and therefore rate the current experience negatively. 

I do not have any problem with reviewers criticising the ship, the service etc, but I do have a major issue with the snobbery of the criticism of the passengers for the way they look or the careers that they happen to have.

I personally have made the Butlins at Sea comparison for ALL the ships I have been on but only in relation to the concept of pay your upfront fare, and then all of your accommodation, food and entertainment are included in that one price. You then have the option, both at Butlins and on board ship to pay more for extra services.

[ann141]

There will always be some on this board who defend P and O whatever the criticism, others who only see the negatives but hopefully mostly those who see the positives and negatives (and have travelled with other cruise lines to compare)and decide that currently P and O still offer what they are looking for at a reasonable price.This will vary according to what individuals priorities are  . .At the moment we are happy to choose P and O but we sail with other cruise lines as well and can see positives and negatives in all lines.Happy Cruising 🙂

[Selbourne]

10 minutes ago, grapau27 said:

I wonder how much the loss of tip money has accounted for a lot of the cutbacks.

 

I don’t think it will be a major factor  Graham as, from my observations, it was offset by increased fares on some of the ships and less OBC across the board. I think we can rest assured that P&O would have ensured that the wrapping of tips into the fare was cost neutral for them. As we know, they don’t give us anything for nothing!

[AndyMichelle]

12 minutes ago, grapau27 said:

I wonder how much the loss of tip money has accounted for a lot of the cutbacks.

It had to go somewhere Graham. 

I'm glad it is flannels and flowers in the cabin rather than increased drink prices etc... 

Andy 

 

Ps. Hope you are well and not overdoing it. 

[Selbourne]

29 minutes ago, Adawn47 said:

And we all know how reliable statistics are.

 

I can tell you with certainty that 98.547278% of statistics are made up. 

[AndyMichelle]

48 minutes ago, Host Sharon said:

But the cabin flower hasn't gone. We had one on oceana last week. We also had an excellent wine waitress (again reported as "gone"). The only noticeable difference was we had to  request face cloths (instantly supplied) and no turndown on the first night. 

Definitely no flowers at New Year on Ventura, or wine waiters.. But, as I have said before, things may be different at that time of year or it may have been trials. 

They did seem drastically under staffed, so that might explain why our food waiters were taking drink orders. 

Andy 

[Selbourne]

2 minutes ago, AndyMichelle said:

Definitely no flowers at New Year on Ventura, or wine waiters.. But, as I have said before, things may be different at that time of year or it may have been trials. 

They did seem drastically under staffed, so that might explain why our food waiters were taking drink orders. 

Andy 

 

In November we still had a flower and wine waiters on Aurora but no turn down service the first night. Frankly the solitary ‘flower’ has become a joke and we wouldn’t miss it. Equally, given the pressure that the cabin stewards are under on changeover day that didn’t bother us. As for wine waiters (who are increasingly few and far between and can take a while to get to us) I can see advantages for the passengers if the regular waiters take that on, as long as it isn’t the straw that breaks the camels back, as they do work damned hard as it is. 

[AndyMichelle]

1 hour ago, Harry Peterson said:

Absolutely, Andy.  Couldn’t agree more.  And I don’t think any poster has suggested otherwise.

 

It works both ways Harry. 

You get criticised for sharing your experience and I feel that I am, in some ways, mocked for sharing mine. 

Us 'newer' cruisers are blamed for lowering the tone, with even our ladies being referred to as 'slappers'.. 

I am not quite the Saturday night TV customer that Mr Ludlow wants, but he is still offering me enough choice to make me want to continue cruising with P&O for now. 

When the fun stops... Saga here I come😊

Andy